Okay...let me make this clear

[Mythsaje]

My last post was at least partially tongue-in-cheek. I KNOW that it's not over until it's over. But, given current trends, it doesn't look good for the other candidates. Unless something REALLY capsizes the Clinton campaign, she WILL be our candidate. Not the best case scenario by a long shot, but certainly within the realm of probability.

On that note, however, the rest of the post ALSO suggested how we can make use of even that less than ideal situation. From recent polls, we know that the majority of Americans support generally progressive ideals like universal healthcare, a living wage, and more stringent environmental protections.

Over the course of the last twenty or so years, the Republican Party infiltrated the political sphere by running stealth candidates for relatively minor political positions all across the board, then used those positions to move themselves higher on the ladder. It's been a mostly successful venture that has only failed to this great extent because much of America has finally caught on to the fact that they're a bunch of freaking hypocritical lunatics.

So, yeah, from our point of view, the Democratic party is no longer paying the slightest attention to the base other than in some fairly obvious placating manuevers. So why don't we do the same thing the Republicans did? Not necessarily as "Stealth" candidates, but as real progressive candidates starting small and reaching higher? It'll take time, but I think ANY Democratic administration (even Hillary's) will give us some breathing space. Any failure on its part to serve the public interest could be to our advantage. Especially since we can be pretty sure that it won't further the cause of the common American over the corporate sphere.

Right now people are generally being given the choice between Republican and Not-Quite-Republican, aided in great part by a complicit corporate media.

We need to start looking past the next election cycle now and trying to figure out what we can do about all of this.

As it appears now, we don't really have much of a choice.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=1976113&mesg_id=1976113

[breathe peace]

1. GORE

.

[jgraz]

2. Sorry, the only thing I hear after that subject line is...

I am not gay.
I never have been gay.

I love my wife.

[dkofos]

3. Remember Howard Dean??

[Mythsaje]

8. I don't think the two situations are comparable...

I really don't.

[waiting for hope]

4. Hang tight Mythsaje!

Edwards is gaining some traction - did you see him last night on Olbermann? He is drawing the line in the sand concerning the differences between the two policies and he did it very well, I might add. :)

[Mythsaje]

7. He did...

I'm concerned about momentum at this point.

[waiting for hope]

11. Here's something that might slow that

down:

Clinton Won't Sign Anti-Torture Pledge

http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalradar/2007/10/clinton-wont-si.html

October 04, 2007 3:19 PM

ABC News' Rick Klein Reports: Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton has declined to sign an anti-torture pledge circulated by a liberal organization, making her the only Democratic candidate for president to withhold her endorsement of a blanket statement condemning torture.

The anti-torture pledge, initiated by the American Freedom Campaign -- a group founded by a coalition of civil-liberties groups and liberal activists -- commits the candidates to disavowing some of the controversial tactics employed by the Bush administration.

"We are Americans, and in our America we do not torture, we do not imprison people without charge or legal remedy, we do not tap people's phones and emails without a court order, and above all we do not give any President unchecked power," the statement reads. "I pledge to fight to protect and defend the Constitution from assault by any President."

The freedom campaign first sent letters to the presidential candidates in August, asking for their pledges. With Sen. Barack Obama's commitment on Tuesday, all of the Democratic candidates except for Clinton have signed off on the commitment.

"We're waiting for it, that she'll be willing to stand up for the Constitution," Steve Fox, a spokesman for the American Freedom Campaign, told ABC News. "Her campaign is well aware of what we’re doing, and that all of the other candidates have signed on."

"We're willing to give the benefit of the doubt for a little while -- not much longer," Fox added. "We're not ready to say Hillary Clinton is against the Constitution, but we’re looking for her to take a strong stand."

[Mythsaje]

15. Well, I suppose we'll see...

So far nothing has really slowed her down.

And, yeah, I really wonder why she wouldn't sign it.

[waiting for hope]

17. Combine that with this:

http://www.thenation.com/blogs/campaignmatters?bid=45&pid=239574

It really makes you wonder!

[Hydra]

5. Diebold

NSA Spying
Military Commissions act
FISA Gutted
Anti-War speach censured
Kyle-Lieberman Amendment

And Hilary will gracefully hand those powers back?

I think we'll be lucky if she decides to let us keep DU.

[Froward69]

6. with you there

[cali]

10. Look at her votes re those issues.

Yes, she voted for the horrible Kyle/Lieberman resolution. She is against warrentless wiretapping. I'm not sure about the MCA, but she voted to restore Habeas Corpus. She voted against condemning MoveOn. I'm pretty sure, there's some differences there between Hillary and the repukes.

[Hydra]

12. I seem to recall that she has a bad habit of voting the "good" position

After the vote is clearly passing.

I'm sorry, Cali, but she is making herself out to be an Imperial President. We don't need another one of those.

[cali]

13. Despite my trepidations on that issue,

she's a far safer bet than any of the repukes. I'm nervous about her. They scare me.

[Vincardog]

22. The choice is not between Hillary and the RePIGs it is between Her and the other Democrats.

WE get to pick who will head OUR PARTY.
It is not up to the Corporate Controlled Media pigs.
It is not up to the DLC.
It is not up to the old Democratic Party machine.


It is up to US. We do not have to choose between Hillary and the Republicans in the primary.

In the primary we get to choose the candidate that will represent OUR values.

I want universal Health CARE not Insurance.
I want a party leader who will work for the working people not the corporations.
I want open fair verifiable elections not black box lies.
I want to end the illegal occupation of Iraq NOW.
I want to try and convict the neoCONVICTS

[alfredo]

9. We have taken over our state party and are putting our people

in office. Our coup started in 2004. Now we are the establishment. Our people now run the state Democratic Party. Howard Dean loves us because we are keeping the grassroots active. We are constantly looking for talent for public office and campaigns.

[Mythsaje]

16. THAT'S what I'm talking about...

Exactly the crux of my point. You're doing precisely what we need to do.

Great job!

[cali]

21. Yes, but don't give us too much credit.

It's much easier to do in VT than say Alabama.

[alfredo]

24. I found that the ones that do the work get the job. It is simple

as that.

[asjr]

14. I can't make any predictions. It is

still over a year away until the election. I may change my mind 3 or 4 times before then. I may be so fed up with everything I may not vote. I wish all the Democratic candidates would include in their speechs a reference to the corruptness of this government. I wish they would drill it in to the people. I wish they would say something to force the media to concentrate on the absolute thuggery of this administration. And put impeachment back on the table as soup du jour. I'm tired of hearing about Clinton's "cackle" and Larry Craig's hand gestures and Brittney's children. The media have lost all credibility and try to shove their crap down our throats. I am a very angry old woman and getting madder by the day. If I had the physical abilities I would go to Washington D.C. and picket the WH every single day and would call the Chimp an SOB, because it is true. His mother is the meanest woman in the world.

[Mythsaje]

18. I think the corporate media is our greatest opponent

when it comes right down to it.

Without their complicity, we wouldn't be IN this mess.

[asjr]

19. Yep! Public Enemy No. 1

[Vincardog]

20. Are the primaries over? Has one vote been cast?

[Hydra]

23. According to the Media, it's all over

And apparently people are being swayed by that.

Scary.