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The Countering of U.S. Imperialism – A Light at the End of the Tunnel

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Time for change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-05-08 12:16 AM
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The Countering of U.S. Imperialism – A Light at the End of the Tunnel
All the world thinks of the United States today as an empire, except the people of the United States. We shrink from the word ‘empire’… We feel that there ought to be some other word for the civilizing work we do so reluctantly in these backwards countries.” – Walter Lippmann, 1927


I believe that the above quote by one the most astute American journalists of the 20th Century is right on target and applies even more today than it did in 1927. It sums up what is most wrong with our country: A toxic combination imperialism, arrogance, hypocrisy, and ignorance.

Our imperialistic war in Iraq says it all. Even after the original excuse for the war was proven to have been fabricated, after we killed more than a million civilians, created more than four million refugees and utterly destroyed their country, our leaders still find more excuses to continue the war. Our national news media, while sometimes bemoaning the deaths of American soldiers, rarely says a word about the deaths of more than two hundred times as many Iraqi civilians, or what the Iraqi people think of our occupation of their country – as if their deaths and their opinions simply do not matter. Hannah Arendt was right when she said:

Imperialism would have necessitated the invention of racism as the only possible ‘explanation’ and excuse for its deeds, even if no race-thinking had ever existed in the civilized world.

Any U.S. citizen who doesn’t understand how U.S. imperialism has operated since 1973 should read Naomi Klein’s “Shock Doctrine – The Rise of Disaster Capitalism”. It’s one of the most informative books I’ve ever read, and so easy to read for such a complex subject.

The United States has used two primary tools to advance its imperialistic ambitions: Covert activities and military support to install or maintain in power repressive regimes that are responsive to the needs of U.S. corporations, to the great detriment of the vast majority of a nation’s population, and; influence over international financial institutions (International Monetary Fund (IMF) and World Bank) to loan money to desperately impoverished nations while imposing conditions on those nations which are highly favorable to U.S. corporations, while keeping the great majority of its inhabitants impoverished indefinitely – a process something akin to loan sharking or indentured servitude.

The game plan has been to put into practice Milton Friedman’s economic theories, developed at the University of Chicago. These theories, when used in several countries over more than three decades, have served primarily to increase the wealth and power of the wealthy (U.S. and multi-national corporations and the local elite) at the expense of everyone else. The use of these economic policies in association with violent and repressive dictatorships is no accident. Since these policies are so painful to the vast majority of a country’s inhabitants, such measures as kidnappings, executions, disappearances and torture are often needed to keep the country’s inhabitants in line. But often, financial pressures and threats alone are enough to do the job. Taken as a whole, Klein terms these methods “shock therapy” – a therapy that is brutal enough to make a person or a population docile enough to go along with what they’re told to do.


Examples of U.S. imperialism

I’ve discussed this process in several previous posts, using mostly examples from Klein’s book. In “Connection between State Sponsored Terror, Corporate Greed, and Economic Shock Therapy” I describe our imperialistic activities in South America. Klein’s book begins with Chile in the early 1970s, where our CIA conspired to overthrow the democratically elected president of Chile, Salvador Allende, and installed the dictator, terrorist torturer, Augusto Pinochet in his place. I also discuss in that post our imperialist interventions in Brazil, Argentina, Uruguay, Ecuador, and other South American countries, and our use of School of the Americas and Operation Condor to achieve our ends. Klein summarizes our imperialist interventions in South America:

The Chicago School counterrevolution quickly spread. Brazil was already under the control of a U.S. supported junta… Friedman traveled to Brazil in 1973, at the height of that regime’s brutality, and declared the economic experiment a “miracle”. In Uruguay the military had staged a coup in 1973 and the following year decided to go the Chicago route…. The effect on Uruguay’s previously egalitarian society was immediate: real wages decreased by 28% and hordes of scavengers appeared on the streets… Next to join the experiment was Argentina in 1976, when a junta seized power from Isabel Peron. That meant that Argentina, Chile, Uruguay and Brazil – the countries that had been showcases of developmentalism – were now all run by U.S. backed military governments and were living laboratories of Chicago School economics.

In this post I describe how the IMF was used to plunder Russia following the break-up of the Soviet Union. Klein describes the effect on the Russian people:

After only one year, shock therapy had taken a devastating toll: millions of middle-class Russians had lost their life savings when money lost its value, and abrupt cuts to subsidies meant millions of workers had not been paid in months. The average Russian consumed 40% less in 1992 than in 1991, and a third of the population fell below the poverty line. The middle class was forced to sell personal belongings from card tables on the streets.

In “The Ruling Financial Class” I describe how the IMF did the same thing to several Asian countries whose economies were failing in the late 1990s. Klein describes the effects on the Asian people:

24 million people lost their jobs in this period… What disappeared in these parts of Asia was what was so remarkable about the region’s “miracle” in the first place: its large and growing middle class… 20 million Asians were thrown into poverty in this period of what Rodolfo Wash would have called “planned misery”… Women and children suffered the worst of the crisis. Many rural families in the Philippines and South Korea sold their daughters to human traffickers who took them to work in the sex trade… a 20 percent increase in child prostitution.

And Klein describes how similar processes with similar results were used in Poland, South Africa, Sri Lanka, and Iraq.


THE CENTURY AND A HALF WAR AGAINST SOCIALISM IN THE UNITED STATES

I discuss the century and a half war against socialism in the United States in detail in this post. One way in which this subject is relevant to the issue of U.S. imperialism is that that, during the Cold War at least, the United States often used the fear of Communism as an excuse to overthrow the governments of other countries (as the Reagan administration did] in Latin America, for example) or to go to war against them (as we did in Vietnam, for example).

Two major problems with that excuse were that in most of the cases where we exercised our imperialism over third world countries: 1) they had no direct link with the USSR, which was the only Communist country that posed a potential military threat to us, and 2) the country was not Communist, but rather socialist. Notwithstanding those facts, the U.S. government utilized a “slippery slope” type of reasoning, where any degree of socialism in a country could represent the first step towards Communism and hence an alliance with the USSR. And then there was the “domino theory”, where any country that turned Communist or socialist could result in other countries doing the same. So, in the name of “freedom and democracy” we repeatedly intervened in the affairs of other countries to overthrow democratically elected governments or prop up ruthless dictators with our military or economic powers.


Reasons for the US war against socialism

Since the purported reasons for our century and a half war against socialism clearly make no sense, it behooves us to consider the real reasons for it. In order to understand those reasons it is first necessary to understand that much of the history of the United States, beginning with the industrial revolution that picked up steam after the Civil War (1861-1865), has involved a type of class warfare, whereby the wealthy have sought to increase their wealth and power by suppressing any movement that sought to bring power to the lower classes.

Policies which tend to benefit the less wealthy and powerful include such things as: protections against environmental degradation; protection for consumers against the risks of dangerous products; protection against dangerous working conditions; anti-trust laws to ensure competition; anti-discrimination laws; progressive tax laws; minimum wage laws; provision of government health care, education, and child care assistance; promotion or assurance of full employment for those able and willing to work; and labor laws that strengthen the bargaining capabilities of workers. These kinds of policies provide needed protections to the most vulnerable of our people and benefit the good majority of the remainder of our people.

The wealthy conservative elite of our society tag the “Socialism” label on all those laws and policies, listed above, that benefit less wealthy and powerful 98% of our population, and especially those that benefit the poor. They accuse anyone who advocates those policies of being “Socialists” and of engaging in “class warfare”. They do that, very simply, because those laws and policies reduce their own wealth and power.

That is what the century and a half war against socialism in the United States has been mostly about. Those conservative elites are right about one thing. The policies that they rail against are indeed socialistic. When added to a primarily capitalistic system, such as operates in our country, they produce a mixed capitalism/socialism system which can maintain the production incentives of capitalism while at the same time guarding against the harmful excesses of capitalism which tend to drive people into poverty and reduce the quality of life of millions of our citizens.

To the extent that successful socialist policies (such as national health care) operate in other countries, they have the potential of providing an example for Americans. If Americans see that the citizens of countries with socialist governments thrive and continue to re-elect those governments, they may consider whether or not it would be beneficial to have such policies instituted in their own country. Thus the need to intervene in those countries when feasible, to make sure that examples of successful socialist governments remain as few as possible. Naomi Klein expands on this idea:

Washington has always regarded democratic socialism as a greater threat than totalitarian Communism, which was easy to vilify and made for a handy enemy… The favored tactic for dealing with the inconvenient popularity of developmentalism and democratic socialism was to try to equate them with Stalinism, deliberately blurring the clear differences between the worldviews. (Conflating all opposition with terrorism plays a similar role today.)


A brief history of the war against socialism in the United States on the domestic front

Our war against Socialism did not start with the Cold War. Suppression of the labor movement in the United States constitutes a major part of our war against socialism. For example, by attributing the Haymarket Square bombing of 1886 to labor leader “terrorists” and imprisoning or executing the alleged perpetrators (with extremely little evidence of their guilt – See “Death in the Haymarket – A Story of Chicago, the First Labor Movement and the Bombing that Divided Gilded Age America” for an excellent discussion of this), our elite national news media probably set back the cause of the labor movement by several years or decades. Eugene Debs, perennial Socialist candidate for President of the United States, was repeatedly imprisoned for speaking out about his beliefs. And Richard Hofstadter, writing in 1970, concluded that the United States had experienced at least 160 instances in which state or federal troops had intervened in strikes, and at least 700 labor disputes in which deaths were recorded, with clearly most of the violence being perpetrated by state or federal authorities, rather than by the workers.

The FDR Presidency (1933-1945) represents the first successful effort in our country to introduce socialist policies that produced major benefits for our people. Cass Sunstein, in his book, “The Second Bill of Rights – FDR’s Unfinished Revolution and Why We Need it More than Ever”, describes the philosophy that motivated Roosevelt to fight for his radical (at the time) programs to benefit the American people:

To Roosevelt, human distress could no longer be taken as an inevitable by-product of life, society, or “nature”; it was an artifact of social policies and choices. Much human misery is preventable. The only question is whether a government is determined to prevent it…. Foremost was the idea that poverty is preventable, that poverty is destructive, wasteful, demoralizing, and that poverty is morally unacceptable in a Christian and democratic society.

As I discuss in this post, FDR’s policies were wildly successful and resulted in the creation of a financially healthy middle class in our country for the first time in its history. Between 1947 (when accurate statistics on this issue first became available) and 1980, median family income rose steadily (in constant 2005 dollars) from $22,499 to more than double that, $47,173.

But then, starting with the rise of the conservative movement in our country, and the election of Ronald Reagan to the U.S. Presidency, FDR’s New Deal began to be progressively dismantled, with consequent stagnation of median income and progressive widening of the income gap in our country. And that’s where we are now.


A LIGHT AT THE END OF THE TUNNEL

When I posted on DU my four articles dealing with the imperialistic adventures of our nation as described by Naomi Klein in “The Shock Doctrine”, several posters commented on how terribly depressing this whole thing is. Indeed, this is a very depressing subject. But in the last chapter of her book, titled “Shock Wears off – The Rise of Peoples’ Reconstruction”, Klein describes a developing trend, especially in Latin America, that appears to be very hopeful.


The stripping away of the aura of respectability surrounding Friedman’s economic movement

Klein cites the pinnacle of the Neocon movement in the U.S. as being 1994, the year that Republicans took control of Congress. Almost certainly by mere coincidence, but still worth noting, is the fact that the day that the Democrats regained control of Congress in 2006 was just nine days before the death of Milton Friedman. By that time, a UN study found that the richest 2% of adults in the world owned more than half of the wealth in the world. Klein writes of that fact:

The hoarding of so much wealth by a tiny minority of the world’s population was not a peaceful process, as we have seen, nor, often, was it a legal one… Many of the men who had been on the front lines of the international drive to liberate the markets from all restrictions were at that moment caught up in an astonishing array of scandals and criminal proceedings.

In support of that statement, Klein cites several instances to show how former victims have been striving to bring the perpetrators of crimes against them to justice: Augusto Pinochet was under house arrest; in Argentina, the former junta leaders were stripped of immunity, with some of those leaders being imprisoned; the former President of Bolivia was wanted on murder charges; in Russia, many of the oligarch billionaires were either in jail or in exile; Ken Lay died in prison; Grover Norquist was accused of influence-peddling; and then there were the whole series of scandals involving Jack Abramoff. Klein notes the significance of all this:

This list, by no means complete, represents a radical departure from the Neoliberal creation myth. The economic crusade managed to cling to a veneer of respectability and lawfulness as it progressed. Now that veneer was being very publicly stripped away to reveal a system of gross wealth inequalities, often opened up with the aid of grotesque criminality…

As people shed the collective fear that was first instilled with tanks and cattle prods… many are demanding more democracy and more control over markets. These demands represent the greatest threat of all to Friedman’s legacy because they challenge his most central claim: that capitalism and freedom are part of the same indivisible project.


The wholesale rejection of U.S. imperialism in Latin America

Klein describes the rejection of U.S. imperialist policies in Latin America:

On the international stage, the staunchest opponents of Neoliberal economics were winning election after election. The Venezuelan president Hugo Chavez, running on a platform of “21 Century Socialism”, was re-elected in 2006 for a third term with 63% of the vote. Despite attempts by the Bush administration to paint Venezuela as a pseudo-democracy, a poll that same year recorded that 57% of Venezuelans were happy with the state of their democracy, an approval rating on the continent second only to Uruguay’s, where the left-wing coalition party Frente Amplio had been elected… In stark contrast to this enthusiasm, in countries where economic policies remain largely unchanged… polls consistently track an eroding faith in democracy, reflected in dwindling turnout for elections, deep cynicism toward politicians and a rise in religious fundamentalism…

Opposition to privatization has become the defining issue of the continent, able to make governments and break them; by late 2006, it was practically creating a domino effect. Luiz Inacio Lula da Silva was reelected as president of Brazil largely because he turned the vote into a referendum on privatization… In Nicaragua, Daniel Ortega, former head of the Sandinistas, made the country’s frequent blackouts the center of his winning campaign

Rafael Correa… called for the country “to overcome all the fallacies of neo-liberalism”. When he won, the new president of Ecuador declared himself “no fan of Milton Friedman.” By then, the Bolivian president Evo Morales was approaching the end of his first year in office. After sending in the army to take back the gas fields from multinational “plunderers,” he moved on to nationalize parts of the mining sector. In this same period in Mexico, the results of the fraud-tainted 2006 elections were being contested through the creation of an unprecedented “parallel government” of the people… Chile and Argentina are both led by politicians who define themselves against their countries’ Chicago School experiments…

Today Latin Americans are picking up the project that was so brutally interrupted all those years ago. Many of the policies cropping up are familiar: nationalization of key sectors of the economy, land reform, major new investments in education, literacy and health care…

Chavez has let it be known that if an extremist right wing element in Bolivia… makes good on its threats against the government of Evo Morales, Venezuelan troops will help defend Bolivia’s democracy… Rafael Correa is set to take the most radical step of all… Correa’s government has announced that when the agreement for the (U.S. military) base expires in 2009, it will not be renewed. “Ecuador is a sovereign nation… We do not need any foreign troops in our country.”


How Latin America gets away with defying U.S. power

Klein provides three related reasons for how Latin America has been able to get away with defying U.S. power in recent years.

First is the fact of massive amounts of grassroots popular backing for throwing off the yolk of U.S. imperialism and moving on with projects to benefit the whole population. When power is decentralized it is much more difficult to overthrow it. Removing a single leader from power is then not so easy or effective, as the U.S. found out when massive uprisings in Venezuela thwarted its attempted coup against Chavez.

Secondly, Latin American countries have decided that they have had enough of loans from the IMF, with its restrictive conditions that force millions into poverty. The rejection of IMF loans in Latin America has been so complete that their percent of the total IMF lending portfolio has shrunk from 80% in 2005 to 1% in 2007. And it’s not just Latin America. During the same time period the IMF’s worldwide lending portfolio shrunk from $81 billion to $11.8 billion. Klein sums up the future of the IMF:

The IMF, a pariah in so many countries where it has treated crises as profit-making opportunities, is starting to wither away. The World Bank faces an equally grim future.

And finally, there is the fact that the region has become much more integrated in its effort to throw off U.S. imperialism. Many Latin American nations stand ready to share resources with neighbor nations who lack those resources. For example, Chavez has offered heavily subsidized oil to the poorer nations of the region.

Klein also notes several other examples throughout the world where nations are turning away from U.S. favored Neoliberal economic policies. But Latin America in the prime example, and Klein explains why:

As inhabitants of the first shock lab, Latin Americans have had the most time to recover their bearings. Years of street protests have created new political groupings, eventually gaining the strength… to begin to change the power structures of the state…Once the mechanics of the shock doctrine are deeply and collectively understood, whole communities become harder to take by surprise… Today… there are just too many people in the world who have had direct experience with the shock doctrine: they know how it works…


CONCLUDING REMARKS – TO RIGHT WING FOOLS WHO DON’T LIKE WHAT I HAVE TO SAY ABOUT THIS

I know what the reaction will be of right wing fools who read this post. They’ll be SHOCKED that an American citizen could “hate America” so much. They’ll hate me for failing to take pride in our military might, and they’ll consider me a traitor for my happiness at the thought of our military power being attenuated by third world nations that don’t have the sense or gratitude to do what we want them to do. They’ll say that I want us to “lose” our war in Iraq, that I want to “weaken” our country, and that I don’t deserve to live in this country. Before answering charges such as these, I’d like to preface my remarks by briefly summarizing the balance sheet in Latin America, as described by James Petras in his book “Ruling and Ruled”:

If we add to the concentration of $157 billion in the hands of an infinitesimal fraction of the Latin American elite, the $990 billion taken out by foreign banks in debt payments, and the $1 trillion taken out by way of profits…. over the past decade and a half, we have an adequate framework for understanding why Latin America continues to have stagnant economies with over two thirds of its population with inadequate living standards.

The responsibility of the US for the growth of Latin American billionaires and mass poverty is several-fold and involves a very wide gamut of political institutions, business elites and academic and media moguls. First and foremost the US backed the military dictators and Neoliberal politicians who set up the billionaire economic models.

My answer to those who would castigate me for being outraged over a situation like this is that I cannot take pride in a system that creates billionaires at the cost of throwing millions of people into poverty, misery and fear. I cannot take pride in a country that the rest of the world accurately sees as the world’s biggest bully. And I cannot take pride in bombing the hell out of a country that poses no threat to us, killing hundreds of thousands of its people, and destroying its infrastructure.

None of these things do anything at all to improve my life. Nor do they do anything to improve the lives of the vast majority of my fellow Americans. Instead, they create anti-American hatred, thereby fueling the recruitment of anti-American terrorists, while destroying the lives of millions upon millions of people throughout the world. Only an arrogant idiot could take pride in all that.

Yes, I hate it when my government does those things. Yes, I hope that we “lose” the Iraq war, if “losing” means stopping the death and destruction and taking WW III off the table. Yes, I hope that the rest of the world counters and defeats our imperial ambitions – or rather the imperial ambitions of our wealthy elite and war profiteers who profit from US imperialism.

A government should be judged by how it benefits or harms its citizens and how it benefits or harms the rest of humanity. No nation has the right to destroy the lives of other peoples just to enhance the wealth and power of a wealthy elite minority.

I believe that most Americans and their country will benefit enormously by having their country’s military might and imperial ambitions humbled by the rest of humanity. Then we will be able to live in peace and work with the other nations of the world to make a better life for all of us. If wanting that means “hating America”, then so be it.
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gateley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-05-08 12:21 AM
Response to Original message
1. K&R and Bookmarking! nt
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ConsAreLiars Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-05-08 12:46 AM
Response to Original message
2. Thank you (K&R) - This is one of those posts that rather than stirring up a lot of noise,
puts out the whole picture.

This phrase says what needs to be said: "A government should be judged by how it benefits or harms its citizens and how it benefits or harms the rest of humanity."

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Karenina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-05-08 08:10 AM
Response to Reply #2
9. Indeed! K&R!!!
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Time for change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-05-08 11:09 AM
Response to Reply #2
17. Thank you -- I have to say that Naomi Klein's book is one of the best I've ever read at putting out
the whole picture and providing overall perspective. A ground breaking piece of work.
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ConcernedCanuk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-05-08 01:08 AM
Response to Original message
3. Excellent post TFC - I read it all
.
.
.

If the USA gets more thinkers like yourself to the forefront,

There may be hope for the USA yet.

Here's to hope . . .
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Time for change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-05-08 03:10 PM
Response to Reply #3
25. Thank you so much -- Here's to hope
:toast:
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sansatman Donating Member (69 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-06-08 03:33 PM
Response to Reply #3
55. Is change in the offing from our raft of candidates?
This is a great synopsis of the rest of the worlds struggles against American (read corporate) empire while we are mesmerized by our election kabuki.



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yuQq70QSMi4
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Juche Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-05-08 01:34 AM
Response to Original message
4. Good post, but missed the part about competitors to IMF & World bank
Various left wing leaders in south & central america are forming banks to compete with the IMF & world bank. ALBA for one which is a more socialistic alternative to other int. banks.

http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2008/01/26/america/LA-GEN-Venezuela-ALBA-Summit.php

I wouldn't worry about the right wingers. They have a 'my country, right or wrong' attitude that a person should unconditionally support the nation (unless a democrat is president). Personally I support my country when it does good, and get upset when it does bad. And I would love to see my country be a meaningful force for good in the world again. We still do alot of good (alot of medical research is done here for example, and many of the world's intellectuals reside here), but we could be doing alot more good with all our intellectual and material capital.
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NM Independent Donating Member (794 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-05-08 01:52 AM
Response to Original message
5. Thank you for all the work you do...
I have been going through your entries, and all the info on your journal. Absolutely mind boggling. Your head must hurt with all of this information in it. Mine hurts just trying to soak it all in.

Please, run for office :patriot:
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Time for change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-05-08 12:54 PM
Response to Reply #5
19. Thank you very much
One of the great things about writing my thoughts down is that then I don't have to keep them so much in my head. I can forget some of them, but then the details are there when I need them to refer to -- thanks to the internet and DU. That way I prevent my head from hurting.
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bluestateboomer Donating Member (313 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-05-08 03:43 AM
Response to Original message
6. A wise essay
K&R!!!:yourock:
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Hippo_Tron Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-05-08 03:58 AM
Response to Original message
7. We act like America being an empire is some big secret, it's really not
Ever since World War II we've been the dominant force in the world and after the fall of the Soviet Union, the only remaining superpower. I don't say empire as though it's entirely a bad thing. Like it or not, US Hegemony does contribute to global stability. There has been no World War III largely because of America's actions. Frankly if John McCain gets elected I think our streak of preventing another world war will be put to the test, though.

Of course our empire has certainly done its share of bad things. There is definitely a better way of maintaining global stability than US hegemony. I'm just not quite sure what it is.
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Time for change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-05-08 07:37 AM
Response to Reply #7
8. I don't know what the evidence is that US hegemony has been a force for global stability
Edited on Sat Apr-05-08 07:54 AM by Time for change
Many of the actions noted above have served to drive millions into poverty, facilitate wars and create chaos. One could go into a lot more detail on any of the cases cited above to make that point. I've done that in some of the individual posts that I cite. For example, consider our School of the Americas, as described in this article and described in my post:

It describes numerous atrocities committed by graduates of SOA, which are consistent with the SOA curriculum. While SOA torture manuals have been withdrawn, their content has not been repudiated by SOA, and some of the worst abusers continue to be honored as guest instructors for SOA courses.

School of the Americas training is oriented to support the military and political status quo in each country, which places the U.S. in opposition to any who seek free speech to discuss problems, alternative means to solve problems, or democratic means to change governments. More specifically, the enemy is identified as the poor, those who assist the poor, such as church workers, educators, and unions, and certain ideologies such as “socialism” or “liberation theology”. All of this just to make sure that Communists or “leftists” don’t get a foothold in any of these countries.

With our numerous violent overthrows of democratic sovereign governments and installing of brutal dictators, and our devastating direct involvement in wars in Vietnam and Iraq, what have we done since FDR and Truman led the establishment of the UN, and Truman established the Marshall plan, to count as being a net stabilizing force in the world?

Yes, some of our Presidents since WW II have striven for peace and accomplished some important objectives towards that end (Truman, Kennedy, Carter, Clinton). But overall I just don't see how we can be considered a net force for world stabilization since the Marshall Plan.
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many a good man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-05-08 09:06 AM
Response to Reply #8
12. To be fair we can never know how the postwar world would have turned out
if the US did not share superpower status with the Soviet Union in a bipolar world.

Would the old Soviet Union as the world's sole superpower been more beneficent than the US? After all, they were right wing, anti-democratic, and expansionist as was clearly shown after their fall. Would western Europe have devoted more of their budgets to the military if they didn't have the US security blanket over them? Would they have been able to develop their social democracies?

We can never know the answers to these questions. A global order is important because it does promote stability, at least among the major powers. Chaos breaks loose when one of the great powers teeters and falls. It is a fact of life.

Strong international institutions that promote peace and share prosperity will do more good than any hegemonic super power. A strong United States that promotes intl institutions and actually lives up to its ideals on the world stage could do a hell of a lot of good for the world. If we can ever get her there. I grow more doubtful with each passing decade.
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Time for change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-05-08 10:03 AM
Response to Reply #12
16. That is true
I don't think that the Soviet Union would have been more beneficient than the US -- especially under Stalin. And yes, Europe would have had to develop their militaries if not for the protection of the US. We do not know where that would have led to.

The only part of your post I disagree with is this part: "A global order is important because it does promote stability, at least among the major powers. Chaos breaks loose when one of the great powers teeters and falls." "Global order" is a very vague term IMO. Depending upon its nature, it may promote stability, or it may not. It may produce more chaos than order.

In any event, "stability" should not be the main goal. With billions of the world's population in poverty and hungry, even though the world has enough resources to provide food for all of us, we should do much more than aim just for stability.

I agree completely with your last paragraph. We have a long way to go to get to that point, especially after our long eight year detour.
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TheLastMohican Donating Member (753 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-07-08 05:20 AM
Response to Reply #16
63. All your points are valid
Except one.

You do know that US consumes about 40% of all resources in the world. Do you agree to share whatever you have with the hungry in Africa and Asia?
Do you think the fellow Americans would like to cut their consumption 2 or 3 times in order for the rest of the world to feed itself nicely?
The US government is just the mirror of its people, people who will kill for having a lifestyle that includes a suburban house, two-three cars, spacious swimming pool and good credit card.

What you suggest is for the people to live humble, forfeit the cars, move to an apartment and EAT less? Do you seriously think that spending Americans find your points appealing?
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-05-08 08:26 PM
Response to Reply #12
34. Agree and disagree . . .
Edited on Sat Apr-05-08 08:30 PM by defendandprotect
Many suggest that the Cold War was contrived --- fake -- and intended to keep the MIIC going.

America, of course, had atomic weapons and showed that it would use them -- without mercy --!!

Most nations post-WWII wanted peace -- and a chance to recover.

It was America which was continuing to push to move the soldiers into Vietnam IMMEDIATELY after Japan.

The British and the French were now unable to keep their empires going --- and revolution was
in the air -- colonies wanted to separate from their masters post WWII.

In India, of course, they used the landmine of religion to split the country in two --
as the English were forced out.

Unfortunately, the days when we could believe in a peace-loving America are pretty much over.
In fact, Imperialism is quite on the menu these days --- openly on the menu.



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ekwhite Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-05-08 02:19 PM
Response to Reply #7
22. I strongly disagree with your assertion
The American empire is bad for the American republic, and for democracy worldwide. Just as the British empire was bad, the Austro-Hungarian empire was bad, etc., etc. History has shown at least since the Roman republic that imperialism leads to an erosion of democracy in the home country. The costs of maintaining the American empire directly contribute to the national debt and the fall of the dollar. American imperial ambition has devastated democratic movements in the Middle East and contributed to the rise of terrorist movements throughout the region. It is American imperialism that has led to the debacle in Iraq, with the death of a million Iraqis and 4000 American soldiers, along with the waste of hundreds of billions of dollars of American treasure.

America has a choice - to walk away from the American empire, as the British did after WWII, or to continue until the empire bankrupts our country, financially and morally.
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Solon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-05-08 06:41 PM
Response to Reply #7
31. Since when was it U.S. policy to "promote stability"?
That was never the goal, the United States, since WWII, at least after Truman, had a stated goal of increasing the influence of American corporations worldwide. Indeed, in order to accomplish this goal, they had to do two things, suppress democratic movements worldwide, and sell it to the American people as "fighting communism".

Also, I see little evidence that the United States actually prevented WWIII from occurring.
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Karenina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-06-08 01:40 PM
Response to Reply #31
54. . .
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Hippo_Tron Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-06-08 05:39 PM
Response to Reply #31
58. Having power concentrated in one state prevents world wars from happening
I'm not saying it's an ideal state of affairs, because it's certainly not.
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Solon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-06-08 06:55 PM
Response to Reply #58
59. Do you have evidence to support that assertion?
Remember, power was theoretically divided between the Soviet Union and the United States for almost half a century, and they fought proxy wars with client states under false pretenses for most of that time. It seems much more likely that nuclear weapons prevent TOTAL war, such as WWI or WWII from taking place, more so than whether or not one state, or two states, had concentrated power. Let's assume, for a minute, that, for some reason, nuclear weapons were never invented, and the world still had the same political makeup, post-WWII that it did in real life. This isn't beyond the realm of possibility, nuclear weapons were only used at the very end of the war in Japan, and they were ready to surrender anyways. Do you honestly think the USSR and the United States wouldn't have fought a World War, or even more likely, multiple world wars with more conventional weapons?

Considering the way both nations are, geographically, and with approximately the same industrial capacity, the idea of a total war that lead to the conquering of either seems highly unlikely. So most likely, if any World Wars were fought, they would be fought to a stalemate each time, with who knows how many client states or proxies destroyed in the process. The Cold War wouldn't have existed, to put it mildly, I would say, given the rise of tensions between the two over Europe, that within a decade of WWII, WWIII would have been fought, though not necessarily won, by either side.

Not to mention that historically, neither the United States nor the Soviet Union were the first superpowers the world had ever seen. The British, Dutch, Portuguese, Spanish, and French Empires all fought for dominance in the world, being what we could call "superstates", having, in a sense, established world governments where as much as a third of the world's population was under each of their's jurisdiction. Even when one dominated over all others, "world wars" as such were fought, the Spanish versus the English, the French versus the English, the 30 years war, etc. Some of these, even with the limitations in technology, actually had a greater death toll than either of the 20th centuries world wars combined.

Besides that, no matter how the superpower is formed, nor how benevolent they seem, they end up being oppressive to either their colonial possessions or client states, and end up having to fight a series of wars to subjugate them. This leads to eras of regional wars, fought between clients(Iran/Iraq), overthrows of elected government, leading to civil wars and/or guerrilla warfare(Nicaragua/Greece, etc.). I could go on, but the fact is that, in a very real way, this is no better than fighting a world war of WWII levels in total lives lost or destroyed. Just because it happens on a smaller scale over a longer period of time doesn't mean its more "stable" than a war that lasts less than a decade. I don't see this as an improvement.
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Hippo_Tron Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-07-08 03:12 AM
Response to Reply #59
60. Nuclear deterrance had a lot to do with it as well
But we had the opportunity to go into a full scale war with the Soviets when we had the bomb and they didn't. Patton argued for this, but Truman wouldn't have it.

And I don't deny that the United States is oppressive. Anybody with a brain can see that. I just don't view international affairs through the lens of good and evil and I think that many people both on the right and the left are tempted to do that.


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Solon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-07-08 03:45 AM
Response to Reply #60
62. Its not so much good and evil as positive and negative effects...
Edited on Mon Apr-07-08 04:04 AM by Solon
The United States has many people around the world that are NOT happy with them, a lot of resentment, and even outright hatred, and this predates Bush. Oddly enough, the blame for most of this enmity is because of the actions of the United States itself. No, its not responsible for ALL the atrocities of the world, the former Soviet Union had a hand in many, and many nations fuck themselves up just fine. But look to our own backyard, we have an economic and socio-political backlash in most of Latin America against the American boot of oppression that has existed there for well over 100 years. The same could be said of Iran as well.

As a result of both the Cold War, and propping up our own economy, we have a top heavy, very expensive, military that we simply can't afford anymore. Not to mention regional instability that can easily spill over into regional war in the middle east. None of this is good for either our security or the security of the world. If we were really interested in global stability, we would be working to create allies, rather than enemies, and do it in a non-oppressive way. No more overthrowing inconvenient democratic governments, no more forcing economic sanctions on a people just because they said no to something the IMF/WB wants, etc.

Stability is important, but it should never take precedence over human rights, Democracy, or the right to self determination.
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leftchick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-05-08 08:39 AM
Response to Original message
10. Excellent! And might I add....
John Pilger's film is a must see to help understand US imperialism in South and Central America....

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article18236.htm

Thank you so much TFC! This is an extraordinary post!

:)
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Time for change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-05-08 04:43 PM
Response to Reply #10
27. Thank you -- That looks like a very interesting film. I'll have to watch it.
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Echo In Light Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-05-08 08:44 AM
Response to Original message
11. Walter Lippmann also coined the term "manufacture of consent" which Chomsky wrote about
...so many yrs later as it's still quite prominent.
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Time for change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-05-08 05:33 PM
Response to Reply #11
29. What did they mean by that?
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Echo In Light Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-05-08 06:21 PM
Response to Reply #29
30. Some info:
It's a cultural form/propaganda stratagem for marginalizing the public voice and role in the affairs and concerns of managing society, specifically to the aid of the elites who largely own and run the society, and in so doing reducing democratic interference with the profits over people ideal. In Chomsky's terms, it's an Orwellian euphemism for how thought control works in democratic society.

http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/Herman%20/Manufacturing_Consent.html

"All this falls under Walter Lippmann's notion of "the manufacture of consent." Democracy permits the voice of the people to be heard, and it is the task of the intellectual to ensure that this voice endorses what leaders perceive to be the right course. Propaganda is to democracy what violence is to totalitarianism. The techniques have been honed to a high art in the U.S. and elsewhere, far beyond anything that Orwell dreamed of. The device of feigned dissent (as practiced by the Vietnam- era "doves," who criticized the war on the grounds of effectiveness and not principle) is one of the more subtle means, though simple lying and suppressing fact and other crude techniques are also highly effective.

For those who stubbornly seek freedom around the world, there can be no more urgent task than to come to understand the mechanisms and practices of indoctrination. These are easy to perceive in the totalitarian societies, much less so in the propaganda system to which we are subjected and in which all too often we serve as unwilling or unwitting instruments." ~ Noam Chomsky
http://www.zpub.com/un/chomsky.html

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-5631882395226827730
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annabanana Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-05-08 09:13 AM
Response to Original message
13. This message needs to be "bumperstickered" for the lazy.
How can we talk about this in simple, unarguable language? That is the only way we can get it to enter the realm of "common knowledge".
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Orwellian_Ghost Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-05-08 09:24 AM
Response to Original message
14. K&R
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ooglymoogly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-05-08 09:31 AM
Response to Original message
15. KR for truth
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lildreamer316 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-05-08 11:47 AM
Response to Original message
18. I think this is the best post I've ever read on DU. Really.
Thank you. Many times reading this, my mind started whirring, going off in different directions, making connections to other areas of American life that have been affected by these policies; realizing whys and wherefores.

This actually helps me to understand part of why I am a stripper, and why that feels so freeing. It is because my earning potential is based NOT upon some corporate (and therefore Chicago-School influenced!) control factor,but upon something much more basic: Human Nature. THIS is why it is possible for a good number of intelligent women and men in my profession to find wealth/at least make a living. There are always people trying to control it, but so far that has been less than successful, although in certain areas it has been.

It also helped me to understand why my parents were not able to comprehend my decision to not finish college. During most of their adult life, incomes were upwardly mobile; education was somewhat affordable and extremely necessary for any kind of good job, and if one were to 'follow the rules'; one would succeed in life. I don't feel this is true at all in today's economic environment. My parents have passed, but I fear they would not recognize the America they grew up in.

Very thought provoking, very enlightening, very encouraging. I personally tend to put a spiritual spin on this (not Christian, but new-agey, LOL) and look at it through those glasses, but any way you see it, it makes a lot of sense.

Follow the money.

I so hope that we can recover from our shock therapy soon. We, and our children, need it desperately.

THIS IS ALSO why I get VERY ANGRY at people, even liberals, who so easily blame the US people for not 'waking up'. Look, we are trying. Why are they always blaming? We need to work together. The example given here of Latin America's people shows that change can happen, awakenings do occur. Sure, we expect Americans to be quicker on the uptake. I certainly hope so also. But you can't blame them for not wanting to let go of the dream. They sold us such a nice one. It's hard to realize we can make a reality better than the dream, when so often the reverse has seemed to be the case.

Thank you so much, again. Absolutely wonderful post, great clear thought. I'm going to keep this to refer to.

:patriot:

This is what a true citizen of the country, and of the WORLD, looks like.
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Time for change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-05-08 07:59 PM
Response to Reply #18
33. Thank you very much
If you're interested in looking at this from a spriitual angle, I would strongly recommend Scott Peck's "People of the Lie". It's one of the most interesting books I've ever read. He looks at the problem of evil from both a scientific and a spiritual angle simultaneously -- kind of melds them together.
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catzies Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-05-08 01:25 PM
Response to Original message
20. OUTSTANDING. This is why I came to DU, and why I stay here.
These are the posts I come here for: knowledge and enlightement.

Bookmarking, archiving K&Ring, etc.
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Time for change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-05-08 10:54 PM
Response to Reply #20
41. Thank you -- That's very nice to hear.
I appreciate it.
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ekwhite Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-05-08 02:06 PM
Response to Original message
21. One of the best posts I have read here in a long time
This is a great summary of what is wrong with American foreign policy, and with the neoliberal policies that were installed after 9/11. It is no accident that we have a concentration of wealth and an erosion of democracy in our country at the same time.
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Time for change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-05-08 11:18 PM
Response to Reply #21
42. Thank you very much -- No, it's no accident at all
The good majority of people in this country (or any other country) do not want a tremendous concentration of wealth, at the expense of 90% or more of the rest of the people. A thriving democracy would not tolerate that.
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H2O Man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-05-08 02:23 PM
Response to Original message
23. Once again,
you deliver with the quality of information that makes DU such a valuable place.

Thank you. Your contributions here are really appreciated, and I enjoy being able to share these with other people -- particularly students.

Nominated.
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Time for change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-05-08 10:13 PM
Response to Reply #23
40. Thank you -- That's really great to hear that you sometimes share these with your students.
Edited on Sat Apr-05-08 10:53 PM by Time for change
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JackRiddler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-05-08 02:33 PM
Response to Original message
24. Excellent piece - especially the perspective on Latin America...
Incredible numbers wrt the IMF. I hadn't realized - it happened ovrernight, and Venezuela led the way. Latin America is leaving the orbit and the most important single event of the last decade* will be remembered as the failed coup of April 11, 2002, when the US proved for the first time unable to impose its will by the last resort of force.

(*Along with the 9/11 deception to launch the Global War, which is turning into the empire's last stand.)

The stage we've reached reminds me of the song by Laurie Anderson, O Superman:

'Cause when love is gone, there's always justice.
And when justive is gone, there's always force.
And when force is gone, there's always Mom. Hi Mom!

So hold me, Mom, in your long arms. So hold me,
Mom, in your long arms.
In your automatic arms. Your electronic arms.
In your arms.
So hold me, Mom, in your long arms.
Your petrochemical arms. Your military arms.
In your electronic arms.
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Time for change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-06-08 12:00 AM
Response to Reply #24
44. Thank you -- I was and am very glad that that coup failed
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Quantess Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-05-08 03:10 PM
Response to Original message
26. Recommended!
The USA is an empire, all right.
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juno jones Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-05-08 05:32 PM
Response to Original message
28. K&R!
Solidarity!

It sounds trite, but its best word I can think of to decribe what we need now.
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snot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-05-08 07:18 PM
Response to Original message
32. My concern: will U.S. CITIZENS realize in time that they're doing the same to US.
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Karenina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-06-08 08:30 AM
Response to Reply #32
48. Good question!
Sunday kick. :kick:
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-05-08 08:42 PM
Response to Original message
35. bookmarked and thank you!
Edited on Sat Apr-05-08 08:44 PM by defendandprotect
I'm still working thru Naomi Klein's book --- library copy in and out --- because I find
that if I own the book I often don't read it! And, I'm still only half way thru Naomi Wolf's
"Death of America." I do, however, feel that I'm aware of much of the material, but there are
surprises....

Of course, I saw Milton Freedman on TV and having listened to him a bit thought him a complete ass.
And from there on totally ignored him and wondered how anyone could be watching him.
HOWEVER, I had no idea of the role he played in the Allende/Pinochet disaster --- or the role that those who practiced his form of economic medicine played in that disaster --- and throughout Latin America!!!

Now, of course, we can look at PBS today and quite understand that it's been under corporate control for quite some decades. But, as I reflect upon PBS' role in presenting Milton Freedman --
and who was the other idiot -- a distortion of another historical character I can't think of at the moment -- somebody's "Journal" -- I have to see this now as something extremely sinister.

Oh -- there's so much to talk about here --- but thank you again.

PS: Just want to mention there's a comment in there about Enron/Lay having died in prison.
Actually, he died under threat of being imprisoned. Some wonder if he actually died and whether
he's off somewhere enjoying himself?



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Time for change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-05-08 09:20 PM
Response to Reply #35
36. Yes, Naomi Klein's book is full of shocking information. And she really knows how to connect the
dots as much as anyone.

Were you trying to think of Bill Moyers? I actually think that he's quite good. He has had a lot of very astute things to say about freedom of the press and the need to counteract media consolidation. He's been very outspoken about that, and I'm pretty sure he lost his job at PBS because of it. Maybe you heard him talk about some things that I missed.

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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-06-08 12:47 AM
Response to Reply #36
46. I was very impressed with what I've seen of NK on video ...
Edited on Sun Apr-06-08 12:48 AM by defendandprotect
and as I said, I'm only 1/4 of the way thru the book, but she's brilliant.

No -- the other person on PBS I was thinking of --- and it was a distortion of a historical person --- was it "Tony Brown's Journal" --- ??? There was an African-American using the
good will for the original character and quite distorting the his history for his own purpose.

Again -- here we have PBS involved in disinforming the public ---
at the time I thought of Freedman's appearances and the Tony Brown thing as just odd.
It was all a great deal more than that, IMO, now.

Bill Moyers, it is true, has done a great deal. But I've always felt uneasy about him.
It's just a personal thing. One of my problems with what he does on PBS is it's done in a
way which would never get anyone up off their couch to do anything about the issue.

Also, he was closely connected to LBJ --- served in his White House.
Pierre Salinger tells us that both he and MOYERS knew LBJ to be "clinically psychotic" --
and as near as I can tell neither one of them did anything about it in letting the public know.
Evidently, the fact that a number of LBJ's aides were in agreement on this may, however, been
part of his impetus for his not running again.

And, of course, LBJ is another subject --- another really corrupt individual who had a lasting
and negative effect on our government and America --- if not much of the world.

Hard to think that Moyers who was also from Texas didn't know the truth about LBJ . . . ???

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diane in sf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-05-08 09:21 PM
Response to Original message
37. Thank you, hope more people wake up to the fact we're being shocked and awed
right here and now in the good old USA.
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Lydia Leftcoast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-05-08 09:26 PM
Response to Original message
38. People of my generation tend to associate the word "imperialist" with
official statements from Communist governments, so they shut down.

But if you look at the facts, you see that indeed, the U.S. is guilty of economic imperialism and economically driven imperialism.

In this case, the Communists were right.
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bluesmail Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-05-08 09:50 PM
Response to Original message
39. bookmarked and K&R
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Kaleko Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-05-08 11:47 PM
Response to Original message
43. Word!
Time for change:

"I cannot take pride in a system that creates billionaires at the cost of throwing millions of people into poverty, misery and fear."

No one can. That's where denial comes in. We live in the Divided States of Denial.

You've written a consciousness-raising article here. I don't know how to thank you enough.
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Time for change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-06-08 12:07 AM
Response to Reply #43
45. Thank you
Yes, I believe that denial is a major problem with our country.
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dougolat Donating Member (78 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-06-08 01:10 AM
Response to Original message
47. Rev. Wright didn't say he hated America,
that's just the way the media spun it. His sermon was about living up to our professed ideals.
When Bill Clinton came to town this weekend I held up a sign for his cavalcade saying
"Iran-Contra thugs You let them go Now look what they've done."
hoping to tweak his conscience.
Had a talk with someone hung up on the "we can't accept defeat in Iraq" line; stopped him with "Is it defeat when the police finally give up on the drug-raid at the wrong address?"
I sure hope Hugo Chavez and Evo Morales can stick to their ideals, and not get caught up in repressive authoritarianism like Castro did.
Thanks TFC, another post to share widely.
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Time for change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-06-08 09:14 AM
Response to Reply #47
49. Self delete -- duplicate.
Edited on Sun Apr-06-08 09:15 AM by Time for change
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Time for change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-06-08 09:14 AM
Response to Reply #47
50. Great retort to "We can't accept defeat in Iraq"
I'll have to remember that one.
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tex-wyo-dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-06-08 10:10 AM
Response to Original message
51. Too late to rec, but will certainly kick & bookmark...
Excellent and informative! Keep up the great work!

It's posts like this that keeps me coming back to DU.
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timtom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-06-08 11:02 AM
Response to Original message
52. Excellent Document!
Didn't bookmark --- SAVED to be converted to pdf for my reading and archiving pleasure.

Thank you for one of the most meaningful posts in a long time.

Now, THIS is what I'm talking about on DU.
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Ghost Dog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-06-08 11:48 AM
Response to Original message
53. Copied
here, if you don't mind.
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puebloknot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-06-08 04:17 PM
Response to Original message
56. I think you love your country very much. I think you must not stop writing...
...because you are a stellar writer and teacher. It has always been the still, small voice that refuses to be silenced that grows louder and louder. And then, in time, the People say, "We knew it all along."

I honestly don't have a lot of hope that the People (big P) will ever think for themselves, but I do hope that a call for a return to our founding principles will be made by a leader whose integrity will grip the imagination of the People and they will follow. Maybe that leader will be Obama.
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Truth2Tell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-06-08 04:35 PM
Response to Original message
57. Kicking hard.
Excellent post TFC! Bravo.
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JCMach1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-07-08 03:41 AM
Response to Original message
61. You post is very important-- and unless Obama gets rid of his Chicago School
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Karenina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-07-08 11:48 AM
Response to Reply #61
64. . .
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