One problem I always had with some Christian churches I’ve been to

[raccoon]

is that when they say things like, “Do you accept Jesus Christ as your personal Savior?”

I’m like, “What does that mean?” That particular question still means nothing to me.

It’s all so vague, and I can’t deal with all that vagueness.

I grew up in a Protestant denomination (not fundie), and the message I got in church was that God was something spiritual and abstract and vague….and it all amounted to zero.

I need something specific. Such as what I posted in here about prayer recently.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=214&topic_id=110188&mesg_id=110188

That’s why I now attend a liberal church. :-)

[ThoughtCriminal]

1. My problem

I sometimes visit the fundy-in-laws church and noticed one thing above all. They never, seem to mention anything that Jesus actually said. How is that possible in a "Christian" church? It was as if the "Red Letters" are poison. I heard a lot from Paul and the Old Testament - not one word from Jesus.

If Satan were to set up a church to undermine the teachings of Christ, I do not see how it would differ from what the fundamentalist religious right teaches in America today.

[xchrom]

2. liberal/progressive churches are moving back away from

the concept of a ''personal'' god -- which is a relatively recent concept.

and it's very, very important -- churches like the episcopal church are moving back to the concept of a ''we'' god -- or god of community.

[CrispyQ]

3. We certainly need a more developed sense of community in this country. -nt

[xchrom]

4. indeed.

and i'm glad certain churches are taking on that interior examination.

[JerseygirlCT]

9. Yes, I've never, ever felt comfortable with the more recent

development of Jesus as your own personal best buddy.

God seems a far huger concept, and being, than my "buddy".

[Dorian Gray]

11. But...

I love the Buddy Christ from Dogma. ;)

Kidding

I'm more about community than worrying about what God wants for me. I personally think that looking out for community first is how we better our own lives, so that's a big part of my theological beliefs, as well.

[JerseygirlCT]

12. It's so easy to lose the part

about loving one another while focusing on some distant God figure.

I do believe that the lesson Jesus was sent to teach was that we ought to focus on loving each other -- and that that's the BEST way of loving God.

So yeah, take care of each other here, and worry less about loyalty oaths.

[Dorian Gray]

13. You are very correct

:)

As you may know from my previous comments, I am Roman Catholic. I realize that even within the Roman Catholic Church there are many people who view religion differently. There are very liberal believers (Martin Sheen) and there are very conservative practioners (Sean Hannity). There is a huge umbrella within the one branch of Christianity, let alone each and every other branch. People tend to focus on what resonates with them: the community aspect, the rules and regulations, the Old Testament, The Sermon on the Mount, etc. In that way, we each make it personal. But, God is not changing, it is our limited views of Him that are changing and imperfect. So, in that way, I suppose we each make a "personal God." But, He is not personal. (In my beliefs), He exists for all mankind, and He does not change in how each and everyone of us view Him. Rather, it is we that try to fit Him into our preconceived perceptions.

[xchrom]

14. my priest calls it the ''jesus is my boyfriend'' syndrome.

[Zebedeo]

5. It's not vague to me.

Here's the explanation of the "accepting Jesus as your personal Savior" issue.

[raccoon]

6. Thanks for the link. nt

[Zebedeo]

7. You are more than welcome. n/t

[Crunchy Frog]

15. Have you made a decision for Christ because of what you have read here?

If so, please click on the "I have accepted Christ today" button below. :rofl:

[Rabrrrrrr]

8. It's from a tradition that believes it acts on behalf of God and can make God do things

Accepting Jesus as one's personal savior, in their tradition, is the path to salvation, making salvation something that you do (by believing) instead of something that Jesus already did by dying on the cross and raising from the dead.

They have the same attitude toward baptism - that it is a human act, and not something that God does.

These are the same people whose praise songs are mostly "I I I I I I I I I I" and "me me me me me me me me me me" songs, and rarely a "we" or "our" or "us". It's very individualistic, and a type of Christianity that is uniquely American (though transported now throughout the world), growing up in the 1800s in America. The prosperity gospel movement and the Left Behind (rapture-based nonsense) come out of that tradition. It's not Biblical, nor very attached to historical Christianity.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

10. Your remark about "praise songs" reminds me of a humorous book

that came out about thirty or forty years ago called How to Become a Bishop Without Being Religious. One chapter dealt with how to become a popular minister in a large congregation, so that you could move up the hierarchical ladder.

One of its recommendations was to choose only hymns that contained a lot of mentions of "I" and "me": "Pass Me Not O Gentle Savior," "Rock of Ages, Cleft for Me," "I Love to Tell the Story," etc.

But the absolute worst of these is "My God and I."

My GOD and I go to the fields together.
We walk and talk, as good friends should and do.
We clasp our hands, our voices ring with laughter.
My GOD and I walk through the meadow heu.



He tells me of the years that went before me;
When Heavenly plans were made for me to be.
When all was but a dream of dim conception;
To come to life, first verdant glory see.


My God and I will go for aid together;
We'll walk and talk as good friends ever do.
This earth will pass and with it common trifles,
But God and I will go on eternally.