The Eternal Quest for the Perfect Drug: Espresso Machines.

[politicat]

It's time to declare surrender in the war on electrics in this house and accept that some things must be powered. Especially espresso makers.

The stovetops are hard to clean, hard to find gaskets for, and make a rather bitter cup of espresso. That's fine if I'm covering the bitterness with milk and sugar and chocolate, but I like lattes, too, dammit.

The French Press is not a problem, but the kettles are - the electric one we've been using is dying a slow, sad death of temp loss, while the stovetop one takes an elephant's age to heat up - 20 minutes for hot water is too long when the cells are complaining about blood in the caffeine arteries.

So we're thinking espresso maker - good one, not a cheapie - that has a steamer thingie (forgive me for not knowing the technical terms - I was too short to work at the coffee house when I was in college), makes espresso, and maybe has a hot water reservoir. A friend has one that also makes autodrip, but her model is not to be found and I'm not sure about the others in the line.

Please recommend something. I may be forced to turn to... instant.

[Dora]

1. I used to have a cheapo Braun, I think it was.

It was okay. I finally sold it at a garage sale because I didn't use it enough to justify the clutter. We make drip coffee in the morning (cheapo Braun again).

If I were to get another one, I'd probably be a purist and go for a stovetop model. I was just browsing this page and adding items to my wish-I-could-have list. http://fantes.com/espresso_stovetop.htm

[politicat]

3. Got three. Want them?

Urgh. They are the most obnoxious pieces of crap I've ever come across. They take forever to cool down enough to clean them, they can't go in the dishwasher, they require a quirky brush to get them really clean, they tarnish when exposed to the gas flame, if you are doing a morning routine thing and can't stand right over it to watch it EVERY SECOND it will invariably boil over or burn the coffee, they get calcium scale at the drop of a gallon of distilled water, the gaskets are impossible to find, and even if you do manage to make a perfect cup... they're sized wrong. The one that says it's a 2 shot is more like a shot and a quarter, but the one that is a 6 shot is more like an eight shot. And the four shot maker is the one that likes to spatter all over the stove.

Things I don't need in the morning.....

Oh, and the top, where the coffee ends up, picks up the worst flavors of either the soap used to clean it or the oil dregs if I just rinse it in hot water.

Grr. Argh. They're going in the scrap metal heap.

[Stinky The Clown]

2. Hoooo boy .... NO NO NO to instant. Your friendly equipment pusher is here

.... is here to help you out!

For home espresso makers, there are a number of options. Easiest is the stovetop jobbies .... like this.



Cheap and easy, they make a bitterish (to my taste) cup of something that, indeed, resembles espresso. But they can't steam milk and you can't make another cup until the pot cools down (cuz, with the internal pressure it builds, you can't open it, even if you wanted to).

Next step up are the little buzz boxes. Like this one ....



There are at least a brazillian of these on the market from all sorts of manufacturers. They all have in common that they have a pressurized water reservoir in which water is boiled. That boiled water is pumped through a portafilter (the removable thing at the front that has a handle and that has the dose of ground coffee in it). There is not a one of this genre that is worth the money you'll pay for it. Trust me. Not one. And I have personally owned seven of them over the years, always in the quest for the perfect cuppa. These are NOT the answer. I call them buzz-boxes in honor of the tinny sound they make as their weak-assed little pumps try like hell to get to 15 bars of pressure. They never do get there, by the way.

Next are the various serious pump machines. Like this, from Gaggia ...



While these seem to resemble the buzz boxes, they are fundamentally different. These have an internal boiler into which water from the (unheated and unpressurized) reservoir is pumped, heated on demand, and forced through the portafilter. These make a credible cuppa. But they take a mixture of art and voodoo to make a repeatable cup. The grind, the tamp, the time, all matter. And in these machines, you control much of them. Unless you're an anal perfectionist, you won't want to bother. Particularly in the morning. When you would kill even your sainted mother for that first cup. Again, I have direct experience with these. They work, but they're a monumental pain in the ass.

There are many makers of this type machine. They cost in the $200 and up range.

Next - or maybe better said - parallel - are the lever machines. La Pavoni's Europicola is the state of the art. You all know what it looks like because it is the prototypical 'espresso maker'.



I have one of these, too. The 16 cup model. The devotees to the Pavoni are indeed a weird bunch. Almost cult-like. They even brag about this modification or that which has been crafted for their machine. Goggle 'em up sometime. Scary! But the bottom line is, these require even more care and personal discipline than the portafilter pump jobbies. They rely on the calibration of your arm strength and speed as you pull the lever down to extract that golden brew. My own experience has ranged from espresso nirvana to a cup of pure drek ... all in the same session. The results from these are, to say the least, variable. Very variable.

But the price is not variable. It is high. As much as a thou for the top end 16 cup model in all polished brass. However, there is an upside to these. they are a true sculptural thing of beauty. Ours is in a place of honor in our dining room .... but it is **purely** decorative now.

Last - and my strong recommendation - is one of the superautomatics. These range from a low of about $350 and range to well over 2 grand. You will find a sweet spot in the low end of about $500 to $700.

I have one each of these two .....

A Saeco Vienna Deluxe:


A Saeco Magic Deluxe


But, were I to buy one now, Saeco has a new model that I'd choose. The Incanto


Forgetting for a moment all the various little bells, whistles, and doo-dads, what do these things need to be a good day to day home espresso maker?

A burr grinder built into the machine

The ability to program your favorite settings so you get repeatability.

Steam to make foamed milk.

A by-pass doser so you get a brew from ground coffee if you wish. Like, if you have hi-test beans in the machine's hopper but have a guest who wants some decaf. With the bypass doser, you can put a shot's worth of ground coffee into the machine and get a cup not from your own bean stash.

Rapid Steam - which is Saeco's name for the system. It is the ability to go from brewing coffee to steaming milk - and back again, with no wait. In essence, there are two separate boilers in the machine.

So why do I suggest the Incanto?

My Vienna has rapid steam, but no bypass doser and no cup heater. My Magic has a cup heater and bypass doser, but no rapid steam. In my view, rapid steam is the **must** have. A cup warmer and a bypass doser might get some use ... but not much, although we **do** keep cups on the Magic's warmer and we often use the warmer as a way to melt chocolate or proof dough. The temp is just about perfect for that! The Incanto has all of this and more .... like automatic descaling.

Of these three, if you want the one at the sweet spot, get the Vienna Deluxe.

I have only spoken about Saeco. There are, to be sure, other manufacturers. The real issue, however, is that many of them buy their guts from Saeco and wrap it in their own skins and add their own controls. To me, just go with the source, yanno? Not to say any of them are bad ..... or even more pricey.

Two online sources for these are Whole Latte Love and Aabree Coffee. I bought one machine form one of them and one machine from the other. One of my machines was new and one was a reconditioned unit. I am perfectly happy with both. I would not hesitate to again buy from either of these companies.

Check out their websites. They really have a lot of info about espresso makers ... including comparisons and feature explanations.

http://www.aabreecoffee.com/
http://www.wholelattelove.com/

Consider a reconditioned unit. The savings is pretty good. Couple hundred bux on my Magic.

Now ... all is not peaches and cream with superautos. They need regular maintenance. Religiously regular maintenance. Focused maintenance. Unskipped maintenance.

Or they break.

My Vienna Deluxe once spent three weeks in the shop and cost well over $200 bux to fix. My Magic also needed a new boiler. But the guy who serviced my Vienna convinced me to do it myself. And he talked me through it all. And yanno? It was easy. Knowing what i do about your propensity to fix shit, you can fix an espresso machine, too. So after that first foray into service, I learned how to do it myself. I have replaced a number of parts on both machines. And only the new boiler for the Magic cost more than a few bux. The pricey parts are the boilers. Almost a hundred bux. The pumps are cheaper. Maybe 30 bux. Steam valves less than 20 bux.

**ALL** of that can be mostly avoided by frequent descaling. I didn't do mine often enough and paid the price. All my repairs except for the steam valve on my Vienna were the result of my sorry, lazy ass. Not the machines. The machines both perform well and constantly. It is I who failed them. Not the other way around.

Here's my service guy's website. Check this one out too. He has a boatload of good info on all manner of espresso makers.

http://www.partsguru.com/default.asp

Anyway .... I could go on ...... but my recommendation is a Saeco superautomatic.

[politicat]

4. Okay....

Re Stovetop models: See my rant about them to Dora. Great Merciful Zeus, I hate the ones we have - and we have (or have had) one of each model on the market. Grr. Argh.

We had one of the target specials for a while. Eh. Whatever. I think it went away. At least, I can't find it, so I prolly wrote it off as a tax deduction after giving it to some worthy charity resale shop.

We already have the burr grinder - and other than it occasionally turns itself on for NOT A BLOODY REASON IN THE WORLD!!!!! (usually while I'm reading something without music on and the house is super-spooky quiet) I like the little bugger. Does a good job going from powder all the way up to big ole chunks o' beans. It's a Capresso, this one:
I suppose it could come over to the kitchen side of the house and become the spice grinder (since the little braun I have does a crap job on cinnamon) but I think My Slave to the Bean is attached to it.

We are currently without an autodrip maker - between the french press and the little Brew and Go my dear Slave to the Bean bought when he was in college (and which makes a damn good cuppa joe) we don't often need anything the presses can't handle. And we got presses... a 56 ounce lexan jobbie, a coupla 32 ounce glass ones, and some mini one cuppers. When we moved, the old autodrip was attached to the wall, so it stayed. It's now a bit of smoke and water damaged melted plastic.

As much as I love the look of the lever machines, I know better. I don't have the consistent strength. So I think the steam issue is critical - I can use steam to boil water for tea as well as frothing (and I'm getting sick of kettles everywhere....)... Looks like I'll be looking for a vienna, then....

[Stinky The Clown]

5. They're always on eBay .... ****but**** .......

..... I don't trust the sellers there to deliver quality stuff.

Go to either of the sites I linked and see if they have reconditioned units. They usually do. If you can spring for a new one, that's best, but, as I said, my Magic is a recon and has performed admirably.

On edit ..... any superauto that steams milk will also dispense hot water. And that's pretty much all of them. But, if you're a discerning tea drinker, mere 'hot'water won't do. Quality tea always starts with rolling, boiling water.

[politicat]

6. Only for black tea.

And only in the English fashion. Russian tea should be boiled in the kettle until it whacks you back with the spoon, then thinned with hot water from the samovar, while western Asian teas are usually steeped in the morning, then rewarmed during the day when drunk (unsalted butter ONLY here...).

Asian style tea starts with water between 180 and 190 degrees, lower for white tea, higher for twig type teas. And for Indian type tea beverages, it's not just boiling water, but simmering for several minutes to half an hour. Oolong water starts boiling, but the water should be allowed to sit for a few moments after coming to a boil, while Japanese Sencha's water is placed in the cups to warm them, then poured back in the cast iron pot for brewing (thus bringing down the water temp to about 170). And when you get into scented (i.e. jasmine green, rose congou, chrysanthymum, etc) there's a whole 'nother world of temps and times and methods. 200+ degree water will ruin any jasmine that isn't given away free at Chinese restaurants - bitter, sour and utterly undrinkable. Only the cheapest of jasmines can stand up to 200+ temps, and most of them should have the first infusion discarded because the flower infusion is too scented, and the tea flavor can't make it through....

We have a digital thermometer JUST for tea water in this house. If I want to do English tea here, I have to nuke the water - at 6000 feet elevation, water doesn't get much above 192 degrees - even at a full, rolling boil. It requires steam pressure (or a microwave) to raise the water temp above that.

That said, 190 is the average temp I use for most of my blends. (I'm the slave to the Camellia bush in this house.....)

[Warpy]

8. My Chinese frends were most unpretentious about tea

and would simply boil water, fill a cup or glass, rub some tea leaves between their fingers as they dropped them into the water, and wait a couple of minutes to start drinking. No pot, no strainer, no nothing. Just let the leaves steep and settle and start to drink the brew unadorned with sugar, cream, or yak butter.

They also used a giant thermos bottle to store water they'd heated first thing in the morning so they'd always have hot water for their tea, which they guzzled constantly, usually 3 cups of tea from the same batch of leaves.

My friends from the UK were similarly unpretentious. They'd boil water, rinse out the brown Betty with a little to warm her up a bit, then fill the pot. They'd drop in a spoonful of loose tea and stir it into the water, count to 20, and pour. This only works with strong black teas, and certainly not with any variety sold in the US. Don't try it unless you've got a supply of PG Tips, that is.

But this is pure off topic digression. I can't tell the difference between espresso and battery acid, so I pass.

[Stinky The Clown]

9. S'easy ...... Battery acid is the stuff that's palatable

[politicat]

18. No ebay.

We don't use it. Ever.

I worked for a guy for a short time who sold on ebay. His ethics were so questionable and his policies so bad that I can't bring myself to consider ebay a source for anything... because he was highly rated. Very scary.

[Stinky The Clown]

16. ****CAUTION****

Don't get a plain old Vienna (dark gray body compared to the Vienna DeLuxe's silver bodY). The Vienna does not have the rapid steam and it is not on a turntable. The machines fill from the back and the sides. The turntable makes service easy. Withut it, you need to lift and turn. Not easy or fun.

If you plan to do any caps or lattes, you'll never forgive yourself for not getting the rapid steam.

There are three 'Vienna" models.

The plain old Vienna, as described above. Dark gray housing.

The Vienna DeLuxe which adds more controls, the rapid steam and the turntable. Silver housing and a pushbutton control panel.

The Vienna Digital (now discontinued but (maybe) still available new and (surely still available) reconditioned)) which adds digital controls including a diagnostics and more programming options. Silver housing with the pushbuttons plus an LED control panel screen.

[NMDemDist2]

11. hey H2S i gotta ask you a question about your Saecos. I have had mine

for almost four years and other than a set of burrs, haven't had to do a thing to it and you have had to have both of yours worked on so...... my question. Do you turn them off every night?

we put an average of 10-15 double shots a day through ours day in and day out. no probs on an older magic deluxe, BUT we NEVER turn it off. and (I am embarrassed to admit) my home machine gets very short shrift on the whole "maintenance" thing (my commercial machine is babied and professionally maintained quarterly, daily maintenance by me)

i'm confused and wondering if you turn them off. that is the only thing I can figure why you'd have the troubles with them :crazy:

edit to add, or your water? we use Arizona high country spring water with no filtration on ours and have had to de-scale twice in 4 years :shrug:

[Stinky The Clown]

14. Ours is always on .... 24/7/365. I pull about six or eight shots a day ...

... from the Vienna. Sparkly pulls maybe 4 or five from the Magic in the morning. Then I pull another two doubles from the Magic at night.

Sometimes on weekends the Magic is going (seemingly) non-stop if there's people here.

My service guy asked me the same question ... do I leave it on all the time. He actually suggested that was part of the reason my Magic's boiler failed. It actually still worked, but the gasket popped a minor leak. He says you should turn it off at night (or even in the morning if you'll not be making any more till the next morning).

I've chosen to ignore this particular bit of advice since it seems to me counterintuitive of everything I know about thermal expansion. That said, the guy who told me is a whiz when it comes to anything espresso. (Literally, Saeco sends him their basket cases when their shop can't handle the work.)

Our water is someplace in the middle. I'm guessing 4 descalings a year would be enough, but after yanking the guts from two machines, I'm finding it far easier and and way less tense to just do it once a month. As you know, descaling these machines is a cake walk. Just as easy as brewing coffee.

By the way, one tip he gave me about the Magic is to run a container of coffee cleaner (not necessarily descaler) through the brew group. Just fill the tank with the cleaner solution, select the bypass doser and a long pull, and don't add coffee. Pull as many of these ersatz shots as it takes to empty the tank. I've done this twice now and the brew group is really a lot cleaner than I can otherwise get it. With no bypass, this won't work on the Vienna, which will not run a brew cycle if there are no beans in the hopper.

Hey .... did you ever fix the grinder in yours? Last I heard, you were using a Rocky and the bypass doser. The grinder is maybe the easiest repair of all to make.

[NMDemDist2]

15. hmmm, great idea about the cleaner through it and as for the burrs

that was freaking Xmas 2004! i had it fixed in 4 days (paid extra for 2 day air shipping) :rofl:

but that's interesting about the seals huh? did you catch the ebay store Saeco put up? that's my next one i'll bet. but since I just spent $650 for a new laptop that danged espresso machine better keep chugging.......

[yellowdogintexas]

7. I have a Krups single cup espresso /w frother, which I acquired

for $29 at a Ross store. Original price: $89.
I love the thing, but then I am not a purist or connesuier (sp), Ijust am enjoying my new toy. Found an awesome brew at Central Market, locally roasted and had it ground for the machine.

It takes a bit to heat up for the first cup, but not as long as waiting for a kettle of water to boil for pouring through a French Press or Melitta cone.

You can switch from brew to steam instantly, and there is a little indicator line on the carafe..when the coffee is at that level, there is also enough steam to froth the milk. It has a gizmo that will allow you to do two small cups of espresso at once,
instead of into a carafe if you like.

I fill up my little carafe for 4 cups (which is the smaller espresso size cup, I think) and pour in the water, when it is about half brewed, then I switch to steam, foam up my milk and then switch it back to brew until it finishes. Good stuff. It makes a pretty large cup, and I can steam enough milk to make it more of a latte than a cappucino if I like.

Now, if I just want some normal coffee, I still use my very cheap 4 cup electric drip machine. When it dies I will most likely replace it with the new 4 cup size Mr Coffe which turns itself off and has a pre set feature, just like the big ones.

[NMDemDist2]

10. costco is your friend, both H2S and I have these and I (for one) swear

by them. AND!!!!!! they are half the price I paid for mine!

120v, pour in water and beans, perfect froth and shots every time! but since I sell these things, you have to buy some coffee to make up for my giving up my source! ROFL



http://www.costco.com/Browse/Product.aspx?Prodid=11049201&whse=&topnav=&browse=&s=1

or go directly to the source, Saeco-USA

http://stores.ebay.com/Saeco-USA

[Stinky The Clown]

12. They changed that a little from the one's you and I have .......

... the control panel is one obvious difference.

Alas ... still no "Rapid Steam".

But you're right. Great machines.

[NMDemDist2]

13. yeah but the only thing i use the steam wand for is to heat my milk when

I make bread. It's only purpose in life in my house is to wake up instant yeast :rofl:

[politicat]

17. I'll see if they have one on the shelf when I'm there today....

There's a part of me that says "That's too much technology for you, missy!" but dammit, I'm not functional before I've had tea/coffee/meds/food.

And if I can compact the coffee station from 3 feet of countertop space to 18 inches, that's a net gain.

[NMDemDist2]

19. you may need to order it from them. the only place i've seen them is in

the "Business Centers" of which there are only 6 nationwide

[wildeyed]

22. You guys are killing me.

I have looked at this thread like four times now.

Must. Not. Buy. $600 coffee machine.........

I am the only person in this house who even drinks coffee, and I can only have a limited amount due to blood sugar issues. But someday, when I am rich and old(er), I am getting one of these Saecos you speak of. I may go in with my sis and get one for my parent's 40th anniversary. There is always much bitching and complaining at their house over who drank the last cup of coffee and then didn't make a new batch. This machine would put an end to that conversation once and for all. Plus I could use it when I visit :)

[NMDemDist2]

23. ROFL

agreed, this is a pretty major commitment of money and (perhaps more importantly) counter space for an occasional cuppa

as for your folks, this works best if they also have some sort of hot water dispenser (I have a big 5 gallon hot/cold dispenser) to make Americanos which will be close to a "normal" cup of coffee

[wildeyed]

26. Hmmm, I will post when the anniversary gets closer.

I want to be certain this is the right thing for them. Also, I should probably check to be certain it will fit in their kitchen.

[Stinky The Clown]

24. Here's one hell of a deal for ya .........

In my estimation, this is the crown jewel of Saeco's product line. This is the Italia, which was recently renamed the Incanto. They're the same machine. A new Incanto is getting close to $1,000.



Whole Latte Love has refurbushed Italias for $425 in black and stainless and for $460 in candy apple red (in case Mom and Dad are that sort of people :) ). As I said above, I bought a refurbushed Magic Deluxe from these people and it was a good purchase and a great price.
http://www.wholelattelove.com/outlet/products/italia.cfm?cid=2

Aarbee Coffee has 'em too ... for about 10 bux more. Scroll down to the bottom of this link:
http://www.aabreecoffee.com/reconditioned.cfm

[wildeyed]

25. You are an evil man, H2S.

Cause you *know* I really want it for myself. And I am a candy apple red kinda person, too.

(repeating to self: must. not. buy. $600 coffee machine. must. not. buy. $600 coffee machine) :o

[grasswire]

20. my unusual solution

...is a barista in the family whose espresso shop is a block away. Otherwise I'm happy with french press and fresh-ground turkish roast beans and heavy cream.

I prefer espresso over ice to anything else, really. No water, no foam, just two shots over ice with cream.

[Wordie]

21. A low-tech alternative to expresso...(coffee ephemera)

I love coffee, and back before I realized that I just can't handle too much caffeine, I used to make Turkish coffee, which is even stronger than espresso. It can be made either sweet or not, and traditionally, the sweet coffee is served on happy celebratory occasions, while sad occasions such as funerals, omit the sugar. The grind is so fine that it resembles the texture of talcum powder, and it is made on the stovetop in a special long-handled pot:



These are called "ibriks" in Turkey, and "rakwehs" (sp?) in Lebanon.

There's a ritual to the preparation (dating from the 16th century). This is the Lebanese method:

Ahweh (Arabic word for "coffee")

2 demitasse cups of water + just a little
2 level teaspoons of sugar
2 or 3 heaping teaspoons of Turkish-grind coffee
1 cardomom pod (optional)

Place the sugar, the coffee and the cardamom pod (if desired) in the rakweh, and stir well. Bring to a boil over medium heat. Foam will rise to the top, and when it does, remove the coffeepot from the heat until the foam subsides. Spoon a little of the foam into each cup. Return the pot to the heat and bring to a boil again, until the foam rises again. Traditionally, the foam is allowed to rise three times.

(Makes two demitasse cups of Turkish coffee.)

This is for a medium-sweet cup of coffee (called "mazbut" which means "just right"). There will be a coffee silt left in the bottom of the cup after the coffee is drunk. You can vary the amounts: the proportions are 1 demitasse cup of water to one teaspoon of sugar and one heaping teaspoon of coffee for mazbut sweetness. You could also use more or less sugar, depending on your taste.

It's really good, but very strong.

And for really low-tech consider the Puerto Rican method: the coffee is placed in a thingie (sorry, I don't recall the name) with a cloth bag that has a long handle. The bag with the coffee in it is submerged into the water and it's brought to a boil. I'm pretty sure that the method is to let it boil up several times, as in the Turkish method (this would make sense, as there was a Moorish influence on Spain, right about the time of the conquest of latin America), and if I recall, the coffee bag is raised and lowered during the process, to extract as much flavor from the coffee inside. I've looked for the bag devices in latin markets, but never have managed to find one. This of course, doesn't quite achieve the fine-tuned and reproducible results that H2S was mentioning (!), but it gives a surprisingly good cup of coffee, as I recall.