If we had a Draft we would not have Bush's War.

[ThomWV]

You know as well as I do why this war continues, its because the people who fight it are the people who, at least initially, think that fighting wars is somehow 'romantic' or otherwise somehow a desirable thing to do. Draftees rarely think that fighting wars is a romantic or otherwise desirable thing to do - neither do the neighbors, friends, and family of draftees.

The reason the war against Viet Nam ended and the reason we got out military out of there completely is that when people were forced to go to war they ended that war.

Getting rid of the draft was the war mongers wet dream.

[rpannier]

1. I want a draft of people who support scrubs and mcbush's wars

I want it to be mandatory they go first --
Painting your chest with BUSH '04 does not qualify you to get out of going -- nor does working on your dads failed presidential campaign

Watch how fast they drop their support

[ThomWV]

3. Just watch and listen to any Young Republican on TV

They want a war, they want no taxes, they want to stay in school and preach this message to everyone they can, the do not want to serve.

[bowens43]

2. This is a bullshit argument.

It has absolutely no validity. I hate to break it to you but the war in Vietnam went on with US involvement for over tne years and we had a draft.

Your argument is an argument for slavery, nothing more.

[ThomWV]

5. I lived throught those time - my experience tells me that you are dead wrong

I was both in and out of the Army during those 9 years, in fact I served in Viet Nam (as an enlistee) for three of those years. But I was also back in the world and participated in the protests of both the 60's and 70's (before and after I served) and from first hand experience and knowledge of the times I can tell you that you are absolutly wrong. When people participate in events they are concerned about them. That may be too simple for you to grasp, but its true.

[leftofcool]

6. Correct!

As a female, I did not have to serve in Vietnam but my husband did and we both protested before and after he served. You are right in that young people do not have to sacrifice anything for Bush's war so the majority of them do not get involved. You can afford to be apathetic if you don't have to give up anything. A draft would be good if it is fair.....no deferments for rich white ivy league students and draft the young Republicans first.

[Donnachaidh]

11. have we really had a FAIR draft?

I don't think so --

Even in the Civil War, anyone who could cough up 300 bucks could get a deferment (or whatever it was called at the time). The recruits were waiting on the docks for the Irish immigrants, so they could offer them a *fast track to citizenship*. The reality was that most of those young men didn't survive to claim that citizenship.

Look at who is running this war -- *5* Deferment Cheney probably thinks in that fascist head of his that doing this somehow makes up for his *having better things to do* during the Vietnam War.

[leftofcool]

4. If we had a draft..........

college students would actually get off their asses and protest something besides the empty keg at the latest frat party

[NNN0LHI]

7. Yea it sure kept us out of Vietnam real well

Oh, wait a minute.

Don

[ThomWV]

10. Drafts don't keep you out of wars, they get you out of wars.

[NNN0LHI]

13. Actually it won't

Having a draft didn't keep us out of Vietnam.

My experience has shown that there are lots of parents who wouldn't mind giving up one of their kids (especially one with issues) to the war effort. I seen that happening with my own eyes during Vietnam.

I still see that occurring now without a draft.

Two thirds of Vietnam vets volunteered as you did, didn't they?

Don

[liberal N proud]

8. How long did Vietnam carry on with a draft in place?

All a draft does is force people to give up their lives for something the don't believe in.
With a volunteer military at least those who join know that they may be called to fight and have given up the right willingly to fight what ever war is waged.

[ThomWV]

9. If there had been no draft we would still be there, and with no draft we will be in Iraq for 100 yrs

McCain is right.

[raccoon]

20. I agree with you on both those points.

I believe if there had been a draft before the invasion of Iraq, either the invasion would never have happened, or we would have pulled the troops out of there ages ago.

[MinM]

12. Absolutely. Those YAFers pushing for war...

would be singing a different tune with the prospect of having to put their own precious butts on the line.

Not to mention the potential stigma of avoiding service down the road. Although they could still be tagged with the 'Chickenhawk' label.

:kick: & R

[midnight]

14. If we had a congress that followed the law we wouldn't have bush.

He would be impeached.

[TheCowsCameHome]

15. The occupation would end in a month if Repuke kids had to go over there.

[NNN0LHI]

17. Problem is their kids won't have to go over there

No more than my kids ever would.

If I was looking at one of my kids or grandchildren being drafted I would spend the money to build up a medical case so they would not get drafted and maybe killed while guarding oil pipelines for EXXON. Take that to the bank.

And I am not wealthy. Wealthy Republicans would do the same. So who is left to draft? Disadvantaged kids. Thats all.

Avoiding a draft is not rocket science. A draft just gives some parents an easy way out to let someone else be responsible for raising one of their kids.

Don

[TheCowsCameHome]

18. I agree to a large extent.

But the worry of having to somehow get your kid off the hook would scare the crap out of many parents - enough to have a groundswell of protests over the whole damn mess we're in.

Right now as long as there are volunteers doing the job, the rest of the country goes on about their business fat, dumb, and happy.

[NNN0LHI]

19. As I said above a draft would not be bad idea to some parents

Gives them an easy way out. The family next door where I grew up had a drug addicted son with psychiatric problems who they could not wait to have him drafted. They thought it would straighten him out. It didn't. He died in a VA hospital a few years later.

Last year I had a friend of the family telling me how she is trying to talk her son who she is having trouble (no details) with into enlisting. I know the truth is she wants to be able to sit in a tavern without being bothered with him. I looked at her like she was the devil.

I am sure these aren't the only cases like this out there.

Don

[KharmaTrain]

16. If Vietnam Were That Simple

First of all...this war for profit would have been waged, draft or no draft, as it meant big contracting money. The game plan was to send in our military to take the place over and have the contractors run the place. When things got out of hand, then our military goes in with the helicopter gunships and heavy armour and make it "safe" for the contractors to do whatever they do. What's gone wrong is the Iraqis haven't played along with the con. They were supposed to take the money and shut up..."no one expected" an uprising as this regime honestly felt it could buy itself "peace" and the money would smooth over any opposition. This regime still believes it.

The first draft protests against the Vietnam war were in '65...almost immediately after our first troops went in. The draft kept going strong for the next 6 years. It didn't officially end until after our troops came home in '73 and many of us who were "of age" at the time (I got my draft card in 1974) were very concerned that if things went sour in Vietnam, we'd be going back.

The reason we got out of Vietnam was that our military and politicians realized the war had been lost...some 50,000 plus dead Americans afterthefact. Protests to the draft helped make the war unpopular, but it sure didn't end the war any sooner.

[Balbus]

21. Everything must be so simple when you look at the world through the eyes of a 7-year-old.

Either that, or you're not very bright.

[Javaman]

22. Here we go again...

:popcorn: like some?

[yellerpup]

23. All we have to do to end the war

is bounce the check to Halliburton.

Edit for clarity

[tuckessee]

24. An easier way is for people to stop kissing troop ass. n/t

[PsN2Wind]

25. The draft

along with a surtax on ALL forms of income, in order to pay the cost of the war as its being waged, and very strict laws on profiteering would have us out of there yesterday.