Opposition to the state and psychiatry

[nadinbrzezinski]

I have at times wondered when we will reach this point in the US. For reference, during the height of the USSR, during the rule of no less than Joseph Stalin, citizens were taught that those who opposed the government were not only good, loyal communist, but were mentally ill. This was done to marginalize those who didn't go along. In fact, many who opposed the state were not sent to the GULAG, but instead sent for ahem, medical care.

Many of these people were diagnosed as having a myriad of psychiatric conditions, and were sent to medical hospitals, were they were treated for their deviant behavior.

This is ongoing under our noses, and can be seen in quotes as follows

"Modern liberalism's irrationality can only be understood as the product of psychopathology. So extravagant are the patterns of thinking, emoting, behaving and relating that characterize the liberal mind that its relentless protests and demands become understandable only as disorders of the psyche." "The Liberal Mind" reveals the madness of the modern liberal for what it is: a massive transference neurosis acted out in the world's political arenas, with devastating effects on the institutions of liberty

http://shop.wnd.com/store/item.asp?DEPARTMENT_ID=6&SUBDEPARTMENT_ID=20&ITEM_ID=2285

Then there is the way that people like MIchael Wiener, no I will not give him the honor of using his pen name, who has railed against Liberalism as a mental disease.... as can be seen in this link to Wikipedia. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberalism_Is_a_Mental_Disorder

What is true is that we have seen this, and now criticism of the mainstream comes to us with the accusations that the person is fixated, or angry, or other mental health terms. This language has entered the mainstream, and one has to wonder if this is the end goal of the puppet masters.

We joke about the blue and the red pill here, but the blue pill also includes this effort to make the opposition medically deviant. and one has to wonder how long until we see people, committed against their will, to protect the rest of the society from their ill. After all, to commit somebody under a 51-50 hold is far easier than prosecution, and could certainly send the message

Food for though, and we do live in very scary times.

[nadinbrzezinski]

1. kick

[mmonk]

2. I'm with you and understand completely.

It's one of the state's methods to try and discredit the truthtellers in front of the masses.

[nadinbrzezinski]

5. And to me the fact that folks are using the language

you must be angry

Don't be that fixated

Why are you overwhelmed?

Speaks volumes of where we are

[mmonk]

6. Yep.

[Bluerthanblue]

13. overwhelmed and angry are terms

I've personally used in my replies to you, and I STILL feel they are appropriate ways to describe the way your posts come across to me.

If you see veiled references to mental illness in them, well, all I can say is that is your perspective, and you are entitled to it.

I'll point out the obvious, that being MANY very well adjusted, mentally healthy people experience anger and get overwhelmed by situations.

And for your information, I have more experience with mental health issues than you might think- a fair amount of it as a consumer.

If you have an issue with me, I would have appreciated you addressed me personally- or pm'd me- :shrug:.

I'm done trying to exchange ideas with you Nadinbrzezinski- I seem unable to express my thoughts to you in a way that doesn't cause offense. That isn't productive for anyone-

I wish you well-

peace~

[nadinbrzezinski]

14. Why is it that all I post seems to be about you?

Free clue, it is not.

WRITING OF HISTORY and CURRENT AFFAIRS

Jesus Age, what part of THIS IS PART OF HISTORY ARE YOU FUCKING MISSING?

[Ghost in the Machine]

20. Usually the ones with persecution complexes stay in the dungeon..

they come up here once in a while, but scurry away quickly when the light is shined on their paranoia...

[nadinbrzezinski]

21. Well I stay out of the dungeons, multiple ones, most of the time

I should go visit for the short story I am researching... based on the deathpalooza...

:-)

[Mythsaje]

3. Projection, plain and simple.

They see their own reflection and get confused.

People who are incapable of grasping shades of gray hardly have room to discuss the mental health of those who can.

[nadinbrzezinski]

4. Not quite, psychiatry has been used in the past to control

political opponents

See here

http://www.jaapl.org/cgi/reprint/30/1/136.pdf

Warning PDF

And given how the language is now internalized, I wonder how far we've got to go until this becomes practice. Given the abuses in the Siegelman case, what if instead of DOJ they went for ahem, medicalizing his condition?

[Mythsaje]

7. I'm aware of that.

But they're hardly in a position to judge OUR sanity, being fucking barking mad themselves.

[nadinbrzezinski]

8. The point is, how long until you are I are diagnosed for "insert malady here"

and taken off circulation?

In other words, medicalizing opposition, which they are trying to do, is easier than legal means

[Mythsaje]

9. Are you truly afraid of that happening anytime soon?

Based on this yutz's website and/or book? Seriously? Of all the things to be worried about in the near future, that's pretty close to the bottom of the list.

[nadinbrzezinski]

10. Surprisingly it is not on the bottom of the list

given how the language is now accepted by many in the so-called mainstream, if McInsane wins... you can almost bet on it

Easier than that pesky law you know

Siegelman was a shot across the bow legally... but I can bet we will see some of these medical ones in the future

[Mythsaje]

11. The psychological community no longer even considers homosexuality a mental disorder.

You really think they're going to buy into the argument that liberalism is?

In truth, it would be easier to sell the notion that Republicanism is a mental illness, since it seems to promote some pretty anti-social attitudes and behavior.

[nadinbrzezinski]

12. Yes, for the same reasons the Russians did...

pressure comes in many ways

[Mythsaje]

17. I think I'm on the wrong day here.

I thought today's fear was "Ohmygawd, Bush is going to declare martial law and suspend the elections."

I could have sworn that "They're going to call us crazy and lock us up for being liberals" was NEXT tuesday's scheduled freak out.

Now I can't remember when "They're going to hack the vote and McCain is going to be President no matter WHAT we say" is scheduled.


I can't keep track of these things anymore. You know how hard it is to get a good fear on when you can't remember what you're supposed to be afraid of at any given time? The Republicans have it easy. Be afraid of Iranian terrorists, gays, and illegal immigrants (Particularly Mexicans) ALL the time.

We've just got so many more fears to choose from we need to schedule them better so as to avoid confusion.

[nadinbrzezinski]

19. I actually rather not let the fear seep in and take the advise of Naomi Klein

Information is power

If we make a tipping point aware, then using these tactics become that more difficult

:-)

By the way I jumped the gun. These week's fear was torture I tell ya!

[rucky]

15. We say the same thing about them.

so we call it projection.

How much does culture decide who's crazy? I'd say that any group that makes up 30+ percent of the voting population should be considered "normal" - even if they're fucked up. If we can accept that, we'd stop dehumanizing millions of people like that.

[nadinbrzezinski]

16. Correct, we do

thanks for bringing that up

And it should be part of the conversation

[Mythsaje]

18. Oh, right, because SANE people think nuking innocent people

just to get a few possible bad apples is A-Okay.

Glad we cleared that up.

[rucky]

24. Of course there's a moral distinction, but this topic is about mental health.

n/t

[woo me with science]

22. If this comes to us, it will be gradual and self-chosen.

I am often dismayed at the therapy worship I see on DU--in particular, the apparent perception of mental health counselors as gurus. For example, there is a knee-jerk perception here by many that mental health counseling is necessary after tragedies. As though human beings had not survived and thrived all manner of tragedies through the ages with the loving support of family and friends.

Mental health "treatment" is worming its way into more and more aspects of our lives, and healthy people are being convinced that they cannot possibly manage stresses and tragedies of life without professional help. It used to be that counseling was considered something to be considered in extraordinary situations, after ordinary supports did not work. Now it is considered to be necessary BECAUSE there has been a tragedy. All of a sudden, we are all incapable of deailng with loss or tragedy without professional help.

Just as an example, I was dismayed recently by the responses to a thread in the Lounge questioning whether a child who recently suffered the loss of her father needed therapy, because she was crying frequently. The vast majority of responses not only recommended counseling as something possibly helpful to the child (a reasonable position, IMO), but vehemently urged it as NECESSARY. In the past, crying more after a loss would have been considered part of normal grieving and not a signal that therapy was needed. But now it seems that most consider it absolutely unthinkable that a child and her family could manage such a loss without professional support.

Grief counseling used to be something offered to people following a disaster, only if they failed to recover sufficiently with the help of family and friends. Now such counseling is often mandatory from the start in work-based disaster situations, even though research shows that pushing people into grief counseling may actually be more harmful than helpful (i.e., Those funnelled into counseling following a disaster are actually MORE likely to show PTSD symptoms a year later than those who are not).

Counselors are the new gurus. Most people don't realize that the research on counseling shows very questionable results for many therapies. And even more therapies don't have any research associated with them at all. Many still are based in lore, or Freudian psychology, or pop psychology, or nothing at all. We need to re-evaluate the trust and power we put in the hands of mental health professionals. People seem extremely eager to trust that therapists have an almost magic perception, insight, and wisdom, when, in fact, they do not. People put trust in mental health recommendations without realizing that many are not evidence-based at all.

Because of our blind trust in mental health as a profession, we now have perfectly earnest threads on DU asking whether presidential candidates should be screened by psychologists prior to being allowed to run for office.


Yes, counseling can be helpful in some circumstances. But we are widening the net. We are increasing the range of situations we feel we cannot possibly be expected to handle without professional help, and we are placing trust where it is often not warranted. In the process, we devalue our own strength, judgment, and capacity to help ourselves and each other. One possible destination of this road is a goverment that can decide who is mentally "healthy" or not, based on the government's view of mental health.

We need a great deal more skepticism when recommending "mental health treatments" in many situations, and we need more evidence-based research to help us realize what counselors can and should actually do for us, and what they should not.

[nadinbrzezinski]

23. Very well said,

And as a former EMS worker I know that one of my jobs was for my guys to SPEAK OUT after a disaster, and trust me the gallows humor got bad

I still have nightmares from some particular calls and most people who believe in this would tell me to go see a counselor

But you are right, it is comming and we surendering to it.

I could cite many a study where pregnancy became a medical issue and where alternate care became anathema (Not to say that medical care should not be the main way to take care of a pregnant woman under certain particular circumstances, but pregnancy is not a disease)