I just talked to a young soldier outside

[MiniMe]

Really nice guy, but soooooo young. He was expressing frustration over the protesters today. He started up the conversation. I told him that I was glad that he was serving, but I don't agree with him about the war, and that we shouldn't have gone there in the first place. He said that he was more frustrated about the traffic. OK, I can understand that, it does get to be frustrating if you are trying to navigate the streets of DC today.

Of course then we got into the war itself. He said the repuke line, if we leave now, the people who have died, died for nothing. I told him again that we shouldn't have gone in the first place, every reason we were given about why we went to Iraq was a lie. He said "That wasn't the reason we went to war". I asked him what was the reason we went to war. He told me that it was to make the country better. I told him that making countries "better" was not a reason to attack and invade a country. We had no business being there.

He then asked me if I were an Iraqi, wouldn't I be glad that we were there? I told him NO, that if I wasn't dead, I would be worse off than before the war. He told me I was wrong, that things are improving. He said that he had been in the battle of Faluja, and how things are so nice there now. I said that John McCain who bragged about a market he went to last year couldn't go near the place this year because it was so unsafe. He kind of shrugged it off and said "it happens".

Then I started in on the water and electricity in Iraq, and how the water quality was horrible now and that they have less electricity now than they did before the war. He told me I was wrong, we had just built 3 brand new power plants over there. I asked him how many we took out before we built 3, and how many were being used for the US Embassy. He told me none were being used for the US Embassy. Things were improved there.

I just couldn't take it any more. I shook my head, thanked him for serving in the military, and left. Seems his job was to escort some General around, I guess the General has been serving up Kool-aid for the poor misguided youth.

[babylonsister]

1. Thanks for trying, MiniMe. I'm sure you gave the young man some

food for thought.

[MiniMe]

4. The one answer that he gave me that really bothered me was that

we invaded a country to make it better. That was really scary. Thanks for your support Babylon Sister.

[gateley]

2. I don't understand how ANYONE --

much less a soldier, can think this invasion was a 'good thing'.

[MiniMe]

6. I don't understand how he thinks that invading a country to "make it better"

is even remotely OK. That really bothered me.

[eShirl]

7. if people they trust are not being strait with them,

I can see it

[gateley]

11. I guess that brings me to I can't understand how ANYONE can trust

this administration.

But I get your point.

[Altean Wanderer]

23. I know someone who strongly supports the war....

Read this guy's rant, he posts on the blog at my local paper:

David Hunt (unregistered) wrote:

One other thing: I used to be a Libertarian... I left in large part because of the utter naivete of many of the people there. The basic philosophy was that if we leave the world alone, the world will leave us alone.

Which is, of course, purest bovine scatology. Iran took hostages in 1979 - they must have psychically forseen how Reagan would win the election. We got attacked again and again and again during the 1990's because, with equal prescience, they predicted President Bush in 2000.

In two of the most telling statements of how the "appeasers" don't get it, right after 9-11 Michael Moore asked why New York was attacked when most didn't vote for George Bush, and actor Tim Robbins was outraged because the terrorists were attacking one of the most diverse and tolerant pockets in America.

In the article:

http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/Read.aspx?GUID=B3339C3F-B742-4068-9ED4-B06D37A9FA74

We have a wonderful bit of perspective:

America’s two foremost envoys were informed that “it was written in the Koran, that all Nations who should not have acknowledged their authority were sinners, that it was their right and duty to make war upon whoever they could find and to make Slaves of all they could take as prisoners, and that every Mussulman who should be slain in battle was sure to go to Paradise.”

When was this? In 1785; the American envoys were protesting the attacks by the Barbary pirates on American shipping originating from the "shores of Tripoli".

Let me see. No George Bush. No Israel. No US imperialism. Just Islamofascist aggression. The same kind they have unleashed on the world since Mohammed first was visited by the angels...

Indeed, some have argued that the "let's run away and appease the Islamofascists" crowd are suffering from a collective Oslo Syndrome:

http://www.frontpagemagazine.com/Articles/Read.aspx?GUID=210F9FFC-9E28-4D9C-84E2-527D6679B4A8

And there are endless excuses by the appeasers for why we should not stand up for the West:

http://sigmundcarlandalfred.wordpress.com/2007/09/19/missiles-mullahs-and-mirrors/

Those opposed to this war, and most probably by extension any war, are in denial:

http://shrinkwrapped.blogs.com/blog/2005/01/the_defensive_d.html

The primary difference between ProgressiveWarrior and myself, besides my being willing to put my own name to my opinions vs. his using a pseudonym, is that he believes there is a choice - when it comes to Islamofascism - between war and peace. I believe there is a choice between war NOW and war LATER.

http://belmontclub.blogspot.com/2003/09/three-conjectures-pew-poll-finds-40-of.html

http://www.americanthinker.com/2006/09/the_moral_emptiness_of_the_lef.html

Ultimately, making excuses for terrorists, as many have done, does nothing but give them encouragement that they can continue their bloody campaign:

http://drsanity.blogspot.com/2004/09/enabling-behavior-for-terrorism.html

In many ways I hope the Democrats sweep the 2008 elections (not really, but just imagine it). In the years that follow, having pulled out of Iraq with failure on our faces, abandoning Czechoslo.., er, I mean Israel to buy "peace in our time", er, a true and lasting peace in the mideast, paying the Jizya tax, er, I mean sending economic aid...

And we will STILL see terrorism in Europe, in the US. We will STILL see Iran nuke Israel.

I can't wait for the excuses then.

Link: http://nashuatelegraph.disqus.com/nashuatelegraphcom_us_nears_4000th_casualty_in_iraq/#comment-240597

[maxsolomon]

3. if you don't believe the lie, it makes it hard to live the lie.

the coming depression is directly attributable to the iraq-shaped ditch * drove us into.

[drmeow]

8. A mass and massive case of cognitive dissonance n/t

[GreenPartyVoter]

9. Very true. I think a lot of war supporters have a very fragile mentality. It must

be very hard to have to continuously prop up their beliefs.

[GreenPartyVoter]

5. At least you tried. *hugs*

[Horse with no Name]

10. I have seen this more and more

and it is frightening. They are indoctrinating these young people...and it IS indoctrination.

They isolate them from thinking people and then pound them with RW talking points. They have a captive audience.

It happened to my brother. I thought my usually docile, sweet aunt was going to choke him to death when he said that the women over there aren't getting raped. They want it. I shudder to think when we get these broken souls all back home.
Between the indoctrination, PSTD, injuries, etc...we are going to have a pretty significant subsection of our country in dire need of psychiatric help.

[MiniMe]

12. Is your brother in the service?

What the hell are they teaching these kids? I think it is that the US knows whats best for everybody. They don't even realize that we are about to become a 3rd world nation.

[Horse with no Name]

13. Yes. He is a Drill Instructor.

And I fear that HE is the one who will be doing the indoctrinating.
His RW talking points were fierce.

[Quantess]

14. It's very admirable for a war-supporting republican to enlist.

He's doing the honorable thing.

[uppityperson]

15. if we leave now, the people who have died, died for nothing.

If we stay, more people will die for nothing.

[yorgatron]

16. i was in the army once,and i was as dumb as a bag of hammers.

so were most of the guys i served with.
nothing has changed.

[MiniMe]

17. That was my thought too, but I didn't want to say that to him

I tried, I just couldn't get through to him. He is really a believer. I'm just sad about the whole thing.Especially about what he thinks is a valid reason to invade a sovereign country.

[Brigid]

18. A noble effort, but don't waste your breath again.

All you'll succeed in doing is raising your blood pressure. The few people left who actually support this criminal enterprise are not going to change their minds, no matter what anyone says to them. There are still older people who think Viet Nam was a good idea, for crying out loud. They're just blind.

[MiniMe]

19. I know, and I usually don't get into it with an indoctrinated person

BUT, he was the one who started talking with me, and was frustrated with the protesters. It was actually a calm conversation. But I just couldn't take it at the end. I just need to go bang my head against the wall that they are now teaching soldiers that it is OK to invade a country to "make the country better". Kid, that is NOT a valid reason, and it is quite illegal. And that isn't the reason that we went there in the first place.

[sweetpotato]

21. Next time ask him - Who should invade the US to *make it better*

Its all relative with the *make it better* thing.

I'm sure there are those who would like to come here and *fix* things to their liking. How would one such as he receive their arrival? Would his wife want to be raped, too?

Gosh, I am really disgusted at this. It makes me very sad to know that one day, he will be living/working in the general population.

I think I'd rather live next door to a sex offender. It would probably be just some guy who went all the way with his girlfriend back in high school, for pete's sake.

[Xenotime]

20. They BRAINWASH them!

[DFW]

22. I have also talked to an Iraq combat vet

After coming home, he decided to run for Congress, and is now the only
member of Congress to have been a combat vet in Iraq. He had quite a
different view on the situation from the soldier you talked to. They
don't all get brainwashed--not by a long shot.

[MiniMe]

24. And of course I came up with my best reply when I was on my way home.

I should have said, so if China or Russia decides that it can make the US a better place, it would be OK for them to invade us? Of course it wouldn't, and I would fight it all the way. And I hate violence. I wish I could have left him chewing on that one.