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AZgirl7 Donating Member (85 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 02:42 AM
Original message
Saying goodbye to my 78 yr old Republican girlfriend
Dear Carol,

Thank you for the phone message. I feel bad that we have not been in contact for these last 2 years. So, I feel that I must try to explain why I let our friendship go.

It is said that people should not discuss religion or politics. But between close friends who share many intimate aspects of their lives, it is impossible not to mix public policy and politics discussions with what are the details of our daily lives, and the impact of them on our psyche. Previous to this president’s tenure, I can assure you, I never had disagreements or hurt feelings between friends over where our country, and its worldwide reputation were going! Very early on in this decade, I got a very insecure and nervous feeling about what our president’s attitude was toward ordinary Americans, and what his priorities were. I got the message quite quickly that he was not at all concerned about people like me, who were struggling to live a stable and happy life, with some measure of hope for the future. I have come to realize that I, and millions of my fellow countrymen, have had our future financial security traded for the profit of a few. I have watched as our country’s treasures have been raided and pillaged, and my kids and grandkid’s futures mortgaged for a misguided attack and occupation upon a people and country who had no means to hurt us. Certainly our intelligence agencies could have taken out one bad man, and what was at the time, a small group of militants. 5 years later, millions have been displaced, disgraced, debilitated, disabled, murdered, and an entire country decimated. Also gone are the antiques of their ancient history, and the records of the very origin of civilization were stolen and destroyed.

I simply could not carry on a friendship with anyone who would condone and support a person who so ignorantly forged ahead with a mission like that. The treatment of our own soldiers tells the truth of how little human suffering means to this ‘leader’ of ours.

I wonder if Mr. Bush, had he ever had the guts to go to war himself, or to be waterboarded, would be able to veto a bill banning torture. A painfully embarrassing policy that has been one of the foundations of his war on terror. It’s also incredible that Mr. McCain agrees with this veto! What a despicable betrayal of his own soul. And Hillary’s YES vote for the US to continue using cluster bombs, when the whole world is condemning their use? It’s our entire government that has allowed this, and brought us to this awful place in history. All for power and greed.

Also, it was far too frustrating to interact with someone who blindly and willingly limited their knowledge of other sources of information and points of view. After searching for truths and spending countless hours reading articles from around the world, it was too hard to converse with someone who responded to my shared information by parroting the talking points of people who are well known paid puppet propagandists of the powers of the war industrial complex, and people who cannot tolerate the opposing opinions and feelings of others. True patriots care about how our country conducts itself, it’s reputation around the globe, and what it does in our names. The most painful thing has been being called unpatriotic, ‘with the terrorists’, or a terrorist myself because I did not agree with Staying The Course.

I now look at people who are the remaining 19% of people who are standing with this president and call themselves ‘staunch Republicans’, as people who have little feeling for those who have less than they do. Anyone who is not in the money seems to be looked down upon, and those humans who are in need are reviled as leeches on society, all trying to take something from you. I feel that is the basic difference between ‘conservatives’ and liberals. People who care about themselves and their money, vs. the people who care about their fellow human beings and will give up some of the excess riches they have been blessed with, for the good of all humanity or our society as a whole. With that being a core belief of mine, that if everyone is lifted, we are all happier, it was too hard to continue on with our friendship.

On a personal level I felt that you were one of the sweetest caring people I ever met, and that just didn’t square with the attitude I felt you had about our world in general and the lack of compassion towards those less fortunate than you. It’s was too hard to talk to someone who allowed themselves be programmed 24/7 by Fox News. There is a well known reason why the democrats will not dignify their existence by appearing for debates. It seems the neocons hate the truth. They’ve even justified the soldiers in Iraq randomly shooting civilians and killing puppies. “They need to let off steam”. I never thought I’d be mourning the loss of my country and to feel that being patriotic is a joke that has been played on me.

I suppose it could be said that I am too emotional or too involved with something I can’t control, if I would let it end a friendship. But, that’s me, and I have to be true to myself. I have since learned that it is useless to try to enlighten others when they do not WANT to be, so I just go away. The pain of our national situation is enough to bear. Unfortunately, the lot of us will go down with this president, and the ‘staunch republicans’ who helped sink this once great country of ours. I hope you’ve put all your life savings in gold already. I have.

Best of luck Carol and Keith. I’m sorry it had to be this way.
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MonkeyFunk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 03:23 AM
Response to Original message
1. So you're abandoning one of the "sweetest caring people"
you ever met because they don't agree with you on politics? After you tried to so hard to convince them that they're ignorant idiots who should agree with you?

I'm sure they'll be relieved.
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AZgirl7 Donating Member (85 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 04:17 AM
Response to Reply #1
3. yes
When anything you mention about Bush, war, or fiscal policy is met with Rush and Hannity hate points, it's time to go. She only SEEMED sweet and caring with her soft Oklahoma accent, but the term 'welfare queen' came up one too many times. I will listen to anyone's LOGICAL opposition, but can't handle ignorant, uninformed blather!
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crikkett Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 05:50 AM
Response to Reply #1
5. Sometimes you have to draw a line, like when a person's politics boils down to
whether or not they're a fascist, or a racist.

AZgirl7 shouldn't worry whether her friend is relieved or not. The letter wasn't punishment, it was pretty honest and she'll never have to bother finding excuses for not attending their dinner parties.


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MonkeyFunk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 06:08 AM
Response to Reply #5
11. And she's one of the sweetest, most caring people she knows
she's an old lady. Being badgered isn't likely to change her political outlook at this point. So why not just avoid political discussions and keep a friend?

When I'm old (hopefully) and dying, I'm not going to be thinking about how I showed so-and-so because they refused to agree with me.
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crikkett Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 09:12 AM
Response to Reply #11
42. Nobody's dying, she's not your friend and you're not the one being dumped over politics.
You're upset over this lady letting her friend off easy and moving on to a happier existence without the kind of annoyance and antagonism that 13-percenters bring into people's lives.

And based on how you're so tenaciously hanging on to this thread I bet a dollar you really will be dwelling on who you showed what and why.

I just hope you're not a 13-percenter.

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krkaufman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 05:59 AM
Response to Reply #1
7. Wow, is that an unbelievably callous remark.
The note dealt with the conflict you so glibly reference.

Wow.
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MonkeyFunk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 06:05 AM
Response to Reply #7
8. I don't see how some people
get out of bed in the morning, if people disagreeing with them bothers so much.

According to the OP, her former friend is 78 years old, and one of the sweetest, most caring people she knows. I think it's silly to lose such friends over a topic that's easily avoided.

Where does it end? OK, your friends have to be Democrats. Do they have to be the exact same kind of Democrat as you? Do they have to agree with you on choice of nominee, down to the local level?

Few people are as passionate about politics as I am, but I can maintain friendships with people who don't agree with me.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 06:11 AM
Response to Reply #8
12. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
MonkeyFunk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 06:16 AM
Response to Reply #12
13. Not at all
Edited on Mon Mar-10-08 06:17 AM by MonkeyFunk
I'm friends with a number of Obama supporters. The ones who are reasoned and civil. Those who spew nothing but hate? Not so much.

And in real life, I'm friends with all sorts of people. If I find we're unable to have civil political discussions, we just don't discuss politics.
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orleans Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-11-08 03:14 AM
Response to Reply #13
64. well, not everyone has the ability to not be bothered by the general
political attitude of people. some people have a difficult time letting shit just roll off their shoulders like rain. not everyone can stand the hypocrisy.

good for you that you are able to be friends with "all sorts of people." how nice for you. how great that it doesn't bother you/get to you to the point that you feel you have to break off a friendship with someone.

we're not all like you, you know. not everyone can just shine it on.
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krkaufman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 06:21 AM
Response to Reply #12
19. Note the common thread between the poster and a similarly callous post #10
I suspected that AZgirl7's mentioning Hillary's cluster bomb vote would draw some ire, and it appears I was right.
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MonkeyFunk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 06:27 AM
Response to Reply #19
23. Huh?
I've never participated in a single cluster bomb thread. I don't get your point.
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Duppers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 06:27 AM
Response to Reply #19
24. yes, I noticed too.
It's so sad the Obama vs. Hillary issue is more divisive that dems vs. republicans on DU.

I don't even peek in the GD-P forum. It's not worth it to me.

:hi:
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krkaufman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 06:50 AM
Response to Reply #24
28. Oh, wow. I hadn't noticed that the GD:P bile had spilled over into GD.
GD, it!

:hi:
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MonkeyFunk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 07:09 AM
Response to Reply #24
31. I disagreed with the OP
long before I got to the mention of clusterbombs. You're just wrong.

This is about social relationships, their limits, their boundaries, and how to maintain them. My position on this has nothing to do with electoral politics.

YOU guys are the ones making it so - just as I suspect the OP was unable to discuss things with her friend without making everything a political battle.
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krkaufman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 06:16 AM
Response to Reply #8
14. Right. But one doesn't have to admonish and/or correct every statement to which they object.
Edited on Mon Mar-10-08 06:17 AM by krkaufman
Then again...



Peace. And out.

edit: (and, yes, I understand irony)
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MonkeyFunk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 06:19 AM
Response to Reply #14
16. Heheh
Believe me, if I tried to correct EVERY statement to which I object, I'd never get any sleep.

And this is a political discussion board - I think it's expected that people will chime in. In real life? Not so much.
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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 06:49 AM
Response to Reply #8
26. I don't even know any republicans
except for my ex and he's more libertarian than republican. All of my friends are dems or big P Progressives. It's not just about politics, it's about an underlying philosophy that encompasses far, far more than politics. I certainly have friends who aren't particularly political at all, but nope, no repubs.
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OmmmSweetOmmm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 07:00 AM
Response to Reply #26
30. I have never been friends with Republicans and couldn't be. It's a matter of values
to me, and as you say underlying philosophy. I cannot bond with people whose beliefs and sense of morality are so diametrically opposite of my own.

My whole family are Liberals too.
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MonkeyFunk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 07:12 AM
Response to Reply #30
33. Mine aren't
most of my relatives are conservatives. They live in conservative areas. I live and work with all kinds of people - I like it that way.

And I don't find being Republican a moral issue. It's a political one. I think we start down a very dangerous slope when we assign moral attributes - or remove moral attributes - based on their position on tax cuts and school vouchers. Do I think they're wrong politically? Absolutely. Morally? No.
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OmmmSweetOmmm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 08:32 AM
Response to Reply #33
37. I can't agree with you at all. nt
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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 08:34 AM
Response to Reply #33
38. So you think supporting torture, for example, is not a moral failure?
That's interesting.
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MonkeyFunk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 09:34 AM
Response to Reply #38
46. That's a different question from being a Republican,
isn't it?

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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 10:15 AM
Response to Reply #46
54. Nope. It's an example of how politics can me
about morals. And sorry, lots of republicans support torture. And that's just one example. But my main gist was that for me, too large a disparity in philosophies makes it difficult to have anything but a superficial relationship.
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MonkeyFunk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 11:02 AM
Response to Reply #54
57. So you assume every republican supports torture
and everyone who's not a republican opposes it?

That's just simplistic.
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Iris Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 08:54 AM
Response to Reply #33
39. Morally - yes. If their political beliefs are based on selfishness and some perverse
idea that the government helping the poor and disadvantaged is bad because somehow they are not getting "their share" despite all the privileges and advantages they may have inadvertently received, well, yeah, I think it's a moral issue.
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MonkeyFunk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 09:35 AM
Response to Reply #39
47. But that's a different question, isn't it?
According to the OP, the lady in question is one of the sweetest, most caring people she knows.
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OmmmSweetOmmm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 10:44 AM
Response to Reply #47
56. The OP clarified that and you continue to use this. The OP said she SEEMED to be,
but the truth about her caring came out when she started to spout hateful wrongwing rhetoric.
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selador Donating Member (706 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 10:04 AM
Response to Reply #8
53. i totally agree
i don't choose friends based on their political beliefs.

i kind of go all MLK - and judge them by the content of their character.

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shanti Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 10:01 AM
Response to Reply #7
52. interesting...
i had this person on ignore already, so my spidey sense was correct!
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LostinVA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 09:00 AM
Response to Reply #1
41. Nah -- he's not
He's just pretending to, so he can stir up some flames on a messageboard.
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The Stranger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 09:18 AM
Response to Reply #1
44. If they support war crimes, maybe they really aren't "sweet caring people."
:shrug:
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MonkeyFunk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 09:36 AM
Response to Reply #44
48. I wish I could see the world
as simply as you do. It must be so easy to just automatically decide who's worthy of respect and who's not, based on how they vote.
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The Stranger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 10:15 AM
Response to Reply #48
55. Some things are easy to spot -- torture, murder, war crimes.
And if you can't see those, then I would be worried.

Other things may be more nuanced, but we are far, far down the road from there.
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MonkeyFunk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 11:04 AM
Response to Reply #55
58. And if someone is a republican
it doesn't mean they support those things. It's overly simplistic.
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The Stranger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 11:09 AM
Response to Reply #58
59. Well, given the numbers, and that overwhelming numbers of Republicans do support them,
it may be overly simplistic to assume that they do not support those things.

Actually, the numbers would indicate that it is more likely, if they are a Republican, that they do support these things.
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orleans Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-11-08 03:43 AM
Response to Reply #48
65. who is seeing things in a simple way? you're stuck on the line
about the sweetest person but you are over looking:
"the attitude I felt you had about our world in general and the lack of compassion towards those less fortunate than you."

and

"it was too hard to converse with someone who responded to my shared information by parroting the talking points of people who are well known paid puppet propagandists of the powers of the war industrial complex, and people who cannot tolerate the opposing opinions and feelings of others."

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Wabbajack_ Donating Member (669 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 04:00 AM
Response to Original message
2. .
:(
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fudge stripe cookays Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 05:43 AM
Response to Original message
4. I did the same.
But never sent a letter. I had "friends" at my old job who absolutely were brainwashed. It did no good to talk to them, other than to frustrate everyone involved.

I know it was hard, but necessary to keep you sane. I'm sorry you lost your friend. Plenty of us have gone through this the last few years.

:hug:
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crikkett Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 05:51 AM
Response to Original message
6. Welcome to DU!
I liked your letter.
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krkaufman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 06:07 AM
Response to Original message
9. Thanks for sharing. You had me at "traded for the profit of a few"
I had my first "Bush breakup" during the 2000 election. Some guy I didn't realize was a 19%er (before we knew of such a thing) was unable to grasp that not all of Florida's votes had been counted, and he just kept repeating James Baker's "the votes have been counted and recounted." He rejected all the basic truths of the "recounts" (including that Bush had initiated legal proceedings), and I just had to let him go.

The 19%er personality became obvious very early on.
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Maddy McCall Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 06:08 AM
Response to Original message
10. If all you ever did was harp on politics...
she was probably getting sick of being around you anyway.
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Duppers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 06:19 AM
Response to Reply #10
15. ouch.
I feel the need to defend the OP because I can relate.

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Horse with no Name Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 06:20 AM
Response to Reply #10
17. the first post that has made me laugh
Right now...I like my friends who are republicans more than the people that I know that support obama.
They are much more rational.
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Maddy McCall Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 06:22 AM
Response to Reply #17
20. If I abandoned all of my Republican friends where I live...
I'd have no friends.

Fortunately, we get together to fish, grill out, camp and stuff...and our lives are interesting enough that we don't have to resort to political or religious conversation.
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Horse with no Name Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 06:25 AM
Response to Reply #20
22. Yeah I understand
at one point when our party seemed to be on the high road...I felt the need to tell everyone how great we were.
However...since the inaction of 2006...not so much.
I am loving my republican friends and we simply don't talk about politics. It keeps us all sane.
The inaction of the democrats has coincided with the action of the republicans.
There really is very little difference anymore.
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krkaufman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 06:56 AM
Response to Reply #22
29. I expect I'm inferring something you didn't imply, but I agree ...
... with what you may not be implying.
    "The inaction of the democrats has coincided with the action of the republicans."
The inability of the slim Democratic majorities to enact change has been largely due to the actions of the Republicans in blocking passage of legislation on a scale not seen in recent years.
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krkaufman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 06:23 AM
Response to Reply #17
21. Wow, if that hateful post is what you find humorous... n/t
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crikkett Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 09:16 AM
Response to Reply #17
43. Are they rooting for Hillary? My intelligent R friends are.
They think she's the candidate who best supports their interests.

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MonkeyFunk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 09:37 AM
Response to Reply #43
49. Then why are more Republicans voting for Obama
than Clinton?
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Duppers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 06:39 AM
Response to Reply #10
25. strange that people never say that about sports
or other unimportant things.

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Duppers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 06:20 AM
Response to Original message
18. your letter went out in my email this morning
thanks and welcome to DU.

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NEOhiodemocrat Donating Member (624 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 06:50 AM
Response to Original message
27. I understand your feelings,
It made me think of the republican poll worker I was with on March 4th here in Ohio. While talking about the proposed tax to be used for public transportation in Youngstown she said "..people don't need buses to get to their jobs, if they have a job they should just buy a car." Arggg, I suppose that she does not realize with a minimum wage job a car and mandatory car insurance would be impossible for most.
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femmedem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 07:11 AM
Response to Original message
32. Someone dear to me, elderly, was sending me those RW chain e-mails.
Some were smearing our candidates, some were advocating for more religion in our schools. I let most of them go. Someties I'd gently debunk them with a link to Snopes.

Eventually I said I was a Democrat and an agnostic, and that the e-mails which attacked our candidates and argued for a breakdown between the separation of church and state were not my favorites. But I asked her to keep sending me the jokes and the cute animal photos, and said that I always liked hearing from her.

She apologized, said she had no idea, and it's been truly fine ever since.

She is family, so I would never have considered booting her out of my life. But sometimes family is good training for how to get along when you disagree.
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zanne Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 09:00 AM
Response to Reply #32
40. I did the same, and it worked. nt
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Olney Blue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 07:14 AM
Response to Original message
34. My entire family and several of my close work friends are Republicans.
We negotiated an agreement where we don't discuss politics. It works, and preserves the relationships.

If you really care for these folks, you might find that you can do something similar.

Best wishes, and welcome to DU!
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elocs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 07:38 AM
Response to Original message
35. My conservative best friend is like a father to me and turned 70 last week.
He was raised in Iowa by a father who hated FDR and he bleeds Republican. He has 3 sons and was dismayed when the youngest was converted into a "Liberal" when he went to the University of Minnesota, but this is also the son who is closest to his parents and they get to see his children often. I love this man and in spite of the fact that I am a Liberal he would do anything for me. He does not judge me for my beliefs and I do not judge him for his. He is not a racist or a bigot or filled with hate. Politics is not at the center of our relationship. It can be done.

I do not believe that every viewpoint that is in opposition with mine is inherently evil in spite of our delight in developing everything into us vs. them, with ours always being about goodness and light. Life is too short to try and browbeat everybody I come in contact with to my point of view. I visit my friend every week and we talk for hours, avoiding politics by mutual consent because it only leads to bad feelings and neither of us will change. I will never turn my back on my friend of over 30 years or walk away from him even if he is a Republican.
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Balbus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 08:22 AM
Response to Original message
36. 78 years old?
She'd probably be dead by the time she got to the end of your letter as it was. I wouldn't sweat it.
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lonestarnot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 09:22 AM
Response to Original message
45. Happened to me. 35 year friendship, which some will say was not a friendship at all because
of its end due to politics. But when your choice of socks is a political choice, I say they are wrong.
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kryckis Donating Member (90 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 09:44 AM
Response to Original message
50. I can't claim to know,,
what it's like to live in such a politically polarized society, but I find this to be a sad commentary on the state of American political culture today. At least from what I've witnessed from afar.

I'm sorry you can't see past the politics and keep your friend. It shouldn't be that way.
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Seeking Serenity Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 09:50 AM
Response to Original message
51. Boy, I sure am glad I don't let party politics and ideology determine my relationships
'cause then I'd have to get divorced. :-)

Seriously, I have a hard time understanding how people can so wrapped up in politics and policy that they will allow long-standing friendships to be cast asunder.

I was struck by this line in the original post complaining about her friend as being someone who "willingly limited their knowledge of other sources of information and points of view." And yet, isn't that what the OP is doing, limiting her knowledge of other sources of information and points of view, namely that of her friend's? She talks about her friend as being someone who "allowed themselves (sic) be programmed 24/7 by Fox News." Can the OP consider that maybe her friend or others like her feels the same about her, that the OP has allowed herself to be programmed by "The Nation," or "Mother Jones" or Keith Olbermann or what have you?

I feel the OP has a lack of compassion in much the same way she complains about her former friend. "I disagree with you on politics and policy, ergo, our friendship is over, despite your being one of the sweetest, caring people I know." The cognizant dissonance in that view is almost deafening.

Progressives are not the holders of all truth and the only correct points of view on all subjects, and those who disagree with us or think another way are not inherently bad and evil. To think, and consequently act, otherwise is, IMO, not very progressive.

DH, the conservative, often says that he doesn't hate liberals, he just thinks they're wrong, and that that is a fundamental difference between the two. After reading the OP, sometimes I wonder if he might be right.
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otohara Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 11:56 AM
Response to Original message
60. Happened to Me - 35 Year Friendship
she moved to Atlanta, married her cool but irresponsible boyfriend, divorced - married a republican and he convinced my former hippie best g-friend to vote for George Bush and worse thought the war was a good thing. The husband called me and said, Michele's always been conservative - yeah, since she met you! My friend has always molded herself to fit the current man in her life. She's a pretty gal and men always fell head over for her - married 3 times.

So now we don't talk - we tried, but it didn't work out!
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gauguin57 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 12:12 PM
Response to Original message
61. It makes me sad that, in addition to effing up the country, Bush is ending friendships.
:-( :-( :-(

I have right-wing family members ... we just stick to the no-politics rule, and we're fine. I won't let Bush and his Evil Flying Monkeys wreck my relationship with my family.
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Seeking Serenity Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-10-08 01:04 PM
Response to Reply #61
62. * isn't ending friendships.
People are choosing to do that themselves.
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AZgirl7 Donating Member (85 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-11-08 02:59 AM
Response to Original message
63. good God!
I guess some more background on the situation would be in order. Early on in Bush's term, I had no idea how horrible things would go. As things progressed, it became clear that the way he was steering things would GREATLY negatively affect our individual futures. When Bush's actions would come up and I would state my feelings about it, my friend would laugh at me and call me 'her little democrat'.

No, I did not try to ram my opinions down her throat, but always got into a spirited debate with her. I do not have the kinds of superficial relationships that would allow an avoidance of all political discussion. I think the raw fear about my own and my children's future played a BIG part in my intolerance of what I saw developing. I'm not the type of female who only wants to discuss American Idol, Natalie Holloway, or the color of my new curtains. The 'friendship' just became too tiring, and my once close friend showed her true attitude. She was actually a very sharp and harsh, and at times difficult to get along with. Her recent voice mail message pleaded with me to contact her, so I felt the need to be honest and tell her why I no longer wanted to pursue our relationship. Also as time went by, I could barely stomach going into her house and hearing Hannity, O'Rielly, Kristol, Barnes and Wallace, day in and day out! And yes, I DO think that it IS a moral and ethical issue!!! I see neocons as cold hearted, selfish (tax breaks at all costs!), name-calling, intolerant brutes.

I've alway been a registered independent, and felt that our country and people were too diverse to be put into categories. There's many things I agree with on the conservative side. But I do not see that flexibility on the Republican side. They seem to go along with the mob no matter WHAT they do! I find it very scary to see a group of people who agree with EACH AND EVERY thing their PREZident wants to do, no matter what it is. It's as if they would DIE if they had to admit they or he was wrong.
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orleans Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-11-08 03:59 AM
Response to Reply #63
66. i understand. i had a bush break-up around the 2004 election.
the woman was nice, friendly, and we'd been friends for about 12 years.

her ignorance & hatred toward various groups of people, her passion and constant cock-sucking of bush & the republika party finally became unbearable.

i cut her loose.

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