Proof that the election was stolen

[Iwasthere]

I need help.

When I tell my brother in Phoenix that votes were stolen, he says, "If that was true it would be front page news". He also says, "It would like Watergate again and if any of the recent elections were stolen wouldn't there be a whistleblower by now?".

[helderheid]

1. see

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x2489956

Also, search for any and everything from TruthIsAll

AND

http://www.rollingstone.com/news/story/10432334/was_the_2004_election_stolen

especially

http://www.rollingstone.com/news/story/10432334/was_the_2004_election_stolen

[Amonester]

14. See also:

http://www.opednews.com/maxwrite/linkframe.php?opedpg=http://www.wanttoknow.info/mediacover-up&opedid=24912
~snip~
Greg Palast—BBC. In the months leading up to the November 2000 balloting, Gov. Jeb Bush ordered elections supervisors to purge 58,000 voters on the grounds they were felons not entitled to vote. As it turns out, only a handful of these voters were felons. This extraordinary news ran on page one of the country’s leading paper. Unfortunately, it was the wrong country: Britain. In the USA, it was not covered. The office of the governor (also) illegally ordered the removal of felons from voter rolls—real felons—but with the right to vote under law. As a result, 50,000 of these voters could not vote. The fact that 90% of these were Democrats should have made it news as this alone more than accounted for Bush’s victory. (click for more)
http://www.opednews.com/maxwrite/linkframe.php?opedpg=http://www.wanttoknow.info/mediacover-up&opedid=24912

[SharonAnn]

2. Gee, maybe if there a Congressional investigation? Naaaah!

[John Gauger]

3. It's atrocious.

John Conyers is ridiculed and railroaded for trying to do what is right for America. I am amazed that people can get away with saying no to an investigation into black voter supression. But such is the state of our beloved nation.

[robinlynne]

27. There was. in ohio. 2004. led by john conyers.

[JeffR]

4. Tell him it would be like Watergate again

if we still had a credible media, and if it were still the same sort of country it was in 1974. We don't, and it isn't. As to the whistleblower, there have been a few. The (mainstream) media haven't been interested in them. Sorry, no links handy, but the info can easily be found on DU.

[Canuckistanian]

8. The new Woodwards and Bernsteins don't seem to be emerging

And remember, even they had a hard time exposing Watergate 'way back in the '70s.

Imagine what it must be like NOW.

[helderheid]

5. 2 more recs

[kerry-is-my-prez]

6. Tell her we are now ranked #53 worldwide in the freedom of press index

Which I'm going to post in a few minutes.

[low_phreaq]

7. 1 more rec n/t

[kster]

9. Simple, tell him you want proof that it wasn't stolen....

then explain to him, that this is, right where the pliticians, want US PEONS, Questioning each other, You both are completely equal because neither on you can get the proof one way or the other, GAURANTEED........ The big question should be why neither one of you can GET PROOF one way or the other.

[greeneyedboy]

10. Project Censored must have an article about it w/ mainstream credibility.

[Check12]

11. Ask him if he knows who Jeff Gannon is or..

If he knows what the Downing Street Memo proved.
Has he heard of Sibel Edmonds?
Why did several MSM news organizations turn down the Foley memos.

I was like him once, I could not believe that our news media was corrupt.

Then these things happened and it broke my heart when the news let us down.

[Check12]

12. Here is the smoking gun paragraph

This is from the highest levels of the British government.

If there ever was a reason for impeachment, this is it.

C reported on his recent talks in Washington. There was a perceptible shift in attitude. Military action was now seen as inevitable. Bush wanted to remove Saddam, through military action, justified by the conjunction of terrorism and WMD. But the intelligence and facts were being fixed around the policy. The NSC had no patience with the UN route, and no enthusiasm for publishing material on the Iraqi regime's record. There was little discussion in Washington of the aftermath after military action.

BASTARD!!!!

[Emit]

13. Maybe

Try Mark Crispin Miller's "None Dare Call it Stolen" Her's an excerpt:

http://www.harpers.org/ExcerptNoneDare.html

I also recommend what helderheid noted -- RF Kennedy Jr's piece in Rolling Stone and some old DU threads.

Also, this piece always hits hard with me -- it's about "Theonomic Reconstructionism ~snip~(a belief that the only true authority is God's, that allegiance to biblical laws trumps that of civic law and that the Kingdom of Heaven needs to be built on Earth before Jesus will come again. In addition to that, homosexuals should be put to death, women should be banned from civic office, apostates and heretics should be stoned to death and there is a great need for more Christian politicians), ~snip~ Howard Ahmanson and the Coors and Hunt families, Reconstructionists formed think tanks such as the Chalcedon Institute and the Rutherford Institute (the friendly guys that funded Paula Jones' lawsuit against Clinton) to give the Christian Right a philosophical base to draw from, and political action committees to finance their elections..." and who owns the voting machines.

http://72.14.203.104/search?q=cache:RDZSMqUzEQIJ:www.tabletnewspaper.com/politics/73_tftgk.html+%22My+purpose+is+total+integration+of+biblical+law+into+our+lives.%22+Ahmanson&hl=en&gl=us&ct=clnk&cd=8

[PATRICK]

15. The "front page" argument

List all known Bush scandals with evidence, but start with election 2000. Gore had the plurality- no argument. The electoral vote in many states was close and questionable even upon examination by a complete moron. Obviously Gore WAS he choice of most voters in Florida at least. A recount was about to prove it. ALL of those issues and the rightness of the decision going to Gore lead the MSM to one conclusion. Ignore Gore and demand he do the "honorable" thing and submit to Bush. Because the media and enough top Dems had submitted meekly to the insistence of GOP spin. The honorable thing should have been something demanded of Bush. In 2002 and 2004 blatant evidence of worse chicanery and visible vote suppression likewise made no impression strong enough to call for 'front page" crusades for justice. Instead the MSM were sophist apologists for contest "wins" and completely neutral on the crimes openly committed and subsequently never brought to punished or stopped in the future.

As with invisible digital vote records, if there is no MSM paper trail there is no truth on record. Presuming there is invests these invisible and untrustworthy deities with omnipotent power over the vote count and the perception- not the reporting of reality. However, truth will out if you look for it. Just don't expect corporate media to do this as infallible guardians of the public and refer them to that recent book of ruined, suppressed American journalists and what brought them down.

Neat argument. Remove the paper record and then demand one as proof. But the news is NOT that neat. There have been editorials, some free of deflective spin, some reporting of fraud and large smoking guns. The front page, the "legs" are denied these immediately and eventually while the march of HAVA vote reform never flinches. These stories can be found and the spin noted and the incompleteness and the lack of any call for action or explanation or accountability. It is always Gore 2000. Truth and honor and values have nothing to do with the contest of power. Democracy and duty have been delegated upward into the invisible and ineffable fraud that is roosted at the top of this nation in most critical(but tragically trusted!) institutions of leadership.

IF things were not so bad and fraudulent, the tolerance and trust would continue pretty much unabated DESPITE the truth. This is still the fond naivete of top Dems and trusting citizens alike. Under Bush, eventually, the situation is so bad everyone with these fatal flaws are being dragged down into the realm of visibly insane efforts to prop up the public trust- which the Leader no longer needs if the votes are push buttoned controlled like his beloved nukes. Everyone one becomes the blinded victim, everyone is called to betray their real duty, everyone loses power upward, ever upward, to the heart of the onion.

[Sancho]

16. I teach research and statistics, and I still think a good source is...

"Was the 2004 Presidential Election Stolen? Exit Polls, Election Fraud, and the Official Count" by Steven Freeman.

I've watched all the debates with TruthisAll and the professional pollsters. There is no question in my mind that some manipulation of votes occurred in some states. We don't want to debate WPE and crazy theories about repubs refusing to talk to exit pollsters.

[marions ghost]

18. excellent book

I am reading it now. Recommend Highly. :thumbsup:

[BeFree]

22. Ah, yes, the exit-polls from 2004

Remember when the exit-poll people were honest - along with the rest of the media orgs? Do you remember the time when, using exit-polls, the news called the winners sometimes as early as 5 pm?

In 2004 the exit-polls around 5 pm found Kerry winning. The numbers produced pointed to Kerry winning about 4 million more votes than *.

Ohio? Kerry was ahead by 4%.

In 2000 the exit-polls, and the real results described a Gore victory.

Exit-polls are the biggest enemy of stolen elections.

[DemReadingDU]

17. Direct Evidence of Ballot Tampering in Ohio

9/1/06
Richard Hayes Phillips Declaration: "Direct Evidence of Ballot Tampering"


http://moritzlaw.osu.edu/electionlaw/litigation/documents/DeclarationofRichardHayesPhillipsfiledbyRichardHayesPhillips.pdf

[Blackhatjack]

19. Buy Him A copy of Rollingstone w/Kennedy article on stolen elections n/t

[John Q. Citizen]

20. Ask him why the dinner date between Neil bush and Scott Hinckley, a

day after Scott Hinkley's brother John Hinckley attempted to assassinate Ronald Reagan, wasn't front page news?

It was reported on once, for about 15 seconds, by John Chancellor on the evening news. Then it totally disappeared. No follow up, no other networks reporting on it, it just disappeared.

This was a huge story. Even if there was no hanky panky, the fact that Neil bush was scheduled to have dinner with Scott Hinckley is an amazing story.

Americans never found out why, who, what, where when. How come the bush's know the family of the assassin? How long have they known them? What are the connections? etc.

So when your brother assures you that something "would be front page news," remind him that big stories are often ignored, buried, under-reported, or subject to the corporate nature of the news media.

The reporters don't get to decide if thier stories get published in the Corporations media outlets.

[Squeech]

21. Actually

the Watergate affair was the exception, rather than the rule, for the American media.

For most of our history, newspapers have been extremely partisan. (Horace Greeley, one of my favorite goofball presidential candidates, was a newspaperman before he was a candidate.) Whenever there was an interest group strong enough to cast a shadow on local politics, it would publish its own newspaper, with a palpable editorial slant favoring its preferred policies. This tradition persists most obviously in the financial press, like the Wall Street Journal, whose editorials have been known to blatantly contradict the (generally accurate) stuff on their news pages.

Jefferson knew this, of course, and he felt that the genuinely informed citizen would read all of the papers, figure out which bits of the stories were confirmed by multiple reporters and which bits were spin, and winnow out the truth of the matter.

Because of media consolidation we no longer have an opposition press; what we have ranges from cute and fluffy corporatist right wing (Couric, Leno) to theocratic authoritarian right (Fox "News" and the Moonie-owned Washington Times).

We need our own newspapers. Desperately. And we need to recognize that Watergate was an aberration-- and probably happened only because reporters got peeved that they were on a presidential "enemies list."

[Balbus]

23. Don't you hate relatives with common sense?

[helderheid]

24. see #1 and #14

[Balbus]

25. All unsubstantiated bullshit.

But here's real proof of election fraud. Unfortunately it's our own party. So maybe we should clean our own house before accusing someone else of a filthy home.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory?id=1557526&CMP=OTC-RSSFeeds0312

[helderheid]

26. really.

:eyes:

[byronius]

28. Uhhhhh. O-K, there, fella. Cave working out fer ye?

Still drippin' from the ceiling a little?

There's so much compelling and profoundly well-researched evidence concerning this that I must mock you a bit. Really.

[GETPLANING]

31. OK, troll, there's one case.

Now, how about those impossible vote tallies, the exit polls all being off in favor of one candidate, and only in swing states where electronic, paperless voting systems were in use?
What about the literally dozens of cases where Republican campaign workers are doing jail time for everything from destroying Democratic voter registrations to tricking university students into switching their party affiliation from Democrat to Republican, using fake "legalize marijuana" petitions? What about the 11 people in Orange County, just today charged with fraudulent voter registration stemming from a Republican registration drive this year that resulted in dozens of Democrats unwittingly being signed up as Republicans? What about the Republican campaign director who is in jail today for jamming a Democratic GOTV phone bank? What about the fact that the RNC paid millions to defend this guy? Are you serious? F*** you! Elections have been manipulated since the times of the Roman Empire, but the GOP has made it an industry. Now go back to FreeRepublic and don't spam out boards any more.

[JHB]

29. It's not "front page" because...

...nobody "important" is pushing it.

[GETPLANING]

30. That's the stock conservative talking point.

Don't waste your time on this idiot. He's beyond your reach. Take your message to people with more than two brain cells to rub together.

[GreenPartyVoter]

32. Check some of this stuff out

http://www.hostdiva.com/liberalchristians/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=116&Itemid=29