We Forget What It Was Really Like Under the Clintons

[still_one]

NAFTA failures; deregulation of banking and ENRON's rise; "Welfare Reform" that led to more poor people. This and more is what the Clintons gave us.


"...the assertion that Clinton "almost single-handedly pulled the Democratic Party back from its slide into irrelevance." The historical fact is that when Clinton took office, the Democratic Party controlled both houses of Congress and a majority of state governorships. By the time he left office, the Republicans controlled both Houses of Congress and two-thirds of the governorships. By the numbers, it was Clintonism that relegated the Democratic Party to the shadows."

http://alternet.org/story/72336/

[HeraldSquare212]

1. He lost the House of Reps after 60 years of a Dem majority! Even Reagan couldn't take the House back

[still_one]

2. The argument of the article is that the Democrats should NOT have lost that majority

Something happened?

[neutron]

45. Obama must be getting desperate

if his people are putting this stuff out all over the blogs.

[Just-plain-Kathy]

49. What makes you think Obama's people put this out?

I think it's under-handed that a Hillary supporter tries to falsely pin something on Obama.

[still_one]

60. So you do not believe Bill Clinton signed the telecom act, or other deregulation

activities?

Please educate me where in that article what part of Bill Clinton's record is incorrect?

[neutron]

39. Our Middle Class enjoyed UNPRECEDENTED prosperity

Clinton was the first president to balance the budget.
He got the poor off of welfare roles and everyone was working.
There was NO WAR. The only skirmish was "get in and get out."

This Topic is a hit job. There isn't a candidate running who
can hope to accomplish what Bill Clinton did.
He was a genius.

[neutron]

40. Clinton was a Tireless Worker

and a genius.

He discovered Al Gore, don't forget.

[neutron]

41. Clinton was a Genius

He accomplished so much so fast, the right wing was terrified.

[neutron]

43. Prepare for Flush Times

if HRC is elected. She understands economics and is sharp as Bill.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

48. Everyone was working?

Uh, no, not my cousin and two friends who spent three years looking for jobs and in desperation, went on Social Security at age 62, after having used up all their savings, just so they'd have SOME money coming in on a regular basis.

No war? Just the war in Bosnia, CIA intervention on behalf of the Taliban in Afghanistan, and continued bombing of Iraq.

It's sad when people think that the Clintons are as good as it gets.

[Just-plain-Kathy]

51. Why do you work so hard to bury other posts? Why are you replying to your own posts?

[frogcycle]

3. "it was Clintonism that relegated the Democratic Party to the shadows"

Now that is a low blow.

Or several.

[still_one]

10. That is the argument presented. Deregulation was never a Democratic platform

Clinton changed that philosophy, and that included everything from the telecommunications act of the 90's, to the banking industry

Because an internet boom was occurring at the time of his administration, does not detract from the fact the foundations of what Democrats had stood for was being eroded, which not only helped lead to unfair trade agreements, but also paved the way for media monopolies

[frogcycle]

24. You seem to have missed my joke.

[still_one]

27. sorry /nt

[Just-plain-Kathy]

31. Clinton laid the foundation for the mess we're in today.

NAFTA.... The Iraqi Liberation Act, calling for the oust of Saddam...Keeping our military privatized in the hands of Cheney's Halliburton...Advising senators to sign the IWR....The Telecommunications Act, which led to the consolidation of the ownership of our media. Thank Bill when for the corporate controlled media we have now. .... Pardons!!! Rendition!!

It drives me crazy to see people here (at a place where I think smart people gather) support the wife of a president who was impeached. We need to win in ‘08 to make changes!! If Hillary wins it's because the fix is in, corporate America will continue to thrive with Hillary as president.

Hillary wants every American to purchase their own healthcare insurance. She said we would need to prove (with an ID card) that we bought insurance before we could get hired for a job. ...Talk about taking the burden of healthcare insurance off of big business.

Whitewater, treating the White House like it was a motel, withholding requested White House documents. ...By no means should Hillary be our top candidate.

Hillary’s alliance is questionable. She say’s she’s against Bush, but when it’s not election season, she supports Bush with her senate votes.

We have to think about the corporations which prospered the most in the last two decades; -Bush/Cheney holdings and Hillary’s Wal-Mart.

:puke:

I'm sure Bill would be working for the Carlyle Group if Hillary wasn't running for President.

K&R :kick:

[neutron]

44. We NEED the Clintons

They survived Kenneth Starr, let's hope they
make it past these smear jobs.

[Just-plain-Kathy]

52. He survived ken Starr? He was IMPEACHED over NOTHING.

[babylonsister]

56. NEED? Oye gevalt! nt

[frogcycle]

50. he never laid that woman

low blow, yes, but never laid

[neutron]

42. My salary was 6 digits

when Bill left office. Hasn't come close, since.

[LanternWaste]

4. I remember what it was like under Clinton...

I can really only speak for myself, but...

Under the Clinton administration, I made quite a bit more money, gave more money and spent more money. I could safely bargain for pay increases with the mere threat of finding another job to meet my needs.

Clinton left office and I was forced to accept regular reduction in pay with the threat that my employers would hire someone else for a substantially lower pay rate.


I remember what it was like under Clinton...
I remember gasoline under $2.00.
I remember high employment.
I remember the shared respect and friendship of and with many nations.
I remember a thriving and booming economy.
I remember the first genesis of the idea of universal health care coming into the public discourse for the first time.

I suppose different people remember different things.

For myself, I remember a lot of things-- bot good and bad; but as I said, I can only speak for myself. I have no doubt that many people think things are currently quite a bit better under the auspices of the current administration. But I'm certainly not one of them...

[bigtree]

6. ditto nt.

[LiberalHeart]

7. Yep. I wish we had those "awful" conditions again. Life rocked back then.

[still_one]

19. The internet boom should not be confused with the deregulation that occurred

during that time, which provided cover for the impact of THAT DEREGULATION, which laid the foundation which allowed subsequent administrations to bring us where we are today

THANK GOD CLINTON NEVER GOT THE LINE ITEM VETO, can you imagine what that would be in bushco's hands!!!

[emilyg]

32. You bet!!!

[still_one]

11. You are correct, different people have different experiences /nt

[Parche]

14. Me too

I agree with you 100%
Aslan rocks

It was the 90's era of good feelings....like President Monroe's terms....:hi:

[Lorien]

15. Yes. I made a nice six figures during Clinton's time in office

went to Paris once and year and traveled around Europe every autumn. Spent a lot of time with friends going to movies,art festivals and eating out. Bought my car with cash. Could afford yearly physicals and dental exams.


Now i make 1/5th what I used to. Haven't had a vacation since 2000. No physicals since 2000 either. I just got a dental exam for the first time in years last month; I need six fillings and two crowns. I only go out to eat about once a month, and to the movies about once every three months. It's been quite a change.

[still_one]

20. There was an internet boom going on at the time. The policies of deregulation were being laid

The impact of those policies by subsequent administrations are the pain we are experiencing right now

[OneMoreDemocrat]

22. If you don't mind my asking, and I completely understand if you do....

How did things go so badly for you?

Are you saying that your prosperity had only to do with Clinton being in office
and that everything disappeared because of Bush?

[Lorien]

33. I'm an Illustrator and animator. My income is directly effected by the

amount of disposable income Americans have. The animation studio I worked for shuttered it's doors several years ago because of declining Box Office (Disney). I had left prior to it's closing to start my own freelance career-primarily with large corporations like Disney, Sony and MGA entertainment. I mostly design toys, collectibles, theme park souvenirs, DVD jackets etc. There used to be a lot of money in it, but as people have been forced to cut down on spending the jobs have dried up. There's also been the issue of outsourcing; much of the work I used to do has been sent overseas. Now I do children's book illustration as much as anything. I love doing it, but it pays only a small fraction of what the other commercial work did. There's also so MANY out of work artists these days that corporations have slashed what they are willing to pay for a job. A job that paid $2,300.00 in 1996 might only pay $800.00 today. It's discouraging to say the least. So yes, I do think things "went badly" because of Bush's policies. There's no denying that Americans as a whole have less disposable income today than they did during the Clinton years. Outsourcing is also a bigger problem now than it was then.

[Midlodemocrat]

34. Wow. I'm sorry to hear that. I think your work is beyond gorgeous.

I had no idea that things were that bad in your industry. :hug:

[Lorien]

38. Thanks Midlodemoocrat

:hug:

[Zensea]

21. Personal circumstance is not a good basis for decision imo

I think it's more important to look at the larger picture outside of oneself when voting for President since the President is for the whole country.

I remember what it was like during Clinton's administration also for me personally.
If I based my vote on such stuff, I would vote Republican.
Why?
From 1996 through 1998 living in NYC I earned a total of $25,000. I'm quite lucky to be alive after that.
This was at the age of 40 with a Master's degree.
I didn't start making more than $20,000 a year or start working less than 50 hours a week until 2002.
I've been making way way more than that since then.
So I am one of those people doing quite a bit better under the auspices of the current administration but there is no way in hell I'd vote Republican.

[LanternWaste]

29. As I said, I can only speak for myself.

As I said, I can only speak for myself. I have no doubt that the definitive, relatively unbiased history of Pres. Clinton's tenure will be written in a hundred years or, once the subjective opinions and memories we individually hold wear off enough.

But one cannot divorce personal experiences from the political landscape, they are intertwined to an extent that in many cases, one is the concomitant of the other.

I think I wouldn't have a problem remembering the our macro-culture during his tenure, too, and I don't think it would be difficult to raise as many good point as the OP did bad points.

I have neither chosen on, nor ruled out a candidate yet-- so I'm simply not married to any one candidate's talking points yet like many of here are.


Edited: the last sentence comes off very different when I leave the N off the word 'neither'... lol

[mzmolly]

36. Indeed, which is why people should look at the actual record vs. read the above for 'accurate' info.

http://www.perkel.com/politics/clinton/accomp.htm

http://home.att.net/~jrhsc/jobwelldone.html

http://pearlyabraham.tripod.com/htmls/bill-legacy2.html

and so on... :hi:

[hedgehog]

30. Don't forget - that $2 a gallon gasoline made it that much harder to

get across the message about global climate change. It was eight years of inaction in funding alternative energy resources, IMO.

[mzmolly]

35. Yeah, that peace and prosperity stuff is for the birds!

:hi:

The fact is that Clinton had the lowest poverty rate in decades. I stopped reading the article with the first lie in the first paragraph.

[frogcycle]

55. so does Monica

[ursi]

5. I haven't forgotten and I don't appreciate the Clintons' sense of entitlement

[liberalmuse]

8. Jobs, peace, intelligent leadership. I know what you mean.

It's dishonest to focus only on the negative. Clinton did a lot of good things while in office.

[Rosa Luxemburg]

13. yes Clinton was respected worldwide too

unlike someone we know

[still_one]

26. So then you agree also with media consolidation, banking deregulation,

through the Financial Services Modernization Act which overturned the Glass-Steagall Act of 1933, along with deregulation of of the energy industry, which laid the foundations for subsequent administrations and corporations to bring us where we are today

[theoldman]

9. I remember what it was like when Bill Clinton was president.

The stock market went up and we were not involved in a big war. Did he make mistakes? Of course he made mistakes but not big mistakes like Bush. I'll take a Clinton over a Bush any day of the year.

[still_one]

28. So you are an advocate of the mass media mergers and banking deregulation

which helped lay the foundations for subsequent administrations to put us where we are today

Sometimes effects are not always realized immediately. We are paying for much of that deregulation today

[Geek_Girl]

58. Yeah there was some bad but there was also some good

The Family Leave Act-
Balanced the Budget
Budget Surplus
The Clean Air Act
High Employment
A Highly Functional FEMA

[stillcool]

12. It's not that I have forgotten...

it is what I never new. Before the internet my sources of knowledge were the television screen, and the daily paper, neither of which has ever exposed much truth about any administration. It's been catch-up time since 2000, and I'm still very far behind. I'm amazed at how so many claim to know the 'facts'. I wish it could be so easy
http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/

[NavyDavy]

16. go join the freepers with this anti clinton rw talking point....a few

bad things happened compared to a million good things happening....so I would take a Clinton over a repuke or anyone who thinks a repuke president was the voice of change but doesn't see how much work had to be done by the Dem president to fix reaganomics...

[lurky]

17. It was definitely a dark time for liberals.

Funny how the current administration makes all previous eras look like golden ages of enlightenment. Herbert Hoover? Economic Genius! Richard Nixon? Paragon of Clean Government! Ulysses S Grant? Model of Sobriety and Competence! Bill Clinton? Hero of Progressive Causes!

Sure, the Clinton administration looks amazing compared to B*, but that's about the lowest bar you could possibly use for comparison.

[Cleita]

18. Don't forget promised health care reform that was ignored

for the rest of his term when Hillary's plan tanked. I know because I was one of those Americans who slipped between the cracks in those years, unable to get Medicare until I turned sixty-five and unable to get health insurance because of pre-existing conditions.

[still_one]

23. In my view they did try to make that a reality. I don't know if the country was ready for it then

Now, with 50 million uninsured, I think the tide is changing

[Cleita]

25. Their reality was a corporate bonanza gift wrapped. That's

why Congress rejected it. After that, instead of going back to the drawing board, they didn't revisit the issue in the rest of Clinton's term.

[still_one]

59. and people will pay for it to /nt

[bigwillq]

37. Clinton damaged the image of the Democratic party

and a big reason why, I believe, we lost 2000. Even though I believe the victory was stolen from Gore, the Clinton era scandals played a role in so many people voting for Shrub.

The Clinton era scandals also brought the latest religious wave into mainstream politics.

[Just-plain-Kathy]

54. Amen. ..n/t

[Bonobo]

46. He moved the Democratic party irrevocably to the right.

And THEN he was labelled a liberal, cementing its place straight in the mid-right of the scale.

We, the Progressives, got fucked as a result.

I'm so far off the scale now, I could only be considered a commie or anarchist or something.

I don't want another Clinton for precisely that reason.

[Fresh_Start]

47. Poverty was at a 20+ year low.

Huge employment
Rising income over every decile
Deregulation started in the Ford administration...it wasn't brought to you by Clinton.
Nafta was not a failure during Clinton administration. There were so many jobs being created that Nafta wasn't an issue.
Banking deregulation was underway for 20 years before the Clinton's administration.
30 states allowed interstate banking before Clinton was elected to office.

[jlake]

53. I remember the Clinton yeas. Far from perfect but absolute heaven compared to the

hellish reign of Reagan, Bush 1 & Bush 2.

[robbedvoter]

57. Delayed the Raygun/Bush fascism project by 8 years (more if they didn't steal the 2000

election - we'd still enjoy his economy - peace and prosperity was good.