Two days of defending our party . . .it's us vs. the republicans, not us vs. Democrats

[bigtree]

If it were entirely up to our party, there would already have been several Iraq votes, binding and otherwise. But, many are content to fight our party leadership instead of focus the attacks where they belong: on Bush and his republicans. THEY are the ones holding up debate on Iraq. The REPUBLICANS are keeping our troops bogged down in Iraq.

The REAL opposition to moving forward with our legislative rebukes of Bush and his occupation lies with the REPUBLICAN leadership, not with our Democrats.



http://journals.democraticunderground.com/bigtree

[bryant69]

1. I agree

I think we might be too used to beating up Dems.

Bryant
Check it out --> http://politicalcomment.blogspot.com

[jwirr]

2. I agree, as an activist much of what is happening on DU really

depresses me. We won and then we turn on our own and nothing they do is alright. We need to recognize that congress has certain rules that must be followed and that the people we elected need to have a free hand to accomplish our goals within these rules that have governed our nation for centuries. If we really feel strongly about the issues then we need to back the Democratic leads while pressuring the pugs to remember how big their defeat was in 06, remind then that 08 is on the way and they are digging themselves further into the hole with their opposition to everything the Democrats stand for.

[redqueen]

3. I don't know, bigtree.

I think there is some wiggle room here. I do agree that we need unity, but we don't need the kind that triangulates our interests into the fringe and makes holding power for power's sake the goal. Sure the republcans used that technique to great success, but what was the end result?

We do have some serious problems when Democratic leaders are helping to beat the drums of war against Iran, when Hillary says proudly that she doesn't regret her Iraq war vote, etc.

These kinds of things alienate voters. Most people don't vote -- some don't care at all, but some are just fed up with how rotten things have become.

We won't motivate non-voters who don't care. That's a waste of time. However, we CAN attract and motivate alienated voters. Calling the Dems out who don't walk the talk is one way to do that. I'm not saying we need daily needless bashing or ugliness, but rational discussion of issues that many consider to be serious problems is warranted, IMO.

I do agree with you that the real problem is conservative leadership in DC... but I think we should also not attempt to ignore or rationalize ugly truths when they are brought to light.

I think we could do a lot of harm to the party by ignoring the faults in it.

Just my two cents.

[Skidmore]

5. Well said, redqueen.

I'm in the category of the fed up and the problem is the conservative leadership in DC--on both sides of the aisle. If Democrats are going to lead they need to distinguish themselves. You can't offer different solutions and sound like the Rs at the same time.

[dogday]

7. Good Points

and I think they need consideration... Who are we if not a party of independent thinkers?

[bigtree]

8. Clinton's running for president. None of these senators will be allowed

to use the Senate as their personal platform like Dole did when he ran from the majority leader's seat.

I trust Reid and Pelosi on Iraq. I trust our party's committee chairmen. They will determine the course of the debate and efforts against Bush's militarism in Iraq and elsewhere. Spkr.Pelosi is fantastic. She has great leeway in getting legislation to the House floor and passed on to the Senate for their input. I expect that next week's action on Iraq will be decisive and swift.

The Iran debate will be greatly influenced by a strong anti-Iranian lobby which has holds sway with many members in our party. This will take active demands for accountability for their claims. I've heard from our leadership that they intend to seek some legislation which repudiates Bush's intention and imagined authority to war with Iran.

[bigtree]

12. I did want to say that I'm a great believer in justified criticism of our party

But, these things that our leaders are being criticized for regarding the Iraq debate are off the mark, in my view. Binding or non-binding, nothing is moving on Iraq. And, it's not like the leaders haven't said over and over that this is the beginning of the process which includes addressing the defense appropriations. Still, some are content in blaming our leaders for not being more strident and immediate in 'going nuclear' against the republicans.

Then there's this whole nonsense about some DLC cult which dominates Congress. These legislators aren't automatons. They share our concerns and deserve support, especially at these critical junctures where they've been set up for a fall by the opposition. We always seem to fall for it. If you just listen to the republicans on the Senate floor denouncing the non-binding resolution as akin to surrender, you can see for yourself what our leaders are up against. it make no sense at all to join in the cacophony of criticism against our own party while the opposition sits back and benefits from the deflection from their own responsibility and complicity.

[redqueen]

13. I don't know...

I think since the Vietnam war was "starved" that this one deserves the same treatment. Resolution or no, we need more strident action and words.

People are dying over there and no good has or will come of it. That's my opinion.


p.s. In addition to the loss of life, we are throwing good money after bad. How long before we can expect unity from our leaders on ending the madness? http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x149204

[bigtree]

14. if it's directed in the right direction it can move obstacles

cast in the wrong direction, strident actions and words with such a close majority can create even more resistance, which can make folks dig in who may have been open to a compromise. Republicans are deliberately fueling that strident rhetoric to make it harder for their members to defect.

[redqueen]

15. Good point...

I can only say that the party leadership's history of not using what power they have ('keeping the powder dry' too many times in the past) has made many of us suspicious of their loyalty. I don't think that's an unreasonable response after watching them seemingly abandon their own issues, the issues which they're supposed to act on on our behalf, repeatedly.

I hope that in time, we can come to trust them again. Thanks for directing your efforts toward making that day come sooner. :)

[jsamuel]

4. Just because Republicans are dead wrong doesn't mean that there aren't Dems who are missing

the point.

I think we should leave room for criticism of our own party. That is of the utmost importance to me. Otherwise we are just Republicans on the left.

[bigtree]

9. on the Iraq debate

there needs to be more focus on the republicans and their obstruction. i'm quite certain they're loving the time spent away from chewing on their hides as we backbite our own.

[Beelzebud]

6. I agree to a certain point. However we don't want to be blind followers like the Republicans are.

[bigtree]

10. of course not. But, on the Iraq issue, it's the republicans who've held up ALL initiatives

on Iraq, including their own - not Democrats.

[GeorgeGist]

11. Opposition is Escalating