5,300 people still missing from Katrina.

[Cleita]

I'm watching the Senate hearing on Katrina. They are questioning Mayor Ray Nagin, who is fielding the questions very well. The GOP fascists are trying to get him to say that the failure was at a local level, not with FEMA or the federal government. Thank God, Senator Lautenberg stated that this needed and independent investigation and counsel because he didn't think this hearing would help much. LOL.

So, between 9-11 and now, that's 8,300 American lives lost in our country because of Bush's incompetence. Add all those dead soldiers killed overseas in unjust wars and Bush has exceeded Hitler in genocide and in less time, too.

Heil, Bushler!

[Nutmegger]

1. What's it going to take???

This pisses me off to no end!!!

COME ON FOLKS, LET'S ORGANIZE AND PROTEST!!! PROTEST DAMMIT!

[Name removed]

2. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[redwitch]

3. Feds not solely responsible

But for Christ's sake if you still think it was people's IQ that kept them there, then you are "to stupid" to bother with.

[Name removed]

6. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[strategery blunder]

8. It's not that they were too "stupid" to leave. They were, in many cases,

too poor to leave on their own.

No car, no trip out of town.

I'm going to broaden the words of Kayne West: Society doesn't care about poor, black people. (Of course, Condaliesa is doing quite well, it seems.)

[Macadian]

17. Kayne West seems to be doing quite well also.

I'm going to broaden the words of Kayne West: Society doesn't care about poor, black people. (Of course, Condaliesa is doing quite well, it seems.)

Is it now a requirment that black people must be poor to count? What is the point of noting that 'Condaliesa' is doing well?

And do people really think that these 5,300 missing people are all dead? Where are the bodies?

More than likely, they have all gone somewhere else. The situation is bad enough without all the exageration.

[earth mom]

21. Condisleeza was shopping for shoes-Expensive Shoes-during Katrina

she doesn't care about blacks or the poor either, just like her boyfriend. :puke:

The missing people haven't turned up "somewhere"-otherwise why are they on a "list"?! :freak:

[markus]

27. The bodies are still in the extensive rubble

or where washed out through the levee breaches.

Based on the resolution rates of lists in Mississippi and St. Bernard Parish, something like 14-20% of those originally reported as missing will likely be determined dead. That puts the Louisiana death toll alone at between 2,500 and 3,000.

Oh, and did I mention that the morgue in St. Gabriel is run by the same company (connected to the Bushies) that was busted for dumping all those bodies rather than repair their crematorium, and that everyone who works for them is required to sign non-disclosure documents?

They don't dare let the world know that more people died after Katrina, and largely as the result of the failure of the levees than died on 9-11 at all locations.

They would have no one to declare war on but themselves.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

33. "washed out to sea" is a likely answer for the Mississippi Coast

I was down there at a relief center early in January, and I never would have believed the damage if I hadn't seen it. A body was found the week before we arrived.

The storm surge along the Gulf Coast was the equivalent of a tsunami, which left clothing, bedding, and furniture stuck in trees and flattened or hollowed out substantial buildings.

Many people stayed behind, either because they were too poor or disabled to leave or because they had ridden out hurricanes before and thought they could manage this one. We heard of a couple who survived only by clinging to a tree as the water receded and of a man who was washed out of his house and survived only because he was able to climb into a Jacuzzi that was floating by.

[markus]

37. It's also a likely answer for the Ninth Ward and St. Bernard

The breeches in the floodwall were extensive, and the water was rushing back out as eary as Sept. 2. If you look at the photographs of the breech (the MSNBC one in particular, which I have stashed away somewhere) it's clear from the white water that the water is rushing back out.

Similarly in St. Bernard, where the levees also failed massively after being over topped, there were long stretches where the levees simply collapsed, and the water ran back out, taking a lot of debris with it. And likely, any number of bodies.

[strategery blunder]

30. You're right...Kayne West is doing well.

The poor are easier for society to ignore. That's why I added that word "poor." That wasn't meant to imply that black people must be poor to count. All people, regardless of income or race, should count, but regrettably, in Rethuglikkkan Amerikkka, some are counted more than others (hence the Condaliesa reference). Of course, Condaliesa is counted more because she's willing to prostitute herself to neocon$, Kayne West, more because he's good at entertaining people.

As far as thinking "are all these 5300 people dead?" most likely, some are, some aren't. Of course, it wouldn't surprise me if somebody paid off the corporate media to keep quiet about it.

I'm going to be spending my Spring Break in NOLA doing volunteer work; I'll have to get back to you on that after I see for myself.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

32. Society doesn't care about ANYONE that's poor...and that number is....

...growing by leaps and bounds. Until that number grows past the ability of the Fascists to control it, the misery will continue unabated.

[strategery blunder]

36. So true...

x(

[Zodiak]

4. too stupid to leave?

Whew....now THAT is respect for the dead. So simple...."don't care about New Orleans, they were just stupid anyways". " don't care about 2000, florida voters were too stupid anyways". Woo hoo....anyone who dies, if determined to be stupid, deserves no compassion. Brilliant!

:sarcasm:

Seriously, this is the most screwed-up compassionaless post I have seen on DU in some time.

[Jason9612]

5. Wow

That's pretty sad...

[Name removed]

7. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[cornermouse]

9. Nuff said.

:nuke:

[HeeBGBz]

11. Seeya...

In pizzaland.

[strategery blunder]

12. That was quick.

This thread sure brought 'em out, didn't it?

[HeeBGBz]

13. What an sick little monkey

Nothing sets me off like someone blaming the victims.

[HeeBGBz]

10. It's not that people were too stupid to leave

People had no means to leave or no cash to leave. Most of the N.O. dead did okay in the storm, but died when the levees broke after the storm.

Nagin was a scapegoat.

But, um, welcome to DU.

[DoYouEverWonder]

14. People did leave

Nagin and Blanco evacuated 80% of New Orleans. Even in the models the best HS/FEMA thought they could do was 60%. The evacuation was an unprecedented success.

The hurricane didn't kill these people, the floods the next day did. After all the M$M and Bush said the worst was over. At the same time, NAGIN was begging for help because he knew the levees were breaching. Bush wouldn't even return his calls.

[Ksec]

15. 5300? Wow, thats amazing

It really is. You would have thought we would have progressed past the point where we lose thousands in an age where the warnings were going out days ahead. The number clearly shows our government could care less about its people . No plans in place to help stranded people? Unbelievable with the many warnings of what could happen in that area. And its not only the bush administration who was totally incompetent but state and local also. The whole bunch should be beatdown. unreal incompetence from all our gov officials on Katrina. Especially Feds. They should have taken over when the city was destroyed and they sat on their hands for days and days.

[FlaGranny]

16. It doesn't surprise me that

8300 people are probably dead. I was a little surprised that it wasn't more, given what that coast line looks like. What is shocking is the total lack of humanity of some people like the tombstoned one. Imagine not being able to feel horror at thousands of innocent dead fellow humans.

[lies and propaganda]

18. i was truly disgusted by Susan Collins at that hearing

She was literally just being bitchy to him. Wording everything as rudely and blaming as possible.
When she yelled at him for having not made more documents and not actually writing a document ASKING for food and water.
Are you fucking kidding me? They had no time, power, nothing, but 4 days with nothing is excusable because of the lack of documents?
Sickening and i will never forgive this nation for what it has and has not donce concerning Katrina.

[SPKrazy]

19. Bush has exceeded Hitler in Genocide?

WTF?

Hitler killed 6 million plus

Bush, while someone I can't stand, has a ways to go to reach that marker.

Although if your point is that Hitler did this over a 13 year period, while Bush has only had 5 years, then, well, I still think he's got a ways to go.

The argument that we are fast becoming a fascist nation, through the increasing corporatism, and loss of individual rights is an argument I can follow.

[earth mom]

22. Dead U.S soldiers and dead Iraqis weren't included in the opening post.

The way things are going those who have died since 9/11 because of Bush are just the beginning.... :scared:

[SPKrazy]

23. It still is nowhere near the 7 million plus killed by Hitler or the

20 million killed by Stalin!

[Media_Lies_Daily]

34. Herr Busch has plenty of time left to far surpass the deeds of those two..

...by the way, your numbers are pretty far off for both Hitler and Stalin.

Hitler was accountable for the deaths of roughly 12 million people in the death camps...6 million Jews, and 6 million others. Add to that number the tens of millions of deaths in England, France, Italy, the Balkans, the Low Countries, and the Scandanavian countries caused by the Nazi military machine. You're probably looking at close to 40-50 million deaths caused by Hitler alone.

Stalin was responsible for 10 million deaths in the Ukraine due to enforced starvation, and about 2 million Soviet deaths per year in the Gulag for every year he was in power. The only time that number dropped below 1 million was during WWII. Again, we have another man that eliminated close to 40-50 million people during his lifetime.

The good news is that Herr Busch hasn't killed that many people yet. He's responsible for only 40,000 Afghans, 100,000 Iraqis, and 2,450 Americans in the Middle East so far.

The bad news is that Herr Busch has nuclear weapons and has publicly expressed the opinion that the U. S. is not afraid to use them in preemptive strikes. How many Iranians will die if Busch goes completely off his rocker and nukes Iran? And once the current nuclear genie is out of the bottle, how many other countries will he attempt to subjugate by threat and action? Venuzuela? Cuba? China? Russia? Europe?

You better start waking up to the fact that this isn't Kansas anymore.

[Rabrrrrrr]

20. Dude, I'm with you in the hating and excoriating - but Hitler?

Last I checked in my math books, 8300, plus let's say 100,000 Iraqi dead, is way less than 7 million.

So far less, it's not even worth considering.

Exceeded Hitler in genocide? Not by a fucking long shot.

Condemn the man all you want, and we should, because he's an evil twisted psychotic little fuckwit, but don't be stupid about it.

[Cleita]

24. LOL, I'm guilty. Math has never been my strong point.

I was in a hurry when I posted cause I had to go out. But think about this. With all this talk about nukes and retaliating with nukes if we are nuked, Bush could exceed both Stalin and Hitler, when it's all over with.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

35. Ease up on the flames....Herr Busch has plenty of time, and the....

...weapons, to prove you wrong.

[sheelz]

25. 5300 missing and

1000+ dead! :banghead:

[Taxloss]

26. I think if you talk a snap census of any major city at any time

you'd find thousands of people unaccounted for.

Some of these people probably are dead, sadly, but the same would be true in any snap accounting.

[markus]

28. Dead and Presumed Missing

Originally published on Wet Bank Guide on Dec. 21 as "The Dead". The title of this post was the title of my original WBG post on the subject back in October.

The New Orleans Times-Picayune reports Dec. 21 that the list of the missing in St. Bernard Parish has been reduced from over 200 to just 47. Sheriff Jack Stevens says deputies will begin searching in the surrounding marshes for those who may have been washed away.

At the cusp of the holidays, I imagine we should all be joyful to hear that over 150 people have been found alive, and I am. But I am also concerned at the thousands the most respected missing persons groups in this nation stil list as missing, and about what the St. Bernard outcome means for those still lost.

It means that at least 1,700 more people than the already reported 1,095 may be dead but undeclared by the government.

The National Center for Missing and Exploited Children has reduced their list of missing children from over 1,000 to 508, but that is still an incredible number after four months. The same group's list of missing adults, last updated Dec. 19, still lists almost 4,800 missing adults.

As reported on Nov. 1 and Oct. 4, the original list of the missing ran to over 7,000. I had previously suggested that the number of yet undeclared dead was over 1,000, based on a
As long as the government and the media try to pretend these people did not did, as long as Time Magazine does not correct it's statement about 23,000 acres devastated--when the figure is 23,000 square <em>miles</em>--I will keep writing here. I will not let them be forgotten.

Why are our leaders trying to suppress the death toll from the hurricanes and the failure of the defective levees? Why are the employees of Kenyon International Emergency Services charged with handling the dead, sworn to secrecy? Why was this company, a scandal-tainted Texas firm tied to the Bush family and implicated in illegally [link:rawstory.com/news/2005/FEMA_outsources_Katrina_body_count_to_firm_implicated_in_bodydumping_scan_0913.html">discarding and desecrating corpses>, hired?

I believe I know why. It is clear that the death toll from the hurricanes, the flood, and the inept government response exceeds that of 9-11, probably by the hundreds. As I said back on All Saints' Day:

I believe they don’t want us to know how badly they failed us in New Orleans, just as they failed us in New York. If the truth were known, that as many and possibly more died in Katrina as died on 9-11, who would they have to blame?

They would have no one to declare war on but themselves.

[Phoebe Loosinhouse]

29. "I believe they don’t want us to know how badly they failed us"

I believe the same thing. Think of all the help and support and human resources THEY REFUSED!!!! I live in a coastal city that could be hit just as badly by a hurricane. I will always think of those Gulf Coast residents who believed until the second they slid off their roofs into murky waters that it would be ok, that their government would be there for them if they just hung on long enough.
I am disgusted to my eternal internal soul at the inactions of our federal government to rescue American citizens.

America, wake up!! stop this stupid finger pointing at the state and local governments. If something of this magnitude hits, it is immediately WAY BEYOND the scope and control of the local guys. That why we have a FEDERAL Emergency Management. Do you get that? THIS failure and these deaths can be laid directly to the door of the Oval Office as well as the door of Homeland Insecurity and the Federal Emergency Mismanagement Dept of Criminal Negligence.

[markus]

31. 200,000

That's how many *homes*, or think of it as families, they are prepared to abandon to the tender mercies of the bankruptcy bill.

I would suggest that you get the hell away from the coast as fast as you can find some fool to by your house.

But I'm that fool. We close on a house in NOLA on March 2, after an absence of almost 20 years.

I don't know what it's going to come to, but I think the governer has made a good first start by halting all future oil leasing in the gulf.