Police chief, two others indicted for letting 8-year-old play with Uzi -- the boy killed himself

[nichomachus]

This is a follow-up to the earlier thread, regarding the death of the boy who was allowed to play with an Uzi at a gun show.


http://www.boston.com/news/local/breaking_news/2008/12/police_chief_in.html

The longtime police chief of a small Western Massachusetts town was one of three people indicted today on involuntary manslaughter charges for the death of an 8-year-old boy who fatally shot himself with a machine gun at a weapons exposition in Westfield.

Pelham Police Chief Edward B. Fleury owns COP Firearms & Training, a gun dealership that cosponsored the Machine Gun Shoot on Oct. 26 at the Westfield Sportsman's Club. Christopher Bizilj died while firing a 9mm Micro Uzi that recoiled and fatally shot him in the head.

The grand jury also indicted the club and two men who supplied the Uzi that killed the boy. The men were identified as Carl Guiffre of Hartford and Domenico Spano of New Milford, Conn.

Prosecutors did not seek an indictment against the boy's father, Dr. Charles Bizilj, who brought his son to the gun show and was standing with a camera 10 feet behind his son as he fired the weapon that afternoon. Bizilj, an emergency room physician from Ashford, Conn., "will be punished every day of the rest of his life," Hampden District Attorney William M. Bennett said this afternoon at a press conference, according to a story on the website of the Springfield Republican.

Fleury and the club also were indicted on four counts each of furnishing a machine gun to a minor. Bennett said prosecutors know of at least four children, including Christopher, who fired the automatic weapons. The club faces a fine of up to $10,000 for each violation.

[Junkdrawer]

1. They are not toys...they are not "your best friend"....

They are machines designed to kill - and to kill many at once quickly...

[Taverner]

2. Sure they are! Why do they sound like firecrackers then?

:silly:

[amdezurik]

3. and to try to pretend it is for "hunters" is just a lie

to kill a deer with one you would need to unload at least a full clip into it. And at full auto on a duck? even the feathers left behind when the rest of the bird is in shreads would have holes in them...

[Vanje]

4. Hunting with an Uzi

would violate game laws.

[amdezurik]

7. Somehow I have a feeling that sheriff and his buds

don't give much of a crap about any law THEY want to break...

[LostinVA]

33. I read in an earlier story that quite a few club members resigned before the shoot

They REALLY disagreed with it.

Shooting off a plinkster or a shotgun is one thing.I'm very iffy about allowing such a young child to shoot off a handgun -- but an UZI? And THIS UZI? I watched a demo video of this firearm, and not only is a certain strength involved, but you have to hold it a very particular way or teh recoil will kill you.

Very sad.

[XOKCowboy]

5. I'm not a gun grabber by any stretch of the imagination but I hope they convict them all...

Giving adults a chance to fire a Micro Uzi at a gun show is one thing but to give it to an 8 year old boy is whole different matter. It's negligent homicide IMHO if someone didn't have a hand on that gun.

As for Dad, I have to agree with the DA. It was bad judgment on his part and he'll pay for it the rest of his life.

[boozepusher]

6. What a sad situation.

I didn't know it was illegal to allow a minor to fire an automatic weapon. My father let me shoot his when I was a teen. Even though it was a full size rifle and not a mini like in this case it was still almost too much for me as a teen. Allowing an eight year old to fire a micro-uzi is asking for trouble.

[kestrel91316]

8. The father, who approved of the whole situation, is an ER PHYSICIAN????

You know, I really wouldn't want someone with as little common sense as him working on me in an emergency. Seriously.

[undeterred]

31. That's the most amazing part of the story.

They see the results of so much idiocy in the ER- how could he have such ridiculously bad judgment?

[JerseygirlCT]

9. Good. Perhaps, maybe just maybe, next time the idiots will

think twice before letting a child "play" with an uzi.

[TomInTib]

10. I was 5 or 6 years old, bugging my Dad to let me shoot his .45.

He finally relented.

I asked him why he removed all of the rounds from the magazine, leaving just the one in the chamber.

"He said, "You're fixing to find out, Son".

I could barely hold the damn thing still.

BLAM!

The recoil bounced that pistol off my forehead.

[bean fidhleir]

11. I would be *astonished* if there were any such law as "furnishing a machine gun to a minor"

This sounds like the DA is trying to invent his own law and hoping there's enough public outrage so that nobody complains and he gets a political boost.

It's the way a lot of people have been executed, including the Haymarket Martyrs, Sacco & Vanzetti, Joe Hill, et lengthy cetera.

[Junkdrawer]

12. There's no law that says "You can't run a red hot poker up someone's ass until they die" either...

"Murder" covers that.

[bean fidhleir]

18. You're arguing backwards, I think. If the law says "murder", the charge says "murder"

The charge here says "furnishing a machine gun to a minor", but I bet there's no such law.

[Junkdrawer]

22. 1st paragraph said "involuntary manslaughter"...that's the big charge...

Also, MSNBC reports:

"But state law prohibits the furnishing of a machine gun to any person under the age of 18", said prosecutor Bennett.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/28054193/

[bean fidhleir]

23. If there truly is such a state law (I'm not convinced), then I've nothing more to say, because

given that machine guns are far from being thick on the ground, the idea that the legislature would spend the time prohibiting putting one into the hands of a minor is mind-boggling. It's like one of those scratch-your-head laws about not carrying a concealed spear over 6ft long, or harboring a wildebeest.

[Junkdrawer]

25. Perhaps the Massachusetts legislature isn't as far in the pocket of the NRA...

as, say, the Pennsylvania legislature is.

[bean fidhleir]

27. I couldn't bear not knowing, so I looked it up

http://www.mass.gov/legis/laws/seslaw98/sl980180.htm

And it seems to me that only a very tortured interpretation of the law can support this prosecution. There is no paragraph that I could find that prohibits "furnishing a machine gun to a minor". Maybe you'll have better luck, if you feel like spending the time.

[depakid]

36. How about good old fashioned criminally negligent homicide

That's usually good for a few years' stretch in the pokey.

[muriel_volestrangler]

37. Yes, following up from that, we have Section 130 for Chapter 140 of the General Laws:

http://www.mass.gov/legis/laws/mgl/140-130.htm

"... whoever sells or furnishes any alien or any person under eighteen years of age a rifle, shotgun, machine gun or ammunition ... therefor shall have his license to sell firearms, rifles, shotguns, machine guns and or ammunition revoked ... and shall be punished by a fine of not less than $1,000 nor more than $10,000, or by imprisonment in a state prison for not more than ten years or by imprisonment in a house of correction for not more than two and one-half years, or by both such fine and imprisonment. ... Nothing in this section shall be construed to prohibit an instructor from furnishing rifles or shotguns or ammunition therefor to pupils; provided, however, that said instructor has the consent of a parent or guardian of a pupil under the age of eighteen years."

So, rifles and shotguns are OK for pupils under 18, with parental consent; but machine guns aren't.

[-..__...]

30. MA gun laws are a sad state of affairs.

They're a bloated, convoluted mess that no one completely understands... including police chiefs, prosecutors, legislators and firearms dealers. I know of at least 3 lawyers that specialize in MA firearms laws.

However... in this case it would appear that the people involved are screwed...



"Chapter 140: Section 130. Sale or furnishing weapons or ammunition to aliens or minors; penalty; exceptions

Section 130. Whoever sells or furnishes a rifle, shotgun or ammunition to any alien eighteen years of age or older who does not hold a permit card issued to him under section one hundred and thirty-one H or, except as provided in this section or section one hundred and thirty-one E, whoever sells or furnishes any alien or any person under eighteen years of age a rifle, shotgun, machine gun or ammunition, or whoever sells or furnishes to any person under 21 years of age a firearm or large capacity rifle or shotgun or ammunition therefor shall have his license to sell firearms, rifles, shotguns, machine guns and or ammunition revoked and shall not be entitled to apply for such license for ten years from the date of such revocation and shall be punished by a fine of not less than $1,000 nor more than $10,000, or by imprisonment in a state prison for not more than ten years or by imprisonment in a house of correction for not more than two and one-half years, or by both such fine and imprisonment. Nothing in this section or section one hundred and thirty-one E shall be construed to prohibit a parent or guardian from allowing his child or ward, who has not attained age fifteen, the supervised use of a rifle or shotgun or ammunition therefor, according to the provisions of section one hundred and twenty-nine C, nor from furnishing such child or ward, who has attained age fifteen, with a rifle or shotgun that is not a large capacity weapon or ammunition; provided, however, that said child or ward, being fifteen years of age or older, has been issued a valid firearm identification card or alien permit to possess a rifle or shotgun which is in his possession. Nothing in this section shall be construed to prohibit an instructor from furnishing rifles or shotguns or ammunition therefor to pupils; provided, however, that said instructor has the consent of a parent or guardian of a pupil under the age of eighteen years."

http://www.mass.gov/legis/laws/mgl/140-130.htm

[nichomachus]

13. Probably a "to wit" clause

Many charges are brought with a generic title and then a more specific "to wit."

It could be something like "child endangerment, to wit, furnishing a machine gun to a minor." The media often report only the "To wit" part because it specifies the exact act.

I once covered a case of a biker gang, in which one of the members killed someone from another gang and dumped his body in the river. The police knew he killed him, but didn't have enough evidence at that point to bring a charge. They did have a witness who saw him dump the body. There was no law specific to that, so in order to hold him, they charged him with the only thing they had: "Polluting a public waterway with the carcass of a dead animal, to wit, Rocco Jones."

[bean fidhleir]

17. I bet that this is not such a case, though (nt)

[nichomachus]

26. Based upon what information?

[bean fidhleir]

28. On this, mostly.

http://www.mass.gov/legis/laws/seslaw98/sl980180.htm

I couldn't find any such "to wit", but maybe you can.

[nichomachus]

29. It's used all the time

I was a police and court reporter in MA for years -- I've seen it used hundreds of times.

[bean fidhleir]

38. Fine. But can you find it IN THE LAW?

[muriel_volestrangler]

14. The law seems to cover furnishing a machine gun to most people, including minors

Machine Gun License

A license to possess or carry a machine gun may be issued to a firearm instructor certified by the Criminal Justice Training Council for the sole purpose of firearm instruction to police personnel, or to a bona fide collector of firearms upon application or renewal of such license.

A "bona fide collector of firearms," for the purpose of issuance of a machine gun license, shall be defined as an individual who acquires firearms for such lawful purposes as historical significance, display, research, lecturing, demonstration, test firing, investment or other like purpose. For the purpose of issuance of a machine gun license the acquisition of firearms for sporting use or for use as an offensive or defensive weapon shall not qualify an applicant as a bona fide collector of firearms. An individual licensed pursuant to 18 U.S.C. Chapter 44, Sections 921-929 and 27 CFR part 178 shall be deemed a bona fide collector of firearms for the purpose of this regulation.

http://www.goal.org/misc/faq/overview.html

Since the boy wasn't a police officer, letting him fire the gun broke the terms of the license, I'd say.

[bean fidhleir]

16. You missed the other purpose: "bona fide collector...demonstration, test firing...like purpose"

That looks like it would fit the situation very well.

[muriel_volestrangler]

19. 'demonstration' would be the collector firing it

And giving it to a child for a 'test firing' when the child doesn't know how to test a machine gun won't cut it either. If you think that 'fits the situation very well', then you have as much sense as the people would gave the gun to the boy. They gave it to him to have fun.

The link also points out there's a law against providing a handgun to a minor; a machine gun will be covered too (they say the laws "too numerous to mention"; they're gun owners, and it seems they take it for granted that providing a machine gun to a minor would be a dumb move).

[bean fidhleir]

24. Please yourself.

[LostinVA]

34. I cannot believe you tied this to the outrages of the Labor and Anarchist trials

Did you throw out your back from that stretching???

And yes, they do have such laws in states with strong gun control.

[uppityperson]

15. Thank you for the update. good. It will make them more cautious in the future.

Hopefully.

[aikoaiko]

20. I can understand this prosecution -- there were significant errors of judgment and gun safety

I have mixed feelings about the father avoiding prosecution. Of course watching his son kill himself is far worse than any prison time, but then there are lots of parents who serve time for accidently killing their children. I;m not sure what makes him different.

I know this tragedy has caused many discussions in guns forums about gun safety and gun training with children.

[pipi_k]

39. Mixed feelings here too...

and for the same reasons...

apparently the DA feels that the father has suffered enough... but damn...even if he wasn't aware of any specific gun laws, what rational person would allow his 8 year old kid to shoot...much less even handle...a deadly weapon....whether he's supervised or not.

Oh, and I'm really trying not to be judgmental about the father's attitude, but he's been quoted as saying that his son got to live a full life doing things that many adults never get to do, and that, in the end, he "has no regrets".

I'm not exactly sure how to take that, you know?

No regrets?

Not one?

like....the decision to allow his kid to shoot a deadly weapon and end up killing himself?

Maybe it's denial. Maybe it's the only way he can deal with the whole thing without cracking up. In my view, it just seems rather....cold.

If I were in his shoes, I don't know if I could ever live with myself again.

Actually that whole feeling of not being able to live with myself again influenced my Xmas gift giving/making last year. I wanted to knit up stuff for the grandkids, and nice warm scarves were one of my choices...but we hear so much about kids being choked by things hanging out of their jackets that I did make them but in a shorter version so they wouldn't get caught on stuff. Same thing this year, except for the adults.

I dunno...maybe I'm just an overprotective worrywart...but giving a deadly weapon to a kid?

Insane.

[Greyhound]

21. Somebody possibly being punished for lethal stupidity?

I'm shocked, shocked, to find that there is gambling going on here.

(...your winnings, sir)

[deutsey]

32. Such a fucking sad story

I have 8-year-old twins, a boy and a girl. I can't imagine what that father is going through, but I also can't imagine letting either of my children (my oldest is 11) shoot a fricking Uzi. I fired a .22 rifle when I was about 12 or 13 and that was under strict supervision of a trained gun expert on a firing range. I can't imagine giving a child an Uzi to shoot under any circumstance.

Regardless, this story depresses me...

[LostinVA]

35. Agreed

The father fucked up big time, and he'll have to live with that knowledge ever single day of his life. There's a reason why parents of children killed like this (ie accidents caused by the parents) often divorce,and occasionally commit suicide.

Very sad.