Most people here who dislike Hillary dislike her for her focus-grouped, corporate friendly campaign

[jpgray]

But isn't that the monster the media have created? Isn't that what it takes to be a successful presidential candidate if you're somewhat left of Attila the Hun? You'll notice that the sell-outs, the triangulators--they tend to do well in presidential elections. Progressive stances on the issues are immensely popular across party lines, yet those candidates who speak honestly to a progressive agenda and don't readily sell out to corporate interests get crushed at the ballot box. Gore and Kerry ran okayish and mediocre campaigns in my view, but nothing so bad that they deserved to have their personalities summarily destroyed by media analysis of image-based trifles. I mean, Gore was painted as a fancy hotel brat phony whereas Bush's windshield cowboy act posing at a ranch he bought in '99 displayed "strong character." I mean, the media turned a guy who -can't have beer- as the guy you'd want to have a beer with. It was insane. Kucinich and Nader, meanwhile, die in the polls. The non-voters should -finally- have a reason to vote (if what Nader says is true) with Nader or Kucinich candidacies being out there. Yet they do what they're known for--they still don't vote.

Now this can become a sort of chicken-or-the-egg thing. Is selling out and maintaining obsessive image control -required- to become a major candidate? Or do all our major candidates simply choose to sell out? Does candidly supporting progressive values force you to the margin, or do only those on the margin choose to speak candidly? How many of Hillary's campaign stances are simply designed to survive the process? And how can we get media regulation and public financing of campaigns unless the people who win, who are in office -because- of that system vote to change it? It's true Democrats are far more likely to change it than Republicans, but they're still very unlikely to do so.

[Fredda Weinberg]

1. I know it's a cliche, but why do you hate America?

We both want things to be different, but given the way things are, HRC has obviously mastered the PR game and history shows that she's capable of cross-over appeal. From her missteps we can infer that her sympathies lie with us and her positions, while nuanced, are still furthering goals we support.

In an imperfect world, she's the best candidate with the greatest chance for success. That's why I campaigned for her first Senate run - to position her for this moment.

[jpgray]

2. Her campaign is far and away the best managed thus far

However it gives us a frustratingly inaccurate view of what she'd really do once in office.

[Fredda Weinberg]

5. I know, but check out her history in Ark - particularly how she

changed her public persona after Bill's re-election loss. She's a chameleon, all right, but the causes she supported are consistent with our values.

[Rageneau]

3. Hillary can win. Hillary can govern intelligently. Hillary is not the problem.

[durrrty libby]

13. It IS just that simple

:applause:

[sufrommich]

4. Did you mean to say " most people here WHO dislike

Hillary"? Surely you don't think yourself capable of speaking for "most" of the 108,000 people registered here.

[jpgray]

6. That's the meaning I was going for. Subject lines can get crowded sometimes

Sorry for the confusion.

[sufrommich]

7. Thanks for the edit.

and I don't mean that sarcastically.

[jpgray]

8. Took a bit of wrangling, but it's there!

[LeftCoast]

9. Got tired of beating up on Ellen eh?

LOL

[jpgray]

10. Is anyone actually reading the post, or just the title?

And where have I said anything about Ellen anywhere?

[LeftCoast]

11. Whoops...My bad

Nevermind.

:blush:

[meow2u3]

12. Populists get smeared in the MEDIA

because the major media outlets are owned lock, stock, and barrel by corporations! Corporate media's interests are at odds with the populist agenda: health care for all as a right vs. for-profit health care as a privilege for the rich and connected; one person, one vote vs. one dollar, one vote; etc.

Corporate interests use the media they own to push their interests, and to hell with the masses.