The Cordoba House mosque is like gay marriage. This is why I'm rooting for it

[Ratty]

Supposedly enlightened people, even here on DU, say they support the right to build the mosque two blocks from ground zero but doing so reflects "poor judgment." I'm so sick of this argument, usually presented in sensitive, reasoned tones. The assumption is that there is some kind of legitimacy to the offense some people take to Islam and, especially in the case of people who lost loved ones 9 years ago, we should be especially sensitive to that offense and not upset them. Maybe being so "up front" about it actually works against the goal of slowly gaining public acceptance because it unnecessarily antagonizes some people. They have no objection to building the mosque, just not quite so close to sacred ground. Where have I heard that crap before? Oh yeah, people who have nothing against gays and think they should have all the same rights as straight married couples, just don't call it marriage OK? Marriage is sacred.

Just had to vent.

[Taverner]

1. When asked why I support the mosque - I answer simply

BECAUSE THIS IS AMERICA

That usually shuts them up

If it doesn't, I just repeat it

[damntexdem]

2. The only poor judgment is on the part of the opponents.

Except for the GOP politicos, where it isn't poor judgment, rather disgusting use of the log-term trauma of others in interests of short-term political gain.

[davidinalameda]

3. I'm sure all the dead gays and lesbians killed in majority Muslim countries

by the governments appreciate the comparison

[Ratty]

4. That's right. All Muslims are murderers and they all kill gays

And all gays are child molestors. Is that what you wanted to say?

[davidinalameda]

5. did I say ALL

no I didn't

reading comprehension is your friend

[mitchtv]

8. I just know they are not allies to gay people

never will be and would join the mormons to hang us all, if given the opportunity, I give them their first amendment right, that's all . They are more backward and hateful to Gays than almost any of the other useless religions, so yeah they have their rights, but don't ask me for more than that.

[mitchtv]

9. just remember the only time they joined with Xians and Jews

was to persecute Gays at Pride actions in Moscow and Jerusalem. A pox on all their houses.

[readmoreoften]

16. I'm sure all the dead gays and lesbians in Muslim countries wouldn't support

white anti-arab fascists in this country and I doubt they'd mind the comparison. :eyes:

[Sapphocrat]

6. Big difference.

There's no law against putting up the mosque. No matter how much outcry there may be, no matter if 100% of all New Yorkers are against it, the builder still has the right to do it, and no one and nothing can stop him.

As marriage equality goes (please don't call it "gay marriage" -- it's just marriage), those opposed to our equality will not be satisfied to allow us marriage as long as we "move five blocks away" (or to the next county, or to the next state).

Opponents of the mosque don't want it "in their backyard." Opponents of equality don't want our marriages anywhere.

I know your intentions are good, but the comparison fails.

[joeybee12]

7. I disagree...opponents of the mosque don't want ti anywhere either...

...read what some of the nutcases have to say if you go past their initial rhetoric.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

12. thats completely untrue. demonstrations against this mosque would occur

anywhere, as demonstrations against all mosques have appeared in the US recently

no one these days wants a mosque in their backyard

the logic is the same, the civil rights should apply to a particular minority but it offends the majority

[readmoreoften]

17. I actually think these people don't want mosques anywhere, either.

Mosques are being threatened all over the US right now. In Florida, Tennessee, etc. Even a Hindu temple in Austin. To many in the debate, the "mosque location" is a thin veil for wanting to eradicate arabs and other middle easterners from the US. In that way, its fascist intentions are very comparable to bigots who hide behind "I'm not against gays I just think marriage is 1man+1woman, etc..."

[Touchdown]

10. When I hear Cordoba, I think Rich Corinthian Leather!

[RetiredTrotskyite]

15. De Plane! De plane!

ROFL.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

11. yes, the logic used against it has the same bigotry behind it

[totodeinhere]

13. Islam teaches virulent homophobia. It's as bad or worse than Christian fundamentalists.

Remember when an alliance of Muslim countries derailed a UN gay rights resolution in 2003?

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2003/apr/25/gayrights.andrewosborn

Then when in 2008 the UN General Assembly denounced homophobia, there was widespread opposition to the resolution from Muslim countries.

To be fair, the Vatican and others also opposed it, and for that reason I am no big fan of the Catholic Church either. Or of the Mormons for that matter.

But it's hard for me to gather much sympathy for those who are trying to build this center near ground zero unless they can explicitly state that they are in favor of GLBT rights, and they have not done so.

[readmoreoften]

18. Many Mexican Catholics are anti-gay. It doesn't mean I support the Minute Men thugs.

Rights are rights, regardless of a populations "general" relationship to LGBT people. The fascist sensibilities embedded in this Mosque paranoia is the same irrational sensibility shown by homophobes.

More directly, individual muslims aren't collectively responsible for the collective governmental homophobia of a group of nations.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

14. as this thread proves, we would rather be bigoted ourselves than allow

everyone civil rights

its partly why we dont have any civil rights, because human beings are not rational. the 1st amendment applies to islam, whether or not you like the religion. likewise, we should have equal rights, whether or not one personally likes homosexuality. i find this entire thread depressing

[Ratty]

19. Sigh, I'm not surprised

All this talk about "they" and "them" is so familiar. Those muslims are anti-gay. Those muslims kill gays. Lump 'em all together, I'm too lazy to spend a moment thinking about it. It's a lot easier just to go with my gut and hate them all. Honestly, it's as if most Christians religions didn't espouse exactly the same sentiments toward gays as Islam does, but somehow I doubt we'd see the same gay outrage towards a Catholic church being built two blocks from ground zero.

[closeupready]

20. That's an excellent way to put it.

'Human beings are not rational.' That's it.