Interesting...

[YvonneCa]

...story.


http://www.ipsnews.net/news.asp?idnews=41398


Discussion here:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x3205388

[beachmom]

1. I just hope that their stories and the people telling them have been fully vetted.

Don't forget that fraud Jesse Macbeth, and don't forget that one of the guys organizing the original Winter Soldier Investigation lied about his rank thereby tainting the event, which Pentagon papers show a lot of truth telling happened. I don't like the fact that they used the same name, and frankly, I prefer VoteVets.org.

[YvonneCa]

2. Good point...

...beachmom. I hadn't thought about that.

[TayTay]

3. Did anyone see the Frontline PBS show on Haditha?

It was a very good look at what happened in Haditha in Nov of '05. You can see the program at: http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/haditha/

For me, this is a painful discussion and one that is not clear. There are out and out instances of wrong-doing and murder in wartime. But in a lot of these cases these things happen when something in the chain of command has gone very, very wrong. I don't think that all those who bear responsibility for the Abu Ghraibs and the My Lai's of war pay the price.

I cannot imagine being the parent of one of the Marines charged with murder in Haditha. Their sons did not leave their hometowns as killers or misfits or psychopaths or anything like that. They left to serve their country. I think sometimes these stories of atrocities are told but are not fully told or explained. What happened, why did it happen, could it have been prevented, was there enough training, was there a clear enforcement of the Rules of Engagement or was this something that happens in 'the fog of war?'

I would like to hear what comes out of these new meetings in DC, but I am not prejudging anyone. I think these are complex cases that often detail official abandonment of young people who serve their country and are left to deal with situations for which they have no training. I think bad things happen in war. That is why war should always be the very last resort after all other efforts have been exhaustedly undertaken and have failed.

[YvonneCa]

4. I agree with everything...

...you say here, TayTay. War is awful, and should not be undertaken unless absolutely necessary.

I have heard of the PBS program you mentioned, but I have not seen it. I will definitely watch. I DO remember watching John Kerry take questions after speaking (I think at Georgetown University) where he was asked about this issue by the students there. His answer showed such profound understanding of war and what can happen in wartime...even to good people sent to fight for their country. He stressed the importance of leadership that demonstrates our country's BEST moral values...all the way down the chain of command...and how the Iraq situation underscores the incompetence of this administration in allowing things like Abu Ghraib to occur. You said it well: "I think these are complex cases that often detail official abandonment of young people who serve their country and are left to deal with situations for which they have no training." Official abandonment.

And I think (because I live nearby and there was some local news coverage) at least one Marine charged in the Haditha situation was from Camp Pendleton, here in California. I remember hearing about one Marine's parents speaking out to defend their son. I felt, and still feel, terrible for them. Knowing that this war should never have been waged...and then watching real human beings try to cope with the 'fallout' is just heart-breaking. Especially when it seems to me (as a 'boomer' :) ) that we should have learned these lessons from Viet Nam. How is it that we have a president that allowed this to happen again? I will NEVER understand that.

[wisteria]

5. Thanks for posting this. I will be very interested in seeing how this turns out.

The Republicans are aware this is going to take place. I have to wonder what type of rhetoric they have in store for these veterans.

[YvonneCa]

6. You are...

...welcome. :) As to rhetoric, my prediction is that they will counter with stories of veterans that 'fit their mold' of patriotism (ie. no dissent, and everything in Iraq is going well), in an attempt to discount what the IVAW present. It should be interesting.