Some questions about The Golden Compass

[hedgehog]

I thought that Pullman was advocating a Zen Buddhist cosmology with a heavy flavoring of evolution.
Agree or disagree?

Pullman describes a hell - ghosts wandering a gray wasteland, occasionally tormented by Harpies. He describes the ultimate bliss as becoming one with everything (I think that's what happens.)

It occurred to me that I have heard of Buddhist Hells for sinners, but that losing self identity and becoming one with the cosmos seems to be the goal of the good. In other words, no heaven. Is this accurate?

[mac2]

1. It's a movie and Christians have more than their share.

[hedgehog]

7. Actually, I was referring to the books. I've since found out that the

collected books are referred to as His Dark Materials. My reaction is that Pullman made a very poor case for his world view. He denounces Christianity for the emphasis on self sacrifice, yet his main characters have to sacrifice their happiness for the sake of the cosmos. It wasn't clear at all to me why Lyra and Will were the fulcrum for saving the cosmos, why not any other lovers? Considering how Pullman emphasizes the role of chance, what would have happened to the cosmos of Lyra and Will had never met? Lyra's father is instrumental in the battle against the Ancient One, yet he accomplished this by murdering Lyra's friend. I could go on, but you see where I am going with this. I found that as the story progressed, the allegory became much more heavy handed while simultaneously making less sense.


Ultimately, the notion of a cosmos that allows for eternal suffering but offers only a scattering into component atoms as an alternative is not attractive to me.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

2. Depends on the type of Buddhism

In Hinayana Buddhism (the type that is most common in Tibet and Southeast Asia), the goal is release from the cycle of reincarnation in the form of annihilation of the individual identity. As I understand it, there's no hell, just a really bad fate when you're reincarnated.

In Mahayana Buddhism, (the type that is most common in China, Japan, and Korea), there are dozens of sects, and many of them have concepts that are similar to the Christian concepts of heaven and hell, dating back over a thousand years. Japan's Tale of the Heike, an epic dating from the twelfth century, has a chapter in which a corrupt regent, Kiyomori, dies and is carried off to hell, and it seems that there's also a belief that working one's way out of the cycle of reincarnation leads not to annihilation but to a heaven-like existence. This is especially true among the so-called Pure Land sects.

[ConcernedCanuk]

4. "there's no hell, just a really bad fate when you're reincarnated" - I wonder about that

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I've been exposed to many religions in my life, consider myself an agnostic by any measurable standard,

But wonder about reincarnation, and karma, which I think may be connected.

Sometimes I envy those with a profound "faith", while at the same time irritated by those that want to "convert" me in some fashion.

'tis a quandary I puzzle over now and then, but not to an obsessive degree.

I explain, to some, as well as myself, that there are SO many religious affiliations out there, that I could never possibly study each one to decide which one is "right".

So I sorta pick the values from one or another religion to make my "rules" of behavior for myself.

Mostly - I think I'm "OK", but

I'm still my worst critic.

[TechBear_Seattle]

5. Please keep in mind: "hinayana" is an insult

Mahayana means "greater vehicle" in Sanskrit; Hinayana means "lesser vehicle" and implies that the form of Buddhism practiced in India and Southeast Asia is somehow inferior to the form practiced farther east in China and Japan. The term you want is Theravata, which can be translated as either "teachings of the elders" or "ancient teachings."

The form of Buddhism practiced in Tibet is Vajrayana. In strictly Buddhist terms, it is closely related to Mahayana with a number of added features which make it distinct.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

6. Didn't realize that--it was the term used when I took a course in

Japanese Buddhism nearly thirty years ago.

[TechBear_Seattle]

8. The term is "controversial" in the world of scholarship

Evidence is that the term was created by adherents of Mahayana Buddhism as a polemic against adherents of the other school, and many of the scholarly Buddhist works come from Mahayana sources. On the other hand, Theravada Buddhism focuses on individual enlightenment while Mahayana focuses more on the salvation of the world, so the distinction between "greater" and "lesser" can be seen as the distinction between a wide focus and a narrow focus.

Still, in general, you would want to use Theravada rather than Hineyana. It makes the same distinction and is less likely to offend. :hi:

[Warpy]

3. Hell regions do exist for some Buddhist sects

and the people in them are people who can't let go of the past, who feel the need to be punished, usually for things that weren't even their fault. When they've had enough punishment, they progress, most likely to a rebirth.

That's one good thing about Buddhism, endless do-overs for people who aren't ready to let go of their egos.