The REAL Problem: Uninspectable, non-transparent, privatized "voting" machines.

[tom_paine]

This morning on DU that battle lines are being drawn in the usual ways. Coincidence Theorists vs Conspiracy Theorists.

Well, let's cut through the sneering and the flames and have a look at the Big Picture, shall we?

During the 90s, while most of us "slept" blissfully unaware, our voting system was taken away from us. It "went dark" to us as it was privatized and Bushie Judges made a rapid series of non-reported judicial decisions that completely insulated voting machine manufacturers from any kind of scrutiny or inspection by the public or our representatives.

Coincidentally, legions of video poker and electronic slot machines in Vegas and elsewhere, are somehow by this same logic NOT proprietary, and the various gaming agencies feel perfectly comfortable in inspecting them twice a year for glitches and rigging. Ultimately, the stakes played for in Vegas and AC pale before the stakes of "the game" determined by these uninspectable, non-transparent "voting" machines...control of trillions of dollars of public monies and rule of a huge and resource-filled nation.

That's the bottom line. The larger pattern of the "coincidence" that suddenly, at the exact same time our voting system "went dark", NOW we get "Dewey vs. Truman" upsets every election?

Can the Coincidence Theorists admit this is a deeply disturbing pattern, particularly given the timing?

I am a scientist, and I understand that correlation does not necessarily mean causation.

Can the Conspiracy Theorists admit that not every anomaly automatically means vote-rigging? Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar, as it were.

Let's remember who the real enemy is: the people who foisted this Third-World non-transparent, uninspectable voting system on we who are are supposed to be "the free-est people in the world".

There is absolutely no way to determine if last night's "surprise upset" was real or not. Skinner's post on the Exit Polling is very interesting, but we saw in 2004 how the networks retroactively went back and redid their exit polls to match the results.

In 2002, there were no exit polls at all, and in that non-transparent darkness, we saw a number of "surprise upsets", like GA and MN. In 2006, there were numerous glaring discrepancies especially in Florida, all swept under the rug into what is now the customary darkness of legitimate requests for investigations refused, often by our own Democrats. And of course in 2000, the first year of extensive non-transparent privatized "voting", was the first of this apparently endless series of "surprise upsets", down in Florida.

[jus_the_facts]

1. K & R....fwiw....

....thanks for bringing this up...especially now...seems most like to forget about it then bitch in hindsight....sigh....at least that's been the trend for the last 8 years and I don't see much if any progress in the legal process in these matters over the same time period either. :nopity:

[tom_paine]

2. You're welcome. I also don't see much progress in the area you speak of.

For me the :wtf: :puke: moment came when the Democrats themselves suppressed further investigation into congressional races, most of them in FL and OH, where glaring discrepancies could have lead to catching the Bushie Bastards redhanded.

But once again, perhaps being afraid of looking like "sour grapes" (how does one get afraid of being accused of "sour grapes" when nationally, we still won, but that is another topic for another thread onthe puzzling cowardice and inaction of our supposed Democratic Leadership), no further investigations were made and those which started were quickly shut down by early 2007.

http://www.bradblog.com/?p=4460

:wtf: :puke:

[jus_the_facts]

3. Seems we're in for the same shit different decade regardless.....

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x2636329

[HCE SuiGeneris]

4. How did I miss this?

Major ass K & R

[helderheid]

8. ditto!

:applause:

[tom_paine]

5. 11 recs and only one kick? Bummer. I feel justified therefore in this shameless kick.

Plus two more gratuitous links to other threads which should also be read by all...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x2640000

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x2643951

[vickitulsa]

6. Another rec and kick

because this OP, my dear tom paine, summarizes and explains most cogently and eloquently the critical issue that underlies all the events and discussions of the NH primary vote.

Peace Patriot, Understanding Life, and others whom many of us here at DU have long known, respected, and trusted, have been trying to bring these same fundamental concerns to the forefront, and they've been eloquent, clear, and very earnest, as well. But your comments here deserve everyone's attention as we try to sort through this disturbing "aftermath."

We should NEVER have been put in this awful, troubling position in the first place! That we at DU or in the public at large should have ANY questions about vote counting and security still at this point is beyond outrageous.

Like you, I so fervently wish that those Coincidence Theorists who are so willing to accept the results we were TOLD were "official" and, in essence, "final" could see the problem with this course of (in)action; and I wish that the Conspiracy Theorists could admit that not every anomaly we encounter means votes are being rigged.

I certainly do not understand why either of those choices should be difficult to make!

We simply must (must!) regain our focus on the Big Picture again before what we've lost -- the most important thing of all concerning the selection of our next leaders in government, which is verifiable, unhackable vote counting that is NOT done in secret -- may very well be lost forever to all of us!

Do we have to endure the chaos and frustration ever longer now until it is truly too late, and we hear our fellow citizens laughing off our complaints way down the road because by then most of them will have completely accepted that "everything's okay with the machines" and that anyone who doesn't believe that assumption is a kook?

Can everyone not see how that would mean The End of democracy in America for real and understand how utterly disastrous that would be?


<Edited to correct a screen name mentioned>

[Bonobo]

7. k&r

[annabanana]

9. Having every vote count is the absolute BASELINE between

a free people and an enslaved people. It is our best and only protection from those who would abuse the power we put in their hands.

It is also highly inconvenient for anyone (on any side of any fence) who would use American Citizens as assets, commodities, chits in a high stakes game of Risk...., fodder, or anything else..

Absolute power corrupts absolutely and it should NEVER NEVER NEVER be handed over to anyone.

[smokey nj]

10. K&R!!

[Wilms]

11. Kick n/t