Right-Wing Religion and Poverty.....

[indianablue]

The single greatest recruitment tool for any religion is HARDSHIP. Hardship is the primary reason most people entered into religion.

So in the eyes of most right wing religious leaders the poorest and most troubled people are the most vulnerable to religion.

That is why right wing religious leaders do not mind poverty or hardship the more there is the more people will flock to them.

[Kerrytravelers]

1. My fundamentalist fruitcake bro and sis in law reveled in being

poor. He was a music minister. The parish supportd them, gave them cars, free trips to Disneyworld. She homeschooled, so they received all kinds of goods and services.

They live in a bubble away from anyone who isn't just like them. Seriously, my husband and I are the only two people they remotely know who don't drink kool-aid and wear brown shirts.

PS I hate these people. Seriously. We don't even talk to his family anymore because of what they are doing to this country.

[StClone]

2. Exactly explains Country's Right turn, too

Needy, under-educated people have access to less media outlets and vulnerable to Corporate media manipulation.

[coloradodem2005]

3. It reminds me of when I went to church and...

...they said "Economically things have never been so good. Morally things have never been so bad." This was back in 1999 after Clinton got off from impeachment.

[Ian David]

7. Have you seen some of the religious advertising?

There are TV commercials that look at first as if they're advertising Prozac. "Desperate? Confused? Cry for no reason? Nothing makes you happy? Vulnerable and suggestible? Come to our church."

I see ads like that ALL the time.

Especially the copies of The Watchtower left in the supermarket literature racks (In Spanish, "Desperati?").

I even saw one ad on the subway that claimed, "Jesus cured my breast cancer!"

I put a sticker on the ad that said, "These statements have not been evaluated by the FDA..."

[coloradodem2005]

11. I think I missed most of those.

I only saw the one for UCC. THe one that says "We don't discriminate."

[hughee99]

4. I disagree...

The single greatest "recruitment tool" for any religion is reproduction. The primary reason most people enter religion is because they are taught it by their parents.

How is hardship not a recruitment tool for any group? Almost any group that's looking to bring in as many new members (and not just as many new contributors) as it can, whether it's religious, political, or social looks to the "poorest and most troubled people". The pitch is, "You need help, our organization can help you, let us tell you more about what we do as members of <your religion or organization here>" It's easier to "sell" someone on your ideas when they need your help, because they are willing to listen.

Edited for grammar.

[jedr]

5. and that's why

the repugs are funding them through "faith bases"....keep them poor, blame it on Liberals and hand out you're voting guides every two years...I'm sure Christ had this in mind!!!!!

[Tux]

10. Makes sense

Why middle-class jobs and even entry level jobs for college grads keep heading to India or China. If we're poor, need help, some nice Evangelical faith-based group can help....as long as you convert.

At this point, I find it sickening that "Christians" would vote for a man that sent so many jobs overseas with his tax breaks and tax cuts. Gay marriage? Who cares? Where are the jobs people need to maintian a family?

[Psephos]

6. I agree with your premise, but not your conclusion

(and please note, I'm posting this as only my opinion - I think in order to make inroads with RW religious people you have to first commit to understanding them)

Hard times and personal troubles make many people psychologically receptive to a message of hope and a better way of living. Religion is the de facto bearer of such messages. (Naturally, there can be quite a difference between the message and the reality.)

But almost any organized group that claims they have truth to dispense and balm for what ails you will find a listening ear among the downtrodden. This goes for political groups as well as religious. Put your trust in Jesus, or put it in A.N.S.W.E.R., I sometimes don't see a huge difference when the organization to which you give your allegiance is hawking a fiercely-defended set of dogmas. This is as good an argument as any for all of us to keep an open mind, even as we rightly defend our politics.

Now, with regard to your conclusion, the idea that rightwing religious leaders actually like poverty and hardship among their followers doesn't ring true with the psychology underlying religious conversion. If people don't see their lives improving after following a religion, sooner or later, they are going to find something else that does deliver the goods (no pun intended). Religious rapture is one thing, but having velveeta in the fridge when the kids are hungry is another. Also, many RW religious believe that God rewards good works. Again, if you are poor, and you join a church, and you start tithing or at least hitting the collection plate, and doing other things that cost some $$ in pursuit of your religion, sooner or later you're going to ask yourself, ok, what's in this for me? If life sucks either way, might as well stay home on Sundays.

Furthermore, I've noticed that churches often help out their own when one of their members hits a rough spot. My guess is this charity also comes with some admonitions about how to get out of the jam, and make some changes so it doesn't happen again. Naturally, charity (whether internal or external) requires the church to have some disposable money. Churches don't hate money. Quite the opposite.

Bottom line is that many RW churches encourage less-destructive lifestyles, and so, provide a net improvement in the fortunes of their members. This reinforces desire to stay affiliated. Even when this doesn't happen, many churches provide an extra layer of safety net. Neither of these seem compatible with the idea of manipulated poverty.

Just my $0.02 worth.

Peace.

[mermaid]

8. Well....

I am a member of a Unitarian Universalist Church, and describe myself as a "Unitarian Christian."

I'm in a bit of a jam right now. My church is helping ME. The one organizing the drive for food for me has kept my name anonymous...and the individual donors have also remained anonymous.

I have, of course, asked the coordinator to pass on my thanks to those who've contributed.

I have now gotten what I needed to get me thru these times and asked any further donations be diverted to any other known member of the church in similar straits, as I do not wish to take more than I need...and expressed my sincere hope that, once back on my feet, I will be able to repay, by answering the call...when someone else in my church is in a similar state of need.

And all of this is done without the donor knowing who the recipient is...or the recipient knowing who the donor is...or any sort of proseltyzing or anything. It needs being done?? Someone does it!!

Anyway, I got the two weeks worth of food I needed.

Short-term help until I could get unemployment benefits started, and my tax refund in my pocket.

[Psephos]

9. Mermaid, more power to you

I hope your circumstances only improve from here on out. We all hit a rough patch now and then, and the hardest part about it is the feeling that when you're in a hole, there's no ladder out. But of course, there is.

I have some friends who are Unitarians and I have to admit I like the Unitarian principles a lot. Your own experience only bolsters my views.

Although I'm not a churchgoing person myself, I think we on DU do a disservice to others as well as ourselves by stereotyping those who are. Again, there is a deeper layer connecting all of us, left and right, than our politics. Let's call it our humanity.

To that end, I think we should make extra effort to separate our dislike for some churchgoers' politics from our dislike for them personally. I hear a lot of lipservice for that here, but it rings hollow when thread after thread is full of Fundie-this and Jesusland-that, and general proclamations that RW Christians are essentially subhuman.

We'll never reach any of them that way. But we can reach some of them at least by learning more about them, understanding how they came to hold their opinions, and demonstrating that left ideas are far more in line with their own hopes and desires than they realize. In particular, Christian ideas of charity and forgiveness have great overlap with left ideas of equality and concern for the disadvantaged. That's a great place to start.

Good luck, Mermaid. :-)

Peace.

[MountainLaurel]

12. Quote from Napolean

paraphrased: "Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich."