Clinton Health Plan for Americans Only

[Perky]

Poll question: Clinton Health Plan for Americans Only

Clinton Health Plan for Americans Only

By BETH FOUHY
Associated Press Writer


WASHINGTON (AP) -- Democrat Hillary Rodham Clinton said Thursday that immigrants living in the U.S. illegally would not be covered by her proposed universal health care plan.

The New York senator said she supports basic health services for illegal immigrants, including hospitalization and treatment of acute conditions. But she said the magnitude of the nation's health care challenge means her universal coverage proposal would not cover the 12 million people living in the country illegally.

"People who are here legally deserve some better treatment and acceptance in the law than people who are not here legally," she said. "These are hard choices."

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/C/CLINTON_HEALTH_CARE?SITE=CATOR&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2007-10-18-19-16-45

[katsy]

1. I have not voted yet.

I'm an American citizen... for all that's worth. Probably not worth much these days.

More on point, I'm a human being, woorking poor. Not part of the deserving elite. Not by a longshot.

When the vote for S-Chip passed, I thought I would have a prayer... to be able to seek medical help for a few scary lumps at the base of my skull. Maybe see a dentist. If my children could only be covered... I may be able to even get a mammogram one day. I manage to scrap enough together for my children's health and I will not put them at risk. The pie is only so big.

But if that's not to be. Okay. Just don't give me a "carrot" of giving me healthcare while waving the "stick" of other human beings.

So... HRC wants to cover American citizens? We are more deserved?

You know - I'm hurting. But I'm not stupid. Health care is a human right in civilized countries. My battle for healthcare is not one I wage on immigrants - legal or not.

It's a human right that is being denied to us all because of these jokers who fancy themselves as more deserving than the least among us.

Thanks but no thanks. Universal Healthcare for all. Wage your legal battles on some other court.

[blondeatlast]

2. Well said, my friend. (BTW, I'm abstaining as well, same reasons).

"You know - I'm hurting. But I'm not stupid. Health care is a human right in civilized countries. My battle for healthcare is not one I wage on immigrants - legal or not."

That paragraph ought to be required reading for everyone in Congress.

It seems this country is rapidly becoming far less civilized.

[katsy]

5. And a divided populous is just what the rulers require

to stay in power.

No to this health plan. Universal healthcare for all: visitors, tourists, legal or illegal immigrants. It's a human right. It's the only civilized solution. And they should cut pentagon funding to get it done. Get some French consultants to help set it up. Whatever it takes is what must be done.

I will not ravage in the gutter for a bone. People must stop listening to politicians and start supporting one another. We will never have the human right of universal healthcare until we stand up for each other and as one.

[Horse with no Name]

18. Awesome post.

I applaud you.

[katsy]

23. Thank you.

:pals:

A little moral support means so much.

[cuke]

19. As a poor Hillary supporter, I respect what you just said

"You know - I'm hurting. But I'm not stupid. Health care is a human right in civilized countries. My battle for healthcare is not one I wage on immigrants - legal or not."

[katsy]

22. I will vote for the Democratic nominee happily.

But no Democratic nominee should use health care to divide people into worthy/unworthy, legal/illegal categories and I will be voicing my displeasure of this tactic with HRC. What's next? Black people don't deserve the same LEVEL of care? Maybe the autistic should be NEUTERED? Maybe the poor have to wait years for care? Really... who the hell do these crown princes/esses think they are to judge who is worthy to receive a basic human right?

This is not about legal/illegal immigrants. We have no reason to trust the self-anointed judges in this case. And if we give them the power to make these judgments... what will the next power grab be? I draw the line in the sand here. One system for all or let the chips fall where they may. Hopefully, the chips will fall on the collective heads of the politicians!

And thank you for your kind words. It makes a difference.

[cuke]

24. I sent her money when she asked

she can listen to my complaint

[backscatter712]

3. The hospital and doctor's office is the wrong place for that shit.

If the guy's not in the U.S. legally, ICE can always knock on his door later.

But keep that shit out of the medical decision tree. Any humane health care plan should have a goal no less ambitious than covering all medical needs of every single human being on United States soil, without exception.

By the way, who are the fucking tools who voted "Thumbs up" on this proposal to deny health care to illegal aliens? You should be ashamed of yourselves. And you call yourselves Democrats... :eyes:

[Selatius]

4. So they get ER treatment, but no health insurance.

That's basically what they have now. Regardless, the illegal immigration debate is far bigger in scope than just health care.

[Dave From Canada]

6. I don't know how you can even consider covering millions of illegals under universal health care,

our system would be absolutely destroyed if we had to manage that. Good luck with that experiment.

[backscatter712]

9. If we stopped wasting hundreds of billions of dollars on pointless wars,

then implemented a very modest payroll tax or increase to the FICA tax, there would be plenty of money to provide all necessary health care to every U.S. citizen, cover every illegal immigrant, and still have money to spare. Lots of first world countries do this.

Oops, can't do that, Bush says taxes are bad... :eyes:

Do not tell me it cannot be done. That's complete bullshit. It can be done, it has been done in other nations less wealthy than ours, and the only reason why it's not done here is because so many fucking idiots in this country have their fucking heads up their asses.

This country needs an enema.

[Dave From Canada]

25. Name one first world country that provides universal health care to illegal aliens.

[backscatter712]

27. So you'd just let them die?

[Dave From Canada]

32. I didn't say just let them die. However, in Canada, we have health cards that every legal citizen

uses to access our healthcare system. If you don't have a card, you don't get service. That's how we prefer it to be. People who pay into the system, are allowed to access it. I know, crazy idea. That's how it is in first world countries with universal healthcare. Matters of immediate life and death situations may be treated differently, but I'm not sure.

[katsy]

11. It's already broken and it's not because of illegal aliens.

Greed killed it.

[Horse with no Name]

20. To start with

You are starting from a lie.
Work yourself backward from that.
WHAT IS KILLING THE SYSTEM AND KILLING THE PEOPLE IN THE SYSTEM is an overstressed healthcare delivery system.
The Emergency Room is at the heart of the rot. People are being FORCED to use it because they have no other healthcare choice.
Google how much the state and federal governments give ER's in large cities to keep their doors open.
Healthcare and clinics for all would ease THIS particular burden.

[Dave From Canada]

26. I'm just telling you what would happen to our system, if we had to cover millions of illegals. We

have enough funding challenges now. You guys are living in another world if you think you can provide universal health coverage for every citizen plus 10 - 20 million illegals, plus 1 - 2 million more per year.

[backscatter712]

28. The big obstacle is not financial, it's political.

Financing is easy - look at HR 676 for example - it pays for universal Medicare (for everyone, it does not say everyone except illegal aliens) through a payroll tax increase, a tax on stock transactions, and by raising income tax for the top 5% earners. That's enough to cover everyone, especially since universal Medicare will save money through reduction of paperwork (can't have mountains of eligibility paperwork if everyone's eligible,) and bulk purchases of medications and such (as opposed to today's clusterfuckery.) Not to mention the money saved through investment in preventive medicine instead of treating people when they're so sick they go to the ER and have to go through monstrously expensive treatments for life-threatening and chronic conditions.

The hard part is politics - like I said, too many contemptible dipshits in this country think they're better than others - they deserve health care while others can be left to die. And too many brainstems keep repeating that right wing mantra "Taxes are baaaaaaaad." It can be done, and in fact, if it is done, it will actually be cheaper than today's mess, but we don't have the political will to do it.

[Dave From Canada]

34. You're wrong if you think it's going to be cheaper to provide universal healthcare to every citizen,

including illegal immigrants. I'm not even sure how you can calculate how much it will cost, because there isn't a known figure on how many illegals are in your country. I've heard 10-20 million. And that doesn't include the 1-2 million coming in every year. If you wanna try and be the world's free doctor/hospital, be my guest, however, in my opinion, from my experiences with the challenges that have faced our system, I don't know how you could ever pull something like that off. Univeral healthcare for every U.S. citizen can be easily achieved. But universal healthcare for any person that shows up in your country from anywhere in the world? I don't even wanna guess how much something like that would cost. However, I'm sure many other countries governments would be greatful. It might allow them to bypass trying to actually provide some healthcare system to their own people, in their own country.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

7. Politics at it's ugliest.

A group of people don't deserve health care because they aren't "good" Americans..or should they be known as "untermenschen"?

[YellowRubberDuckie]

8. Guys, why should people who don't pay taxes benefit from universal health care?

They need SOME kind of motivation to be here legally instead of every reason to not. I'm all for people immigrating to this country. I just want them to go through LEGAL channels to do it. I know people who have done it from several different countries, including Mexico. There are some from Mexico who are a little upset that they worked their asses off to come here legally and the people who came in illegally get the same, and sometimes better, benefits.
Duckie

[backscatter712]

10. Most illegal immigrants do pay taxes.

Some of them may work under the table, but most these days work with fake or stolen Social Security numbers, thus they pay taxes just like the rest of us.

[YellowRubberDuckie]

29. That's called fraud....It's a felony...

And should get them deported. See, why do you want illegal criminals here?
Duckie

[angstlessk]

12. hell the truly poor don't pay taxes and get health care too boot..you want

them to go without health care? Is it about paying taxes??? if so..the poor are the least deserving of government funded health care!

[backscatter712]

13. Good point.

Like I stated, the goal should be to provide all necessary medical care to every single human being on U.S. soil. Immigration status should not enter the equation, and neither should income level or amount of taxes paid.

[YellowRubberDuckie]

14. They are here legally....

I have no beef with them.
Duckie

[angstlessk]

15. You just hate brown people who come here to get a better life?

THE PROBLEM IS WITH MEXICO..WE NEED TO SANCTION MEXICO..FORGET IRAN..MEXICO IS MORE OF A THREAT TO US THAN IRAN EVER WILL BE...MAKE THEM CREATE A COUNTRY THEIR PEOPLE WANT TO LIVE IN...NOT WANT TO EMMIGRATE FROM!!!! :grr:

[YellowRubberDuckie]

17. Then let them come legally...

I never said I hated brown people or didn't want them here...I just said come legally. You're seeing what you want to see.
And if the problem is with Mexico, why don't they stay there and FIX THEIR OWN COUNTRY? We did!
Duckie

[backscatter712]

16. So you have beef with illegal aliens getting health care?

Yeah, god forbid that you not be able to afford that 42" plasma screen because Jose needs chemo...

:nopity:

[YellowRubberDuckie]

30. I can't afford a 42" plasma anyway...

MY god, I guess no one is allowed to disagree with anyone else. Wow. And we're supposed to be open minded. I wasn't snotty at all...I was just sharing my opinion, and everyone goes off on me. And everyone reads something that wasn't written.
Duckie

[cuke]

21. Because it's the humane and human thing to do

Because I couldn't force a doctor to do something I wouldn't do no matter how much you paid me; Turn a sick person away

[LWolf]

31. That's not universal,

and it's just another version of sorting humans into groups who are more deserving of life than others.

Bullshit.

[bridgit]

33. Thumbs up...