After spending 2+ years in a job where I work with and around many gay people....

[Locut0s]

I can't help but wonder WTF homophobes are scared about?!?! I've always been left wing and pro gay rights but until recently when starting working at my first real job, assistant manager at a retail store down town, I didn't know many gay people personally. I grew up in a sort of conservative neighbourhood but my parents instilled me with left wing values from day 1. The store I work in is in a very gay friendly neighbourhood here in Vancouver. My Boss is gay as are 2 of my fellow employies and I'd say at least 10-15% of our customers are. After spending so much time with people who identify as gay I find myself almost preferring their company to straight people even though I myself am straight. Most are just so much livelier, happier, and understanding than your average gruff straight guy/gal.

[SoCalDem]

1. Some people are just stupid..

My daughter in law's best friend died recently (cancer), and his parents had "disowned" him, and his partner had died a few years earlier, so he was truly alone.. He had her go "funeral shopping" with him, and made her his power of atty. He switched over his bank account to her name and got all his finances in order. He went on vacation to hawaii with my son and daughter-in-law and after they got back he passed away a month later. They arranged his funeral and have his ashes for their next trip to hawaii (eek..just thought about homeland security :scared:..)

He knew he was dying, so in his last months he had fresh flowers delivered every day to his apartment (he loved orchids). He gave his "pet" orchid plants to my DIL, and had several parties where he gave away all his stuff. My son & DIL took him meals every day, and arranged for a nurse to stay with him his last month..

His family did not come to his funeral, and after expenses, his account had $30 in it.. He planned everything down to almost the penny.. All his belongings left over went to a mission in San Francisco..

His mother actually called my DIL, and apologized to her for not coming.. shesaid they just could not "forgive" him..

He was 33. and an only child..

Homophobia runs deep and cold..

[Historic NY]

2. Some people just can't live and let live...........

amazing and their own flesh and blood. WWJD

[Blue Diadem]

3. That breaks my heart.

I can't imagine parents being so cold. I'm glad your son and dil were there for him.

[Javaman]

8. That is just so crushingly sad. Thank god he had your DIL in his life. nt

[Kingshakabobo]

9. And I'm debating, in another thread, with DUers who say it's OK to call gays "sinners"....

.....as long as you don't "act" on it.

Real life stories like this, my friends, is where the rubber meets the road...

[Locut0s]

15. Wow that's a sad story. Amazing to think that ones own parents could be that cruel...

It can be a cold and lonely world some times. I'm glad to hear that he had your son and DIL!

[CoffeeCat]

4. My therapist and I had a conversation...

...about why I really like gay people. I'm a stay-at-home, heterosexual soccer mom
who lives in the suburbs and I've been pro-gay since I escaped from my bigoted, racist,
conservative parents.

I told my therapist that I find most of my suburban neighbors to be superficial and
incredibly dysfunctional. Some are nice and my children have made friends in the area,
but most of the adults are vacuous.

I commented to my therapist that I wished a bunch of gay couples would move into our
neighborhood, because gay people are so cool. We talked about why I connected with
gay people.

My therapist is gay and he said, "Many gay people, in this day and age, have had to go
to a pretty scary place. They have to decide whether or not they will
risk personal anguish and loss--by coming out. When they do go there, it requires
immense strength and depth. If a gay person does decide to live honestly and be
himself/herself--then they are living truly authentic lives. That process is similar
to what you are experiencing in recovery (I was raised by abusive wolves). You've shed
your shell, you risked the pain and now you're on the other end--living an authentic life."

I thought that was so beautiful and it described perfectly my affinity for gay people.

I used to be in denial and I went through a challenging process, so I could live life
on my terms. Many gay people have similar journeys. When you meet someone who has
gone to that "challenging place", you know they are authentic and living close to their
soul. They're real. They're not full of pretense and dysfunction.

So many people cover up their emotions and fill their world with possessions and distractions.

I sometimes feel that I'm surrounded by cardboard cut outs. I know there are people in
there somewhere...it's just hard to reach them. Most of the gay people I meet are
people who are living in full color. They know who they are and they're real.

It's so refreshing.

[Neecy]

13. I wish you lived next door to some friends of mine....

They're a gay couple, both in their mid-50's, and I've known them for years. They moved from San Francisco a few years ago to a suburb in Philadelphia, and not long after they moved in they noticed a lawn service guy mowing the lawn across the street. They walked over to ask what he'd charge for their lawn and the guy took one look at them and said, "I don't work for you people" and walked away. They were really hurt by that and when they told me I was more angry than they were.

People don't really realize how often we get these little cuts and why this Obama thing is so distressing. It's good to see, though, how much support from the straight community is in here - believe me, it goes a long way to healing.

[CoffeeCat]

14. I just can't believe that someone...

...would say that to a gay person.

I'm not naive. I bet things like that happen all of the time. It's
just so distressing though. When I read your post, I felt like someone
punched me in the gut.

Please know that, even though these bigots exist--there are straight
people who do support you and care about you.

"Lawn boy" is not worth thinking twice about. He sounds
really ignorant and insecure.

Everyone deserves to be surrounded by kind people and nice neighbors.

I agree with you about the Obama thing. If I was gay, I would feel
slapped in the face. As a straight person who knows when someone
is pandering, I feel like he's slapping us all in the face. My
estimation is that this was entirely on purpose--and an attempt
to position himself as more of a centrist. He must feel that he
needs to do that to woo some Hillary supporters to him.

[JNelson6563]

18. You won the therapist lottery

First of all, congratulations for having the intellect and the wherewithall to break away from all that you knew in your formative years. Few can even consider doing such. Secondly, you have one mighty enlightened therapist there.

Cheers,
Julie

[MH1]

5. They don't want their kids to be gay

and they think that if society accepts homosexual behavior as okay, then their kids will not know it's "wrong".

Everyone I know who holds this view does so for religious reasons - they've been taught and fervently believe that homosexuality is a terrible sin.

Would you like your kid to grow up thinking that abusing animals was a-ok? Mainlining heroin? And so forth. My point is that this is where these people are coming from. I base this on discussions I've had with evangelicals.

Folks here might not like to hear it, but someone taking this view is not just "nuts" and "hateful", they are, in their minds, looking out for their own kids.

They may be terribly misguided but that is because they start from the premise that homosexual behavior is such an awful sin that society has a role in helping make sure their kids don't go down that road, just like they think society should help protect their kids from drug use, pornography, and even sex and violence on TV.

And notice I use the term "homosexual behavior" because evangelicals don't see homosexuality as immutable, like skin color. They assume if you feel compelled toward homosexual behavior, that is something you can and should control, if not change - I think most assume you can change it.

This is my understanding of the evangelical position against homosexuality. My own opinion is that a lot less concern and a lot less of society's attention ought to be put on what consenting adults choose to do with each other.

The opinions on both extremes of this discussion confound and disturb me. If there is nothing wrong with homosexual behavior (imo there isn't, as long as it's between consenting adults) then why does it matter if it's a choice or not? Isn't the biological configuration really a spectrum, where some will find their orientation more strongly locked in then others? Why assume that no one can willfully change their behavior just because there are some who can't?

[lateo]

6. It is a simple fact.

Most of these hardcore homophobes are secretly gay.

[monarch]

20. I agree!

They seem to operate from the assumption that if society didn't strongly condemn "homosexual behavior," as one poster put it, everyone would be engaging in gay sex all the time.

[Odin2005]

7. Ignorance, sheepishness, and religious stupidity.

It basically stems from the BS spewed from St. Augustine and various later theologians about how all sex is sinful unless it is done only to procreate, even enjoying sex was considered sinful by many theologians.

[maxsolomon]

10. i've been around openly gay men since 4th grade

i'm 44 now, so that's 35 years. my elementary school art teacher & humanities teacher were in a committed relationship that lasted until an early AIDS death - 1982 i think.

i'm not scarred, and i'm grateful that my parents were a. open minded enough not to care (they let me go to NYC in 7th grade for a week with this couple & see broadway plays!) or b. clueless. i don't think i even figured it out until after that trip - 8th grade, 9th grade - when i realized that 2 men having their christmas decorations featured on the front page of the cincinnati enquirer was atypical.

that said, gay men can be just as tiresome & irritating as anyone else. especially in freak-out-the-straight-boy mode. but they can also be the most engaging, least judgemental people on the planet. and they're among the only people who remain actively social after 40.

i chalk the hatred of homosexuality up to pure stubborn willful ignorance & fear of the unknown.

[Atman]

11. I worked in the womens fashion industry for years.

I was the only straight male in the department (or semi-straight, anyway). It really worked out to my benefit when vendors would come around handing out hockey tickets to their skybox. But I certainly agree, and research backs you up; people with gay friends are more tolerant, because they get to see that gay people aren't any different. I'm always amused by the straights who think they'll be hit on or raped in the shower if there is a gay guy there. Why? Do straight people just randomly fuck strangers? What makes them think they're so hot that someone will immediately want to do them just by standing close by? It's comical.

Being an artist in the womens fashion biz, I pretty much had mostly gay friends for a long time. All were very cool, except my boss, who was a total douche bag, but as a human in general not because he was gay.

.

[Locut0s]

16. I've come to think that being gay tends to breed one fo two things in people...

either acceptance and from that a sense of easiness and happiness or bitterness and resentment at the way the world has treated them. I have met many a bitter and mean gay person in my time working as well but given the way the world treats gays I can't really blame them.

[sweetpotato]

12. Who owns whom?

This is the fundamental problem with gay relationships as seen through the lens of the patriarchy. According to "the way the world works" men are supposed to own women. Women are to submit to this ownership. They have to change their names, listen to their husbands/owners, and submit, submit, submit.

When you try to adapt this construct to gay relationships, there is no clear "owner" and no clear "posession." Gay relationships are between EQUALS, and people who have bought into the patriarchal society as the "only way" cannot accept marriage between equals.

At least this is my theory.

I've been trying for years to figure out how a marriage between two men or two women threatens my heterosexual marriage and this is the best I can come up with. Its "unnatural" to those who want to perpetuate the patriarchy.

If you allow women to marry other women - who will tell them what to do? Who will "keep them in line?" They have no man to head up the household. Its unnatural, I tell you!

[JNelson6563]

17. I feel the same way

My friends who are gay are the kindest, most enlightened souls! I love them and feel fortunate they are a part of my journey through life.

It isn't money that makes us truly rich, it is those who are a part of our lives.

Julie--a wealthy woman

[Az]

19. You have no scars on your face and you cannot handle pressure

Old song by Billy Joel that I think sums up a lot of prejudice and intolerance. There are people that lead insulated lives. They only come to know their own niche and are never exposed to any ideas or people outside that realm. They never have to struggle or deal with adversity the way others do. And as a result they believe that the world should be like their little hidey hole. Meanwhile other people lead lives with adversity and turmoil and they learn to give other people slack because they recognize the slings and arrows that life can toss at anyone. Because they have their scars they can recognize the scars others have and they can let them be who they need to be.