Oh, wonderful. Hillary taking another shot at Kerry and Gore.

[beachmom]

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x5487101

Pressed on whether she truly believes Obama is an elitist, Clinton called him “a good man,” but recalled the narratives of the 2000 and 2004 president election.

“You don’t have to think back too far to remember that good men running for president were viewed as being elitist and out of touch with the values and lives of millions of Americans,” she said.

You know, this is the Kerry forum, and I have tried to keep the majority of the heat of the primary out of here. But when Hillary takes a direct shot at Kerry, well to hell with it. Completely uncalled for and shameless. She should apologize. By the way, when Kerry announced he would not run for president, and Hillary was trying to get his fundraisers (she was not that successful apparently), she referred to Kerry as a "good man". See, you have to understand, calling someone a "good man" is a derogatory remark from her. Ugh. I just can't stand hearing another word from this person. Oh, and spare me her wiggle word: "were viewed as". She was trying to knock two great Americans down who have more integrity by breakfast time than she will have in her lifetime.

[JI7]

1. her husband is a whore

what does she think about how her husband's behavior in the oval office with the cigar and intern led people to turn to religion and other things rather than vote for Gore.

oh, and Gore was behind by double digits until he picked Lieberman for VP. it took Gore associating himself with someone who was known for being critical of Clinton's behavior to close that gap.

[JI7]

2. i wonder if this means Gore really will endorse Obama

or at least support getting behind the candidate who is ahead as Obama is now.

[beachmom]

3. She repeated it again on CNN. This is a talking point.

Obama = Gore and Kerry, i.e. LOSERS. Who look French.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x5489161

[wisteria]

4. I am in agreement with you on this. She took the opportunity to slam good Democrats who actually

aren't elitists in order to further her own ambitions. To suggest that any Democrat is an elitist is shameful, we are the party of the people. I am done with her. She has no right to even be in this party.

[ladym55]

5. How low can she go?

Every time I think she's betrayed everything possible, she comes right back with something else that's mean-spirited and detrimental to our chances for the GE. Kerry and Gore have dignity and class, and if that makes them "elitists," give me elitists every day of the week.

And she's delusional. Does she REALLY think that she is going to get a free pass on electability from the press????

She really wants us to have FOUR MORE YEARS of Republican incompetence and corruption, doesn't she?

[beachmom]

6. Diary on Kos about it now:

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/4/13/225534/511/101/495180

[beachmom]

7. Wow, a lot of the commenters sound like us. From 2 years ago. :)

[karynnj]

8. Well, I think both Kerry and Gore - in reality are more in touch with American values

than she and her husband are. First of all, they both have a value of telling the truth - as Americans do. It is also not an American value to have sex in the White House with a young woman you care so little of you can't remember her name. It is also an American value to serve your country, not to pull every string you have and then lie about it. It is not an American value to take $800,000 from a guy who runs a narco country and kills trade unionists. It is not an American value to have a Tyson company lawyer lead you through commodity trading that nets you $100,000 when you husband is in the position to call the company on dumping chicken waste in the streams and waterways. (It is an American value to write a book decrying that type of practice.) It is not an American value to puff up your resume claiming you initiated programs you didn't. Nor is it an American value to lie about being under sniper fire.

Elite does also have a positive meaning - and I do think that Kerry and Gore are near the top of the list of people who genuinely care about the world, their country, and the impact of their decisions on others - they are genuinely compassionate and caring people. They are the cream of the crop. I said it about veterans before - that you can see and hear in the taped meetings Kerry has had with them a real genuine connection. You hear stories like that of Jon Sholtz, home from Iraq and as angry as Kerry was when he came home from Vietnam. You hear that after they met, Kerry felt the need to call him privately to speak of the anger he himself felt after Vietnam. That led to involvement in the Kerry campaign, but all of us know the outreach would have happened had there been no campaign. Kerry really cares. HRC with the veterans is not all that different than W - they are props with HRC smiling, unconnected in the middle of the picture.

The fact of the matter is that HRC went to Wellsley, then to Yale and BC to Georgetown, Oxford, and Yale. They were not born to families like the Gores and (Forbes)Kerrys, but they had the mentors and connections to the elite from the time they were in their early 20s. The difference is that they do not see that for all their adult life they were privileged. She can't see how privileged her life really was - she has been Democratic royalty for 15 years! To not see that is pathetic. There were posts once that Kerry should have made a bigger deal of having worked summers as a youth unloading trucks and was in a union. In fact, he knew that that would be denying the real truth he was born into the elite with all the connections that entailed. That was the reality and that was what he had on his web site - that he was privileged and choose a life of service. He would have been able to pull strings to avoid Vietnam with greater ease than Clinton - and it says something that he didn't.

Hunter Thompson, for all his eccentricities, was an insightful person and he got Bill Clinton and John Kerry right. He said that "Nixon would stab his enemies in the back, but Clinton would stab his friends in the back". He also said that John Kerry was a "brave man with a good heart". In the 1990s, I thought HRC was better than BC, now I can see they deserve each other.

[Inuca]

11. "They deserve each other"

Absolutely! And I wish them many more bitter years together.

[Island Blue]

9. Hillary is such a woman of the people.

I'm sure all her common folk friends who attended Wellesley, Yale and all of those Renaissance Weekends would agree. :crazy:

[Mass]

10. Eh, her daddy took her behind the cabin to teach her how to shoot.

If Kerry had tried this one, everybody would tell he is a fake. How come do the media not go after her on this. It sounds so ridiculous.

[ginnyinWI]

12. absurd.

It was such a funny image that Obama used it in his talk to the Steelworkers: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NIxmi3e2Vmo

It was so good I had to watch it twice. Good for him-making her a laughing stock for once.

My take on her comments: It was as if she was saying, "Well,Gore and Kerry are good men but were seen as elitist and out of touch, so here's Obama, another good man whom I can smear the same way, and it will work!"

What a funny world she must live in--one where the DLC is the good Democratic way, but true Progressives who listen to and respond to ordinary people are to be vilified in any way possible. One where a Republican is preferable to a Progressive Dem. She thinks: such nonsense to listen to the people--who don't know the real score!

[MBS]

13. oh, God this was great.

Thanks for the link!!
I just love it when he goes "heh", with a little grin. Then you know he's about to have fun with exposing the (as he called it once) "okey-dokey" of campaign nonsense. Beautiful.

[Inuca]

14. Loved the "heh" :-) n/t

[karynnj]

15. Actually - Here may be the best response

Kerry went to Pepperdine University, an evangelical school - with Ken Starr heading their Law School. He spoke on religion there - in the speech and the Q & A, he and the students showed mutual respect - Kerry noting a few places where they disagreed. I seriously doubt HRC would have the guts to do this and speak of her religious views - which from what I heard at the debate are let's say, "less well developed" than Senator Kerry's. I noted that when asked about going to church she wouldn't answer other than to say she went on Easter.

http://www.pepperdine.edu/pr/releases/2006/september/kerry.htm

[beachmom]

16. Now a front page Kos post:

http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/4/14/161122/129/735/495579

[beachmom]

17. Watch at your own risk. Kerry defined as "elite" in '04:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jzVBdJ3ZSdw

And now one of our own, supposedly, is using the same attack on another Democrat. Who needs Republicans anymore?

To soften the blow, watch this one:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J6wpG2Xesbk&feature=related

He DID mention children's healthcare in 2004!!!! I missed it at the time.

[wisteria]

18. The first one is stupid. Bush had as much if not more. And, I fail to see how having money precludes

one from understanding and helping those people less fortunate than yourself. It is a shame this junk even made its way into the 2004 campaign. Thanks for posting though, it reminds me how small the Republicans were in 2004 to attack Senator Kerry like this.

The second one is nicer to watch, truthful and bittersweet.

[karynnj]

19. I had never seen either of those - because NJ was not a swing state

The first one is actually not that effective - people knew that Kerry was wealthy. The mistake is that the RW's irrational hatred of Ted Kennedy is not universal. Most people do accept that the Kennedys were brought up with the value that their wealth came with a responsibility to others - so pairing him with Teddy there doesn't work to anyone who still has any residual fondness for any Kennedy. Also, other than the silly look in the last photo - they took some of the better Kerry shots. The picture where they speak of $250 shirts shows why he buys $250 shirts - he looks great. (Thinking about it more than normal - Kerry's shirts do look cleaner, neater and nicer than others, but what I SEE in that picture is a very sincere clean cut man. The intelligence and honesty in those eyes is worth more than the immaculate shirt.) The point is that the haircut, shirt, houses and boats show great wealth, but it's all classy.

I liked that he did mention - HONESTLY - children's healthcare. (Oddly, he could have said that he and Kennedy initiated S-CHIP with more validity than HRC, but it would have been wordier, few would know exactly what S-CHIP was, and Factcheck.org, which backed HRC would have simply noted that it was Kennedy/Hatch - apparently he is the only one who gets no credit for co-sponsoring things.)

HRC is worse on the elitist claim than the Republicans were here. She is stereotyping Obama's ideas and life - here they merely showed that Kerry was wealthy - which could have (and in 2008 likely would have) been countered by creating within the day a parallel Bush one. During the debates, when the issue of the "wire" came up, the idea that it was a poorly manufactured suit was quickly dispelled by information that it was a very expensive French suit and there are photos of the Bush family summer house in Kennebunkport and the country clubs he golfs at. Possibly ending in Kerry's life of service.