Rolling Cigarettes, and Musing on the Commons and Sin Taxes...

[catnhatnh]

That's what I'm doing tonight. I'm a smoker, but on SS disability I can no longer afford to buy "factory" cigarettes-Marlboros cost over $40 a carton here and I smoke more than a carton a week.Instead,I buy tobacco by the pound and papers (actually tubes) and roll my own-after the cost of the rolling machine the cost is under $11 per carton.
There are those (called puritans) who figure the smoking caused my problem. They would be wrong-my problems are two-fold, an industrial accident that crushed three discs and a mind-set that endorses sin taxes.Sin taxes of course is the framing used to punish behavior frowned on by those who enjoy feeling morally superior.They apply to people who smoke, or drink, or gamble.New Hampshire is discussing raising the tax on cigarettes by 25 cents a pack...about $150 dollars a year if I still could afford the manufactured ones.
I want you to think about that...my total habit now at near cost is about $15 a week, or call it $600 per year...but if I smoke a "major brand" my cost would be $60 per week and over $3000 dollars a year and about a quarter of my SS.And they want to raise it $150 per year...
There is another class of people.They make what the Bush government calls "middle class" but the receive 10 times (or some times 20 times) what I do.They are less prone to smoke than I am...they were raised different-they have doctors and a support system and the cost of treatment or therapy means little to them.They have browsed at the commons and done better than I. If they provide 20 times more we could argue parity.But even If they do-why are we all charged the same regardless of ability to pay?
If tomorrow a diner cut a pie and left pieces of 1/2 and 1/4 and 1/8 and 1/16 and then 2 pieces of 1/32 should each be priced the same? Because that is the premise in this country-it matters not which piece you are served-not only is the price the same-the guy who gets the half of the pie-well it would be wrong to even charge more for the part he wants to give away BECAUSE IT IS MORE THAN HE CAN EAT IN HIS LIFETIME...
But tommorow, new sin taxes will be passed because smoking, and drinking, and gambling are "wrong" but that doesn't even begin to explain why fourth generation Duponts are safe from paying dime for dime the percentage of taxes I do...

[bbinacan]

1. Smokers unite.

I've been thinking about rolling my own. Can you offer some advice on the best method? :smoke:

[The Straight Story]

2. There are some really good machines for fairly cheap to get

http://www.ryotobacco.com/page/ryot/CTGY/rollmach

Premier makes some nice ones.

I can get a 1 lb of smoke for $15-$16 and 2 cartons of tubes w/filters for $1.99/carton. 1lb makes about 2.5 cartons.

Drop in tobacco, stick a tube one, pull lever. Done :)

[htuttle]

3. Personally, I prefer the experience of rolling them by hand

I find that I'm just fine with a cigarette about 1/2 the size of 'standard' ones.

Of course, when I smoke them in public, they tend to look like a joint...leading to many hilarious situations, given my pony tail and beard...:eyes:

[bbinacan]

4. Thanks a lot. n/t

[catnhatnh]

5. Ok...cause your a smoker...

my bitch is actually more about why "sin" is highly taxed and "wealth" isn't.First of all, find a place that sells "discount" cigarettes...Buy the most expensive cigarette machine they have-the cheap ones break every other week...mine cost about $35.It has made over 40 cartons of cigarettes, so if it broke tomorrow, my per carton cost increase would be minimal.Up this way a pound of tobacco is about $14 and makes close to 2 cartons of regulars or slightly less than that in 100's.Tobacco tubes here come in packs of 200-a cartons worth...regulars are $3 per box and menthols $4 and there is a difference.If your really considering this, save your empty packs for a week. They sell cigarette holders but empty boxes are free and more comfortable.The ones you roll yourself (once you get used to the task) will probably leave a small void at the tip of the filter tube.This is OK since they actually tend to burn longer, which is a huge benefit if you smoke as you drive or chain smoke at any time.Any questions don't hesitate to ask or PM...best of luck.

[bbinacan]

6. Thanks for the info. n/t

[The Straight Story]

10. Sadly, because many on the left have jumped on board the bandwagon

Sin went from something religious to something social.

If you smoke you are sinning against society and it's goals. From health care to pollution.

We have lost the balance between personal freedoms and society's needs. Between individuals (like bar owners and their patrons) to make decisions affecting them as adults as an example - and replaced it with something else (the ability for people who don't do as you do to be able to go to the same place, so now all places must be the same in case anyone is offended).

We have come to limiting choice because we believe we must please all - so it is no wonder our candidates reflect that as well :)

[Oeditpus Rex]

13. If you buy American Spirit tobacco

you won't get the 400-odd chemical additives that are in Big Tobacco smokes.

Everywhere you look, they say, "No additives in our tobacco does NOT mean a safer cigarette," but I figure that's just legal CYA. How could they not be safer? Hell, my freakin' doctor recommended 'em to me. :shrug:

They're also quite a "green" company, and their customer service is excellent.

http://www.nascigs.com/

[Garbo 2004]

7. This online site has a lot of info, reviews etc.

http://www.ryomagazine.com/

[Ghost in the Machine]

8. I've been rolling my own since I was given a rolling machine for my birthday back in Feb..

My smoking costs went from $10/day buying 3 packs/day to $15/week for enough tobacco & tubes to roll 2+ cartons. 1 bag of tobacco & 1 box of tubes costs me $7.52 with tax and all. I buy the Teton Mild brand from Wind River Tobacco Company out of Jackson Hole, Wyoming..

http://www.wrtco.com/products_teton.html

I'd suggest this to anyone and everyone who smokes. It doesn't take long to roll a few packs, or even a carton, and it saves you a TON of money..

PEACE!

Ghost

[Two Americas]

9. the point of the OP

The point the OP is trying to make has nothing to do directly with personal individualized "solutions," but we have been thoroughly trained to think in that way by the relentless barrage of libertarian propaganda about "personal responsibility" and "personal choices."

This has severe political consequences. Whenever anyone relates their personal experience we start giving out personal solutions. Whenever anyone talks about politics, we act as mere observers and analysts as though we were historians viewing it all from hundreds of years in the future. The personal and the public are in this way kept strictly segregated, and that renders all of our political discussions and arguments weak and ineffective.

When someone says they are poor, rather than going after the predators, rather than talking about political solutions to social problems, we analyze the poor person, find fault with them, give them advice, see them as the problem, and see all possible solutions as being in the realm of "personal responsibility" and personal choice."

In this way, most modern liberals are really libertarians, no matter what "positions" on "issues" we might take. "Positions" on "issues" have nothing to do with reality, cost us nothing, and gain us nothing. We cannot connect our politics to real people, and we cannot connect the experiences of individual people to our politics. We have no politics. We have libertarianism with an "organic" label slapped on it for show.

[catnhatnh]

11. I think you get it,Though I wrote it poorly....

Libertarian to me is what I learned in the service-F you buddy, I got mine.The post was supposed to be more about the paradox of the commons and the drain on those commons by the elite.I am way too old and slow but I was trying to show that fees and taxes that never even blip on the uberclasses screen eat 30% or better of each nickle of their "lessers"...

[Redneck Socialist]

12. I wish we could recommend individual posts.

because yours is worth of it.

[Two Americas]

14. thanks

I appreciate that, Redneck Socialist.

[Prophet 451]

15. Believe it or not, you're lucky

Tobacco costs an average of about £5 (ten dollars) an ounce here and three-quarters of that is taxes. Gambling tax is 9%, paid on stake or winnings (better's choice). Booze is difficult to work out since beer is still served by the pint here. Top tax rate here is 40% (plus 11% National Insurance, our version of Social Security).

That said, the majority of those taxes go towards funding universal healthcare.