SEN. ROCKEFELLER: All right, thank you very much, Senator Wyden.
Senator Warner is next, but he's not back yet, so I'm going to take
advantage of the regular order and ask you, Director Mueller, to discuss
something which you brought up which has had almost no discussion in this
country at all. There's occasional discussion when it comes to, you know, is
Baltimore safe as a port, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. But rail lines,
and -- but there's been no kind of comprehensive discussion of it.
I would like to have you talk, if you can, for a full five minutes
about what you said, and that is the threat of terrorism within the United
States of America.
MR. MUELLER: I think -- I refer to it in three levels. The
first is al Qaeda itself -- bin Laden, the core, which, as has been described
here previously on the Fatah, and the second level is individuals who are not
necessarily directed from the outset and the planning is not accomplished by
core al Qaeda but have some ties to al Qaeda, whether it be financial or
recruiting or otherwise. And the third level is self-radicalized without any
ties whatsoever to al Qaeda.
The threat here in the United States is principally at this
juncture, we believe, self-radicalized groups with no ties to al Qaeda. Two
of those instances we rolled up last year. One related to the plot against
JFK. The other related to the plot against soldiers at Fort Dix.
However, there are individuals in the United States who are
philosophically, ideologically associated with al Qaeda who recruit, finance,
and would have the capability of providing a support mechanism to somebody,
should they come in the country, much in the way there was unwitting support
for the 19 hijackers as they came into the United States before September
11th.
And our great concern is that there will be operatives that come to
the United States, whether it be from Europe or elsewhere, that will come in
with the goal of undertaking a terrorist attack.
If you look at what has happened, transpired recently in the UK, in
2005 -- the July 7th, July 21st attacks -- if you look at the recent -- one
was a successful attack; the other was aborted, or not aborted -- was not
successful. If you look at the recent detentions in Barcelona, Spain, these
were individuals who had association with al Qaeda, had traveled to Pakistan,
gained perhaps some financial backing, but certainly the training that they
brought back, and had a cadre of individuals that were available to undertake
attacks.
Our great concern is that, while it is happening in Europe, it is
one plane ticket away from occurring in the United States. And consequently,
it's that middle level that may be self-radicalized at the outset but then,
because of the close association, familial associations with Pakistan, gets
training in Pakistan, gets support in Pakistan, and comes back, utilizes the
network to undertake an attack, would be not satisfied with undertaking an
attack in Europe but undertake an attack in the United States. SEN.
ROCKEFELLER: And I understand that. What I'd like to get you to focus on
for a minute or so is that which is carried on by people who have become
disaffected, either through unemployment, which now presumably will grow,
through the example of a cause, the attraction to a cause, and it may not be
that they actually go to al Qaeda or they get their training in Afghanistan,
but they simply decide to create malevolent actions within the United States
for purposes which can either be twisted or which reflect their fundamental
unhappiness within the American society as it's held before them in many
ways.
MR. MUELLER: I think that is a possible explanation for certain
actors who would take the dissatisfaction, the disenfranchisement in the
United States, and couple it with the radical Islamic ideology, and the two
would reinforce each other.
What you also see in a number of these instances around the globe,
well-educated, relatively well-off individuals who also have subscribed to
this ideology, who undertake such attacks. The most recent one that comes to
mind is the doctors in the UK who, not last summer -- I think it was the
summer before -- attempted to bomb a nightclub in London. That did not work,
but then drove a car into the airport at Glasgow.
These were doctors. These were not persons who were unemployed.
They are not persons who lack skills. And consequently, while you can look
at some individuals who may have motivation, given their current financial
circumstances, you cannot rule out others who would undertake attacks for
other reasons but do not suffer from the same disadvantages.
SEN. ROCKEFELLER: In 30 seconds if you can, do you see the trend
within the United States -- let me say this. Are we not paying enough
attention to this, not referring to the FBI, but referring to the American
people, to the American news media, to the discussion? The discussion is
always attracted, you know, to fire bombs and destruction overseas and loss
of life.
And yet the Robert Reid situation indicated that things can happen
in other ways also. And I think there are -- and that was very early,
therefore maybe not less relevant. But people become attracted to a cause.
People have to have some meaning in their life. They're disenfranchised
economically or in their own minds, and they want a cause to give their life
meaning, even though it's malevolent meaning. It's a very powerful factor.
And I would think that America is no less immune to that than, let's
say, parts of Africa, although it may not be as developed. And I want to
hear you talk about that, unless you find my question inappropriate.
MR. MUELLER: No, I would agree with the premise of the question in
terms of persons who fall prey to that malevolent ideology as being
something that we are tremendously concerned about. There can be any number
of causes. Do we pay enough attention to that?
My concern is that we're several years away from September 11th, and
inevitably there is a complacency that begins to take hold when there is
nothing immediately happening. And I do worry about complacency. I do worry
about early intervention, early identification of individuals who fall prey
to the ideology.
I can tell you, we, our counterparts, DHS and state and local law
enforcement through our joint terrorism task forces, are alert to this. But
it also takes representatives of the communities in which this can occur to
be alert to it and not turn a blind eye towards it and to alert us when there
are the signs that somebody is becoming radicalized and getting to the point
where it is beyond the discussion stage and to the point where they take an
overt act pursuant of a particular plot or conspiracy.
SEN. ROCKEFELLER: So to sum up, then, you do not have to be
Russian, Chinese or somebody else in order to do cyber terrorism. You can do
that as an individual, untrained in Afghanistan or Pakistan, from within the
United States if you're angry enough about something that you think that by
doing that you will bring meaning to your life simply because you feel
disenfranchised.
MR. MUELLER: Yes, meaning to your life. You know, even if you were
not disenfranchised, it brings additional meaning to your life. You can be a
college student in Atlanta or elsewhere.
SEN. ROCKEFELLER: Correct -- or a doctor. You're correct.
MR. MUELLER: And we've had instances along those lines.
SEN. ROCKEFELLER: I thank you, sir. And I apologize to Senator
Warner, whose turn it now is.
http://www.dni.gov/testimonies/20080205_transcript.pdf
Printer-friendly format
Email this thread to a friend
Bookmark this thread
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
