It Is Slowly Sinking In That Political Activity Is Meaningless

[ThomWV]

There is little to no meaningful relationship between the people and the Government in that the good of the greater public is not the driver for Governmental activity. Only the profit makers are served and the damage to they do to the people in making their profits are ignored. You and I can sing our complaints and needs from the rooftops and the only thing we will accomplish is to scare the birds. Of the 435 Representatives in the House there are less than a dozen who are truthful, even less who use their talents to serve the people. The Senate is worse. We are lied to, robbed, and our children are led to the slaughter daily. We are taxed to support the lavish lifestyles of our very masters, and the politicians who should be our servents instad tend to the rich. Almost none of the money you pay out in taxes is used to benefit you.

It does not make a whitt of difference what your or I think, what we care about, or what we see as national priorities. Should we be successful in voting in someone who actually would make a difference out decision would be immediately overridden by superdelegates.

Do you know why we have Superdelegates? Go back and look up Chicago.

[thunder rising]

1. Anymore cheery thoughts this morning?

[Subdivisions]

2. The question is, what do we do about it? n/t

[Tesha]

32. For about seven years now, I've felt that the correct answer is a guillotine set up on...

For about seven years now, I've felt that the correct
answer is a guillotine set up on the National Mall.

Until our leaders once again have some fear of the people,
they will continue to sell out to the monied interests.

Tesha

[defendandprotect]

41. What is your Plan B? What are your options --- ???

There is always a place to go --

[VP505]

3. Well said

and the more I watch the Senate and House floor debate the clearer it becomes. The only time we get a few crumbs brushed off the table for us is when we are being used for their greater gain.

[leftofthedial]

4. "elections" are a sham

we can have whichever corporate-sponsored candidate we wish, unless someone is better at election fraud than we all are at conducting a "fair" sham "election."

It really doesn't much matter. We pretend we live in a democracy; no matter who we pretend to "elect," the government by, for and of the corporations gets stronger and stronger and presses their foot even harder into our throats; things get worse and worse . . .

[Triana]

8. they are absolutely a sham - we don't choose our representatives...

...they are chosen FOR us. Elections are a ruse - we go through the motions - and that ruse is in place simply to keep us from revolting in the streets.

[blues90]

26. absolutely true

People believe in their government no matter how many times they have proven they do not represent the people and never will . It's a show every 4 years to keep us believing a lie .

[Marr]

5. There's a reason we have this pendulum effect in US politics.

The system is set up in such a way as to allow capital to almost completely control the process. Things get better for regular people only when they are pushed so far and get so angry that the establishment has a real fear of violent revolution. That's where the New Deal came from, and I'd say it's where a lot of the reforms of the 60's came from as well.

I agree with you in this sentiment-- the people are simply ignored until they pose a potential threat. That's why I expect things will have to get quite a bit worse before we ever see the concerns of the middle class really addressed.

[Earth_First]

6. One word: Superdelegates. nt

[originalpckelly]

7. Your sentiments here are the expression of an unspoken frustration with our system.

It's time we do something about this.

[MadHound]

9. It is the fact that all of the old levers of control are broken

Therefore, if we want our government back, we're going to have to develop new ones. Sadly, creating those new ones are going to require that the people act in both manner and numbers that haven't been seen for a long time. Can this be done, certainly. But it is going to require that the majority of people in this country wake from their stupor and once again become active. However there is nothing like bad economic times to do just that.

We as a people have stark choice before us. Either wake up and take our government back from the corporations, or continue down the path towards fascism that we're on. At this point I wouldn't bet either way, however that shouldn't prevent people from preparing for both.

[ThomWV]

13. There is only 1 lever of control - Money.

[MadHound]

16. Yes and no

Money is a large lever of control, and the one that is being abused today. However the people do have others open to them, both legal and illegal. It is only a matter of whether or not we have the courage of our forefathers and will use them.

[gateley]

10. I agree wholeheartedly with your assessment, and you stated it perfectly.

But even though at times I feel helpless and frustrated, there ARE a few twinkles of light:

Barbara Boxer, Chris Dodd, Feingold, Biden, Kennedy, Kerry, Dennis, Wexler and others. Even Ron Paul spoke his truth and attracted a sizable following.

We need to get them like-minded support in the House and Senate. OR - a revolution and re-build from the bottom, which has its appeal, too.

I do agree that it might need to get worse before we turn around - the Yin and the Yang - but regardless of how frustrating or heartbreaking it is, we can not give up.

[kelligesq]

11. What to do about it? change to independent or

start a third party that is what the old democratic party used to be: a Populist party. AND let the dems and republicans know what you are doing and why.

The OP's explanation is a pretty good start for a letter of why we would change
or start a third party.

[defendandprotect]

42. What you are saying is heresy here . . .. and is why there is no Plan B at DU --- !!!

[blindpig]

43. plan B

That's a start.

[defendandprotect]

45. Agree . . . but the r-w has so propagandized unions that many people

don't understand their importance == !!!

Or, the great lengths they went to to destroy them in America ---
Mafia, phoney arbitration, etal ---
and places like Walmart --- !!!

[LWolf]

12. I have always known this.

It's why I eschewed party politics until GWB; why, while I've always stayed informed and voted, I've also always viewed the entire process with more than a grain of salt.

It's why my youngest son doesn't vote, despite my urgings, and tells me that the only substantive changes will be accomplished through the death of the nation, through revolution, conquest, or just general decay. I'm not as cynical as he is, but I don't go into the process blinded by faith in the system.

[mdmc]

14. At first I thought you were my cousin,Thom

You are the only other person I know that spells his name Thom, instead of Tom.
So I read everything you wrote here on DU.
While I agree with you regarding politics, I would like to stress that all of life is politics.

I wonder how many people you moved with your OP-
This reading has rocked my world (this obscure reading has... ? forgot the title...

It was like reading DU'er undergroundpanther's diary from a century ago.

All we can do is rage against the dying of the night. And as long as you have a thought to share with us, I will rage right along side of you.

Peace and low stress :pals:

Funny, your OP brought a tear to my eye. (it sucks to be) a bleeding heart liberal.

[ThomWV]

25. Thank you very much

I really appreciate what you had to say.

Oh, on that spelling. It was a habit I got into in the Army. Sometimes they wanted a sigature, sometimes they just wanted your name. So I started writing it as "Thom" and them if someone said I was a maggot not smart enough to sign my name, all I had to do was add an "as" on the end of it. To this day that is how I sign things, Thom - space - as.

Funny world. Actually my step father got his middle name in the Army. I have no idea what his real middle name was his middle initial at birth was a C. In the service someone mistyped it as a G. on some form and he couldn't get it fixed, so he just took on the middle name "Grant" because it started with a G. No shit. Its on his grave stone.

[mdmc]

28. Kick

Reminds me of Catch22 - when the doctor pays pilots to say he was on flights that he was too scared to take.
One of the planes goes down. The narrator, doc, and a general are watching it drop. The general looks at the official flight roster and states, "Oh no, the Doc is dead too."
The doc tells him he is not dead, but cannot compete with the official flight roster.

Later the narrator asks what is wrong with another wounded friend. The friend replies that he is sick and can't be cured. The narrator asks, "What does doc Denna (or whatever his name is) say about your illness?"
The doc replies, "I'm not allowed to say anything. The general informed me that I was dead and would be court Marshalled if I continued to talk."

Horrible recount of a great novel.

[mdmc]

15. it was this thread -

This -
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=389&topic_id=2802390

We have Dean as DNC Chair. We have someone to stop HRC. We have hope.
It is obvious that someone has to do something, it is just fucking pathetic that it has to be us (Jerry Garcia of the Grateful Dead said something like this)

[bellasgrams]

19. You seem to be blinded by hate. Hillary is not the monster

you seem to believe. You have been sucked into the RW talking points during all these years. If BO manages to stay in the National spotlight for that long they will have vilified him the same way. She is a good person, a down to earth person, not snooty, or arrogant and she knows her stuff.

[Kurovski]

23. Where in that post do you see hate?

You have one opinion, they have another.

Do you think that hate is a built-in componant of disagreement?

Nowhere does that post state that Senator Clinton is a monster. Nowhere.

And you speak of arrogance, yet post this: "You have been sucked into the RW talking points during all these years." :shrug:

[mdmc]

27. I know exactly what she is

She is my senator. I understand that the wingnuts hate her. That is what I like best about her.
To me it doesn't matter who wins, BO, HRC, or Mac. The drug war will go on, Iraq war on, war on the working class, on.

It would be worth HRC winning just to see the bushbots explode.

I despise HRC a great deal as I see her as fake - a wannabe that will do whatever is popular. Strong and wrong. And proud of it.

I used to be a huge HRC fan. That ended in Iraq. Now I see her a part of the problem.

HRC will be a bit better then Mac, and much better then bush.:shrug:

[roody]

17. We can be effective and make change

at a local level, but even locally it is an uphill battle.

[L. Coyote]

18. Political activity is always meaningful. Strategy is useful in determination of effect

of activity choices.

What activity is best under what situations certainly isn't what it used to be.

If anything, there has never been so great an imperative for "meaningful" political activity.

Can we move on to the strategy discussion already? I just lost a minute. :rofl:

[DemoTex]

20. From the DU Memory Hole (2/14/2007): Money Trumps Peace

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x210732

Q: A lot of our allies in Europe do a lot of business with Iran, so I wonder what your thoughts are about how you further tighten the financial pressure on Iran, in particular, if it also means economic pain for a lot of our allies?

Bu$h: It's an interesting question. One of the problems -- not specifically on this issue, just in general -- let's put it this way, money trumps peace, sometimes. In other words, commercial interests are very powerful interests throughout the world. And part of the issue in convincing people to put sanctions on a specific country is to convince them that it's in the world's interest that they forgo their own financial interest.

(My emphasis)

http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2007/02/2007021...

"Money trumps peace." It takes breathtaking hubris and world-class arrogance to even say that in public. It is a perfect example of why we are truly fucked. We, the People, are so totally marginalized that it matters not what we think or say (or how we vote), or even what we do (within the bounds of reason), anymore. It is past time to start thinking outside the box. Waaaaay outside the box.

[melody]

21. Build the wall high enough you never have to worry about climbing over it

Inertia is the problem, not the rational outcome.

[Telly Savalas]

24. Well said.

[flashl]

22. Remember Lani Guinier?

Lani Guinier is likely best known as President Clinton's nomination for Assistant Attorney General for Civil Rights. She was called a 'quota queen' because she supported a system of proportional representation in local elections.

There is another problem in the election system that receives little attention, it is gerrymandering

Gerrymandering is a form of redistricting in which electoral district or constituency boundaries are manipulated for an electoral advantage.

Gerrymandering Is Alive and Well: Why We Need Redistricting Reform

Despite the “tidal wave” that allowed Democrats to wrest control of the House of Representatives from Republicans for the first time since 1994, the undemocratic effects of blatant political gerrymandering were alive and well.

Across the country the levees of politically gerrymandered congressional districts held against the tidal surge of voter outrage. The 2006 elections proved why gerrymandering is still a national scandal, and why those of us pushing for redistricting reform are more emboldened than ever.

Most states have vested authority over congressional redistricting in their state legislatures and that is where the problems often begin. Many of these state legislators are anxious to move up the political food chain, and so some of these politicians actually carve out a congressional district for themselves.

...

The two most effective means of rigging the voting process in redistricting are known as “packing” and “cracking.”

Packing occurs when the party in control of the redistricitng process places as many voters of the opposite party into a single district to reduce their influence in other districts.

Cracking on the other hand disperses a concentration of voters from an opponent’s party into numerous districts in order to hinder the ability of those voters to elect representatives of their choice.

---

The result is summarized by renowned Goldman-Sachs investment expert, Robert Hormats:

One of the reasons (for the horrific polarization of politics in America) is that as a result of gerrymandering in the Congress, you don't have to look for the center.

All you have do is --

if you're a Republican, you appeal to the Republican right;
if you're a Democrat, you appeal to the Democratic left.

There's very little incentive to appeal to the middle, because of the way Congressional districts are now allocated.

If your district is 80% Republican and 20% Democrat, you don't have to worry about the 20% Democrats; all you have to do is appeal to the hard-core Republicans and you will win. And the same thing with the Democratic districts.

So it reduces the incentive of members, in the House at least, to appeal to the middle.

[KoKo]

39. Interesting quote from Hormat's book. thanks. n/t

[ProgressIn2008]

29. Here is a list of things I do not expect to be touched/mentioned/acknowledged

come January 2009.

Insanely bloated defense budget
phony "war on terror"
any use of the word "homeland"
fairness doctrine
private military contractors
Bechtel, Halliburton, KBR
consolidation of media
big pharma industry & insurance industry
big money in elections & Wall Street/lobbyist money in politics
accountability/justice for Bushco
WTO
AIPAC
privatization of infrastructure
Second Congo War
Bush family history

These are not idle concerns -- they're the heart of the problem, and unless they're addressed head-on, we have more of the same. This all goes far deeper than the Bush years. To deny it only denies a beginning to the hard work needed to solve the problems.

[alfredo]

30. Forget the national, go local. City State politics is where you can make

a difference. It all starts there.

[Eric J in MN]

31. Superdelegate system was started after the 1980 election...

...by people who thought Senator Ted Kennedy should have been the Dem. nominee instead of President Jimmy Carter.

[KharmaTrain]

33. Should We Go Back To Smoked Filled Rooms?

Politicians are designed to "serve people"...now who are those people? If you're in a military district, it's gonna be different than those who serve an agricultural area as opposed to those who serve an inner city. To lump all congresscritters into one box and blame them as useless is disengenous at best. While there are those who we can and do disagree with regarding votes on specific issues, these people still have been voted in by their constituents and each wins or loses on their own merit. What we can and must do is help elect the best candidates and not be afraid to toss out those who have overstayed their welcome or face a better challenger.

So is opting out of the political system going to fix it? So what's the alternative? Pitchforks and torches? Good luck trying to get people away from their keyboards. Form a third party? And with whose money do you start it with...or do you starve yourself? Yes...the system isn't perfect, but you can't fix it if you're trying to ignore it.

The Democratic party is a private entity...its rules are determined by its members and if you want changes then change the party. A big step in that direction happened when Howard Dean became the head of the DNC...but he's had his hands full in trying to rebuild a party.

I have no fear nor concern about Superdelegates as I don't even see it being an issue. We will have a front-running candidate by the convention and the superdelegates will split along lines that will only verify the rank and file vote.

[MuseRider]

34. Very well said.

Until this election I have known this but ignored it. I always voted, held my nose almost every time. This time I just can't bring myself to even care. I felt marginalized and taken for granted for years but now the light is on and I see that we all are. That is certainly not helped by the behavior we see surrounding our elections. Not only do we have nothing at all to do with the final outcome none of the work that people do for candidates is ever repaid by a good representative. That word, representative. It sounds very old and quaint doesn't it? Could our process be anymore immature? Could it be anymore like pure entertainment? How in the hell did a smart nation become like we are today? I used to laugh when people said they would vote for the best looking candidate since they would have to look at them for at least 4 years. Now there is having a beer with them attitude. I have yet to hear a real policy discussion, nobody seems to care as long as someone can put them back into that dream that all will be better if you just vote for me. Hope? Change? Riiiight. Read my page, that says what I believe just don't watch what I really do. Really, believe me, I will be just what you want if only you elect me. You bet :eyes:.

[blindpig]

35. Might depend upon how one defines political activity.

If one defines "politics" as the election cycle, as voting for the pre-approved selections of the Money Party, then it is worse than meaningless, it is collaboration.

If all we're doing is playing a fixed game then it's time for us to start a new game. A new game would not be convenient, would require work, might require risk. And it is true that most Americans are up to their asses trying to keep their heads above water, with seemingly little time to engage in the basic, grassroots activities which are the basis of real politics, the Man counts on this. Yet if the people's concerns were to be honestly addressed, the Edwards campaign cracked the door on that and we see what happened as it got traction despite institutional opposition, the people will respond.

Might it be that the oft referenced "sheeple" are those who participate in the charade, and not those who don't?

[lonestarnot]

36. Ack reality bites/blows like a big stick beat'n!

[FreeStateDemocrat]

37. The fix is in. Fuck the ruling class.

[KoKo]

38. What's amazing is that it seems some funding for the Liberal Blogs is drying up.

Buzzflash complained a couple months back that their funding from a source had dried up. (when Dems came back in power).. Now I notice they are angry at what some of what they say were "Clinton Operatives" coming on and posting racist comments who have now pulled out and refuse to donate anymore. Buzzflash has a big plea up for money...like they are desperate. They had a year end fund drive to bring in $150,000...

The "Consortium" has been desperate for funds to keep going. And, it seems there's a lock down on our Dems feeding us info for activists to get working on. My e-mails from "Center for American Progress" are down to every couple of weeks where I used to get an "issues e-mail" every day. Only "Activism" is over at "Firedoglake" where they are still doing petitions and working for Act Blue candidtes...but even there there seems to be a lack of the "old excitement" ...as if they are working "alone," now.

It has seemed to me that when our Dems got back in power the "oomph" and "zeal" for "netroots activism and attention to discussion of issues has taken a "back seat" to the election campaign for '08.

There are other sites, I've noticed a change in...but I just mentioned the ones most here would know.

[alfredo]

40. Steve Earle Says it best:

The revolution starts now


When you rise above your fear
And tear the walls around you down
The revolution starts here
Where you work and where you play
Where you lay your money down
What you do and what you say
The revolution starts now
Yeah the revolution starts now

Yeah the revolution starts now
In your own backyard
In your own hometown
So what you doin’ standin’ around?
Just follow your heart
The revolution starts now

Last night I had a dream
That the world had turned around
And all our hopes had come to be
And the people gathered ‘round
They all brought what they could bring
And nobody went without
And I learned a song to sing
The revolution starts now

[Virginia Dare]

44. On a national level, that's true..

but on a local level, you can still have somewhat of a voice, and those are the people who make the most difference to your everyday life anyway. It's probably always been this way.

[VotesForWomen]

46. don't worry about the superdelegates; the MSM wouldn't let a non-corporate approved candidate get cl

close enough to winning for it to matter.

[Dark]

47. Yea. Political activity hasn't acheived anything in Europe

Nor have we Dems taken back either house.

The gov't is still in control of the repubs.