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If bushco murdered Wellstone, how come they didn't do in Jeffords?

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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-31-07 02:20 PM
Original message
If bushco murdered Wellstone, how come they didn't do in Jeffords?
Jeffords put more of a wrench in the works for bushco than Wellstone did. So how come they didn't do him in? And it would have been easy too, right? So why cede control of the Senate when they could have just knocked off Jeffords?
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Virginia Dare Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-31-07 02:23 PM
Response to Original message
1. This is slightly OT Cali, but what are your thoughts on the..
anthrax attacks?
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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-31-07 02:30 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. I don't know.
A while back, I did quite a bit of reading about it, and I didn't feel able to come to a conclusion. But I do believe that you can make a case that it was an inside job of some sort.
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Virginia Dare Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-31-07 02:45 PM
Response to Reply #2
5. I unequivocally think it was an inside job..
and this is the reason why I think there are "forces" out there who wouldn't stoop to murder and/or attempted murder to get what they want. Considering who had the most to gain from getting Daschle and Leahy out of the way, it's not too big a leap to figure out who that may have been. Just throwing that out there.
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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-31-07 02:38 PM
Response to Original message
3. kick
anyone care to offer an opinion?
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mmonk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-31-07 03:22 PM
Response to Reply #3
20. On Jeffords or the anthrax?
Edited on Wed Oct-31-07 03:42 PM by mmonk
I think Wellstone was seen as someone who could gather support more readily. The anthrax was either connected to the MIC, possibly someone in the State Dept., or one of the semi-legit groups the neocons are thick with. The person had to have access to a militray lab as well.
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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-31-07 03:24 PM
Response to Reply #20
23. Sorry, I'm not following you.
Do you mean that Wellstone commanded more of a following? How did that pose more of a threat to bushco than handing the Senate to the dems?
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mmonk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-31-07 03:47 PM
Response to Reply #23
29. Who would replace Jeffords?
Would it necessarily be a democrat? I make no claims on the Wellstone death anyway, others do. The anthrax issue has more smoke to it. What's the point of this little inquiry anyway?
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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-31-07 03:53 PM
Response to Reply #29
34. no. it would have been a republican. Our gov is
a repub and he would have named a replacement. The point of the exercise is simply that there was at least one other senator who was as much or more of an immediate problem than Wellstone
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mmonk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-31-07 03:58 PM
Response to Reply #34
35. I was thinking republican as well.
It doesn't prove anything one way or the other. That's why I don't dwell on the Wellstone death, just miss the leadership he showed. I do however, have major questions on the anthrax and was wondering how that entered the conversation.
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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-31-07 04:12 PM
Response to Reply #35
36. yeah. I also have major questions about the
anthax. Furthermore, I'm very suspicious of the fact that they haven't apprehended anyone.
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mmonk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-31-07 09:26 PM
Response to Reply #36
42. You would think if they were fighting such a big "war on terror"
they would have made a better effort. The mo for the anthrax mailings is American rightwing since it went to congressional democrats and media anchors. Such an operation wouldn't really benefit a terrorist organization (just singling out dems and news anchors).
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seemslikeadream Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-31-07 02:41 PM
Response to Original message
4. A-S-B-E-S-T-O-S
C-H-E-N-E-Y
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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-31-07 03:06 PM
Response to Reply #4
7. Wellstone wasn't the only key person in that
and that doesn't answer my question about Jeffords, who threw the admin for a big loop.
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seemslikeadream Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-31-07 03:07 PM
Response to Reply #7
8. YES HE WAS
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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-31-07 03:17 PM
Response to Reply #8
13. oh, that just proves everything. Thank you so much for
your insight. :shrug:
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seemslikeadream Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-31-07 04:16 PM
Response to Reply #13
37. I started this really lonely battle with good friend Senator Wellstone
Edited on Wed Oct-31-07 04:19 PM by seemslikeadream
Sen. Murray Opposes SB 2290, Praises Dr. Bret Williams, Dr. Harvey Pass, Chris Hahn and MARF


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Remarks by Senator Patty Murray on Asbestos Legislation

http://murray.senate.gov/news.cfm?id=220630

For Immediate Release: Wednesday, April 21, 2004

Mr. President, I rise today to share my serious concerns with the asbestos liability bill now before the Senate. As my colleagues know, this is not just another bill for me. This is something I’ve spent years learning about, educating my colleagues about, and writing legislation to address.

In fact, my work on asbestos started 3 years ago this very month, when I asked the Senate HELP Committee to hold a hearing on asbestos exposure in the workplace. I started this as a really lonely battle with good friend Senator Wellstone. We held press conferences, and it seemed like no one came. Senator Baucus and Senator Cantwell were with us, but it was a very lonely fight.

That’s why today it is so great to watch my colleagues like Senator Daschle, Senator Reid, Senator Dayton and Senator Leahy moving this discussion to such a productive level. They have taken the time to listen to victims, and I think that if everyone did we’d have a much more balanced bill before us today.

I’m pleased that after all these years of working with victims, family members, and doctors -- the full Senate is now engaged in a debate about asbestos.

I am also pleased that many of the things I have been fighting for have been included in this legislation. This bill includes the ban on asbestos that I first introduced two years ago. That is an important acknowledgement of what I told the Judiciary Committee last June, "If Congress is going to prevent any future lawsuits, then Congress must try to prevent any more asbestos casualties, by banning the use of asbestos."

So I am pleased by some of the progress in this bill, but I am also deeply disturbed by what this bill will do to people whose lives have been torn apart by asbestos, to future victims, to family members, and to average Americans who are being exposed to deadly asbestos everyday without even knowing it.

After listening to victims, hearing their stories, and looking them in the eye, there is no way I could vote for this inadequate and unbalanced bill.

I’m Standing Up for Many

As I’ve learned about asbestos over the past three years, I have been troubled by the duplicity of some companies, by the negligence of our own government, and by the absolute horror that asbestos inflicts on people. But throughout this process, I have also been touched by the commitment and optimism of victims. Some of them realize it’s too late for them, but they want to make sure that no other American goes through the horror they have experienced.

After working with them, I know I am not just standing here on the Senate floor as a single Senator. I’m standing here on behalf of all of the people I have been honored to meet and stand with over the past three years.

I’m standing here on behalf of people like Brian Harvey, Gayla Benefield, Bret Williams, Ralph Busch, Marv Sather, and George Biekkola. They were all exposed to asbestos through no fault of their own.

I’m standing here on behalf of family members of asbestos victims. People like Sue Vento, the wife the late Congressman Bruce Vento of Minnesota, Sue Harvey, and Lt. Col. James Zumwalt, the son of Navy hero Elmo Zumwalt.

I’m standing here on behalf of doctors who have labored to save their patients against a merciless killer. Doctors like Michael Harbut, Alan Whitehouse, and Harvey Pass, who not only provided medical care, but worked to raise awareness and call for needed research.

I’m standing here on behalf of public health leaders like Dr. Richard Lemen, the former Assistant Surgeon General of the United States, Dr. Phil Landrigan, and people like Andrew Schneider and Barry Castleman – who have worked to warn the public about these dangers.

And, I’m standing here on behalf of researchers and advocates. People like Chris Hahn of the Mesothelima Applied Research Foundation and advocates at the Environmental Working Group.

All of these people have stood with me at press conferences and have testified before Senate hearings calling for us to help the victims and to ban asbestos. We have a real obligation to them, and I’m standing here on the Senate floor today to make sure the Senate does right by people who have been wronged.

George Biekkola

Let me share one of their voices with you. In July 2001, the HELP committee held that hearing I requested on Workplace Safety and Asbestos Exposure. One of the witnesses was Mr. George Biekkola of Michigan, a World War II veteran and a community leader who helped bring a hockey rink to the children of his community.

Those of us who were at that hearing three years ago will never forget what he said. He broke down several times as he read his statement, but his message was clear. He told us that he had spent 30 years working at the Cleveland Cliff Iron Company in Michigan. He operated a hard rock drill and was exposed to asbestos dust. He was forced to retire at the age of 60 because asbestos had scarred his lungs and reduced his lung capacity by one-third.

At that hearing he told us, quote, "I thought I’d be spending my retirement traveling out West with my wife, hunting deer up in the mountains. But today, I can’t." He said that he couldn’t exert himself because his heart was weak and that he had to be careful because a simple case of pneumonia could kill him.

He told us, "This isn’t how I thought I’d be spending my retirement, but when I think about the other guys I worked with -- I guess I came out lucky."

He said, "I’m here today to tell you my story so that maybe someone else working in a mine or a brake shop or a factory won’t lose the things I have lost."

He concluded his statement with these words. "Senators, please make sure that what happened to me won’t happen to anyone else . . . Workers like me are counting on you to protect us. Please don’t let us down."

Mr. President, I’m sad to report that George Biekkola died two weeks ago today from asbestosis and mesothelioma. Until the end, he was looking out for other victims. In fact, at his funeral last Saturday, his family displayed a photograph of him testifying at that Senate hearing.

George isn’t with us today, but his words ring as loudly now as they did three years ago – Senators, don’t let us down. That is why I’ve been working on asbestos for the past three years, and that is why I cannot support this inadequate bill.

Mr. President, after all the things that Americans like George Biekkola have been through, after all they have lost, after all their families have lost, and after all they have done to protect others, I will not let them down, and that’s why I cannot support this bill.

Context

Before I turn to the specifics, I want to put this discussion in context. For decades, we’ve been pumping this poison into Americans on purpose and by accident. It’s wrecked lives, families, fortunes, and it’s been a problem for many businesses.

Asbestos is everywhere, and it’s killing us. We’ve got to stop putting this killer in products. We’ve got to stop importing products that contain asbestos. We’ve got to figure out a way to "make whole" everyone who’s been affected by this epidemic, and we need to do it in a balanced way that gives certainty and equity to both victims and companies.

This process has been an education for me because, like many Americans I thought asbestos had been banned a long time ago. In 1989, the EPA did try to ban asbestos, but that effort was overturned in a lawsuit from the asbestos industry. Ten years later in 1999, reporter Andrew Schneider and the Seattle Post-Intelligencer published articles about a disturbing trend in the small mining town of Libby, Montana. Residents there are suffering from extraordinarily high rates of asbestos related disease.

At many plants where vermiculite from Libby was processed and then shipped, waste rock left over from the expansion process was given away for free. I learned that people used this free waste rock in their yards, driveways and gardens. This picture shows Justin and Tim Jorgensen climbing on waste rock given out by Western Minerals, Inc. in St. Paul, Minnesota sometime in the 1970’s. According to W.R. Grace records, this rock contained between 2 and 10 percent tremolite asbestos. This rock produced airborne asbestos concentrations 135 times higher that OSHA’s current standard for workers. We have to do right by Justin and Tim, and those are the people I’m thinking about as I look at this bill.

I also learned that our country is far behind others. The United States remains the only industrialized country beside Canada that has not yet banned asbestos. More than 30 million pounds of asbestos are still consumed in the United States each year.

A Continuing Danger

I learned that asbestos is still found today in over 3,000 common products in the US, including baby powder, cosmetics, brake pads, pipes, hair dryers, ceiling tiles and vinyl flooring. It is still legal in 2004 to construct buildings with asbestos cement shingles and to treat them with asbestos roof coatings. It is still legal to construct new water systems using asbestos cement pipes imported from other countries. It is still legal today for cars and trucks to be made and serviced with asbestos brake pads and linings.

Workers in this country are still being exposed to dangerous levels of asbestos. According to OSHA, "an estimated 1.3 million employees in construction and general industry face significant asbestos exposures on the job."

Washington State Impact

Asbestos has taken a particularly large toll on the people of my state. According to a recent report by the Environmental Working Group, King County has the fourth-highest number of deaths related to asbestos in the country. Three other counties – Kitsap (24th), Pierce (28th) and Snohomish (52nd) all rank in the top 100 for asbestos-related deaths. Overall, Washington state ranks eighth in asbestos-related deaths nationwide.

Just last week in Spokane, Washington our state Department of Health announced that 100 former workers at a vermiculite factory likely inhaled deadly asbestos fibers and should seek advice from their doctors.

They also warned that the children and spouses who lived with these workers could become ill from particles that were carried home with loved ones on clothing, skin and in hair. Given the known dangers of this mineral, we should all be asking - why are we still using it? Why are we still adding it to products on purpose where there are perfectly acceptable substitutes?

My Work on Asbestos

Americans in every walk of life and in every corner of this country have been exposed, and we’ve got to protect them. That’s why I’ve worked to do a series of things over the past few years. On June 18, 2002, I introduced the Ban Asbestos in America Act. I reintroduced this bill again last May as Senate Bill number 1115. I want to thank all the Senators who have cosponsored my bill: Senators Baucus, Boxer, Cantwell, Daschle, Dayton, Durbin, Feingold, Feinstein, Hollings, Jeffords, Lautenberg, Leahy and Reid.

I’ve pushed the EPA to warn homeowners about the dangers of Zonolite insulation, which today is in the attics of 35 million homes, schools and businesses. I’ve urged the EPA to warn brake mechanics about the deadly asbestos dust they are exposed to on the job. I’ve asked OSHA to increase its efforts to enforce existing regulations that attempt to protect automobile brake mechanics.

I’ve shared my concerns with legislators in Canada, the country that is the largest source of America’s asbestos imports. I testified at a hearing on Libby, Montana, and I testified before the Judiciary Committee last July.

Asbestos liability is a real problem. It’s a problem for victims, and it’s a problem for companies. We need a balanced solution. Unfortunately, this bill falls short in 6 ways.

6 Problems with this Bill

First, it is unfair to victims because the awards are too small – even smaller than many would get if they were allowed a day in court.

Second, it could lock future victims out of getting help because the trust fund is inadequate.

Third, it keeps Americans in the dark about the dangers of asbestos. It does not include the education campaign that we know is needed and that I have been pushing for over the past three years.

Fourth, it falls short on research, tracking and treatment for asbestos diseases.

Fifth, it makes family members jump through too many restrictive hurdles.

Sixth it allows insurance companies to place liens on the awards that family members receive - unfairly reducing the award they deserve and treating them much differently that other federal compensation programs.

Let me discuss each of those in detail.

1. Awards Are Too Small

First, the awards are too small. Many people who have had their lives torn apart by asbestos will actually do worse under this bill than they would in court. For example, awards for lung cancer victims who have more than 15 years of exposure to asbestos are limited to $25,000 - $75,000, even though most victims will die within a year. Victims with asbestosis who have lost 20% to 40% of their breathing capacity – many who will be disabled for life – will receive only $85,000. That is far less than their lost wages and medical costs. This bill gives them less than they deserve. At the same time, it blocks the courthouse door to victims who have staggering medical bills, lost wages and other damages. I don’t see how Congress can leave asbestos victims worse off than they are today, but that’s what this bill would do.

2. The Trust Fund is Too Small

Second, the trust fund is too small to compensate all victims, but that is just one of the problems with this trust fund. I believe a successful trust fund would provide fair and adequate compensation to all victims and would bring reasonable financial certainty to defendant companies and insurers. To do that, the trust fund must include four things: fair award values, appropriate medical criteria, adequate funding, and fast processing.

The system for processing claims must allow victims to get prompt payments without the complications, time and expense of a traditional lawsuit. Unfortunately, the trust fund in this bill falls far short of what is needed. I have already discussed how the award values are unfair.

In addition, the trust fund is not adequately funded. In fact, the trust fund in this bill has been slashed dramatically from the original Hatch legislation. In the Judiciary Committee’s bill, the trust fund was $153 billion. But in this bill, the trust fund has been slashed by over $40 billion.

Now, the trust fund didn’t just shrink on its own. It was reduced after closed-door negotiations that included only one side – the defendant companies and the insurance industry. It was not based on the actual needs of victims. Instead, it was based on what insurers and businesses were willing to pay. This one-sided agreement reduced the funding provided in S. 1125 by more than $40 billion. Making matters worse, an additional $10 billion in contingent funds does not become available for 24 years. The United States Senate should not adopt a policy of adjusting award values just to meet an arbitrary and artificial limit reached in a backroom with only one side present.

Not only was this figure arrived at in an unfair way, but it’s clear that it is not enough to meet the needs of current and future asbestos victims. The Congressional Budget Office has estimated the cost of this bill at $134 billion. This bill only provides $109 billion – so there is a significant shortfall already.

But there is very good reason to believe that the shortfall will be even larger. Recent claims in the Manville trust shows much higher than expected claims for many asbestos diseases. Those claims also show that recent mortality and morbidity data increase the likelihood that the number of asbestos related diseases and related claims will exceed current estimates.

If this fund becomes insolvent, it will leave victims without the help they need. Because of that possibility, last year, Senators inserted a number of protections during the Judiciary Committee mark-up.

Important Protections Were Removed

Tragically, the bill before us today throws away those carefully-crafted, bipartisan protections.

For example, we had protections for victims in case the trust fund became insolvent. Those protections in the Biden amendment were stripped from this bill.

We had protections that guaranteed that asbestos victims would preserve their legal rights until the trust fund is operational. That’s important because if this bill becomes law, it will end up in court, and there will be no mechanism for victims and their families to get help while this law is tied up in court. We solved that problem with the Feinstein amendment, but again -- those protections were stripped from this bill.

So overall this trust fund is inadequate. If we are going to lock the courthouse doors to victims, we’ve got to be 100 percent certain that the trust fund will have enough money to cover all of the 600,000 current claims -- and the thousands more that may be filed later. This is especially important because asbestos diseases have a very long latency period – often decades long – making it hard for us to predict today who will need help in the future.

If we pass this inadequate trust fund, my constituents – and hundreds of thousands of other Americans -- will be left out in the cold with only the faded memories of their loved ones to carry them through this tragic ordeal.

3. No Public Education Campaign

My third concern with this bill is that it keeps Americans in the dark about the dangers of asbestos exposure. This bill completely drops the education campaign that was in both of my asbestos bills. One of the reasons why asbestos takes such a deadly toll is because people are unaware that they are being exposed it.

Ralph Busch of Spokane

Ralph Busch exposed himself and his wife to asbestos when he renovated his home. He never knew about the dangers until he happened to read a story in the Seattle Post-Intelligencer. Today, his dream house is abandoned, his credit is ruined, and his health is a constant worry. Ralph Busch did not do anything wrong. He couldn’t have known about the danger of Zonolite insulation. There is no way that Ralph Busch could have known that by buying and renovating an old house he would eventually expose his family to dangerous levels of asbestos.

We must make sure others do know about this public health risk by providing additional resources to educate the American public about the dangers of worksite and home exposures to products that contain asbestos.

We must also provide safety information to homeowners on what they can do to prevent asbestos exposures at home, particularly in the attic and basement.

Workers Unaware of Dangers

In addition to homeowners, many workers are exposed to asbestos on the job. Often they are not aware of the danger, and they don’t have the protective equipment they need.

I am heartened to hear that EPA, ATSDR and NIOSH are now proactively reaching out to consumers and workers to warn them to stay away from vermiculite attic insulation. But, I am very concerned that the EPA, prodded by a request from the law firm of the former acting agency administrator, is considering revising its "Guidance for Preventing Asbestos Disease Among Auto Mechanics" to convey the false impression that brake repair work is no longer a risk.

Clearly, any effort by the EPA to downplay these risks flies in the face of current Congressional intent regarding the inherent health problems with exposure to asbestos in the workplace. I sincerely hope that EPA will not bow to the pressure of the industry and in fact strengthen its guidance for brake mechanics.

4. It Does Not Do Enough for Research, Tracking and Treatment

My fourth concern is that this bill does not do enough for research, tracking and treatment.

I want to thank the Senator Hatch for including some modest resources in his latest version of the bill – which should be used to establish mesothelioma research and treatment centers around the country. Yesterday I was pleased to hear Senator Hatch say that he would be willing to explore additional funding for asbestos research and treatment centers. These centers will be critical as the medical community works to develop new treatments and protocols for the variety of deadly cancers and diseases that exposure to asbestos brings to workers and their families.

Unfortunately, not included in S. 2290 are the resources needed to track the victims of mesothelioma and other asbestos causing cancers, and to conduct additional research about the harmful effects of this deadly material.

These are areas that doctors and other experts have told me time and again we must invest in. I heard from some of those doctors last month at a press conference I held, which Senator Reid and Senator Dayton attended. At the press conference, Dr. Bret Williams of North Carolina said, "As a doctor, a cancer patient, a husband and father, I am asking my government to take a stand. Fix the problem. Give us hope. Fund a mesothelioma research program. Please invest in a cure."

A surgeon from Detroit, Dr. Harvey Pass, told us that progress on asbestos diseases requires funding, and he said that funding, "remains absolutely insufficient to set up the type of collaborative approaches that already exist with lung cancer, breast cancer, prostate cancer, and colon cancer."

So the fourth problem with this bill is its inadequate support for research, tracking and treatment of asbestos diseases.

5. Treats Family Members Unfairly

My fifth concern with this bill is the way it treats family members. Under this bill, family members of victims will be forced to jump through an additional series of hoops, reducing the likelihood they will ever receive an award.

Susan Lawes & Spokane Families

Let’s remember, these family members have lost their loved ones. In many cases they are vulnerable themselves because they came into contact with asbestos fibers through a family member. Take the case of Susan Lawes. Her father was a pipe fitter and was exposed to asbestos on the job. When he came home from work, asbestos fibers were still on his clothes. He’d walk through the door after the end of a long day and give his daughter a hug. Last month, Susan was diagnosed with an asbestos disease. As she told me, I am literally dying because I hugged my dad.

Susan and so many people like her are not treated fairly under this bill. The children and the spouses of workers should not have to prove five years of exposure to asbestos from their husbands and fathers as they would under this bill. They also should not be forced to appear before a special Physicians Review Board in order to determine their medical condition and whether they are eligible for a compensatory award.

It’s the same for people in Spokane, Washington. Spokane is one of the 22 sites that EPA has determined is still contaminated. Why are we forcing these innocent victims of take-home asbestos exposure to jump through extraordinary hoops to determine their eligibility for an award?

So my fifth concern is the unfair way this bill treats family members – making them jump through hurdles that reduce the chance they will ever get the help they need.

6. Allows Insurance Companies to Reduce Victims’ Awards

Finally, this bill allows insurance companies to reduce any awards that victims actually receive – something that is not found in similar federal plans.

This bill allows insurance companies to place liens on the awards that victims and family members receive.

I find it unconscionable that health insurance companies and other entities can recoup their costs by placing liens on the awards family members receive in compensation for their loss of a father, a husband, a son or a daughter.

These workers were often the only breadwinners in their households, but this bill tells their surviving family members that they can be sued by their health insurance provider for a substantial part of an award – an award that as I’ve shown may already be inadequate.

What’s especially disturbing is other federal compensation program do not allow this type of action, but for some reason, asbestos victims are being given fewer protections. The awards provided to victims in federal compensation programs like the Radiation Exposure Compensation Act, the Energy Employees Occupational Illness Compensation Program and the Ricky Ray Hemophiliac Relief Fund Act are not subject to liens by workers compensation insurers. I don’t know why the authors want to treat asbestos victims differently, but I do know that it is not fair, and it’s one of the reasons why I can not support this bill.

So Mr. President, in the end, this bill falls far short of what victims deserve.

The awards are too small.
The trust fund is inadequate.
It fails to educate Americans about the dangers of asbestos.
It falls short on research, tracking and treatment for asbestos diseases.
It puts unfair burdens on family members.
It allows insurance companies to reduce a victim’s award.
I’ve been fighting on this for years, and it makes no sense that we could squander this moment with a bill that is so inadequate. George and Gayla and Ralph and Marv and Bret and Brian all deserve so much better, and I will continue to fight for them.

Mr. President, regardless of what happens with this bill, the one thing we must do is ban asbestos, and I assure my colleagues I will keep fighting for that. I do want to pass a law. We need a real solution. I don’t want companies going bankrupt. I don’t want victims going without the help they need. I still think we can do it, and I will continue to fight for a balanced and fair bill that will do right by victims across the country. We really have an obligation to them and their families. I’ve been fighting for them for three years, and no matter what happens this week, I’m not going to stop now.

*** POSTED APRIL 22, 2004 ***

http://www.mesothel.com/pages/murray_s2290_pag.htm

Asbestos-Containing Products Risk Reduction Act of 2002
Posted by seemslikeadream on Fri Aug-06-04 09:25 AM

Asbestos-Containing Products Risk Reduction Act of 2002

Sen. Patty Murray, D-Wash.

Legislative Summary


................

Over the years, asbestos has taken a staggering toll on our country. We have recently been reminded of the dangers posed by asbestos because of concerns about asbestos exposure from the dust and debris caused by the collapse of the World Trade Center Towers. Had this country acted swiftly to ban asbestos when public health evidence about its dangers first emerged, the Towers would not have been built with any asbestos at all. Now we’ll need to wait several decades to determine whether asbestos exposures in New York will cause asbestosis, lung cancer and mesothelioma for first responders and residents.
more
http://216.239.57.104/search?q=cache:gyZmO6_dELkJ:epw.senate.gov/107th/Murray_062002.htm+wellstone+epa+report+asbestos&hl=en

W.R. Grace files for bankruptcy
Taxpayers may get cleanup bill for asbestos contamination

Tuesday, April 3, 2001

By ANDREW SCHNEIDER
SEATTLE POST-INTELLIGENCER SENIOR NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT



Because of the filing, taxpayers may get stuck with millions of dollars for cleaning up sites contaminated by the 150-year-old company.

Grace President Paul Norris said yesterday that his company has received more than 325,000 asbestos personal-injury claims, which have already cost the company nearly $2 billion.

The federal government has done health screening on 6,114 people or who live or lived in or near Libby. Analysis of the first 1,067 examinations showed that 30 percent of the people had signs of asbestos-related disease. With it often taking 20 years or more for the disease to become apparent, no one is willing to guess how many people will be sickened because of the exposure to asbestos in Libby and other sites that processed the vermiculite.

It is estimated that hospitalization, oxygen, medication and home care can cost a person between $300,000 to $500,000 during the course of the illness. Grace is the sixth major company to cite asbestos claims as their reasons for filing chapter 11 since January. Twenty-six companies have made such filings since 1982.

Most of the hundreds of thousands of pending asbestos suits are filed against multiple defendants. The litigation will often list 10, 20 or more corporations that either produced asbestos or used it in products they manufactured.


The Environmental Protection Agency is conducting investigations at 55 sites throughout the country where Grace ran expansion plants that turned the vermiculite ore into insulation and garden and construction products. Sixteen other sites have been identified as being contaminated enough to need cleanup.

"We budgeted between $14 and $16 million for this year, and it now becomes a problem of getting that money," Peronard said. "It's looking more and more like taxpayers will pick up what Grace drops."
EPA has been working closely with forensic accountants in the Justice Department to see whether the company has moved its assets to other, newly formed corporations.

more
http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/business/grace03.shtml


U.S. Seeks to Intervene in W.R. Grace Asbestos Bankruptcy
Posted by seemslikeadream on Fri Aug-06-04 09:39 AM


LIBBY, MONTANA—June 14, 2002—On behalf of the Environmental Protection Agency, the U.S. Department of Justice has filed a motion to intervene in a bankruptcy action involving offshoot companies of W.R. Grace, a major asbestos defendant. The government charges that just prior to bankruptcy filing, W.R. Grace transferred funds to spin–off companies to hide assets and avoid liability for asbestos claims (Daily Inter Lake Newspaper, Kalispell, Montana, May 27, 2002). The company and 61 domestic subsidiaries had filed for bankruptcy reorganization under Chapter 11 of the United States Bankruptcy Code in April, 2001.

W.R. Grace is the manufacturer of construction materials and chemicals and the former owner of an asbestos–contaminated vermiculite mine in Libby Montana. Vermiculite is an ore resembling mica that is used in housing insulation, soil conditioners, and fertilizers.

The United States is a Grace creditor and hopes to recover expenses for the environmental cleanup of Libby, which has been declared a Superfund disaster area. The company has received over 325,000 asbestos personal injury claims from Libby and elsewhere, according to a press release (see W.R. Grace web site, click on GRACE in the News, click on 2001 News Releases, then on April 2, 2001).

topAsbestos Insulation and Fireproofing
One W.R. Grace product, Zonolite insulation, often contains vermiculite that is contaminated with tremolite asbestos and derived from the Libby mines. The Environmental Protection Agency is removing Zonolite from homes in Libby, although it has no immediate plans to eliminate the insulation from millions of other residences nationwide (see article on Asbestos Zonolite Insulation in Libby).

more
http://216.239.39.104/search?q=cache:_QRtYz5UJgsJ:www.asbestosnetwork.com/news/nw_061402_wrgrace.htm+w.r.+grace+bankruptcy&hl=en


environmental liabilities -- $1 BILLION
Posted by seemslikeadream on Fri Aug-06-04 10:14 AM

Grace told the Securities and Exchange Commission in 1998 that its liability for environmental cleanups was more than S230 million. But some EPA officials estimate the company's environmental liabilities to be "substantially greater," adding that it could be closer to $1 billion.
more
http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0FVP/is_22_261/ai_87016288

OMB and EPA squash the EPA Report
Posted by seemslikeadream on Fri Aug-06-04 10:27 AM

December 29, 2002
Bush administration squashes EPA public health warning that insulation in 15 to 35 million U.S. homes is probably contaminated with an extremely lethal form of asbestos.
According to the Barre-Montpelier Times Argus and Wichita Eagle, the Bush administration has squashed the release of an EPA public health warning that insulation in 15 to 35 million U.S. homes is probably contaminated with an extremely lethal form of asbestos. The warning was originally planned to be released in April 2002, along with a declaration of a public health emergency in Libby, Montana, where ore from a W.R. Grace vermiculite mine was contaminated with an extremely lethal asbestos fiber called tremolite that has killed or sickened thousands of miners and their families. Shipping records from W.R. Grace show that at least 15.6 billion pounds of vermiculite ore was shipped from Libby to 750 plants and factories throughout North America, with between a third and half ending up in insulation called Zonolite that was used in millions of homes, businesses and schools from the 1940s through the 1990s.

In early April 2002, the U.S. EPA had a public health warning ready to go: News releases had been written and rewritten, and lists of governors to call and politicians to notify had been compiled. But the declaration was never made - just days before EPA was set to make the declaration, the warning was squashed by the White House Office of Management and Budget (OMB), even though the EPA had already greatly watered down the warning at the direction of the OMB.

Both OMB and EPA acknowledge that the OMB was actively involved in quashing the warning, but neither agency would discuss how or why. EPA’s chief spokesman Joe Martyak said, "Contact OMB for the details," while OMB spokeswoman Amy Call said, "These questions will have to be addressed to the EPA." Both agencies have also refused requests under the Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) to provide documents to and from OMB about the asbestos warning.
http://www.eces.org/articles/000256.php
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MNDemNY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-31-07 02:45 PM
Response to Original message
6. Remember the scene from Fahrenheit 911
"The Senate is absent." (for the record, I do NOT believe Wellstone was murdered)
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dflprincess Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-31-07 03:08 PM
Response to Original message
9. Because I don't think Wellstone would have rolled over and kept his mouth shut about the war
quite as easily as most senators and Bushco certainly didn't need someone in the Senate who might actually shame other Democrats into standing up. And, by getting rid of Wellstone, the Republicans were not only able to take over the Senate, they were able to replace him with that weasel Norm Coleman who only recently began trying to put a little space between his lips and Bush's butt.
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MNDemNY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-31-07 03:16 PM
Response to Reply #9
12. The war?? No, the ELECTION.
Edited on Wed Oct-31-07 03:17 PM by MNDemNY
One senator is all that was needed to challenge the 2000 election.
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dflprincess Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-31-07 03:21 PM
Response to Reply #12
19. Wellstone died in 2002
it really was past the point where he could have challenged 2000.
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MNDemNY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-31-07 03:24 PM
Response to Reply #19
22. My bad
Edited on Wed Oct-31-07 03:25 PM by MNDemNY
when your as old as I am it all blends together!
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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-31-07 03:18 PM
Response to Reply #9
16. now that's thin
why not do in Byrd then? Or Leahy?
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dflprincess Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-31-07 03:25 PM
Response to Reply #16
24. Because they had a sure thing in Coleman
I don't know who might have replaced Byrd or Leahy. There were several reasons for Bushco to dislike Wellstone (including the asbestos connection another poster mentioned.)
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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-31-07 03:27 PM
Response to Reply #24
25. OK, but
then why not do in Jeffords? They could have gotten the Senate back that way. That was certainly a big deal.
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dflprincess Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-31-07 03:47 PM
Response to Reply #25
28. Who would have replaced Jeffords?
n/t
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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-31-07 03:51 PM
Response to Reply #28
33. Vermont had/has a repub gov.
Douglas would have named Jefford's replacement and the Senate would have flipped back to the repubs
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dflprincess Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-31-07 09:37 PM
Response to Reply #33
45. But Douglas wasn't elected governor until November 2002
Edited on Wed Oct-31-07 09:42 PM by dflprincess
at the time of Wellstone's death Howard Dean was governor of Vermont and remained in that office until Douglas was sworn in in January 2003. If Bushco wanted to replace Jeffords with a Republican they would have had to wait until at least January to do anything about it - though I'm sure they could have fixed things to make sure a Republican won the governor's race.
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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-31-07 09:41 PM
Response to Reply #45
47. you're right. I forgot that Douglas didn't
get elected until 2002. Not that that changes much.
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onenote Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-31-07 03:10 PM
Response to Original message
10. an opinion: bushco didn't murder wellstone
which would go a long way to explaining why they didn't do in Jeffords or Kucinich or Leahy or Waxman or Conyers or Feingold or George Soros or Michael Moore or any number of folks that they don't much like.

And as for the anthrax attacks? I'm not sure what is meant when its referred to as an "inside" job. Was it someone with access to anthrax from a government lab? Wouldn't surprise me. Does that mean that whomever did it was acting on orders from higher up as opposed to being a lone nut? No way to tell. I lean towards the lone nut at this point.
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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-31-07 03:16 PM
Response to Reply #10
11. Yes. that's about it.
I lean toward the lone nut re the anthrax attacks too, but you're right, there's no way to tell. The reason I don't lean toward bushco having done it, is that it wasn't targeted enough.
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Virginia Dare Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-01-07 12:46 PM
Response to Reply #10
50. This is where you, me and Cali part company...
I don't think Wellstone was murdered, although I do know someone who worked for him, and they were suspicious to say the least.

However, I do not think that the anthrax attacks were a "lone nut" case. It defies logic. How could a "lone nut" get their hands on weapons grade anthrax, and if it was a "lone nut" who did, how hard would it be to catch them?

I also don't believe the "lone nut" theories on the JFK or the RFK murders. I do believe that Oswald was the lone gunman, but did he dream the whole scheme up himself? I doubt it. I guess I just have too many spooks in my family, but IMO some conspiracy theories have legs, others don't.
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madokie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-31-07 03:17 PM
Response to Original message
14. Idealogy is the difference
jeffords could be dealt with that day, whereas Wellstone was to be dealt with for years to come, beings their idealogy was all the different as day and night. I don't say I think Wellstone was murdered but I do say the timing is suspicious and it very well could have been
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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-31-07 03:20 PM
Response to Reply #14
18. What do you mean when you say "Jeffords could be dealt with
that day? How? And actually, if you know anything at all about Jeffords, you'd know that they actually weren't different as night and day. In fact, they had quite a bit in common- including opposition to the war.
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madokie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-31-07 03:30 PM
Response to Reply #18
26. it was something that could be dealt with by a lot of ways for them such as the way they did
but with Wellstone it was an ideology that government was for our, you and I's benefit and not the corporate's toady, so he was much more dangerous in the long run
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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-31-07 03:42 PM
Response to Reply #26
27. the way they did? huh?
They never dealt with Jeffords. The Senate flipped to the dems. And by your logic, they should have killed Kucinich and Sanders.
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madokie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-31-07 04:24 PM
Response to Reply #27
38. oops,
no not by my logic should anyone be killed. the way they did was how they kept on with their plan albeit jeffords and without the majority. Jeffords himself required no being dealt with, whereas the idealogy of Wellstone did
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H2O Man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-31-07 03:17 PM
Response to Original message
15. They did.
He's been replaced by the twin brother of the guy who replaced Paul.
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Gold Metal Flake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-31-07 03:19 PM
Response to Reply #15
17. Miss him, miss him, miss him.
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H2O Man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-31-07 03:50 PM
Response to Reply #17
32. #9 n/t
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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-31-07 03:22 PM
Response to Reply #15
21. OK.
liked your Cheney impeachment series btw- or at least what I've read of them- part 1.
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H2O Man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-31-07 03:50 PM
Response to Reply #21
31. Thank you.
If you will promise to read parts 2 & 3, I will be willing to add a true fact that combines part 4 and this thread.

Cheney was replaced by a video UFO. It's true. The vice president was taken by aliens, and replaced by the cartoon character Simon Bar Sinister. If you study films of the VP replacement, you will note an inhuman glow. More, when he attempts to speak, his words are mere plays on the infamous, "Simone says!" from the UnderDog carttons of old.

I will give you one guess as to the true identity of his simple-minded assistant, Cad Lackey.
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mr_hat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-31-07 03:48 PM
Response to Original message
30. 'Cos they were A TV SHOW! Get real, people.
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Hippo_Tron Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-31-07 04:43 PM
Response to Original message
39. They didn't murder him, but exploited the hell out of his death to get Coleman into office
The faux outrage that they created using his funeral was unbelievable.

If he were my father, I certainly wouldn't have let Dick Cheney come to his funeral after the disgusting campaign they ran against him. I don't care if he's the fucking Vice President, when someone performs that kind of character assassination, it's not political anymore it's personal.

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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-31-07 09:31 PM
Response to Reply #39
43. I completely agree with that
it was unbelievably disgusting.
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dflprincess Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-01-07 10:55 AM
Response to Reply #39
48. It wasn't his funeral - the funeral was private
The mock outrage was over the public memorial. Not mentioning politics at Wellstone's memorial would have been like not mentioning baseball at Kirby Pucket's public memorial.

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Hippo_Tron Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-01-07 11:42 AM
Response to Reply #48
49. Thanks for the distinction
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angstlessk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-31-07 05:48 PM
Response to Original message
40. For one thing Jeffords is a politician...Wellstone was a STATESMAN
to this day I cannot tell you who Jeffords is, but I will tell you the very first time I heard Wellstone speak in the house, I asked .. WHO IS THAT MAN?

Wellstone cannot be compared to ANYONE in congress in either houses today. He was Lincoln and JFK rolled into one.
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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-31-07 09:35 PM
Response to Reply #40
44. oh my word. Hyperbole much?
and if you don't know who Jeffords is, how can possibly feel qualified to weigh in?

You just offered opinion, not fact. I admired Wellstone. He was his own man, but it's sort of silly to suggest that he was "Lincoln and JFK rolled into one".
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JackRiddler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-31-07 06:22 PM
Response to Original message
41. Useless speculation -
Why didn't Spacelord Hitler invade Venus first instead of Mars?

It is irrational to seek to make preemptive excuses for presumed perpetrators of something you don't and cannot (yet) know happened one way or another.

As opposed to reflexive distractions such as the OP, a rational question would be, Was the Wellstone death the result of a hit?

The practical outcome of asking a rational question would have been an investigation that did not immediately rule out that possibility, which did not happen.

The attribution of the event to pilot error (an unknowable factor) is exceeded in convenience only by the awesome timing and effect of the event itself.

There is nothing crazy in the suspicion that Wellstone was assassinated, or in the refusal to be certain either way. It's a great question to pose, if this country ever has a legitimate government of the people some time in the future.
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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-31-07 09:39 PM
Response to Reply #41
46. too funny!
you indulge in speculation, but I shouldn't? My, my, what a nice little display of cognitive dissonance.

No, there's nothing "crazy" in the suspicion that Wellstone was assasinated- even though there's considerable, even overwhelming, evidence that it was an accident, but there is something crazy about being absolutely positive that he was assassinted.

But continue on with your critique. As I said, cognitive dissonance. Or sheer old fashioned hypocrisy. Take your pick.
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RFKHumphreyObama Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-01-07 01:18 PM
Response to Original message
51. If they had knocked off Jeffords during the time when he was the deciding vote
Edited on Thu Nov-01-07 01:20 PM by socialdemocrat1981
Gov Howard Dean would have named his successor -Dean didn't leave office until January 2003, which was approximately the same time as when the Republicans regained their senate majority. If they had organized an "accident" for Jeffords in the two years beforehand, Dean may have appointed a Democrat or even Bernie Sanders to the senate vacancy and this would have cancelled out the advantage of eliminating Jeffords.

Please note that I am seeking to provide a logical answer for the question on the hypothesis you posed and this should not be interpreted as meaning that I subscribe to all the conspiracy theories. Truth be told, I am generally disinclined to believe in conspiracy theories -although I am uncertain about the circumstances of the Wellstone crash and think it would be given a closer look
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librechik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-01-07 01:22 PM
Response to Original message
52. Jeffords is an R.
Edited on Thu Nov-01-07 01:22 PM by librechik
they can always control those guys, if they aren't irrelevant. Jeffords, except for perhaps one time, was more or less irrelevant.

Wellstone, on the other hand, was a loud smart passionate and popular Problem with a capital D.

No need to pull any punches there! Oh, the family was with him?

Ha ha ha. Got rid of a few future problems with a capital D as well.

I HATE THESE PEOPLE!!!!!
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Basileus Basileon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-01-07 01:26 PM
Response to Original message
53. Well, after Wellstone, they ran out of
Edited on Thu Nov-01-07 01:27 PM by Basileus Basileon
incompetent pilots who had twice been fired for failing to keep their planes at a safe minimum airspeed. So, you know, they simply couldn't have done anything.
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