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Goodnevil Donating Member (260 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-05-08 09:42 PM
Original message
A Campfire in the North
Edited on Mon May-05-08 10:10 PM by Goodnevil
My wife and I are somewhat unusual people. We are vegans and are what much of society would categorize as “Wiccans.” We are intellectuals and we are open-minded. We are, for lack of a better phrase, uber-liberals.

We have found no foothold in this country for our belief systems. American corporate culture and it's insistant way of life are almost deliberately, it seems, set up to oppose us in our everyday lives. We struggle constantly to find middle ground with the rest of this nation only to find it a pointless battle. We do not find it to be as diverse as the media would label it. To be sure, we have found no contentment in being “American.”

I know that there are no perfect nations and that each state on this planet has its’ negative and positive aspects depending on who you are and what you stand for. There are, however, still choices out there on this small little planet for an enterprising and fearless individual or family. I grow weary of the constant religious intolerance embedded in our culture, the lack of foresight by our leaders, the belligerent (ineffectually so) nature of our people when faced with any problems internationally. I despise the American sensibility of mass consumption and waste. I loathe the fact that I pay large portions of my income to a government which provides no useful and tangible services in return.

Something has happened recently which, while I knew it was always possible, nevertheless shocked me into re-evaluating my thinking about what I want for myself and for my wife and son. My employer was unable or unwilling to offer health insurance at a reasonable price which I could afford. Private health care through multiple companies refused to offer health insurance to my wife (a type II diabetic) and my son (who has a mild and easily treatable colon disorder) due to preexisting conditions. We have been forced to put my son on state run insurance while my wife has no insurance at all. I have been able to purchase private coverage through Blue Cross Blue Shield simply because I rarely see doctors enough to “get” a pre-existing condition.

My government and the very people with whom I share a country have told me, in effect, that my wife’s life and health do not matter. My countrymen have told me by de facto that my son’s health is irrelevant because he does not fit into the system. I have a college degree from the University of Texas at Austin and seven years experience in the corporate world from which I have narrowly avoided being outsourced several times. I have worked harder than most to make a life for my family. My wife is working a full time job and attending college, taking twenty-one hours with a 4.0 average and we still are not considered worthy enough to survive.

I ask you all, my fellow Americans, why I should care about this Union or it’s citizens? Why should I stay here with all of this “opportunity?” Why should I not take up arms against this country should I dwell in another and swear allegiance to it’s flag and people if those same people are willing to call me brother and care for me and my family?

I ask you, what are nations but the latest evolution of a few hairless creatures huddling by a primeval fire in search of comfort from the wild and the dangers of this brutal and dangerous world? Isn’t that why we form groups and societies? I state plainly that if there is no fire and you are all not my comrades against the cold of the night and the claws of the wolves then why am I here in this land in the first place? Why do I huddle around your fire for warmth when there is one across the valley in sore need of warriors?

My pack, my tribe, my village, my city-state, my kingdom, my empire, my nation-state, and my super-power has told me that I do not belong and that I am not needed. My people have, in no uncertain terms, advised me that I am on my own and that it is every man and woman for his or herself. Very well, who am I to argue?

These are the thoughts that have ran through my troubled mind over the past few weeks since that rather snide insurance underwriter told me at 8 a.m. on a Monday morning that my wife’s health and well-being was financially inconvenient to their company. I have decided, therefore, that I will not blame the United States government for my woes. I will not blame Bush and I will not blame the next fool who takes command of this death ship. I won’t blame each and every one of you patriots of the glorious experiment and the great City on the Hill. You are mostly fools and as such cannot be blamed for your stupidity…merely treated as any village idiot, that is, coddled in your ignorance and fed just enough to be kept alive.

I will blame no one, but I can take responsibility, as the conservatives constantly push us to do, for myself and my family. I will do the responsible thing and remove them and myself from this unfortunate situation called the United States of America. As soon as it is humanly possible we will emigrate to Canada. We will take our chances with their “inferior” medical care, lack of I-phone coverage and their small military and we will be happy.

I blame none of you for this debacle, but do not presume to ever knock on my door asking for asylum because there will never be any forgiveness in my heart for any of you. We will not share a fire together and we will not share a beer reminiscing about “Friends” and “Seinfeld” and “Star Wars.” My wife and son were not welcome at your hearth now and none of you will be welcome at mine on some day in the future across that far northern border.

I do not forgive any of you for this Grand Failure on the Hill. I will never forgive myself for this failure, either.
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Goodnevil Donating Member (260 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-05-08 09:44 PM
Response to Original message
1. quick bump
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supernova Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-05-08 09:47 PM
Response to Original message
2. That kind of bitterness will destroy you
I can understand being frustrated enough to move to Canada but the hardness you carry in your heart right now will only eat you alive and do nothing to the people who have caused our situation.
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Goodnevil Donating Member (260 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-05-08 09:56 PM
Response to Reply #2
6. I hear you
but I'm really not bitter, just resolved to find a better life. I'm more disappointed in our people than anything else. Ultimately, I just think this is a wiser choice. How many Romans would have chosen to stay in Rome while it was being sacked?
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HeresyLives Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-05-08 09:49 PM
Response to Original message
3. You are welcome to share
our campfire. I'm across that river in Canada, and I hope you can join us soon.
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orleans Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-05-08 09:49 PM
Response to Original message
4. well, for what it's worth--welcome to DU.
i lived outside montreal for awhile (years ago)

it was beautiful. people were wonderful.

stay close enough to the campfire and let it warm your heart.

it will be alright.

everything will be alright. eventually.

(i really believe that--otherwise i'd go crazy)
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Goodnevil Donating Member (260 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-05-08 10:03 PM
Response to Reply #4
9. Thanks for the welcome
I'm getting a second bachelors in Environmental Health Science which is very transferable to Canada. My wife will work on her masters and we will leave.
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orleans Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-05-08 10:13 PM
Response to Reply #9
13. Environmental Health Science? that sounds wonderful
what does that cover/get into?

i wish my daughter would show some interest in environmental studies.

(she's a theater major)

i keep thinking she could still combine environment w/theater.

it seems difficult to find schools that offer such a thing.
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Goodnevil Donating Member (260 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-05-08 10:19 PM
Response to Reply #13
14. Well
Basic and advances hard sciences like chem, phys and biol/microbiology. Also, environmental planning, epidemiology, environmental regulations, organic chem, water reservoir managment, environmental geology, entomology, hydrology, limnology and mammalian and pathogenic microbiology. Cool stuff! Awesome global job opportunities in private consulting and government regs. Need some certs but otherwise a piece of cake. Don't even need calculus :)
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orleans Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-05-08 10:24 PM
Response to Reply #14
15. it sounds wonderful to me. (oh, to be younger and back in school...) n/t
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gateley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-05-08 09:49 PM
Response to Original message
5. I'm so sorry that happened -- and
heartbroken and furious that that's the reality of "health care" in the United States.

I've heard nothing but praise about Canada's health care system, and I just may be right on your heels!

Take care. :hug:
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Glorfindel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-05-08 10:02 PM
Response to Original message
7. I'd follow you in a second, with no hesitation, if I could stand the cold
Alas, I'm a creature of the warm southern climes, and the frosty north holds no allure for me. Good luck in all your future endeavors!
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Goodnevil Donating Member (260 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-05-08 10:04 PM
Response to Reply #7
10. Good news there is GLOBAL WARMING
Should turn the whole area a bit warmer...hopefully.
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uppityperson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-06-08 12:54 AM
Response to Reply #10
26. No, it is Global Climate Change. Some places will be warmer, others colder.
Some places will have wild storms and severe weather. "global warming" is a misnomer as it is actually "global climate change".
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Mojorabbit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-05-08 10:02 PM
Response to Original message
8. I look at it a bit differently
The majority of the people in this country feel as you do. We are fixin to overthrow the village head. I am willing to wait and see how the new one does. Your position re insurance is not unique. My husband is a physician and due to a health incident eight years ago after which he has been healthy as a horse, cannot purchase insurance at any price.
It is a frightening position to be in.
As for religion, sigh. I don't expect a whole lot of change in that dept for a good while.
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Goodnevil Donating Member (260 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-05-08 10:09 PM
Response to Reply #8
12. The Christian thing
is a big deal to us. More and more battles are being waged to keep church and state separate and clearly the politicians are pandering more and more to the Christian right. Frankly, it's quite disturbing. I don't consider religion to be a deciding factor in our emigration, but it is a major one. I'm not anti-Christian, I am simply a non-Christian trying to fit in an increasingly non-secular society.
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aikoaiko Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-05-08 10:07 PM
Response to Original message
11. I wish you and yours well. Good luck. I hope you find your greener pastures.

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Goodnevil Donating Member (260 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-05-08 10:34 PM
Response to Reply #11
16. What I hope people take away from this post
is not that some lone pagan and his family is leaving the country in disgust, but that we all have the same choice and can wield that freedom of choice as an instrument of obtaining personal liberty. Emigration/immigration is a powerful tool to empower the individual imperialist in this global economy to surpass national boundaries and become citizens of the planet rather than merely being beholden to the ideals of just one nation.

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dysfunctional press Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-05-08 10:40 PM
Response to Original message
17. if your wife is taking 21 hours of classes, aren't there group policies for students...?
Edited on Mon May-05-08 10:43 PM by QuestionAll
that she could take advantage of?

:shrug:

btw- it sounds to me that you probably aren't going to be happy wherever you go...i don't get the feeling from you that you're even capable of it.

but good luck with that- the shorter days would start to drag on me after awhile.
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Goodnevil Donating Member (260 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-05-08 10:50 PM
Response to Reply #17
18. Wow ok
Edited on Mon May-05-08 11:05 PM by Goodnevil
I think that's pretty personal and somewhat rude but I'll bite.

I'm not seeking some ultimate happiness in Canada. I am, however, seeking security for my family as I have explained. I am not an unhappy person that I know of. As a matter of fact, despite our health care and financial problems, I am happier now than I have been in many years mainly due to the wonderful relationship I have with my wife and son.

No, the university health care system also declined her for pre-existing conditions that were not her fault.

It should also be noted that somehow the diabetes began during her pregnancy with my son. She is in otherwise excellent health.

She does yoga every day, she eats nearly perfectly and even lifts weights on a regular basis. The statistics are against her, however, because most diabetic Americans are fat asses who eat too many twinkies and watch too much television.

I get this same response from people when I tell them I'm a vegan or a pagan. I wish it still surprised me. It seems anything that is not status quo or typical with society's view of what is correct automatically flags you as an unhappy person, deranged or a malcontent.
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Kitty Herder Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-05-08 11:47 PM
Response to Reply #18
24. Don't let comments like that get to you.
I don't fit into the status quo either and I'm always getting that kind of shit. I think it's horribly rude of someone to tell you that you wouldn't be happy anywhere because you are expressing frustration at an untenable situation and (OMG!) are actually taking steps to remedy that situation. What you're doing sounds sane to me.


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uppityperson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-06-08 12:55 AM
Response to Reply #18
27. "most diabetic Americans are fat asses who eat too many twinkies and watch too much television."?
"I get this same response from people when I tell them I'm a vegan or a pagan."

Do you mean black/white stereotyping prejudicial response?
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reggie the dog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-06-08 05:49 AM
Response to Reply #18
29. I am far happier in France than I was in the USA
The police are not as violent, the citizens are not as violent, there is no "war on drugs" even though cannabis is still illegal it is a health issue not a criminal issue. We have nationalized health coverage for everyone, university tuition of 200 euro per year on average, public owned electricity, gas, telephone, and train service as well as the post office. Solidarity is seen as a good thing and individualism is seen as a negative here in France. We also protest and stike more often when we do not like reforms made by the goverment. Our right wing party, the UMP, has political ideas like the Democrats, or even farther left than the Democrats, and we have a Socialist party which is like nothing in the USA. We have no party like the Republicans here in France, not even the FN is that far to the right.

If you seek security you can find it in many countries outside the USA. Do not forget Scotland, the left wing bastion of the UK!!!!!
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MattSh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-07-08 01:12 AM
Response to Reply #29
35. Hell, I'm happier in Ukraine than in the US.
Most (not all) of what you said applies here. In addition, we have subsidized utilities (I've never paid more than $140 a month, and that includes cable TV and fast Internet), and my wife owns both of her homes (no mortgage). The percentage of people who actually *own* their home is likely higher in than in the US. I can ride the Metro (subway) for 10 cents, or take a bus for 10 - 40 cents. Salaries are much less here, but when you don't have a mortgage, you can get by on less. Way less. And you do have 4-5 weeeks of vacation, plus a week off around Christmas and another week off in the spring. The health care system does need some fixing here, though. It is free to all, and the doctors (and house calls) are wonderful, but the hospitals themselves are still suffering from the fall of the USSR and the 1996 hyper-inflation. And yes, the politics are more vibrant here too. And probably more honest, but that's not saying much these days, is it?

And it's alway better to be living somewhere on it's way up. The USA, I'm afraid, in on a long elevator ride down.
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DrCory Donating Member (862 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-07-08 05:26 AM
Response to Reply #18
38. Wow Indeed...
It's rather absurd of you to write this:

"I blame none of you for this debacle, but do not presume to ever knock on my door asking for asylum because there will never be any forgiveness in my heart for any of you. We will not share a fire together and we will not share a beer reminiscing about “Friends” and “Seinfeld” and “Star Wars.” My wife and son were not welcome at your hearth now and none of you will be welcome at mine on some day in the future across that far northern border.

...and then complain about someone else being rude. Blanket condemnations aren't typically well tolerated here. I for one am pleased that you will be transplanting such moral elitism to distant parts.
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Raster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-05-08 11:15 PM
Response to Reply #17
20. Your information about the student insurance as good. Your "btw" comment was indeed rude.
Edited on Mon May-05-08 11:16 PM by Raster
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uppityperson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-05-08 11:13 PM
Response to Original message
19. "there will never be any forgiveness in my heart for any of you."
If you are cutting all ties with everyone, why are you telling all of us to never have contact with you again? Or is that the reason for this post? Yes, this gvt sucks, yes there are lots of bad things, but "My wife and son were not welcome at your hearth now and none of you will be welcome at mine" how the hell do you know how welcome you were at mine?

However, if you chose to be that bitter towards everyone, that is your choice. Good luck to you all.
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Goodnevil Donating Member (260 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-05-08 11:21 PM
Response to Reply #19
21. Too abstract I think for you
Edited on Mon May-05-08 11:22 PM by Goodnevil
I was merely trying to say that we simply do not care about one another in this country. It goes beyond mere normal insensitivity. We actually go out of our way to tell eachother "f you, I don't care if you live or die because I have my freedom."

I can't live in a country which has a government in name only. Our government doesn't DO anything for it's people? Why would we want to keep it around or live under it's shadow? That makes no sense!

Again with the bitter. I'm bitter, yes, admittedly, but don't I have the right to be? Although I see the point you're trying to make: Love it or leave it. Well, as I've said, I'm leaving it as fast as I can but our system is screwing me over just as fast as it can and making it more difficult for me to leave quickly. I swear to you that if I had the financial means I would put in my application tomorrow to the Canadian embassy.

What I'm truly trying to say that we are all at fault for what has happened in this country, even me. We blame everyone but ourselves and we voted these jack-holes into office. We bought Wal-marts crap, we buy Dell's computers, we listen to the hype on CNN, MSNBC and FOX. We are doing this to ourselves. There are no kings here. I blame us, the American people. We simply don't give a damn about eachother.
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uppityperson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-06-08 12:52 AM
Response to Reply #21
25. "Love it or leave it."? I think you misunderstand.
When the bloody hell have I EVER said anything like that? I do not know if you merely misunderstand, or if you chose to insult by passing judgement, but I guess I would not care to have you in my home if that is your attitude.

"We actually go out of our way to tell eachother "f you, I don't care if you live or die because I have my freedom."" is not too abstract, but indeed false. As is "We blame everyone but ourselves and we voted these jack-holes into office. We bought Wal-marts crap, we buy Dell's computers, we listen to the hype on CNN, MSNBC and FOX. We are doing this to ourselves."

If you truly cannot see those who have fought, who are fighting for positive things, in this country or others, I truly pity you. If you are so narrow minded as to put everyone in those categories, I also pity you.

"We simply don't give a damn about eachother." I truly pity you.
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rockymountaindem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-05-08 11:23 PM
Response to Original message
22. I'm glad you think the jerks and greedheads in this society, who we here all collectively oppose,
speak for us :sarcasm:

I lived in Canada for four years as a student, ending about a year ago. If you need to go up there to have health care, that's fine. Their society has as many problems as ours does, they are only different. If you think you will fit in better up there, then more power to you, but if you think that somehow because Canada has universal health care and a smaller military budget that they also have some kind of wholly different mindset, you're going to be sorely disappointed.

I don't know why you would come on a website dedicated to venting our frustration against the people you say you are angry with, tell us all how we're just as bad as they, and then expect us to share your feelings. Have we, as individuals or as a group, committed directly to your problems? I think that we have not. You do not know us any better than we know you. You have no idea whether or not you would be "welcome at our hearth", as you put it. If you want my advice, I think you need to do like most Canadians already do and make a distinction between American policy and American people.
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Goodnevil Donating Member (260 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-05-08 11:31 PM
Response to Reply #22
23. No excuses
Edited on Mon May-05-08 11:56 PM by Goodnevil
Sorry, I don't see any difference between the policies of the American government and choices of it's people. We live in a republic. Our representatives are elected by popular vote. Our current situation is the product of a series of choices made over generations by citizens just like you and me.

Canada isn't perfect, but their society indeed has a different value system than our own. I think I'm going to have to disagree with you there.

I don't care if you share my feelings on this subject. I care if my wife and son do, but you? No, sir.I'm not venting my frustrations, I'm pointing out some very obvious problems which have fragmented my patriotism and destroyed any belief I had on the beauty of the American system.

As I said, I have a great deal of contempt for the American people as a whole and I certainly hold very few of them in high enough regard to think that they have the wisdom to understand the flaws in their own line of thinking and being.

No, I don't want your advice. To be honest with you, this post was more of an abstract expression of what I feel is inherently wrong with the American people: lack of personal responsibility for their own government.

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reggie the dog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-06-08 05:55 AM
Response to Reply #23
30. I agree with you
I was really let down by the people of the USA. Why do most Americans support economic policies that let the rich get richer and the poor get poorer? Why do they support the war on drugs which makes people like me, and often their own children, criminals? Why am I a criminal for burning a joint but eoconomic sanctions and wars which kill millions of Iraqi civilians are considered good things?


Why do people bitch at me for not standing for the national anthem at sporting events? I do not tell them to sit down. Why do people in my own family say speak english or leave knowing full well that my wife and daughter are French and that half of my family does not speak english?

My answer.

It is because I am surronded mostly by assholes who largely outnumber the compassionate friendly people.

In France there are less assholes and more compassionate people in my opinion, but it is not perfect.
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reggie the dog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-06-08 05:40 AM
Response to Original message
28. move
try to move to Scotland, their NHS was not as damages as the NHS in the rest of the UK. Or you can go to Canada, it is better than the USA. Try Finland or France if you can. You will likely earn less money but you will have far better social services. You owe no loyalty to the USA.
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Goodnevil Donating Member (260 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-06-08 09:29 AM
Response to Reply #28
31. Finland in my dreams
but we are pretty dead set on Vancouver. My wife has pointed out to me that many people (including ourselves) have been unable to be truly active in politics (not just post on a forum or participate in an e-mail chain) due to work and school responsibilities; desperately trying to get ahead in a system which seems to punish that. I apologize for lumping everyone into one group. I do believe that we all share the blame collectively for the failure of American democracy, but for many it is not for lack of trying.

All in all, my heart has been broken by the country. I don't think it's fixable. I think that like all Gordion knots, this one will have to be cut by a sword, not untied by hand. We might be able to bow out gracefully like Great Britain, but I highly doubt it.
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reggie the dog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-06-08 09:33 AM
Response to Reply #31
32. Vancouver, and BC
Vacouver is my favorite city in North America. They had speakeasy underground coffeeshops selling grass back in 1997 and they still exist today. The city provides heroin and needles to addicts to keep disease and theft down. It is like a bit of Europe in North America. I loved BC while I was there on vacation.
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uppityperson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-06-08 11:08 AM
Response to Reply #31
34. I understand your frustrations, have felt many of the same.
thank you for clarifying.

"I do believe that we all share the blame collectively for the failure of American democracy, but for many it is not for lack of trying." I hope you are able to be active in politics in the future.
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ensho Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-06-08 10:32 AM
Response to Original message
33. wishing you and yours well

you are not alone in leaving the dead united states
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Hannah Bell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-07-08 02:18 AM
Response to Original message
36. I totally relate. The message "You don't matter" is given to
many, in many different ways.

Try to change it, & you find again - you don't matter.

We voted for change & an end to the war - we didn't get it.

They lie & do what they like; we don't matter.
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Hannah Bell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-07-08 02:21 AM
Response to Reply #36
37. When you get this message enough, is it any wonder people
lash out in various ways, harming others or themselves?

It's completely understandable; why care for others if they don't care for you?

People are social creatures, & they function best within a framework of relationships where their existence matters.
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