Spreading Democracy Dust & Jesus Juice 'over there'??

[Raoul]

Run time: 06:50 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=56iGVHDrkSk   Posted on YouTube: October 01, 2010 By YouTube Member: raoul116 Views on YouTube: 0   Posted on DU: October 01, 2010 By DU Member: Raoul Views on DU: 797

 
Hey folks, you know freedom isn't free - it has to be bought...

[zinnisking]

1. I don't want to alarm you...

But your friend has a crucifix around her neck. ;-)

[Raoul]

2. Holy

shit!! I never noticed that! And I don't want to alarm you but we're both theists... LOL

[zinnisking]

5. hehe... Thanks for clearing that up.

I was starting to feel very sorry for her and was wondering why you were trying to hurt her feelings about her beliefs. :) Even though I'm an atheist, I am still a bleeding heart.

[Raoul]

7. What is it

about you atheists that attract me like a fly to honey? LOL
Seriously, the closest friends I have, in fact, probably the ONLY friends I have (besides my wife) are atheists and/or agnostic. I think it has something to do with intellectual honesty many of you folks have. I was always a sucker for the brain..

And believe me, I would NEVER make fun of her about anything but I won't publicly say why - at least now.. LOL

[zinnisking]

11. Maybe it's because

my name is 'Christian'. B-)

And believe me, I would NEVER make fun of her about anything but I won't publicly say why - at least now.. LOL

I think I already know. I know all about the "weaker sex" power. I'm sure even a built guy like you can be reduced to feebleness when faced with their force.

Don't worry. I won't tell anyone.

[Raoul]

12. Thanks

Wink, wink. Wanna hear something that is hysterical in a way? A million years ago, or so it seems, when I was involved in formal debates with atheists on Internet forums, before presenting an argument on line I would voice it to her in a role playing thing. She would take on the atheist viewpoint and literally eviscerate some of the stuff I'd posited. Then I take her advice and plug up the holes or whatever and make my argument online.

Now we would REALLY get into the role playing and there were times when we had to stop for a while to cool down. One time I was really busting her chops about something she'd rebutted with. I was making some sarcastic jabs or something like that and know what she did? We had been doing this over a nice dinner with wine - she took her glass of wine and poured it on my head!

I was stunned to say the least but then I rolled over laughing so hard.

Don't tell her I told you okay? LOL

later...

[Enthusiast]

3. K&R. The Afghanistan fiasco

is about the single most egregious of our ill conceived wars, except for the exception of Iraq. In my mind there was actually a greater justification for the Vietnam War than there is the Afghan War. What kind of convoluted reasoning does it take to believe we can win the hearts and minds of a population by waging war on them?

19 hijackers, how many were Afghan natives? Dealing with the perpetrators of 911 would have been more effective accomplished by using intelligence assets, IMO.

[Raoul]

4. Excellent comments

and facts! This is why I would never be anywhere near a right wing bias - facts to them are like garlic to vampires.
Especially that comment about the origins of the 19 hijackers. Why didn't we bomb the hell out of Saudi Arabia - what was it, 16 or 17 of the 19 came from there?

But actually, if war were waged logically, we would have bombed the crap out of Florida since Atta (the alleged ringleader of the 19) took his flight training down there. At least I believe it was him - if not, some of the others definitely did.
thanks.

[Enthusiast]

6. Thank, Raoul.

Terrorists can use any country as a base to plan and carry out a terrorist attack. They can come from anywhere. So it makes little sense to see conventional war as a solution. Unless, of course, some misguided national leader somewhere would be stupid enough to plan and carry out an attack on the U.S.A.

I don't think there are any 'state sponsors of terrorism'. They all know U.S. forensic intelligence is too effective for them to get away with anything of this nature. But that didn't stop the Bush Administration for being complete idiots by invading two nations.

[Raoul]

8. You're welcome and

not to belabor this but I have a question. You mentioned something about 'Nam being more justified or to that effect. It's always been our belief that most, if not all wars, are money motivated. Like my wife said in the video - follow the money trail to find the real cause of a war. The question is - what was the money motivation in 'Nam? Do you have any idea about this? I've been asking this question over the years to some but no one seems to know. I know it wasn't to stop communism or other bs they spouted but I can't find the corporate tie in.

[RaleighNCDUer]

9. How about oil in the South China Sea?

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/war/spratly-oil.htm

(edit to add link)

[Raoul]

10. Never really

gave that any thought so I went over and checked out your link. BTW - thanks. The only thing, though, is that while your premise might be plausible, the reserves spoken about were in terms of 'after 1997' as in finding them or something to that effect. The war in 'Nam was in the 60s although they might have suspected, even back then, about the oil. The other thing is that the highest figure mentioned was 200+ billion which is only about 1/4 of the proven reserves in the top 10 countries in the Middle East (818 billions barrels).

But it's still plausible I guess - thanks again for taking the time to look it up and post the source here.

[Enthusiast]

13. Raoul, as you know, the domino theory

was a popular justification for the Vietnam War. Funny, now that things have played out we can see the domino theory was a flawed concept. I felt it was flawed at the time. Just as so many of us thought the Iraq War was wrong headed. Kind of strange so many of us regular guys can see these wars as mistakes right off the bat but our intelligence can't see it even though they billions of dollars worth of resources.

I wasn't drafted. My birthday came up as a pretty low number but they didn't get to me because they didn't take as many guys in 1971. I passed my physical. I figured I'd be drafted for sure.

I think at the time many looked at Vietnam as another Korea. But maybe the real motive behind the war was profit. Some people were making huge profits from the war, just like today. At least then they didn't privatize everything like today.

[Raoul]

14. Case closed...

Just found this on Yahoo news regarding our 'heroes' fighting for democracy. Hope it doesn't make you as ill as it did me.

Headline: Photos show US soldiers posing with Afghan corpses

SEATTLE – Those who have seen the photos say they are grisly: soldiers beside newly killed bodies, decaying corpses and severed fingers.

The dozens of photos, described in interviews and in e-mails and military documents obtained by The Associated Press, were seized by Army investigators and are a crucial part of the case against five soldiers accused of killing three Afghan civilians earlier this year.

Troops allegedly shared the photos by e-mail and thumb drive like electronic trading cards. Now 60 to 70 of them are being kept tightly shielded from the public and even defense attorneys because of fears they could wind up in the news media and provoke anti-American violence.

Among the most gruesome allegations is that some of the soldiers kept fingers from the bodies of Afghans they killed as war trophies. The troops also are accused of passing around photos of the dead and of the fingers.
end of quotes.

I only copied some of the info - you can find the entire article at:
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20101001/ap_on_re_us/us_afghan_probe_photographs

[Enthusiast]

15. Yup, case closed.

Obviously there will be no new won hearts and minds, no way.

[Raoul]

16. And you know what

is so sick about this? I've seen right wing bloggers support this behavior. I've even seen so called 'clergy' applaud this odious behavior. This is why I believe the real war is between those of us who are rational Americans and the extremists on the right. I've infiltrated some of their private blogs where only people of their ilk are allowed and the things I've read, well, it's food for a possible book I may write some day if I can get off my lazy ass...