How to Talk about McCain's Age

[marmar]

from OurFuture.org:



How to Talk about McCain's Age
By Bernie Horn

May 4th, 2008 - 11:11pm ET


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My wife warned me not to write about John McCain’s age. “You’ll get busted by the PC police,” she said. Well, I’m guilty, but with an explanation.

* Fact: If elected, John McCain, who turns 72 in August, would be the oldest person ever elevated to president. Ronald Reagan was a spry 69 when first elected.
* Fact: Voters are fully aware of McCain’s advanced age. He looks a lot older than Reagan ever did.
* Fact: Voters generally consider advanced age to be a perfectly legitimate issue. And they will in this general election.

So shouldn’t progressives talk about it? Yes, but the message frame isn’t “geezer.” We progressives don’t discriminate on the basis of age. If McCain is physically and mentally fit to hold our nation’s highest office, we won’t deny it to him on the basis of longevity. But just because we oppose ageism doesn’t mean we should ignore what voters are thinking.

Let’s start with a February 2008 CBS News/New York Times poll which asked, “In general, what is the best age for a president of the United States: in their 30s, in their 40s, in their 50s, in their 60s, or in their 70s?" Here’s the answer:

30s 40s 50s 60s 70s Unsure
2% 20% 48% 18% 2% 10%

A 70-something just isn’t the voters’ ideal president. It’s not that voters dislike old people. It’s that they look at such a candidate and think: (1) his health might fail while in office, and (2) he might be out of touch with contemporary issues and attitudes. In fact, DNC-sponsored focus groups found that voters volunteer exactly those concerns about McCain.

Here’s where progressives need to understand framing. All of us carry preconceptions, stereotypes and pictures in our heads which we use to make sense of new information. In fact, people can apply more than one stereotype to just about any person, policy, or situation. A child who runs into a burning home to save the family cat can be framed as “brave” or “reckless.” Voters will think about McCain’s age—the question is what preconception or frame they will use to pass judgment on it. .........(more)

The complete piece is at: http://www.ourfuture.org/blog-entry/how-talk-about-mccains-age

[Tangerine LaBamba]

1. His age v. his health

Sure, his age is an issue. It has to be. In the real world, he'd have been forced to retire seven years ago. Now, he's looking for a new job. Does that make sense?

Sorry, but I've had a lot of experience working with senior citizens, and the truth is that you're not, at 72, as good as you were even five years earlier, let alone twenty years earlier. Everything is slower, everything disengages more easily, more quickly, and the progression of that - let us call it - deterioration is not reversible.

I'm far more concerned with his history as a melanoma patient. Not releasing his medical records is mighty suspicious. Melanoma is the sneaky cancer. It grows inward, not giving a hint of its presence, and then it burst outward, and that's usually when it's Stage IV, and, as an oncologist once told me, "There is no Stage V."

That they're concealing his medical records should be very troubling to anyone who's considering voting for him. Of course, if you're considering voting for him, a rational matter like his health probably wouldn't mean much to you, because you're already irrational.

[klook]

17. When's the cancer coming back?

I agree with you. I hate to be so blunt about it, but there's a real good chance he'll have a relapse, possibly fatal, while in office. This dogged Paul Tsongas as well, as many will recall. He declared he was cancer-free during the '92 primaries. Five years later he was dead a month shy of his 56th birthday.

[Tangerine LaBamba]

39. That's right

And he had non-Hodgkin's lymphoma, which is a dangerous cancer, but nowhere nearly as insidious as melanoma.

Even if I were a Republican (pause of long, hysterical scream), I wouldn't vote for him, simply because of his medical history and the games they're playing about being open with the facts.

I had a good friend with melanoma. Surgery, five rounds of chemotherapy and radiation. He was fine. One weekend, he went hiking with his kids; the next weekend, he died.

That's how melanoma works.

[liberal N proud]

2. We are talking about the President of the United States

Age does matter. There is the physical aspect coupled with the mental aspect and he is too fucking old.

Race, religion and gender should never be mentioned but health and mental condition which both can be effected by age must be part of the equation when selecting the next commander in chief.

He is too fucking old.

[phantom power]

3. If McCain was elected, his probability of dying would be 14% over 4 years.

It would be 25% over 8 years. That's using aggregate statistics for 72-year-old males. Obviously he would have better health care than average, although you could make an issue of that.

[Ichingcarpenter]

4. The Age Factor -What Learning Research Tells Us About Candidates

By; Robert Epstein is a former editor in chief of Psychology Today. His column, "The Skeptical Psychologist," appears regularly in Skeptic magazine. His most recent book is "The Case Against Adolescence: Rediscovering the Adult in Every Teen." Now a resident of California, Epstein was born and raised in Hartford.



The first part of the article is equally important so don't miss that part.
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SNIP >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
So who would make the best president? Well, other things being equal, the answer depends on what kind of world you think is coming over the next four to eight years. If the challenges you expect us to face are similar to those we're facing now, the more experience the president has, the better. If you envision radically new challenges turning up any time soon — events like the 9/11 attack, for example — inexperience wins the day.

And then there's the elephant in the room, one that's so big and so scary that I hesitate to point it out. Although, as I've said, research reveals both advantages and disadvantages to experience, it's far from forgiving about age, especially when people are as old as John McCain. A recent brain scanning study, for example, shows that brain size peaks at age 14 and that by the time we're 70, our brain has shrunk to the size it was when we were 3.

And lest you think that we cram increasing brain power into that constantly shrinking brain, consider: Raw scores on intelligence tests peak between ages 13 and 15, and most kinds of memory also function best during our teens. The bottom line is that as we age, it gets increasingly harder for us to learn and master new material, which is why so many baby boomers spend so much time kicking their computers.

When you factor disease into the picture, things look even worse. By age 85, nearly half of Americans have Alzheimer's, a devastating destroyer of cognitive abilities that can creep up gradually over a period of many years. A president in his 70s, Ronald Reagan was suffering from signs of the disease during his second term, and his memory problems were severe within three years of the time he left.

So just how experienced — and how old — do you want your president to be?

http://www.courant.com/news/opinion/commentary/hc-commentaryepstein0504.artmay04,0,2902271.story

[EarlG]

5. K&R - great article

I don't really have a problem going after McCain on his age, but the author's approach is far more elegant. If your message is that John McCain is out of touch, the mental picture that voters have of McCain - of a codger - strongly reinforces that message. It's much less dubious than calling him an old coot to his face. Picture him in a debate with either Clinton or Obama and imagine them constantly referring to him as out of touch while he stands there looking all grizzled and curmudgeonly.

John McCain is out of touch...



John McCain is out of touch...



John McCain is out of touch...



Lol.

[eridani]

28. The third is the best. Not only does it tie him to Bush

--but it shows him being shorter than Bush and more than a little hunched over.

[Kurovski]

29. McCain appears to be in touch with Bush's need for physical affection.

That's so beautiful. Groove, my brothers and sisters.

[Laurab]

42. It could be that he just fell asleep right into Bush's arms, too.

Which is pretty romantic, if you think about it. I haven't!

[Kurovski]

44. Nap time is important when one is past the century mark.

Romance is all about trust. I'm always thinking about it.

Filthy warmongering shitbags need love, too.

[Laurab]

45. Oh I know you are, we discussed your love behind your back

in the DUzy thread, and it was such an inspiration.

Filthy warmongering shitbags DO need love, and I'm so glad those two found it - and that we have the photo to prove it! I've heard they sleep well, too. It's just so...nauseating.

[Marr]

6. McCain's age will be a very effective issue once he's chosen a running mate.

McCain is (wrongly, of course) perceived as a moderate. If he doesn't want to completely drive off his loony base, he cannot choose a running mate who is more moderate than his *image*. On the other hand, if he chooses one of the tried-and-true fascists in an attempt to appeal to his base, then that lunatic's potential presidency upon McCain's death will be a frightening prospect. And if he goes with an unknown, there goes his whole "experience" line. Grandpa dies in his sleep and we get President Noob?

[blondeatlast]

7. GREAT article! We needed the "out of touch" meme in 2004--there will NEVER be a better time

for it than in the GE campaign.

I would recommend that every DUer read this and respond!

K&R

[blondeatlast]

8. Every DUer needs to read this and respond--2 more votes gets it lots of visibility! nt

[Kansas Wyatt]

9. Grand Pappy McSame

Even more senile than Ronnie 'Shoot One of Those Big Babies Off' RayGun. Reagan Administration dejavu.... The Bush Crime Syndicate raping and pillaging the Good Ole' USA, under an Old Coot's Watch.

[goclark]

22. Being a Senior I feel qualified to speak

I am a Senior and I don't have any problem with understanding old age. The other day a friend sent me a postcard that represents exactly how I feel inside everyday, the card says....

"Masquerading as a normal person day after day is exhausting!"

Regarding McCain ~ If I feel old and I am retired, I can only imagine how afraid he is to take on this schedule.

He will be on vacation more day than GW. GW was always tucked in bed by nine and they let him slide. He wasn't in bed, he was drunk.

We would have " More of the Same with McCain"

Back to McCain.....

Just the visual of that picture with him hugging Bush is a mind stopper.

We should show his love of Bush every five minutes.

And to think that Rev. Wright got all the attention!

You can't get much more love than that photo between two males.
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"Fired Up! Ready to Go!" implies that the leader is capable of moving in a swift manner.

I love this post!

The Democratic Nominee should be out with his/her family and playing basketball and jogging and stepping out of his car with black sun glasses, without assistance.

One of the things that helped JFK get elected was his family. They just kept coming from every angle and they were all YOUNG and VIBRANT.

Please put some real joy in the WH again.

[marmar]

10. 2 More Recs Kick!

:kick:

[blondeatlast]

11. I can't rec anymore but I can do my best to see that everyone sees this--it's a valuable discussion

and strategy.

[blondeatlast]

12. One last kick before I sign off; please read this, DU! nt

[GardeningGal]

13. One thing the article forgot to mention.....

bomb bomb bomb bomb bomb Iran

[treestar]

35. That should re looped as often if not more than Rev. Wright

Since it is not, that proves the media is not "liberal."

[Stinky The Clown]

14. Off to the Greatest with ya ............

[kath]

15. Anna Quindlen wrote a good column on this issue a while back:

http://www.newsweek.com/id/105554/page/2
How Old is Too Old?


I'm aware that there are women and men who perform brilliantly at arduous jobs far past the time the rest of us would be phoning it in or tuning it out. But the job McCain seeks is like no other, in its demands and its import. It's significant that while the old mandatory retirement age of 65 has been largely junked, there are still age limits for jobs like airline pilot or police officer, the kinds of jobs that require some of the same skills as the presidency—unwavering mental acuity and physical energy.

Political operatives say that his age makes McCain's choice of a running mate particularly critical. But if you enter the process stressing a hedge against mortality or incapacity, shouldn't that suggest something about suitability for the job in the first place? The senator's pursuit of the presidency reminds me a bit of those women who decide to have a baby in their late 50s. The impulse is understandable, the goal possible. But, looking at all the facts, and the actuarial tables, is it really sensible?

[opihimoimoi]

16. Age impacts on performance.....from whart I have seen..he ain't doing too well.

We need fresh minds w fresh ideas and concepts...all this Pub Crap over the years have not yeilded shit....not good shit but actually Bad Shit...

Age is a Factor...

[struggle4progress]

18. Is it fair to make a big deal of the fact that McCain is an crazy old Bush-snuggling war-monger?

[SoCalDem]

19. We use it via "left-handed" praise

"....fully honor his sacrifice, as a young ADULT... FIFTY ONE YEARS AGO/HALF A CENTURY AGO..."

"...began serving in congress when Obama was still in school..."

"...tough competitor...he's survived multiple bouts of cancer..."

[eppur_se_muova]

20. " ... for someone his age." " ... considering his age."

(Oh, and every now and then, pop out a "McThuselah" for the Hell of it!:evilgrin:)

[blondeatlast]

33. The fine art of the backhanded compliment is vastly underrated

as to its effectiveness and vastly underused in the public arena.

You nailed it, SoCal. :thumbsup:

[treestar]

36. The second one is a little dangerous

It makes McLame sound more experienced. Which he actually is. It's just that the question is "experienced at what?"

[phiddle]

21. Humor is an effective weapon

James Carville (I detest him, but he's funny) said recently (paraphrasing): "Either of our Democratic candidates would answer the 3 AM phone call. At 3 AM John McCain will be looking for the bathroom!"

[Ichingcarpenter]

23. Pain effected Kennedy so much he changed Doctors

That he saw his medication was affecting his thought (did I use those terms right?)

I have pain and deal with it in the evening as I have confessed


McCain has pain, you can see by the way he walks
He an't doing pot, that's for sure, and you know
he is taking pain killers because it is easy to observe.

[Generic Brad]

24. You have made me think of a question I would like to ask McCain

If he is elected president, will he stop collecting Social Security benefits?

[DFW]

25. How to talk about McCain's age? Have a calculator ready, first off.

[Voice for Peace]

26. What scares me is

who will they have waiting in place as VP?

[GoddessOfGuinness]

27. Ghosts from the past...

I went to high school with the author of this excellent piece.

Nice to know he's doing good things.

[eridani]

30. At 72, some are sharp and fit, and others really losing capacity

Reagan's incipient Alzheimers wasn't visible--he was pretty fortunate in the department of bone health. I say as many pictures of McCain with a side view as possible. Harp on the missing medical records thing.

There is also the "temperament" issue. I'd stay away from using the word "character" with respect to an ex-POW. However, I think there should be a special 527 dedicated to hiring people to bring up the "did you ever call your wife a c**nt in public" issue. Also it might pay to bring up the fact that his wife is seldom seen with him, and she doesn't have the Judy Steinberg excuse of being a busy country doctor. And why would he dump his first wife just for being in a car accident?

[ColbertWatcher]

31. Age vs. Accessibility

If this is about framing and how to avoid the "age-frame", we need to change the focus from age to accessibility.

McCain's age is of no consequence.

It is his accessibility that is at issue.

It is not to which generation he belongs, but whether he can represent all of America, without alienating his donors.

It is not McCain's age that makes him unable to relate to mainstream America, it is his inability to define himself without countless explanations. How many times has he made a clear, lucid comments just to contradict them the very next day? This is not due to age, but due to his desire to appear accessible to certain demographics, specifically the ones who control the purse strings of his campaign.

What characteristics appeal to voters is not whether McCain seems like a many ready to die, but a man able to fight for the American people instead of giving in to his wealthy donors, lobbyist friends and the policy makers in his party.

[blondeatlast]

34. Matt Iaabi (sp?) was discussing the contradiction aspect on "countdown"

yesterday. This is an issue that isn't at all new with McSame (the Return of W!); it's been a problem since he became a Representative back in the day.

His ridiculous notion that he didn't know it was unethical to ride on a private jet for a meeting with a powerful banking executive (Keating) is a stellar example of his nonstop doubletalk. It was lauged at in the AZ press when he said it, but damn if he didn't get away with it.

So many weaknesses in this candidate--why are we afraid to go head on at him?

[ColbertWatcher]

46. What we have to do is...

....define the opponent succinctly.

Yes, he has so many weaknesses, but how to nail that to him as simply as possible so that it will stick even if we are threatened and made to be afraid?

I believe McCain is not trust worthy, based on how he has altered his convictions the day after forcefully stating them.

McCain's next-day explanations are not a question of "flip-flopping". No one really has a problem with people changing their minds. What is happening with McCain is more deceptive than a sincere change of mind or even "clarification".

And it is not something that can be explained away by his age either.

From his opposition to Webb's GI bill to campaign finance to torture, McCain has consistently moved from his self-proclaimed "straight-talking maverick" to "loyal party operative".

This reminds everyone of those debates in Congress where votes were going one way, but after a closed-door meeting or a long night out of the view of CSPAN, the vote is suddenly and inexplicable the opposite of what was previously declared. The new results of this extended vote benefits the industry which was the subject of the bill, who then goes on to reward everyone who fell in line with lobbying positions after retirement or with donations for re-election.

McCain may genuinely want to support Webb's bill, and run an honest campaign and he may be--more than anyone else--the one person who believes America is a nation that does not condone torture. But after every opportunity he has had to back up his assertions with action, not only has he failed to do so, but he does so in such a way that it is completely in sync with what his party's bosses have already pre-determined for their constituency, put in motion through the current administration (and complicit members of Congress) and desperately want to maintain through another GOP White House in order to stay in power.

McCain is simply another piece of the GOP political machine. His problem is he wants the prestige of the office; he believes it is the rightful place for the son of a Navy admiral. Who knows, maybe there are people pumping up his confidence with dreams of real leadership he has yet to demonstrate.

In order to achieve the ultimate prize, McCain has sadly, by degrees, given up any integrity he may have brought with him to Washington; he compensates for his lack of political savvy and true leadership with appeasement to his party's bosses.

His next-day explanations are a reflection of his place in the machine and not his leadership of his party.

McCain knows he is in debt to party operatives--not voters--for his position as presumptive nominee and will behave accordingly.

Our government is based on checks and balances and justice and accountability, none of which will matter to John McCain, who seems to be on a path to continue the plan his party has set in motion at the expense of anything the voters may demand.

McCain may say otherwise, but give him a day, that will change.

[MiniMe]

32. Maybe he'll start farting during campaign speeches

That should put a focus on it.

[JustABozoOnThisBus]

37. My friends, pull my finger, my friends.

:rofl:

[MiniMe]

38. LOL

Too funny!

[zorahopkins]

40. This Creeps Me Out

I am an older woman.

And this article just creeps me out.

Suppose the question were this "In general, what is the best gender for a president of the United States: male or female?"

And then suppose the author were to write this: "It's not that voters dislike women. It’s that they look at such a candidate and think: (1) her "hormones" might interfere while in office, and (2) she might be out of touch with tough issues."

I don't think (or, rather, I would hope) that none of us would tolerate "framing" around the pre-conceptions sexists carry about women.

So why should we tolerate "framing" around what ageists think?

Like I said, this article really creeps me out.

[TexasObserver]

41. I'll say it. McCain is too old to be president.

Anyone who is over 50 years old and says they have not lost a step mentally is kidding himself or herself. Our contemplative skills may be better than ever, but we, as humans, do lose mental acuity as we age. I don't know ANYONE over 70 I would want to be president.

The office taxes even the most healthy. McCain is old, he's not in great health, and I can't imagine his getting better in the next four years. He already can't remember today the thing they had to correct him on yesterday.

[hootinholler]

43. Um isn't the proper way to speak in sanskrit?

Maybe the ancient language the cavemen spoke.

-Hoot