Just got back from Pittsburgh, PA meeting on voting machines...

[Junkdrawer]

All the top big-wigs from Diebold, ES&S, Sequoia, and AccuPoll were there.

The Good News:
Allegheny county was leaning toward Diebold, but now is pretty much excluding them and ES&S from from the list. Open source only.

The Bad News:
The State still won't allow a paper trail and the Feds are pushing a deadline that was the main reason Diebold was #1 on the list.

[snowbear]

1. So... sounds like Diebold is out though?

That's great!

[Junkdrawer]

3. Mark Radke was not happy..

BTW: Diebold hired the former Chief Counsel of the National Democratic Party to try to turn around the sale. The guy hogged the floor for better than 30 minutes, but the commissioners weren't buying his BS.

The computer scientists from Pitt and CMU (together with the head of the local League of Women Voters) seemed to have won the day. I was a supportive voice, but I didn't do the heavy lifting.

[mom cat]

6. Thanks for being a voice where it was needed!

:applause:

[mod mom]

19. Glad to hear it. He's a slime ball.

[Junkdrawer]

20. See post #14. He bold-face lied to the commissioners and I'll bet...

we can easily catch him on it.

[LaPera]

2. ES&S is larger and as bad or worse than Diebold...

They are simply going to keep stealing our votes in various precincts necessary, (around the country, and we'll never know which precicnts, until its too late) to keep them in power...and we can't do a fucking thing about it....

And worse...most people including democratic politicians don't believe its happening or give a fuck about it!!!

[Junkdrawer]

4. Actually, my comment was (in part) that Diebold...

takes the lion's share of the heat because they're the only ones whose source code we've examined. I looked right at the VP of ES&S and said "If we had your source code, I'll bet we'd be talking about all the ES&S hacks today instead of all the Diebold hacks."

[LaPera]

8. How did he respond to your astute & correct accusation? n/t

[Junkdrawer]

9. Silence. n/t

[Wilms]

12. You bet, Junk. And not enough people understand.

Recently, a poster was all excited about their county rejecting Diebold...and choosing ES&S instead.

Plus, even without seeing "source code" one will find vulnerabilities in the ES&S schema.

There was an election in Cumberland Cty, PA, and one in Indiana where election results were overturned after a hand-count and investigation revealing that improper (intentional or accidental) Ballot Definition Settings that can exploit the straight-ticket option were involved in the mishap.

I stopped ranting about it because the Cumberland story received little attention on this board. If the headline doesn't include "Diebold stole the election", or "MCM said such and such", it drops like a rock.

[Bill Bored]

23. I would hope that the reason for preferring ES&S over Diebold

is simply because of the Op Scan/Automark solution.

[Wilms]

28. They didn't indicate that.

And I hadn't thought about it to ask. :blush:

[laheina]

5. If they kicked Liebold and ES&S

Why no paper trail?

[Junkdrawer]

7. Open source only. n/t

[LaPera]

10. Why indeed should any private corporate own our, (the peoples) voting

machines in the first place...that becomes fraud waiting to happen...in this case of course, the fascist republican corporations own the machines and have absolutely no problem stealing our right of the sacred votes, in order to advance their greedy, ideology and agenda!!!

[AlinPA]

11. I went to our county meeting last night; it looks like ES&S, but only

enough of them to satisfy the minimum of HAVA, i.e., accommodation of handicapped. Everyone is pushing for upgrading the paper system to the type that reads the voter's ballot on the spot and spits it out if there is double voting. Several comments (mine was one)referred to Diebolds's CEO's statement that he was committed to getting Bush the votes he needed to win in Ohio. Also the ES&S was most liked at a mall demo and voter practice. Two of the voting committee mentioned that Diebold was reluctant to turn over their source code. In the end they turned it over to the state.

[Immad2]

13. Thank you, Junkdrawer! May your day be filled with happiness! Great Job!

[Junkdrawer]

16. Thanks, but, as I said, others did the heavy lifting...

The woman from the League of Woman Votes was great. Regarding the discount deadline set by Diebold, she said "Frankly, when any salesman pulls that on me, it's my signal to walk out of the store." Applause.

[Immad2]

21. May you all have great days!

[Junkdrawer]

14. Priceless Moment:

The computer scientist from Pitt read the Diebold memos concerning the -16,000 vote for Gore from Volusia county in 2000.

Mark Radke was asked to respond and said "I'll have to get back to you on that one, this is the first time I've heard of it. Frankly, I don't think it happened."

I yelled "It was in all the papers. Volusia county had to do a full manual recount. Remember?".

[blue neen]

15. Has there been any decision on

what machines they are going to use in Westmoreland County?

I haven't heard anything lately.

[Junkdrawer]

17. I don't know, but the Feds are putting HEAVY pressure on the counties...

to move - they're threatening fines when the Feds haven't even specified the standards.

[canichelouis]

18. CRIMINAL

[demodonkey]

27. Westmoreland Suit Had Hearing in Commwealth Court today...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=203x412242

[Bill Bored]

22. The state WILL allow a paper trail as long as it's not a toilet paper

roll that preserves the order in which the vote were cast which undermines the secrecy of the ballot. So the Accupoll might be acceptable since it prints sheets of paper instead.

Am I wrong?

[demodonkey]

26. Correct. AccuPoll's VVPR needs only two minor changes to be certified.

They are done and ready for ITA testing.

Pennsylvania DOS report on AccuPoll mentions that it should come back for reconsideration after making those changes.

[Junkdrawer]

29. So far, the state has raised two objections:

1.) The continuous roll objection

2.) The "what would we do if there is a discrepancy" objection.

That latter is resolved by State bill 2000, but the bill was introduced by a Democrat and it's a Republican state congress. Now, a Republican congress wouldn't hold up a voting reform bill, would they? (*thinks of Rush Holt's bill languishing for two years now*).

[Bill Bored]

24. Was Michael Shamos in the room by any chance? nt

[Junkdrawer]

30. He was supposed to be there, but I didn't see him. n/t

[texpatriot2004]

25. Live Free or Diebold nm

[onthebench]

31. ES&S = Elections Stolen and Suppressed N/T