As a Democrat I am getting tired of Dems' Incompetence

[DaveJ]

Repugs should be no problem to defeat. Why is it that Dems continually allow Repugs to devise plans that lead us into the future, plans that really make no sense, while Dems themselves little more than yearn for the past? Many of the jobs that we have lost under Schrub, the jobs that Scrubs will not acknowledge of been lost, will never return. Schrub will never acknowledge how important these jobs were to us because he does not know what having a job is like.

There is no point getting wrapped up in that. Democratic politicians are little better than Repugs in the dense that Dems entered the political field because they thought it would be a nice high paying job to have. Repugs entered politics because they are insane but they have ideas for the future, like all the lies we in the SOTU address. Where are Dems' ideas for the future??????

We cannot sit back and assume Dems will win next time just because Repugs' performance has been dismall. We need to look forward more. At least Repugs want what's good for the country, you can't deny that, the problem is they are lunatics. But in the meantime Dems really ought to be able to 'counter-match' their ideas.

[leftstreet]

1. What "good" things do believe Republicans want for the country?

[DaveJ]

3. Many lies in the SATU sounded nice.

Can't Dems at least pretend to lie just as well? All I'm asking is what is Dems' vision for the future? It seems like they are more concerned about bringing back the past which will never occur.

[Erika]

8. Bringing back the past?

Yet another inane post.

[nebula]

2. The role of the Democratic Party

The Democratic Party has proven itself to be nothing more than a token fig leaf/token oppostion party.

But in reality, the US is ruled by a one-party dictatorship.

[Erika]

4. What are you talking about?

Yes, the GOP is pathetic. The Dems offer hope and best yet a cleansing from the GOP dirt and their promise of more $ of the working class shifted to the rich.

[DaveJ]

9. You can do better than that...

We need to. Everyone knows the GOP is corrupt but few really believe they are out to harm the country. So they take bribes from big business, big deal, in the meantime they really believe they are supporting the U.S. What many ignore is the fact that most Democratic politicians have been in the business so long they think of it all as a big game. They are human beings who simply thought of politics as a career choice, they want to draw a paycheck and relax with their families. They are not going to save us. What we need is ideas that propel us into the future, and simply saying we want to reduce corruption and raise taxes is good but not nearly enough. Yes Repulicans are disgusting but we need to get off our lazy asses (intellecutally) and counter their insane plans with better ideas.

[Erika]

14. Lazy asses? No, the democrats are hard workers

Where do you come from?

[DaveJ]

19. Not hard enough apparently....

Based on the last 6 election results.

[MatrixEscape]

5. I don't see incompetence ...

II follow the money and I see collusion and profit. The politicians in question are not being flogged, abused, or beheaded for any action they perform. Why should they represent you in fact when they only have to apply their acumen to the period when you vote them in. That is all well managed and the money they get is the money that buys the votes, not the factual representation.

They get rich, fat, happy, and they rise above you. What's the penalty for not doing the right thing or following the wishes of the people today?

You get your puppet on the left or your puppet on the right. What is most important is that you are engaged in a process where the rules are clearly drawn out before you play, and far beyond the limen of your awareness of it all.

Then, you either end up feeling disgruntled and yield to anticipation of the "next time" or you feel jubilant and justified that what you were manipulated towards in the first place, has come to pass. As long as you don't break out of or see beyond the control grid, everything is fine and will proceed as planned ... even here.

[DaveJ]

23. Nice critique

It's no secret that Repugs are what they are. Even they know themselves how disgusting they are. Politicians should continue to use their corrupt nature against them but the average citizen needs to look forward more. Take the ideas they present and use them in a positive way -- they are lies but many of them make sense.

[Erika]

6. What are you talking about? Schrub or Scrubs?

A totally meaningless post.

Get a grip on reality.

[MatrixEscape]

31. You know ...

I like that phrase for the fact that it is not only trite, cute, and meaningless, but for the sense of inquiry it can evoke in thinking people.

It is old, I know: "What is reality?" Oh, but the philosophy of it has waxed and waned across the scope of history itself.

Might I venture that "reality" is subjective, primarily, and ACTUALITY is what may lie within the realm of the objective? It seems far more simple to start with that premise and work forward than to tell people, in essence, to get a grip on something that is neither consistent or concrete.

My reality may or may not be yours. Your reality may or may not be anything similar to that of a native Indian, an Aborigine, etc. Actuality seems to be something we can all agree on as "out there" and maybe related to the findings of empiricism and physical sciences, but even then, we must have faith that our own realities are correct in that assumption.

You have to have faith in reason. You usually start with reasons to have faith. Isn't it odd how both relate and how neither yields anything absolutely concrete and irrefutable to your own reality?

If someone can give me a sound demonstration of a thing that is reality, then maybe it would be possible to get some kind of a "grip" on it. I assume that the word "grip" is meant to relate holding onto something that is tangible.

[proud2BlibKansan]

37. Something tells me

he doesn't share OUR reality. LOL

[Canuckistanian]

7. Agreed. What are they waiting for?

Every Democrat agrees that * is a force that must be stopped. But every chance they get is foiled. Not by the media (which is a BIG problem by itself), but by lack of connecting to average Americans.

The media cannot wholly be blamed in this. Time and time again, Democrats have been unable (or unwilling) to get a cogent soundbite or theme out there to make people sit up and notice what's going on.

Issue after issue just passes them by. No comment is heard, no speeches noted. Some things explosive, such as this latest memo form the U.K. We should have heard SOMETHING from the Democrats by now. But nothing.

It's almost as if they've given up.

[Erika]

11. The Dems have done great

but silenced by the GOP majority voice.

[leftstreet]

12. I hear the Dems loud and clear. It's the people who've been silenced.

[Canuckistanian]

16. I disagree with that

The GOP doesn't control EVERYTHING in the country. Not yet, at least.

What's lacking is a leader, a spokesman for the majority Democratic voice.

I'm not seeing one.

Oh, sure, Dean is doing a great job, but he's ALONE our there. And Conyers is right on with his message.

What's needed is some solidarity.

[Erika]

17. Dean is not alone

Believe me, if he called for donations tomorrow, it would go ballistic.

Why aren't you discerning the GOP?

[DaveJ]

20. Because that would be doing them a favor.

They do not deserve the time an effort to be criticized. They are repugnant scum who should be avoided... but definitely not ignored.

[Canuckistanian]

27. I do. It's just that I don't see a concerted oppostion

Yes, Dean has a great following. Among the people. But that means diddly unless he has many 'big names' by his side, supporting him.

There's no feel of a movement behind him, just crazy ol' Dean, spouting his librul claptrap.

Sorry, that's just what I perceive.

[LWolf]

40. fyi

I don't consider Dean, or his positions, to be "liberal." That's a construct of so-called "centrist" and rw propaganda. In my leftist opinion, of course.

[DaveJ]

13. It's not that Dem politicians don't care...

...well maybe actually it is. What do they care? After living with politics every day it becomes a game to them. The important thing to them is that they have a retirement plan and a large home in a nice neighborhood. Repugs have insane notions for the future and Dems do not have the energy to compete with them.

[Erika]

15. We have lots of energy to fight for the worker, don't you? n/t

[DaveJ]

18. We are on the verge of winning....

It's no time to become complacent. Who is the worker, the painter, the assembly line worker, the farm laborer? America can do better than that. What platform do we want our candidates to stand on. Bringing back the 60's is not an option. Dems need to offer an option that competes with their futuristic fantasies.

[Lorien]

24. Er, what Dem politicians want to bring back the '60's?

Have you ever listened to Al Gore? He talks about developing alternative fuels and using cutting edge technology to advance our nation and solve the world's problems. The repugs are the anachronisms living in a fantasy world; the '50's....the 1250's, in fact.

And no, the GOP IS NOT interested in doing what's right for the country; only what's right for their bank accounts and those of a few criminal cronies.

[oasis]

25. "futuristic fantasies". Howzabout providing an example of what you're

talking about?

[DaveJ]

28. I'm talking about *'s ideas in the SATU address...

...among other things. For instance * talks about fueling cars with switchgrass. Granted, we know his idea is a lie in that he has no idea how to accomplish this goal. No serious Repug will ever give two thoughts about it. But Dems, instead of pointing this out, might want to think about using that statement as a tiny stepping stone and more forward with the idea.

[oasis]

30. Do you mean that Dems should call Bush's bluff?

[DaveJ]

32. What does that mean?

You are basing that question on the assumption that * controls every aspect of the economy. Maybe switchgrass would work. All we know is that Repugs could not care less -- they are hardly mentally adept enough to research the topic. But if they were, shouldn't Dems at least attempt to match their level of expertise... instead of complaining about this and that? Look I could spend my time complaining about Repugs, it's not difficult, but I would rather motivate Dems to strive for something better. (editted for spelling... it's late.. gotta get some sleep)

[oasis]

34. When Democrats were in power they got things done. I can't complain

about them since they have to fight the GOP *AND* the Corporate Media with one hand tied behind their backs.

[mzmolly]

10. .

:hurts:

[jillan]

21. The problem with the DEMS as I see it

Is that all they do is bash republicans!

We have a candidate in Az that is voting in a local election.
He was on a local aar program. Everytime the talk show host would bash
repugs - the candidate would answer with {paraphrasing here}
I'm not running AGAINST republicans, I am running to take our
country back, to preserve our rights and freedoms.

That is the attitude DEMS should have.
F*ck the republicans! They are doing it to themselves. We don't have to say a word.
We need to get on message already. And start talking about
DEMS, not about repugs.

[oasis]

22. When Dems are back in power they will deliver. How do you"counter match"

an under funded No Child Left Behind or a rip off health plan that you fought tooth and nail?

Greedy GOP bastards do not, repeat, do not have the best interest of the country at heart when they gut programs that benefit 99 percent of Americans.

[DaveJ]

26. Okay this is the way I see it -- There are two realities...

The reality of lies that we heard in the SATU address and the reality of intellectual proof. Dems do fine when it comes to the latter. The way we connect with the common man is to compete with their lies. I'm not saying we lie. I'm saying that we put forth ideas (that any 3rd grader can come up with) to counter-act ideas like we heard in the SATU... it really doesn't matter what the ideas area, just present some kind of forward thinking ideas to combat the lies.

[oasis]

29. Call me "old fashioned" but I would rather "combat the lies" with truth.

If Dems have any "forward thinking ideas" they can only be implemented after they return to power.

[Erika]

33. Whats a SATU?

Maybe you need to get a touch more grounded.

[Kickin_Donkey]

35. It's all about the media ...

The playing field is not level. The Republicans control virutally all mainstream media outlets, and have their own water carriers in front of the camera 24/7/365 -- everyone from Katie Couric to Chris Mathews to Russert to Blitzer to O'Reilly to Coulter to Limbaugh and a host of others. In the last 10 years, it's become blatant propaganda, but for most if not all of the 20th century, especially since the 1970s (post-Watergate), it's been brainwashing Americans and creating the message.

This is why whatever Democrats do or stand for gets underplayed and/or excoriated. Meanwhile, Republican scandals are whitewashed or underplayed, Republican politicians get a free pass, Republican policies and positions go unexamined, Republican presidents wear Teflon. Katie Couric fawns over Puke politicans, but treats John Kerry like varmin. There was a study done on national TV news in the run-up to the invasion of Iraq: there were something like 1,000 pro-war commentators on the air, and something like only 8 anti-war commentators (Don't quote me on these figures, because they are not exact -- just trying to give an idea of how skewed it was).

If both sides, were treated equally, we'd win everytime. But they're not treated equally. Imagine that for every Bush ass-licker on TV, we had a liberal of the same status fighting back and in their face -- ratio of one to one. Imagine if all the "liberals" they put on these TV panels were as far left and vociferous as the far-right loons they put on -- not phony opposition like Colmes, DINOs like Lieberman, centrists like Biden, once-Democrats like Jeff Greenfield, Russert, Mathews; bend-backwards Democrats like Stephanopolous, "representatives" of the left who are nothing of the sort like Morton Kondracke or Christopher Hitchens. Imagine that on all of the TV panels there was a neutral host and two liberals to counter the two conservatives, instead of what you see now: a conservative or GOP-leaning host (e.g., Russert), with a far-far-right conservative, a far-right conservative, a conservative, and, lastly, a moderate to serve as the "liberal" on the panel -- and no liberal to be heard from.

Imagine if our guys got equal air time and equal treatment and were out there battling and speaking for our side every night on every program -- people like Helen Thomas, Michael Moore, Katrina vanden Heuval, Cindy Sheehan, Paul Krugman, Molly Ivins, Bernie Ward, Ray Taliaferro, Joe Conason, Ariann Huffington. Imagine that for every Republican who got a TV program like Scarborough, O'Reilly, Tucker, Bill Bennett, Dennis Miller, Paula Zahn, Larry King -- there was a Democrat who got a TV show. Out of all that's on TV, we've got only one who comes from the left: Keith Olbermann. Phil Donahue had the top-rated program on MSNBC when his show was canceled.

Just imagine if the media went after Bush on the Iraq war or Plamegate with the same zeal they went after Clinton on Whitewater or Monica. This overwhelming bias in favor of the Republicans skews all national debate. Pukes can make outrageous statements or lies to get their points across and propose crazy-ass programs because they will be protected. Dems can't do anything without getting blasted.

Nope, the field is not level. Unfortunately, it's become part of the culture of Washington politics. They Democrats know it's not level, and are therefore gun-shy. When you know you're gonna get creamed about anything and everything you do, it's only natural to be reluctant about sticking your neck out.

So, to me, it's all about they media. Others on this thread say they have no courage, but that's just putting the cart before the horse. They'd have a lot more courage if the media was truly free and fair.

[proud2BlibKansan]

36. Reading your responses and thread starter,

your motives seem pretty clear to me. Maybe you don't understand we don't praise Republicans here. And we don't copy their work either. :eyes:

[DarkmoonIkonoklast]

38. Incompetence? Not even!

To declare the Dems incompetent is to assume that they wish to govern wisely, honestly, and with SOME respect for the citizens, the voters, the taxpayers, and the Constitution of this once-fair land...

This is manifestly false.

Those who march under the donkey (with a few, notable exceptions... judge their fruit to know which are the exceptions) are, like their twins under the sycophant, not at all incompetent; they are RUTHLESSLY competent at the one thing they care about: getting rich and/or powerful off the sweat and blood of the taxpayers.

When one party to a contract or covenant breaks the agreement, it is incumbent on the other party/parties to re-evaluate the deal. I say the leadership of the Democratic Party has shattered the compact with the public which they've claimed to honor since the days of Give-em-Hell Harry... I no longer feel bound by that contract, and I want my representation back!

Anybody with me?

[Orsino]

39. It's not incompetence, exactly.

Repubs have more power to the precise extent that they've sold out for corporate dollars. Be glad that the Dems aren't generally as good at prostituting themselves; they are probably our our only hope for peaceful reform.

Political parties are supposed to be chaotic messes. The unifying effect of money on the Republican Party is an unnatural state of affairs.