Teen Who Drove Drunk Gets 30 Days for Fatality

[MountainLaurel]

30 DAYS?!!!

:nuke:

A 17-year-old Fairfax County girl who pleaded guilty in a drunken-driving crash that killed a Leesburg woman was sentenced yesterday to 30 days in a juvenile detention center and ordered to do 500 hours of community service.

Loudoun County juvenile court Judge Pamela L. Brooks suspended the most punitive part of the sentence, which called for the teenager to be detained until September 2011, when she turns 21. Brooks also revoked the girl's driver's license and ordered her to get a job to pay $5,000 in funeral expenses to the victim's family.

The teenager was sent to Loudoun's detention center April 21 after she pleaded guilty to involuntary manslaughter. Brooks did not give her any credit for the 38 days she has served.

Kathleen Becker, 59, died instantly the night of Sept. 20 when her van was hit head-on by the teenager's sport-utility vehicle. Becker was returning home from choir practice at a Catholic church in Sterling.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/05/29/AR2008052902273.html

[DS1]

1. Wow.

[zanne]

2. I wonder who she knows?

It's frustrating to me how one person can be given decades of prison time OR 30 days and community service for the same offense. How can that be misconstrued as justice?

[MountainLaurel]

4. It's very interesting

Because the Post, which published this article, just had one a couple days ago about a man who got 10 years for killing someone while DUI. Except that he had the bad luck of being a pigmentally challenged illegal immigrant.

[hokies4ever]

7. If the girl was an illegal immigrant

Bill ORally would make this a huge news issue.

[MountainLaurel]

13. Oh, you can just bet n/t

[Winterblues]

48. And then there is Laura our "First Lady" that killed her ex boyfriend

and absolutely nothing happened to her...Who you know and who you blow I guess.

[hokies4ever]

62. Never heard of this story

Link?

[Winterblues]

69. I don't have a link but it is common knowledge

She was a teen ager that ran a stop sign and hit a car with her boyfriend in it and killed him. I don't know if alcohol was a factor or not

[Beaverhausen]

76. here- it's true

http://www.snopes.com/politics/bush/laura.aspv

[DadOf2LittleAngels]

64. Because justice is not formulaic..

It cant be, hence we need judges! and hence even in jury trials its the *judge* who applies punishment.

I'm not saying I agree with all of this I don't know all the facts. But the judge might have looked at it and said 'this is a mistake thousands of kids make and had she not *accidentally* hit and killed someone she would have gotten a slap on the wrist therefore I'm going to go a bit beyond that rather than let a common stupid teenage thing ruin this girls life..

[Rufus2007]

3. That's a sad story

Imagine having to live with that for the rest of your life.

[MountainLaurel]

5. You play, you pay n/t

[hokies4ever]

6. Unfortunately this isn't very surprising

Just need a good lawyer to coach you into expressing lots of sorrow in front of the judge and that you're a great person.

On another note, she was drinking at a choir practice at her Catholic church? :wtf:

[zanne]

8. I believe the victim was coming back from choir practice. nt

[hokies4ever]

12. Oops. Thanks for the clarification

:patriot:

Now it looks even worse for that girl to only get such a meager penalty.

[gatorboy]

10. She was drinking at a football game.

[Quantess]

57. Oh, well she's a good kid, then.

Regular attendance at HS football games proves it.
:sarcasm:

[La Lioness Priyanka]

9. she is a kid.

[MountainLaurel]

11. A kid who murdered someone n/t

[La Lioness Priyanka]

14. not deliberately. she accidentally ran over someone.

at 17 ones understanding of consequences is far limited.

[Tesha]

17. She chose to drink. She was doubtless schooled in the consequences.

Or don't they show Red Asphalt or its kin
to kids anymore?

Tesha

[La Lioness Priyanka]

19. actually i doubt she was schooled in it very much. since americans do not allow their kids

to drink under 21, they also dont really bother to explain the consequences that much.

kinda like abstinence only programs.

[hokies4ever]

25. Does Hillary hate America as much as you do?

:rofl:

[SammyWinstonJack]

30. ...

:wtf:

[La Lioness Priyanka]

35. real clever. nt

[DadOf2LittleAngels]

66. Im over 30 and I have never seen it..

[MountainLaurel]

18. But does that mean there should be no consequences

Other than her poor, bruised conscience?

What did she think would happen when she got hammered at a football game and then decided to take a drive?

[La Lioness Priyanka]

21. she probably didnt think anything.

[MountainLaurel]

24. Exactly

And I'm of the opinion that willful ignorance is even worse than deliberate action in this case. And it's not like she didn't know what she was doing was dangerous: All of the high schools in her county have drunk driving awareness education programs, and a lot of schools will park a wrecked car (from a DUI accident) in front of the school during prom season to remind students what drinking and driving will do. And the judge herself said she was a smart girl, so it's not like she was mentally incapable of understanding her actions.

Frankly, I'd like to see the U.S. institute a system like Germany's where if you get caught drinking and driving, you lose your license. Period. Forever.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

36. you are talking about a 17 year old. maybe you people have forgotten being 17

:eyes:

[hokies4ever]

39. But if she's 18 then she goes away to prison for life?

When's her birthday? Did she just turn 17? Is she 18 now but was 17 when it happened?

[La Lioness Priyanka]

41. i think what you are trying to argue is that had she been aperson of color or an immigrant

she would have gotten a harsher sentence.

i think the problem isnt her sentence its that other people get harsher sentences. i think they should get lesser sentences too.

also i think people under 21 should get lower sentences in general.

[redwitch]

92. My friend's daughter drove drunk at 16.

Two of her friends in the car were killed when she slid on an icy road and hit a tree. She went to a state prison for a year.
Last week a 16 yr old kid drove drunk and hit a tree. He was alone in the vehicle. He died at the scene. A fellow classmate was one of the first firemen on the scene. He was with his friend when he died, something I am pretty sure he'll never forget.

But teenagers always think they are immortal and I am sure this recent death won't be the last to set our small town reeling. :cry:

[Hippo_Tron]

79. 18 year olds have legal rights, including the right to vote

They elect the politicians who determine the sentencing laws and the judges (in some states) who hand down the sentences. 17 year olds don't get that right therefore they should have lesser sentences.

[CRF450]

83. Some of us had more common sense

to not drive if intoxicated at that age, thats for damn sure! She's getting close to being an adult, yet she still cant make responsible decisions. 30 day sentence, what the fuck is wrong with that judge!?

[Hippo_Tron]

74. No consequences?

She's a convicted felon. That basically ruins her future.

[NCDem60]

80. If that's the case we should

raise the driving age to 21.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

81. or develop a good public transportation system first.

[Rage for Order]

89. Your line of reasoning...

That at 17, one's understanding of consequences is far limited, can be turned around on you to say, "See? This is why we must have parental abortion notification laws, because at 17, one's understanding of consequences is far limited." Or does your line of reasoning only apply when the 17 year old is driving?

edit to add: In addition, what if she was 17 years, 364 days when this occurred, i.e. 1 day away from turning 18? Is there some magical mind switch that is flipped when one turns 18 that makes them more aware of consequences? If so, please explain. If not, then 18 year olds shouldn't be responsible for their actions either, and if this is the case then at what age does someone become responsible for their actions?

[usaftmo]

91. Why do you infer that

when someone is 17 he or she doesn't know right from wrong/understand consequences from actions...then magically all of that clears up when she or he turns 18?

I started driving when I was 16, and even before taking driver's education knew that actions such as hers are wrong...and can easily become fatal (either to myself or others).

Does that make me a visionary? Not really...it makes me realistic.

[ProfessorGAC]

15. Murder Requires Motive and Intent

The Professor

[La Lioness Priyanka]

16. exactly

[hokies4ever]

20. but just 30 days?

I don't think she should get the death penalty, but it's hard to argue that this penalty is too harsh.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

22. why should one HAVE to argue that this penalty is too harsh...

i think its fitting. i dont think her license should be returned for 10 years though

[hokies4ever]

23. Good lesson for analysis on many issues

is to remove the 'just right' option, because people use it as a cop out instead of critical thinking. So let's pose the question like this: Is the penalty too lenient or too harsh. Choose one of the other. If you're 'undecided', then which answer are you leaning more toward, too lenient or too harsh.

Surely you're not going to say too harsh are you?

[ProfessorGAC]

27. A Bit Too Binary For My Taste

If i knew all the facts and details, perhaps "just right" is a viable choice. You didn't provide that.
GAC

[La Lioness Priyanka]

32. i think it might just be right.

[hokies4ever]

34. If 'just right' is your answer, then what would you say if it was 31 days in jail?

Too harsh?

See what I'm getting at? Just right defers to someone else's judgment and will often have a wide range of what is considered to be 'just right'.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

37. does obama hate children as much as you do? nt

[Echo In Light]

28. What if it was some "no good" heavy metal kid that no one gives a shit about?

Would you still find the sentence applicable? Just curious.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

31. actually i just read her age and came to this conclusion. didnt read anything else about her

and frankly dont care if she is a good or bad kid. she is still a kid

[ProfessorGAC]

26. That Wasn't The Point

One could fairly argue that 30 days is too lenient. One could fairly argue this is appropriate as a "scared straight" measure for someone with no history of wrongdoing.

But, it's not murder.
GAC

[hokies4ever]

29. It's justice that isn't blind, that's for sure

[ProfessorGAC]

33. Still Not The Point

But, apparently you don't care.
GAC

[hokies4ever]

38. The whole point of this is that justice isn't blind

Wake up. That's the biggest point here. Her lenient penalty has everything to do with who she is and not what she did.

[ProfessorGAC]

54. Go Ahead And Be Wrong

You've been wrong before. I'm sure you're VERY used to it.
The Professor

[La Lioness Priyanka]

55. you want her to suffer because other people are racist. thats BS logic.

[hokies4ever]

61. You ought to apologize to her family members of the deceased lady

By the way, a car accident isn't exactly a great way to go.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

65. have you even bothered to read the families response to the sentence?

[hokies4ever]

68. What's wrong with juvenile detention until she was 21?

That seems like a reasonable sentence to me. What message are we sending? It's better to drive drunk and kill someone than to commit any crime where the punishment is greater than 30 days? How is this deterring behavior? All of her classmates are learning that it's okay to drive drunk and kill someone.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

70. is that your way of saying you have NOT read their response?

[hokies4ever]

72. You want to start an internet fan club for this murderer?

You seem to be infatuated with her.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

73. i just am not full of hate for a kid who made an awful mistake. nt

[hokies4ever]

77. I'm not full of hate

Just think that she should be in a juvenile detention center until she is 21. That seems to be a fairer sentence than 30 days, if she serves the entire sentence. You call it hate, I call it justice. I guess that's just the difference between people with a moral center for justice.

[Romulox]

71. Wrong. Reckless indifference to life is sufficient to sustain a conviction for 2nd degree homicide.

[Romulox]

75. Another point: Motive is NOT one of the elements of the crime of murder...

[seabeyond]

40. i think that is appropriate. i do not think the death penalty is required

hopefully it will be the hugest of lesson for this person, and will be life altering for her

there for the grace of god go i....

i am and never have been a drinker and even i have drunk and drive. most all i know have. i know many will come on my post and vow purity.... but i dont buy it. shit happens. the worst and most horrible of shit happens. life. i have walked it thru out my life as most all of us have. this is a horrible deal. for all parties involved.


there is no turning back the clock

[gatorboy]

43. No one said anything about the death penalty. But 30 days for taking a life?

A single month of time for an entire life?

[seabeyond]

44. unless her life is taken too, you can not balance it whether 30 day or 20 years

cannot be done.

hopefully her punishment will be in pay it forward. become a better person. give of herself. a lesson learned. that would be the biggest balance of event for her to carry this with her always

[hokies4ever]

63. Why not just give her 30 minutes in jail then?

[NuttyFluffers]

95. technically there is a creative way she can serve "life imprisonment":

become the victim's family's new legal daughter (and would still be under their guardianship until legally an adult).

several societies have deemed such a restitution a fair judgment on such cases. we wouldn't do it, but it does raise an interesting discussion. it is part punishment and restitution and catharsis all in one. sometimes the most poignant way to sentence someone is to make them serve under the chains of the heart.

[DCKit]

52. I'm sure.

My BIL had his legs crushed between his tow-truck and a police car by someone like this young woman. AFIK, there was no penalty for her, but only because he didn't die.

Three years later she killed someone in another drunk driving accident.

But I'm not judging.

[KSinTX]

42. She's a girl, of course she got off light

I can't recall the names or the case, but there was a case in which a teen helped murder her mother, took off cross-country on a joyride with her boyfriend and others then got the lightest sentence of the group. Repugnant.

[Echo In Light]

45. Likely some truth to that

You just stated the obvious thing that I'm sure many are thinking but didn't want to state outright.

[KSinTX]

49. There's a legal term for it and for the life of me I can't recall

but there is a presumption in law that some people are so filled with remorse that they are entitled to either a lesser sentence or release from prison because they have "suffered enough." It has generally been applied to white collar criminals and women. I've tried to look it up but can't seem to find it at the moment. I recall it was used in a couple of cases here in Texas and the only reason it's in my head is because it so boggled my mind. It may just be a Texas thing, though.

[Rosemary2205]

46. The family seems to be happy with it.

Becker's daughter, Sharon Macielinski, said her family did not want the girl to be locked up for a long period. The teenager will be on supervised probation until she is 21.

In an interview Wednesday, Macielinski said: "We're not looking out for revenge or payback or anything like that. We're looking at: What is best for rehabilitating this individual so other people don't get hurt?"

[La Lioness Priyanka]

47. that family clearly has more commonsense & compassion than most people. nt

[RadiationTherapy]

50. "...the teenager's sport-utility vehicle. "

Are SUVs more difficult to navigate in an emergency? Why does a 17 year old have an SUV? Because the parents think their baby is safer, despite the rest of us being less safe?

I am biased, but willing to be corrected on this issue.

Condolences to all involved in this accident.

[Blue_Tires]

51. And, from the very same state, I present Alfredo Ramos

http://www.wavy.com/global/story.asp?s=6307948

...who our friends at faux news made into a national issue (and sparked up a wildfire of anti-latino sentiment locally which still burns today)

in case you were wondering, he got 24 years, which almost everyone thought was too light (i guess they wanted a public hanging or something to send a message to the other 'illegals') In fact, the first time he got caught DUI he got 90 days (suspended), which was still longer than the girl in the OP who killed someone...This is especially amusing considering Fairfax Co. is not one of the more liberal places in the world, i.e., "tough on crime" conservatism...Do I even need to ask if she is white?

[pitohui]

53. what do you bet the 59 yr old victim was black on top of that? she was coming back from choir

either way, how can the court make it any clearer that nobody cares if an older woman is killed

what if the 17 year old had killed another 17 year old with her drunk driving, nobody here would think that 30 days is fair and the judge wouldn't think 30 days was fair and the victim's family wouldn't think 30 days is fair

but our society holds the life of an older woman to be of little or no value and i for one am damn sick of it

[Rosemary2205]

82. BULLSHIT

A 22 yr old ADULT served no jail time, paid $250 and was given a 2nd chance - or rather a 3rd chance since he's already a criminal by being illegally in this country and buying fake ID. He chose to do it again and killed 2 people. He's and adult that's a repeat offender. Throw everything but the kitchen sink at him I don't care. Clearly, because he lives under the radar to begin with, the only way to protect other's from his drunken driving is to keep him separated from society.

This juvenile is a first timer. As a first time juvenile she'll serve 68 days in jail and 4 years probation and pay $5000 plus the fees to be on probation, which can be substantial. As a first timer she was punished much harsher than Ramos - and probably should get more but for the family of the dead woman asking for leniency.

[lonestarnot]

56. Is she related to old lady bushitler? She got off too ya know. No time whatsoever that I know

about. :shrug:

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

58. Sounds fine to me.

A kid was being irresponsible, accidently killed somebody.

30 days is enough to teach her a lesson.

[pitohui]

88. it ain't about teaching her a lesson, it's about justice

i realize that almost no one believes the life of a 59 year old woman has value and that therefore the taking of that life does not deserve any real punishment...but i have to admit i'm flabbergasted by that attitude on DU

i'm an older woman, my life still has value

as for the victim's very family not caring about seeing justice for her, what does that say about them? the usual, i guess, she's almost 60, time for her to die and leave them what money she has anyway, fuck her if she thought her life as a person had meaning and value...

again, if the victim had also been 17, no one here would be satisfied with the token punishment, it would be recognized that a life of value and promise had been stolen thru assholery and carelessness

but because the victim is 59, even her own daughter doesn't give a fuck -- a sad, sick comment on our world

nobody drinks like a "remorseful" drunk, i'm sure this "remorseful" drunk will go on to hurt many other people, after all, she has learned a valuable lesson indeed -- if you drive drunk and kill the right person, it doesn't matter, being all sad and sorry and wiping a tear from your eye is all you gotta do to make it right

[La Lioness Priyanka]

94. justice is not vengeance. nt

[End Of The Road]

59. If this had happened in certain parts of Texas

she would have been confined until she was 21, with review as to further incarceration after that. We go too far here most of the time, but 30 days is wholly inadequate, unjust. She made a decision to drink & drive. Don't do the crime if you can't do the time.

[Hamlette]

60. another teen in the same circumstances

years ago I ran into one of my favorite judges. I'd not seen him in years and we had the chance to chat for a bit and catch up.

His daughter had been in an auto accident that killed someone and it figuratively ended her life, he told me. She was unable to forgive herself. He was distraught about the whole thing. The death, of course, and what it had done to his daughter who he adored. I told him "it will get better, she'll recover some." He looked at me and said: "I wouldn't. And neither would you. And neither will she. Her life will be productive but it will not know the joy it once would have."

For some people, the punishment they will inflict on themselves is more than enough.

Wise judges know that and factor it in to the sentence.

[pitohui]

90. the punishment drunks exact on themselves is drinking and weeping more into their beer

you know what? i don't care about how sorry some miserable drunk is as they cry into their beer and make a big psycho-drama over THEIR screw up

the daughter's "remorse" will just be an excuse for her to continue to drink and indulge her self pity -- and the inevitable result will be more drunk driving episodes

meanwhile her victim is dead forever

come on, who are you kidding? you know good and well that the judge got his daughter off because he is himself a judge and knows who to pay off

the whole story disgusts me

his daughter killed someone and being "sorry" is supposed to be enough, who is he kidding? it don't impress me none, i'll say that much!

[RB TexLa]

67. At least a family member can use civil court to take anything this filth may earn over her life

to make up for the insult from this inexcusable judge.

[Hippo_Tron]

78. Until they give 17 year olds the right to vote, I think juvenile sentencing is appropriate

As the judge said, he didn't have a whole lot of in between options. Either put her in with the hardened criminals or have her do a small amount of time.

To be honest if I were this girl, I'd almost rather do a year or two. Having to face the world after something like this is probably worse than prison time.

[BlooInBloo]

84. I assume there are relevant details here that I'm just not aware of.

[FourScore]

85. I know an amazing story of a young man who had killed a teenager while driving drunk .

He became clean and sober after the accident and went to AA meetings every day for years.

20 years later, and still going to AA meetings, his own 17-year old son was killed by a young man who was driving drunk. The man, upon hearing of his son's death drove straight to an ongoing AA meeting and sobbed. He wanted to drink himself to oblivion. But he got through it.

Later, he spoke up for the young man who killed his son at the young man's trial and told the judge of his own history. The boy who was driving was so despondent that he had killed this man's son. He asked the man how he could forgive him. In reply, the man asked the teenager to join him on a journey. He told the judge about their plans and the judge granted their wishes: Together the two went on tours across the country to speak at high schools in order to convince other young people not to drink and drive. They did this for at least three years, maybe longer, I don't know. An old friend of mine knew this man and had told me the story years ago.

This is a true story.

[seabeyond]

86. i saw a news program on this. like 60 minutes. and yes to your story.... n/t

[FourScore]

87. I always thought that a news show or movie should be made of this.

I'm glad to hear it was on 60 minutes (or something of that sort). My friend who told me the story went to the same local AA meetings as the older gentleman. That's how he knew him.

[Odious justice]

93. Should be in prison.

Oh well. I guess it's hard to punish someone in America anymore for simply killing an innocent person by accident. That seems to be our foreign policy, minus the whole "accident" part.

[NoGOPZone]

96. Yes, it's known as the 'Janklow sentence'.

Kill someone with your car and be free in months.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_Janklow#Car_crash_and_aftermath