Impeach Bush & Cheney now or wait for Democratic House?

[yurbud]

Poll question: Impeach Bush & Cheney now or wait for Democratic House?

While Bush has obviously committed a laundry list of prima facie impeachable offenses, and some republicans could probably see voting for it as a matter of political survival, there is an argument for waiting:

If impeachment of both is successful, that means we get President Porkchop Hastert.

I think next in line is Senate majority leader, Bill Cat-killer, far-right tool Frist.

If Dems wait until they have the House, it would presumably be Nancy Pelosi, an acceptable care-taker.

Should this make a difference?

[SammyBlue]

1. Okay, your poll got Freeped. . .some cocksucker Freeper

decided to infect our little nook in the web and cast for the last one!

[Selteri]

18. Which is only more sad that they think no laws are broken.

We do not have a dictatorship and we are not a part of a monarchy!

[Jed Dilligan]

2. I think there should be enormous pressure on the GOP Congress

to initiate proceedings, and that it should be a major campaign issue when they (predictably) don't.

[yurbud]

3. that's a good idea--will Dems actually do that though?

[Jed Dilligan]

8. No telling. I honestly don't understand

why they are so cowed.

[petgoat]

10. why they are so cowed.

I've got only one explanation, and I don't believe it myself but it
explains everything so I can't discard it.

1. The world really is running out of oil in thirty or forty years, and
economic and social dislocations will cause a lot of problems.

2. Dem and Repub leaders agree that we must control the oil so that our
liberal democracy shall not perish from the earth so

3. Control of Iraq and Afganistan was necessary, but the American people
would never go along with a war just for oil so

4. 9/11 was allowed to happen or made to happen to motivate the war and
facilitate the reduction of rights (which will be necessary in ten years
or so as unemployment and home foreclosures soar).

5. Neither the Dems nor the Repubs had the stomach for this Machiavellian
crap, so they all agreed to let a band of loco cowboys do it for them.

It explains the media silence, the 9/11 coverups, the spineless Dems,
Kerry's wimpy campaign, the tolerance of stolen elections and crooked
voting machines, and the 9/11 incompetence. It explains why the only
politicians with any spine are members of the CBC.

I can't think of any other explanation.

[yurbud]

21. I think you are close, but for some it might be simpler: media and money

The corporate media will jump on them if they stray too far from the reservation, and they over-estimate mainstream media's importance. Somehow, people still love Howard Dean even though the mainstream and right wing media treated him like a raving lunatic.

They are also looking longingly at corporate money. Only a handful of progressive candidates got the bulk of their donations from small donors in the 2004 presidential race--Kucinich, Dean, and probably Nader.

They know if they piss off the corporate big boys, they have and are nothing.

Imagine a Joe Biden candidacy without credit card company money. He would be running in the Lyndon LaRouche range--where is sorry, hair-plugged ass should be.

[yurbud]

22. Sadly, we COULD survive with less oil and the transition to biofuels

is already starting at the local and state level. I'm visiting Oregon for the holidays, and the GOP just defeated a bill to require 7% biodiesel sales by 2007.

Biofuels could easily be done, and it would not be as subject to monopolization or price manipulation because it is so easy to make (ask a moonshiner).

The big hegemony project is really about the survival of the OIL COMPANIES.

[petgoat]

4. While we're waiting for the Dems to gear up, let's scream loud:

http://www.worldcantwait.org/

[gordontron]

17. it would be cool if that wasn't a communist organization

otherwise I'm completely with you, but it undermines the message

[petgoat]

19. Look at the endorsements list. Are those all Communists?

If these folks aren't ashamed to associate with them, why should I be?

(Also, they used to say the same thing about A.N.S.W.E.R--that it was just
a front for the Workers World Party.)

ACT UP, New York City
After Downing Street Coalition
Aimee Allison, army conscientious objector (Gulf War
90)/counter-Recruiter
Tom Ammiano, San Francisco Board of Supervisors
Anti-Flag
Edward Asner
Rosa Ayala, Justice for Janitors*
William Ayers, professor and author
Russell Banks, writer
Rev. Willie Barrow, Women Connecting*
Dave Berenson, Cleveland, OH, U.S. Green Party
Michael Berg, anti-war activist
Jessica Blank, writer, actor
Blase Bonpane, author
Bob Bossie, SCJ, 8th Day Center for Justice*
Elombe Brath, Patrice Lumumba Coalition, NYC
Carol Brightman, author, "Total Insecurity: The Myth of American Omnipotence"
Dennis Brutus
Gabriel Byrne, Actor
Campus Anti-War Network(CAN)
Tim Carpenter, Director, Progressive Democrats of America
Chicago ADAPT
Ward Churchill
Citizens For Legitimate Government
Kate Clinton, humorist
David Cobb, 2004 Green Party Presidential Candidate
Code Pink: Women for Peace
Steve Colman, poet
Barry Crimmins, writer/
correspondent, Air America Radio
Culture Clash
Chris Daly, San Francisco Board of Supervisors
DC Anti-War Network
Democrats.com
Dominican Women's Development Center, New York
Tom Duane, NY State Senator
Michael Eric Dyson, author, "Is Bill Cosby Right?"
Steve Earle, musician
Edwin Ellis, President of Veterans for Peace, LA*
Eve Ensler
Michelle Esrick, actress, poet, filmmaker
Donelle Estey, artist, Artists Against the War
Jodie Evans, Code Pink
Nina Felshin, curator, writer
Rev. John Fife
Jane Fonda
Michael Franti, musician
Aaron Freeman, comdian
Deborah Glick, NY State Assemblywoman
Global Justice and Peace Ministries, Riverside Church,
New York
Francis Goldin, literary agent
Sam Greenlee, poet
André Gregory, theater director
Andy Griggs, US Labor Against the War, Exec. Board of United Teachers of LA*
Jose Guerrero, artist and muralist, Chicago
Paul Haggis, Director/Writer of Crash, screenwriter of Million Dollar Baby
Haitian Coalition for Justice
Suheir Hammad, poet
Sam Hamill, Poets Against War
Kathleen Hanna, Le Tigre
David Harris, founder of The Resistance*, writer
Jon Hendricks, jazz singer/lyricist
Jon Hendricks, artist
Hermandad Mexicana
Warren M. Hern, MD, MPH, PhD, Director, Boulder Abortion Clinic
Hip Hop Caucus
Marie Howe, poet and writer
Impeach Bush Coalition
Abdeen Jabara, past president, American-Arab Anti-Discrimination Committee*
Ron Jacobs, writer
Alan Jones, Dean of Faculty at Pitzer College*
Bill T. Jones, dancer
Sarah Jones, poet and actor
Rickie Lee Jones, musician
Esther Kaplan, author of With God On Their Side
Casey Kasem
M. Ali Khan, American Muslim Council
C. Clark Kissinger
Frances Kissling, President, Catholics for a Free Choice*
Yuri Kochiyama
Ron Kovic, author, Vietnam Veteran
Jonathan Kozol
Joyce Kozloff, artist
Ray Laforest, organizer, DC 1707, AFSCME*; member, Pacifica National Board*
Beth Lamont
Martha Lavey, Chicago
Mark Leno, California Assemblyman
Rabbi Michael Lerner, editor of Tikkun magazine
James Levin, co-director of Cleveland Festival of Arts & Technology (Ingenuity)
Simon Levy, director, "What I Heard About Iraq" at Fountain St. Theatre
Bruce Lincoln, professor, History of Religions, University of Chicago
Margarita Lopez, New York City Council Member
Haki R. Madhubuti, chairman, publisher, Third World Press
Gregory Maguire, author, "Wicked"
devorah major, poet & novelist
Make the Road by Walking, Bushwick, Brooklyn, NY
Lucinda Marshall, Founder Feminist Peace Network*
Bill Martin, philosopher
Allen Michann, owner, Grand Lake Theater, Oakland, CA
Ellen McLaughlin, actress and playwright
Camilo Mejia, conscientious objector
Dave Meserve, Arcata California city council member
Carol Migden, CA State Senator
Carly Miller, Clothing of the American Mind
Mark Crispin Miller, author, "Fooled Again"
Millions More Movement, Pittsburg /Antioch CA organizing committee
Bill Mitchell, co-founder of Gold Star Families for Peace*
Leon Mobley, musician
Tom Morello, Audioslave
Tracie Morris, poet
Andrew Muñana, Images Salón, East Los Angeles
National Lawyers Guild
Armando Navarro, chair and professor, Ethnic Studies, UC Riverside
Bill Nevins, teacher, Albuquerque
Not in Our Name
Mike and Julie Nussbaum
Brian O'Leary, PhD., author, former astronaut
Bertell Ollman, prof. Dept. of Politics, NYU
Outernational
Ozomatli
Jose Padilla*, executive director, California Rural Legal Assistance (CRLA)
Grace Paley, writer
Patrick Henry Democratic Club
Rosalind Petchesky, prof., Hunter College & Grad. Center, CUNY
The Network in Solidarity with the People of the Philippines
Peter Phillips PhD, Project Censored, Sociology Dept Sonoma State University
Jeremy Pikser, screenwriter, Bulworth
Harold Pinter, Nobel Prize winning playwright
Frances Fox Piven
Sterling Plumpp, poet
Kevin Powell, writer
Progressive Democrats of America
Queers for Economic Justice
Jerry Quickley, poet and playwright
Malik Rahim, New Orleans Community Organizer
Michael Ratner, Center for Constitutional Rights*
Reach Hip Hop Coalition
Raghava Reddy, stem cell biologist, biomedical scientist, film maker
Eric Resnick, Gay People's Chronicle* reporter, peace activist, one time candidate for US Congress
Allan Rich, screenwriter/actor
Boots Riley, The Coup
Walter Riley, lawyer
Douglas Rushkoff, author
Kalamu ya Salaam, Listen to the People
JD Samson, Le Tigre
Sonia Sanchez
Rev. Henry Sanders, Fountain of Life Missionary Baptist Church, Watts, CA
San Francisco Bayview Newspaper
Sapphire, poet, writer
Rinku Sen, Colorlines*
Richard Serra, artist
Lou Shaw, writer, creator of Quincy MD
Cindy Sheehan
Martin Sheen
Stanley Sheinbaum, economist, LA
Nancy Spero, artist
Dona Spring, Berkeley Council member
Sunsara Taylor, Revolution newspaper
Studs Terkel
Marianne Torres, Peace and Justice Action League of Spokane*
Dwight Trible, jazz vocalist
George Tuttle & Ben Cushman, grapegrowers
Gore Vidal, writer
Kurt Vonnegut
Alice Walker
Wavy Gravy
Leonard Weinglass, lawyer
Rev. Dave Weissbard, senior minister, The Unitarian Universalist Church, Rockford, IL
Cornel West, Princeton University
Rev. Phil Wheaton, Episcopal Co-pastor, Community of Christ, Washington DC
Saul Williams, poet
Standish E. Willis, National Conference of Black Lawyers
Krzysztof Wodiczko, artist
Ann Wright, former US diplomat, resigned in protest of Iraq war
Leland Y. Yee, Speaker pro Tem, California State Assembly
Juanita Young, courageous resister, leader in October 22nd Coalition*
Dave Zeiger, filmmaker, "Sir, No, Sir!"
Zephyr, graffiti artist, writer
Robert Zevin, Robert Brooke Zevin Associates, Inc.
Howard Zinn, historian, "A Peoples' History of the United States"
David Zirin, author, "What's My Name, Fool? Sports and Resistance in the United States"

[gordontron]

26. hmm I'm not saying that all the supporters are

but certainly the leader is. I saw her interviewed once and she said it herself. Not that the organization doesn't have potential but it needs to clarify itself as not communist.

[ISUGRADIA]

5. Frist is not in the line of succession, fyi, ted stevens, president

pro tem is after Hastert

[yurbud]

7. he's a great guy isn't he?

[ISUGRADIA]

14. great as in evil? demented genius? 8^)

[yurbud]

23. great as a colorless corporate tool or stool specimen

[LittleClarkie]

6. Yes- other

because the Republican majority will never, ever do it themselves. It's not a matter of wanting to wait. It's a matter of having to wait.

[yurbud]

9. seems like a no-win for them. If they don't, it looks like they approve

of his crimes (which they do), and if they impeach him, they put a historic stain on their party--a second GOP president forced to leave the White House in a little over three decades.

When put like that, I guess it's pretty obvious they won't do it.

The taint of Bush on them is short term.

Impeachment would be remembered by even the least politically involved citizens.

[DemInDistress]

11. impeach now and if necessary re-impeach in jan 07' nt

[Trillo]

12. If congress waits, does it create tacit approval?

What if election fraud machines are still in action? If Dems do not get seats back, then what goal has waiting served?

[yurbud]

24. damn, I knew I left something out! Exactly. Election fraud can only

work if the race is within a few points, not landslide.

[leftstreet]

13. N.O.W. Non-voters and no-longer-voters need a reason to vote Dem

If the Dems don't raise the impeachment issue before 06, they'll permanently convince the non and no-longer voters that "all politicians are just crooks." Those same ignored voters will feel further righteous in saying, "why bother to vote, it's all just one party anymore."

[deacon]

15. It is the duty of this congress, right now, to impeach

[shenmue]

16. Now

How long are we going to wait?

Until they turn themselves in?!

Come on.

[tritsofme]

20. Shall I walk on water now, or wait for Jesus to come back

and give me pointers.

Republicans aren't going to impeach their own boy.

And even if we win control of Congress in 2006, it will be a very hard battle in the House, let alone conviction in the Senate.

[yurbud]

25. Is there some advantage for Dems or country having a weakened

but still dangerously corrupt and thug-ish president in office?

Or do you mean that business interests don't like the idea of impeachment because it would put too much taint on their primary tool in DC, the GOP?

[britpopper]

27. It;s an obvious choice...

Yes and ...ALL OF THE ABOVE!

[flaminbats]

28. Why worry about a delayed impeachment?

I doubt the act of resigning would of occurred to Nixon or Agnew under this Republican Congress. The real question is whether or not a Democratic Congress would of impeached these criminals if they had not resigned?

Somehow I doubt a Republican impeachment is something to worry about, hell if it happened..I WOULD PROBABLY JOIN THEM! :eyes:

[Silverhair]

29. Impossible with a GOP house. Just a pipe dream.

Removal by impeachment is impossible in any case. Just won't happen.