Critical point being missed in Cheney/Libby/Plame story today?

[Jane Austin]

Wasn't the reason Fitzgerald didn't bring Espionage Act charges against Libby because he couldn't prove that Libby knew Plame was covert?

Well, if what Libby is saying now is that Cheney told him to spread classified information about the Plame/Wilson issue, isn't that an admission that Libby knew Plame was covert - - or at least that he knew he was leaking classified information?

What am I missing here?

The law professor, Turley, didn't say anything about that on Hardball, nor did Tweety.

This just jumped out at me as the biggest thing in the story.

Comments?

[Kagemusha]

1. All I see are leaks about it at this point.

And it's kinda hard to use a legal defense as evidence of anything.

[MadMaddie]

11. Speaking of leaks...

It seems to me like we are seeing leaks in the Dam of * empire.

In the begining there was one leak and they plugged it "Downing Street Memos" for a time,
...and then they had the "Valeria Plame" leak and they were able to plug it for a short time,

There was the "Brownie" leak they are trying to plug it,

Oh then theres the "Katrina leak" they are trying to plug it but it won't stop leaking,

The pressure behind the damn is becoming greater...

They have told more lies and have been engaged in more corruption than any administration in history.

The dam is going to break!! And when it does....

[Jane Austin]

13. You forgot the Domestic Spying leak to the NYT's

That's the one I think has damaged the dam the most, and now it's springing all these other leaks. :)

[MadMaddie]

14. oooh...I need to add that to my dam...Thanks...

:hi:

(Not my dental dam or pelvic dam):crazy:

[Jane Austin]

16. I hope those dams aren't leaking. Yikes!

n/t

[MadMaddie]

21. Bwahhaa....ha...haa..

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl::rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[hang a left]

20. Is it just me....

or are you always so quick to poo poo revelations about this case.

[Kagemusha]

22. No, I just like making fun of loyalty tests.

I just have an urge to say that however bad and evil we may find Cheney and Rove to be, that is not evidence in a court of law. Also anonymous reports of a legal defense are not proof of its existence. A legal defense isn't something tangible until it's argued by a living, breathing lawyer in a court of law. What we have are leaks about a possible defense leaked for political reasons by... someone, and I don't know who and neither do you.

But I'm expected to believe in this on blind faith. Sorry, I've been smacked around by life too many times to take this on faith.

And since you're on the subject of whether or not my comments are legitimate, I post on these threads because I give a damn. Because I really have high hopes for principles and justice and I resent the idea that any country's political system should be run in such a way where politics trumps national security and 'if the President orders it, it is legal'. Better is expected. Better should be delivered.

But that's not going to happen on the basis of rumor.

[MissMarple]

2. Good point. Maybe they're treating it like the elephant in the living room

And Cheney made him do it. ;)

[gkhouston]

3. Not sure. Couldn't he claim that Cheney told him Plame

was CIA but not classified? :shrug:

I think the biggest implication here is that if Libby is claiming that Cheney "authorized" him to do this, it may be the first hint that Libby is going to cooperate and things will move a little more quickly than we'd hoped when that trial date got set for next January. 'Cause if he cooperates fully, Fitz is still gonna prosecute him for the perjury, but might make a sentence recommendation and that's the best deal Libby is going to get.

[Jane Austin]

5. I believe what I heard on the news was that Cheney told him to spread

"classified information."

I don't have a transcript, so I can't swear on this.

[gkhouston]

7. oh, that would be juicy if true. I hope that's what you heard! n/t

[MsKandice01]

10. Yes, that's correct...

Vice President Dick Cheney's former chief of staff, I. Lewis (Scooter) Libby, testified to a federal grand jury that he had been "authorized" by Cheney and other White House "superiors" in the summer of 2003 to disclose classified information to journalists to defend the Bush administration's use of prewar intelligence in making the case to go to war with Iraq, according to attorneys familiar with the matter, and to court records.

Taken from here...

http://nationaljournal.com/about/njweekly/stories/2006/0209nj1.htm#

[Jane Austin]

12. Thanks for that corroboration. n/t

[Laura PourMeADrink]

4. I thought, with regard to the Espionage Act, it was a matter of

proving intent, that was so difficult. The intent to cause her harm by blowing her cover? The mere leaking of classified information is another crime (maybe same act?) - which certainly sounds like it fits, for sure.

[Jane Austin]

6. I'm only going on what I read was in Fitzpatrick's pleadings, that he

couldn't prove that Libby knew Plame was covert.

Wouldn't that be the only reason the information about the trip would be classified?

[Jane Austin]

8. In my opening post, I referred to the Espionage Act, and I think that is

not correct. I believe Fitz went on at some length in his press conference about Libby's indictment in October, that he doesn't really like that law.

I think the relevant charge here would be just plain old leaking classified information.

[Pithy Cherub]

15. Actually, Fitz may not have fully charged Libby in October.

as he gathers more evidence that would mean he could continue to add indictments up to and including the Espionage Act. as a smart prosecutor he would hold something back to get Libby to turn on higher ups in the Bush administration's rat-infested food chain. Fitz is treating this in the same manner as a mob prosecution.

[Jane Austin]

17. Oh, be still my heart!

:)

[Laura PourMeADrink]

18. You know, I was wondering, about Libby's request for daily

briefings, some of which Fitz didn't even have. I know all about the graymailing theory, but I also wonder. Say you knew there was extremely damning evidence in one of those briefings and you wondered if Fitz had it. Or wondered if someone else snitched and turned it over. By Libby asking for a copy, it let's Libby et al know what Fitz has and what he doesn't have. This idea is probably nothing that many others haven't thought of, it really just hit me.

[carolinalady]

9. If Fitz had charged Libby with outing Plame, Libby would stand

a very good chance of having the case dismissed. The WH intentionally deleted critical e-mails. Libby's lawyer is trying to use that as a basis for dismissal, but Fitz accurately pointed out that the missing e-mails do not change the fact that Libby lied under oath. The e-mails supposedly help establish that Libby was ordered to reveal the information. Fitz probably knew about the e-mails before charging Libby, so he purposely did not charge him with leaking. The WH tactic backfired in that respect because they can not make the case go away and Libby now has no reason to remain loyal. Why do you think this info has been released to the public? It wasn't Fitz who leaked it. It was Libby. He is pissed so he is going to try and damage them publicly if he can. The problem is they are like Teflon. Nothing seems to stick.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

19. teflon (now known to have a cancer causing chemical in it too) how

appropos ! Yes, I think Fitz is a very good chess player. He probably thought long and hard and weighed all the pros and cons before he charged Libby. Great drama, huh !