Being left handed in the middle ages...

[The Straight Story]

[angstlessk]

1. I am left handed and went to Catholic school...my mother was also left handed

as was her dad and he went to Catholic school and every time he tried to write with his left hand he got it smacked till he became ambi-dexterous and could write with either hand...and that was not the middle ages!!!

on edit: sleepy...

[Donnachaidh]

5. but many don't become ambidextrous

Some time back they did studies of people who had been *switched* and they had continual problems in their lives, all stemming from the abuse that was used to force them to write in a way that was unnatural for them.

It wasn't just Catholics who practiced this form of torture. My grandfather was a Presbyterian and he told stories of being beaten with pointers and anything else that was "handy" (no pun intended). When my mother went to a catholic school they tried to switch her, and my grandfather intervened and told them they would lose a student (and her tuition) if they continued. And we've had strong lefties in the family ever since.

Stupid ignorant superstitious assholes just used that *hand of the devil* malarkey from their personal mythology as an excuse to abuse untold thousands of kids. :grr:

[angstlessk]

7. that surprises me, I thought it was only Christian and Catholic schools

that tried to change the handedness of their students...I read a book called 'Sinister People' about left handed people years ago and found it interesting...

[Blue Diadem]

56. It happened to my Mother too.

She had infantile paralysis(Polio) when she was 3 and it weakened her right side. So she was mostly a lefty, especially writing left handed. She told me her hand was smacked with a ruler by her teachers in public school and she was forced to write with her right hand. That was back in the 20's.

[dysfunctional press]

65. presbyterians are christians.

nt

[Spike89]

67. catholics are christians n/t

[Donnachaidh]

81. uhh, last time I looked Presbyterian were considered Christian. n/t

[tavalon]

28. My kid, who is autistic is naturally ambidextrous, though as he heads into his teens,

I'm seeing him use his left hand for a lot more things. And then his teachers tell me they think he's right handed. Luckily, that boy won't have any of the pushing to change. He pushes right back.

[tblue37]

31. because the brain's speech center is involved with handedness,

when people are forced at a young age to switch handedness, they can end up with speech problems, usually stuttering.

The word "sinister" means from the lefthand side, and there are still people who beleive that there is something sinister about left-handedness.

[malaise]

34. Thanks n/t

[awoke_in_2003]

53. Well I guess that explains

why I had to go to speech classes in second grade. I was left handed, they started breaking me in kindergarden. I got a slur, though. I think I pronounced "s" sounds as "th". I don't think they did it for any religious beliefs, though. More likely a cost savings- no need to buy left handed scissors, sports equipment, etc.

[SammyWinstonJack]

35. I was forced to switch, became ambidextrous. I don't think it served me well.

My youngest son is a lefty.

[semillama]

57. That happened to my dad attending public elementary schools

in the 1940s.

[malaise]

8. I was a leftie and I was encouraged to switch

I use my right hand more but I can write with both.

Is there any truth to the rumour that kids who are forced to switch usually stammer. I heard that since I was a teenager but I never stammered.

[angstlessk]

13. it was so many year ago that I read that book, but I do not recall

anything about stammering..maybe because it never affected me, but I just don't recall. I recall that if you are left handed your brain is exactly opposite from the right handed person..so, since your speach and handedness both involve different lobes of the brain I suppose it could affect speach.

[tblue37]

32. See my reply #31 above.n/t

[tblue37]

33. See my reply #31 above.n/t

[eShirl]

43. Hell, my husband's not even 40 yet and the nuns beat his left hand with a ruler

whenever they caught him writing with it.

[Richardo]

2. That is one of the best allegories I've ever seen

Recommended. :thumbsup:

I always like a good 'Bizarro'

[terrya]

84. It certainly is.

I wish I could recommend it, but the 24 hour period is over. :-(

"Bizarro" is one of the best.

[htuttle]

3. Middle Ages??! Try late 1960's in SE Wisconsin!

I was born left handed, but was forced to sit on my left hand while I learned to write with my right hand in the late '60's and early '70's in South Eastern Wisconsin.

I still write sloppily as a result.

We aren't half as evolved as we think we are...

[Fumesucker]

11. My brother is left handed..

Our dad taught him to write with his right hand..

Nowadays his handwriting is better than mine.. :(

[awoke_in_2003]

55. "I still write sloppily as a result"

I still do, too. My father is a lefty, and both me and my sister were. This was the early 70's. Wander when they started doing it? My father was never coerced this way.

[MercutioATC]

4. Historically, the left is religiously "sinister".

Amazing how silly and arbitrary a lot of these things are.

[provis99]

10. yes, lefties are "sinister", and righties are "dextrous".

Even the language is bigoted.

[fudge stripe cookays]

25. You are also "gauche."

Don't forget THAT one!

[Sinistrous]

18. !

[NV Whino]

6. Sinister, it is.

[provis99]

9. my dad used to have his left hand tied to his waist by his teacher

and was forced to write with his right. I'm left-handed too, and still remember my fourth grade teacher telling me I was using the Devil's Hand to write with (this in the 1970s, no less).

But that's Mississippi public education for you. I wonder if they still do it that way down there?

[Lex1775]

12. A lot of us lefties had similar experiences growing up...

My parents tell me that when I was younger they would take things out of my left hand (balls, pencils, toys, etc.) and put them in my right because it never crossed their minds that I could be left handed, even though my grandfather (mother's side) is.
I now write right handed, but with a really hard left handed slant. It used to drive my teachers crazy. I throw right handed but kick left footed. I shoot a rifle left handed but a pistol right handed. I eat left handed but put a beer bottle in front of me and I will reach for it with my right hand. I'm all screwed up... thanks to Leftie Intolerance! Maybe I can sue someone... ;)

[sandsavage]

14. This made me laugh

because it brought back memories.My cousin patty and I sitting in little straight back
chairs,with our left hand tied to our chairs. Little rural school house,kindergarten thru
eighth grade, all in one room. I'm 64 years old.For some reason this being tied down, gave
Patty and I the giggles. So there we sit with tape over our mouths. Made us giggle worse.
Never had a stammer problem. Sloppy writer. Can use both hands. Crackerjack softball player
back in the day. Lefty or righty was a plus.I remember the teachers name. Mrs.Crow, went
bonkers over any kid that was left handed.She was a strange bird.LOL My how things have changed.

[The Straight Story]

17. You should write more here about those times

would love to hear more about what school was like back in your day (and heck, even mine - being as I am 42 now...)

[annabanana]

44. Welcome to DU!

You paint a great picture.. Two little kids with taped mouths and a fit of the giggles...

[Gemini Cat]

15. I write, eat, and bat left handed.

I throw equally bad with either hand.
Piss on people who try to force left handers into using their right.

[Sequoia]

79. I swing a bat, golf club, sweep, mop, write with left hand.

Eat with my right because of mean adults making me do it. I can sew and iron with both hands but I hardly do those tasks anymore. My mom once told me my grandmother tried to get me to switch but I wouldn't. Got called the Devil's daughter a few times. Sheep go to heaven, goats go to hell.

[mrreowwr_kittty]

16. Proud southpaw here.

I'm so "sinister" I even named my cat Southpaw.

[Leftist Agitator]

37. Is that the cat that you burgled?

:)

[mrreowwr_kittty]

64. Yes!

Actually I adopted him when he was a wee little kitty. Either he wandered off or somebody left him in the road and he got run over by a car! He had tire tracks on him when I picked him up from the animal hospital where my friend worked. Luckily for him, he was such a baby that his bones were all cartilage so he had no injuries, save for a little cut by his eye. He's almost 9 years old now.

[Leftist Agitator]

70. That cat was lucky to have someone like you to love him.

I'll bet he has brought a lot of joy into your life.

[PlanetBev]

19. I eat and write with my left hand

but I can only use a scissors with my right hand.

Go figure...:shrug:

[The Straight Story]

20. No need to worry, it is just the devil

:)

[sandsavage]

22. I don't want to

highjack this post. But if someone starts a topic, on what the old timers remember about
how school used to be, I will join in. School was wonderful and so different back then.
Just a newbie and can't start topics yet. I do love this site. Found you when I quit the
Repub party.Been a Lurker for a long time. Love the site and the spirit that dwells here.
Never a dull moment on DU lol

[The Straight Story]

23. Sounds like a good topic to me

Give me a minute to post it.

[Celebration]

45. That;s because scissors are made for right handers n/t

[LanternWaste]

74. messing with my learned behaviors was not the good thing I'd been led to believe...

As a leftie growing up learning how to use scissors right handed, it became second nature to to use them that way.

Then, some years back when the whole Make Things For Left Handed People craze began to blossom, I bought a pair of left-handed scissors. E-gads! The mess I made with that pair of scissors would have made a third grade arts and crafts student dismiss me...

I realized that messing with my learned behaviors was not the good thing I'd been led to believe...

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

21. I wonder if cartoonists will be making cartoons like thats with gay replacing left-handed...

in the year 2600.

Great toon. K&R.

[Richardo]

24. ;-)

[awoke_in_2003]

58. or even worse

a gay southpaw :)

[Aloha Spirit]

60. oh noes! spare the children!

[rpannier]

26. Pround to be #5 rec

[barbtries]

27. the sad thing is

the middle ages were not so very long ago. my mother was left handed born in 1925, and her father tied her left hand behind her back to retrain her to be right handed.

[FreepFryer]

29. Listen - I have nothing against the left-handed as long as they don't try to recruit my kids. (n/t)

[Mad_Dem_X]

50. LOL!

We're everywhere - you can't stop us! ;)

[FreepFryer]

69. I've even enjoyed left-handed piano players (some of the best entertainers are 'that way') n/t

[Dont_Bogart_the_Pretzel]

85. LOL

:)

[Perry Logan]

30. I'm sure the 109th Congress would have made left-handedness illegal, if they'd had the time.

I say this as a lefty, by the way.

My grandmother, who was also left-handed, was raised in Boston. The schools made her tie her left hand behind her back in order to write. Really sinister.

[myrna minx]

36. Perfect analogy. This coming from a sinister, devil handed gal.

:hi:

[klyon]

38. even lefties have rights too

works for me

[mohinoaklawnillinois]

39. My older brother, Tom, was left handed.

My mother got really angry when she found the nun at our Catholic grammar school was forcing him to use his right hand in first grade. She marched up to the school, and gave Sister Whatshername, a real telling off. Both of my grandfather's were left handed, so she knew all about the problems they went through as kids. This happened in 1956.

[annonymous]

40. My father was forced to be right handed in elementary school

Back in the 30's left handedness was discouraged. I am ambidexterous and I drove my first grade teacher crazy because I could finish my schoolwork faster than any other kid in the class. She tried to discourage me from being ambidexterous and encourage me to be right handed so I chose to be left handed just to spite her. My children are both left handed. My mother tried to get me to make both of them use their right hands when eating but I felt it was a lost cause. My brother got yelled at a lot as a child for using his left hand to eat. For some reason, my mother felt using the left hand to eat was improper.

[LeftHander]

41. I approve of this message....

For obvious reasons.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

66. Two obvious reasons, one textual and one pictorial.

:hi:

[raccoon]

42. Nobody ever forced me to write with my right hand, thank goodness.

But it was a pain in the butt that desks, 3-ring binder notebooks, and spiral-bound compositions books were all made for right handed people. And scissors, which out of necessity I learned to use with my right hand.

What chaps my arse is my teachers would get on my case about my handwriting, and I was using a RIGHT-HANDED desk.

On my own, I learned to write with my right hand but it doesn't write as well as my left and doesn't have the control.

[fight4my3sons]

46. one of my twins is a lefty

and I never thought about the desks, 3-ring binders, spiral-bound composition books. I have gotten him scissors that are appropriate to use. Thank you for the insight. He is the only left handed person in the family.

[Celebration]

47. somewhat ambidextrous here

There were plenty of left handers in my school in the 50s and the teachers didn't bother them. I do remember that kids that didn't seem to care were "taught" to be right handed. I probably had a very slight preference for the left hand but was encouraged to be a rightie. As a result, I can easily do mirror writing in script (with my right hand). I can do it almost as fast as regular writing, and both are equally messy.

Can anyone else here easily do mirror writing in script? I truly don't know anyone else that can do this, but I am sure there are people out there that can.

[mcar]

48. I'm a left handed daughter of a left handed mother

I've read that that's about as lefty as you can get .

My mother was the youngest of 13, born during the Depression. The only time her mother stepped in during her education was when the good Sisters tried to make her write right-handed. She told them to leave her alone.

[Mad_Dem_X]

51. Me too!

Mom and I are left-handed, Dad and Sis are righties.

[Mad_Dem_X]

49. Proud to be a lefty!

In every sense of the word. :)

[Harry Monroe]

52. We interrupt this thread for a special paid advertisment

Left handed in a right handed world?? Problems finding left handed implements ?? Visit Flanders Leftorium in Springfield!! He's got answers to all your left handed problems. Located in the Springfield Mall, open 10-9 daily except Sundays.

We now return to you regularly scheduled rants!!

[mr_hat]

54. No TP in the MAs, see?

[dger11]

59. Pedophiles are 3 times more likely to be left-handed.

Good number of left-handed serial killers as well. Lefties tend to have higher spatial intelligence, which makes up for their occasional sinisterness.

[newspeak]

63. oh really?

never heard that one--so, let's see I believe * is left handed and his daddy-the Boston Strangler was left handed, but so was one of the most intelligent men in history, Leonardo Davinci. I'm left handed, have a book on the subject and nowhere does it mention lefties being three times likely to be pedophiles.

[Withywindle]

68. No, * is right-handed, but here's the weird thing.

He's the first right-handed Pres since Carter! Reagan, Bush I, Clinton...all southpaws. (So was Gerald Ford). And our chances of getting another left-handed Pres in 08 are very high, because Obama and McCain both are too.

[SteppingRazor]

71. Here's an article on this phenomenon, which shows that pedophiles are 30 percent more likely...

to be left-handed, not three times more likely.

Still, there is some small correlation. Of course, correlation is not causation.

From the article:
"Although the effects were small, it should be noted that a 5% difference means about a 30% change in NRH (e.g. 15.7% in pedophiles vs. 11.5% in controls).
. . .
In contrast, education is not related to the handedness/pedophilia relationship. Pedophiles had elevated NRH relative to controls with or without controlling for education. This result suggests that, even though pedophiles have a rate of NRH comparable to other offenders (or perhaps slightly higher), there may be a different mechanism underlying the handedness/pedophile relationship than the handedness/(general) criminality relationship. Thus, elevated NRH in pedophiles probably does not merely represent a 'criminal/antisocial behavior' tendency, because of, for example, general cognitive and/or educational difficulties. Instead, these data may indicate that elevated NRH in pedophiles reflects abnormalities that, in part, directly affects their sexual preference systems (see <24> for a review of CNS abnormalities in pedophiles)."

Link: http://www.gnxp.com/blog/2007/02/left-handedness-and-pedophilia-brain.php

[yellerpup]

61. Kick for Dan Pirraro.

[GTurck]

62. I'm a leftie...

and in grade school in Chicago,in the early 50's no less,a fuss was made about it by only one teacher;in the third grade. She insisted that if I could not be "rehabilitated" that I at least have my paper "properly" positioned like the right-handers papers were. When that didn't work - I turn my papers to the right and don't have that curved wrist writing of many left-handers - she made me sit in the back of the class room where I could not see the blackboard because of vision problems. That was to be my punishment; to fail because I couldn't see what was written there. But I was a reader and gave her the awful job of announcing that I had the highest reading average of any student in the entire school district that year. Oh,and that back desk helped my develop a hell of a memory. I would read whole sentences and write them down verbatim or with minimal editing and stayed,in subjects requiring high reading skills,at the top of the class. It was,however,in third grade where my math skills declined because I could not see the equations from that far away.Never have been much of an athlete either. Is that from being a leftie?

[Mnemosyne]

72. We lefties are always in our right mind. And it's very hard to screw. n/t

:evilgrin:

[Spike89]

73. mid 60's school lefty

The nun's tried to make me right handed, my Dad stopped that. Despite the obvious religious connection, he told me her rationalizations were not religious in nature, but practical. He didn't buy those either. As for lefties brains being the opposite of right handed folk, that isn't true. Wiring is similiar but lefties have increased wiring between the hemispheres.

[VotesForWomen]

75. shows how ignorant, superstitious, primitive, and fearful the human race is. nt

[EstimatedProphet]

76. HOW DARE YOU ATTACK LEFT-HANDED PEOPLE!

It is perfectly normal and natural for people to be left-handed! This small-minded nonsense...

Wait. What? It's an allegory, and nothing to do with actual left-handed people?

Oh. My bad.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

77. I'm a lefty, and fortunately, my parents, both of whom were

trained as elementary school teachers, were cool with it.

However, whenever my maternal grandmother saw me writing or drawing left-handed, she'd say, "Couldn't you just TRY doing it right-handed as a special favor to me?"

[stirlingsliver]

78. Bigotry and Prejudice STILL Exist

I am left-handed, and I am always amazed at the bigotry and prejudice that is built in to our culture.

Scissors.

Can Openers.

Watch Band buckles

Computer "Mice"

and on and on and on.....

[coriolis]

80. Yeah, most "handed" tools are geared for righties but there's no bigotry or prejudice involved.

jeez...

[Dont_Bogart_the_Pretzel]

86. I wonder if Steve Jobs is a lefty

since his Macs (Before Mac OSX )only had one button.

[Cleita]

82. Forget the Middle Ages.

When I was in elementary school in the forties, in the last century, all my left handed class mates were forced to use their right hand.

[terrya]

83. You guys DO know this is supposed to be about GLBT people, don't you?

This seems to have flown over quite a few heads in this thread.

[Blue-Jay]

88. I had a cat who was left-handed.

Well...left-pawed, anyhow.

[jdadd]

87. My father was a leftie....

Born in 1913, I was told that an early one room schoolteacher tried to change his writing behavior to right handedness untill my grandmother intervened. Grandma was a former schoolteacher herselfe and had started dad out writing with his left. He did most things left handed with the exception of hammer a nail, which he could do equally well with his right. I was amazed the first time I saw him switch the hammer to his right hand, so he could finish up nailing in a tight corner.