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Better Believe It Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-10-08 12:12 PM
Original message
3 Articles On Tibet Everyone Should Read For A Little Balance
Western "Free World Leaders" Lecture China On Non-Violence In Tibet

CounterPunch
Weekend Edition
March 29 / 30, 2008

China, Tibet and the Propaganda Olympics
By WILLIAM BLUM

-William Blum is the author of Killing Hope: U.S. Military and CIA Interventions Since World War II, Rogue State: a guide to the World's Only Super Power. and West-Bloc Dissident: a Cold War Political Memoir.-

The Washington Post recently ran a story about how the Chinese people largely support the government suppression of the Tibetan protesters. The heading was: "Beijing's Crackdown Gets Strong Domestic Support. Ethnic Pride Stoked by Government Propaganda." The article spoke of how Beijing officials have "educated" the public about Tibet "through propaganda".

That's a rather interesting concept. Imagine the Post or any other American mainstream media saying that those Americans who support the war in Iraq do so because they've been educated by government propaganda. ... Ditto those who support the war in Afghanistan. ... Ditto those who supported the bombing of Yugoslavia. ... Ditto scores of other US invasions, bombings, overthrows, and miscellaneous war crimes spanning more than half a century.

Now Germany's foreign minister has warned China that its response to the crisis in Tibet may jeopardize the Summer Olympics in Beijing. "The German federal government is saying to the Chinese government: be transparent! We want to know exactly what is going on in Tibet." He also warned China to avoid any violent measures in its standoff with Tibetan protesters. Human rights organizations have demanded that Coca-Cola, Visa, General Electric, and other international companies explain their dealings with the Chinese government as it prepares to host the Summer Games. The French Foreign Minister floated the prospect of boycotting the Games' opening ceremony because of China's response to the protests. And the president of the European Parliament said European countries should not rule out threatening China with a boycott if violence continued in Tibet.

It's nice to see the West's conscience stirred up. They're real good about such things, when the target is not one of their own, particularly against a communist country. In 1980, 62 nations -- including the United States, Canada, West Germany, Japan, and Israel -- boycotted the Olympics in Moscow because the previous year the Soviet Union had invaded Afghanistan. Four years later, the Olympics were held in Los Angeles. Not a single member of "The Free World" boycotted it, even though the previous year the United States had invaded Grenada and overthrown the government, with a lot less political justification than the Russians had for invading Afghanistan. The Grenada invasion was as much lacking in legality and morality as the invasion of Iraq in 2003.

Please read the entire article at:

http://www.counterpunch.org/blum03292008.html

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The Tibet Protests: An Excercise In Hypocrisy by Uri Avnery
CounterPunch
Apri1 7, 2008

Uri Avnery is an Israeli writer and peace activist with Gush Shalom.


LIKE EVERYBODY else, I support the right of the Tibetan people to independence, or at least autonomy. Like everybody else, I condemn the actions of the Chinese government there. But unlike everybody else, I am not ready to join in the demonstrations.
Why? Because I have an uneasy feeling that somebody is washing my brain, that what is going on is an exercise in hypocrisy.

I support the Tibetans in spite of it being obvious that the Americans are exploiting the struggle for their own purposes. Clearly, the CIA has planned and organized the riots, and the American media are leading the world-wide campaign. It is a part of the hidden struggle between the US, the reigning super-power, and China, the rising super-power - a new version of the "Great Game" that was played in central Asia in the 19th century by the British Empire and Russia. Tibet is a token in this game.

I am even ready to ignore the fact that the gentle Tibetans have carried out a murderous pogrom against innocent Chinese, killing women and men and burning homes and shops. Such detestable excesses do happen during a liberation struggle.

No, what is really bugging me is the hypocrisy of the world media. They storm and thunder about Tibet. In thousands of editorials and talk-shows they heap curses and invective on the evil China. It seems as if the Tibetans are the only people on earth whose right to independence is being denied by brutal force, that if only Beijing would take its dirty hands off the saffron-robed monks, everything would be alright in this, the best of all possible worlds.

Please read the entire article at:
http://www.counterpunch.org/avnery04072008.html

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Bashing China Is Not The Answer by Professor L. Ling-chi Wang
Cnn.com/Asia
April 9, 2008
Ling-chi Wang: "Humility and compassion, not hypocrisy and self-righteousness, is what is needed."

Bashing China is not the answer
Violent protests desecrate Olympics, insult the people of China
By Professor L. Ling-chi Wang
L. Ling-chi Wang is professor emeritus of Asian American & Ethnic Studies at the University of California, Berkeley.

The media, as usual, have seized the opportunity to pour fuel onto the fire. Politicians are tripping over each other in their eagerness to condemn China, to call for boycotts, and to claim the high moral ground, even though the United States has been treated as a rogue state worldwide because of our invasion of Iraq, and our unlawful detention, torture, rendition, etc.

Sadly, most Americans know little about international issues and for that matter, China, as demonstrated by the conspicuous absence of information regarding historical context and complexity. Instead, the media, politicians and organized groups prefer to use only sound bites and, frequently, disinformation to perpetuate ignorance, instill fear, and incite racial hostility, or worse, hatred toward China.

China, like many countries in the world, including the U.S., has problems. It has much to learn from the rest of the world. For example, China has yet to learn how to understand and treat its minorities -- such as Tibetans, Uighurs, Muslims, Hmongs -- as equals. In this respect, they are not that different from us. We are still learning how to treat minorities such as Native Americans, African-Americans, Latinos, Chinese-Americans and others as equals.

I am not opposed to free speech and legitimate protests against China's wrongdoings. However, I am opposed to using the Olympics to demonize China and its people and disruptive, confrontational, and violent tactics. Such actions have the effect of desecrating the Olympics and humiliating and insulting the people of China. No good can come of them.

Please read the entire article at:

http://www.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/asiapcf/04/09/commentary ....

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Professor Ling-chi Wang is a distinguished scholar and activist on Asian American issues. He was at the center of the struggles that shaped the creation of the Ethnic Studies Department at UC Berkeley, and has been an advocate ever since of the department’s social activist agenda, particularly in the wake of the Bakke court decision and other attacks on affirmative action. He has been centrally involved in activism, scholarship and dialogues about the rights of Chinese-speaking students in K-12 education, the housing crisis in San Francisco’s Chinatown, the 1996 campaign finance scandal, and, most recently, issues around the Japanese government’s responsibility to Chinese, Koreans, and other Asian targets of Japanese aggression during World War II. He played a key role as strategist and advisor during former Los Alamos National Laboratory scientist Wen Ho Lee’s battle against espionage charges. His recent publications in Asian American studies include "Being Used and Being Marginalized in the Affirmative Action Debate: Re-envisioning Multiracial America from an Asian American Perspective" in Asian American Policy Review and "Structure of Dual Domination" in Amerasia Journal.




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Triana Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-10-08 12:19 PM
Response to Original message
1. Still crapping on the DU rugs eh?
How much DO those communists pay you to drop your propaganda here?
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Kaleko Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-10-08 01:08 PM
Response to Reply #1
10. So far, there are at least 5 disinformation agents posting CCP propaganda on DU
This guy is one of the most prolific. Don't click on his links. The number of hits may be one of the ways they get paid.


:hi:
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LeftishBrit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-10-08 12:24 PM
Response to Original message
2. Nobody thinks that the Tibetans are 'the only people on earth' who are suffering in this way
And of course it's true that many other countries don't treat minorities well.

However, that's not an excuse for what's happening in Tibet.

And China is in the spotlight right now because it's hosting the Olympics. If it didn't want to be so much in the spotlight, maybe it shouldn't have bid for them. As it made that choice, it has to take the consequences of having its actions scrutinized by the world.
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JeffR Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-10-08 12:25 PM
Response to Original message
3. You're not interested in balance.
You're just catapulting propaganda. There's a difference.

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mainegreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-10-08 12:26 PM
Response to Original message
4. the CIA has planned and organized the riots?
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High Plains Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-10-08 02:01 PM
Response to Reply #4
18. Of course not! The CIA would never do anything like that.
Try reading the first author's book on the history on CIA interventions.
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mainegreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-10-08 07:33 PM
Response to Reply #18
30. Wrong place.
Edited on Thu Apr-10-08 07:33 PM by mainegreen
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AlCzervik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-10-08 12:27 PM
Response to Original message
5. take a break Beijing Bob, you aren't helping your cause.
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SidDithers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-10-08 12:31 PM
Response to Original message
6. So, Tibet became Shangri-La after the Chinese invaded?...
Is that what these people think?

http://www.tibetopenletter.org/

Sid
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mainegreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-10-08 12:32 PM
Response to Original message
7. Also, I wish there was a negative recommend button right now.
Your crapfest really deserves it.
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NanBo Donating Member (316 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-10-08 12:39 PM
Response to Original message
8. going for 3 strikes here?
last 2 times were locked--you don't take a hint well, do you.
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Better Believe It Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-10-08 01:14 PM
Response to Reply #8
12. A Few People Are Flaming Here In Order To Muzzle Free Speech
and get posts locked that they disagree with. A few posters have just admitted that!

The rules are now being abused by a few people for the sole purpose of locking down posts they disagree with!

I'm sure that was not the intention of moderators and how can the moderators stop such undemocratic behavior?
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Occulus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-10-08 01:17 PM
Response to Reply #12
13. Bile. n/t
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ProfessorGAC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-10-08 02:33 PM
Response to Reply #12
23. Yeah, You Keep Telling Yourself That
The only one you'll convince would be you. This has nothing to do with free speech. This has to do with people calling out a propagandist.
The Professor
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High Plains Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-10-08 03:37 PM
Response to Reply #23
29. What a crock of shit.
Propagadanda = stuff you don't like

That's a pretty piss-poor attitude for someone with "Professor" in his name.
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ProfessorGAC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-11-08 08:19 AM
Response to Reply #29
33. Pot Meet Kettle
I'm the one with a bad attitude.

It's not a single datapoint. Not that you would understand the significance of that. But you're welcome to be wrong. I'm sure you're quite used to it. In fact, i would think it happens most of the time.

The Professor
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kestrel91316 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-10-08 01:05 PM
Response to Original message
9. I see our residen paid Chinese propagandist is back. Yawn.
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High Plains Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-10-08 03:33 PM
Response to Reply #9
28. Do you have any evidence to support that libel?
"paid Chinese propagandist"

Or are you just pulling it out of your ass?
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awaysidetraveler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-10-08 01:09 PM
Response to Original message
11. Wow... this kind of propaganda doesn't belong on DU.
You are advocating human rights abuses. You are saying that we should say and do nothing in objection to those human rights abuses.

It is the Tibetans and other Chinese human-rights advocates that are using the Olympics to bring political pressure
to the Chinese government. You are citing Chinese propaganda that offers no proof of CIA involvement.

I hope for the sake of the citizens of China that you are not Chinese,
because your faceless words discredit the integrity of your family and the people of your nation,
just as they dehumanize the Tibetan and Chinese victims of your government's oppression.
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Tierra_y_Libertad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-10-08 01:34 PM
Response to Original message
14. K&R The authors make good points about hypocrisy.
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Karenina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-10-08 01:50 PM
Response to Reply #14
17. The authors are all well-respected
by those whose minds haven't yet been seized and RECOGNIZE them. Tibet is NOT a B/W, this/or/that issue. It's history is complicated and worthy of study. As usual the MESSENGER is being pilloried. :crazy:
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Tierra_y_Libertad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-10-08 02:19 PM
Response to Reply #17
21. The Bogeyman mindset. China being one of the favorite bogeymen.
China is hardly a paragon of respect for human rights, but they hardly alone. As one of the authors points out, there are plenty of countries that have committed, or are now committing, terrible abuses against the people, only to be ignored or rationalized because they pose no serious threat.
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trashcanistanista Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-10-08 01:34 PM
Response to Original message
15. Sorry, I have to agree.
This stuff does not belong here. I am alerting.
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High Plains Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-10-08 02:03 PM
Response to Reply #15
19. Why not? Because you disagree with it? Censorship is ugly, too.
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Richard Steele Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-10-08 01:40 PM
Response to Original message
16. Spam spam, spammity SPAAAAMMMM...
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High Plains Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-10-08 02:04 PM
Response to Original message
20. I haven't seen a single substantive response to the OP
Just name-calling.
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Burma Jones Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-10-08 02:27 PM
Response to Original message
22. These are fair articles and do not let China off the hook, they all point out
some valid hypocrisies.

That being said, China is a dominant world power and deserves the negative attention, just as the US and Russia deserve their negative attention.
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PVnRT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-10-08 02:43 PM
Response to Original message
24. Counterpunch's article makes it sound like
the USSR had any justification for the invasion of Afghanistan. There was none, just as there was no justification for the invasion of Grenada or Iraq.
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Better Believe It Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-10-08 03:05 PM
Response to Reply #24
25. Which Author Allegedly Defended The USSR Invasion?

I couldn't find any statement by either of those two writers supporting the USSR invasion of Afghanistan. Please quote it. Thanks.

I hope you oppose the firebombings and physical attacks on Chinese shops and people in Tibet as much as you oppose Chinese troops in Tibet. I do.

I haven't seen anything posted yet condeming those violent attacks on innocent Chinese civilians and their shops. Have you seen anything posted along those lines? Gee .... I wonder why not.
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Robb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-10-08 03:17 PM
Response to Reply #25
27. You still here?
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Threedifferentones Donating Member (820 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-12-08 11:06 AM
Response to Reply #25
35. Hey man I hate to break to you but
Americans support wars like Iraq because of indoctrination and propaganda. Most of our countrymen are convinced that AMerican military forces and intelligence agencies "spread freedom," when of course the reality is they do whatever it takes to ensure our mega-rich have access to the foreign resources they need to become mega-richer.

So I have no problem believing that most Chinese support the oppression of Tibet due to propaganda. Your posts are stupid, no one takes them seriously. Shit, I just wasted 3 minutes replying....
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DrCory Donating Member (862 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-10-08 03:14 PM
Response to Original message
26. Read them...
China's still a thug, and you're still a shill.
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Orwellian_Ghost Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-10-08 08:17 PM
Response to Original message
31. Geez
What's with the hostility, bullying and outright slurs in this thread.

Why won't people even respond to the material presented?

The articles are pretty academic and only ask people to use some critical thinking skills and what we get are reactionary responses to the OP.

What is it people are afraid of?

It is healthy to challenge your assumptions folks and as the most propagandized people in the history of history it is vital that we question everything.

It only displays the weakness of those who attack the messenger when the message is not even considered. The credibility of the folks who in knee-jerk fashion abstain from disagreeing in an open and intelligent fashion with these three articles cannot be taken seriously.
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Robb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-11-08 08:10 AM
Response to Reply #31
32. It's one thing if you're reactionary the first time
...it's just many of us are tired of getting crapped on over and over by paid shills for China. And not just DU, pick a message board with a China topic, and enjoy the cacophony.

I expect I speak for most by saying I'd eagerly debate anyone who truly believed in their position. But I'm not going to waste my time on someone who takes a position professionally.
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Malidictus Maximus Donating Member (326 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-12-08 10:07 AM
Response to Reply #31
34. Well, I respectfully disagree.
Edited on Sat Apr-12-08 10:09 AM by Malidictus Maximus
The entire point of the OP and several others is boils down to "Other nations have done/are doing evil things to indigenous populations, too so anyone criticizing China is a CIA dupe".

To which I reply "So fucking what; it's a *GOVERNMENT*, it's going to do evil things. I met a Russian exchange student many years ago and after several drinks managed to explain that "yes, we hate your government; but don't take it personally, we hate our own government, too". All governments do evil, the only question is do they provide enough bread and circuses that the population does not revolt. (Pardon me if I've been reading too much Bakunin and Kropotkin lately)

China asked for the spotlight by competing for the olympics, so they have no right to bitch when the spotlight brings protest. To say that they have created and are creating a state that combines the *WORST* of capitalism and communism is not racist or ethnocentric, the only question is about wether or not engagement or condemnation will most influence their leaders to mitigate the environmental and 'human rights' policies that we 'westerners' find distasteful.

On the other hand to expect the Chinese, who have had dynasties lasting twice as long as the existence of this country, a history stretching back to the beginnings of recorded time and the much more experience at Empire than the U.S. to really give a shit about a few hundred (or thousand) deaths or a few months (or even years) of opprobrium is unrealistic at best, foolish more likely.
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