The myth of "job creation".

[SoCalDem]

When jobs are removed from one state, and "created" in another...at a reduced wage for the same work, it may be a "gain" for the receiving state, but it's a net LOSS for the industry/country.

I hope Obama's "money-people" figure out a better way to report jobs, and to go back and re-do the numbers for the last 8 years.

example:

A $25hr union job (with benefits) in Michigan is ended
That worker takes 2 part time $10 hr jobs (no benefits)

2 $12hr jobs in a right to work state are created (with lesser or no benefits)

on paper, that's a +3 , but it's probably a LOSS overall because of the lost spending power..

The loss of the $25 hr job, means that a kid may not go to college, a new car won't be bought, a vacation won;t be taken, etc.

The 2 part time jobs & the 2 $12 hr jobs with few benefits will not be sufficient to maintain much buying power, and the longevity of the job is always in jeopardy, so long-term planning is unlikely.

Taking something from someone else does not "create" anything..it only redistributes it.. Republicans are usually vociferously against "redistribution of wealth", but that;s exactly what they do when they raid their state coffers to lure businesses from other states or from foreign entities. They call it "enhancement" for their citizens, and it is, but it is ALSO corporate cannibalism, because it creates nothing "new"..it only sets up new facilities to draw wealth and prosperity from older facilities that do/have done the same thing as their new facility.

States-rights make it possible and profitable for states to set up differing degrees of rules & regs, and of course an industry that generates pollution, will always look for a place that will allow them to pollute at will, undercut the competition and then haul profits out of the US.

[Skink]

1. There's still 12 dollar an hours jobs?

[Warpy]

3. There are, but good luck

getting one of the five jobs 300 people show up to apply for.

[Lifetimedem]

15. In our area 700 showed up for 10 jobs

[truedelphi]

5. Isn't it sad that that is our reaction??

$ 12 an hour in mylocale is like winning the lottery

[Turbineguy]

2. Ah yes, the Bush Economic Miracle....

I hope to miss it soon.

Actually... I hope it ends soon. I doubt I'll miss it.

But I was thinking.... it's a bit of social engineering to make easy money in the stockmarket dry up and force people to go out and look for a real job.

[BlooInBloo]

4. It's false that it's a zero-sum game. It is perfectly possible for the whole pie to get bigger.

[Turbineguy]

7. That requires the creation of wealth

the operative word here being "create".

[Warpy]

9. That's accomplished

by building infrastructure, developing natural resources, and manufacturing items people want.

We've watched these assholes let our infrastructure rot, sell off our natural resources, and transfer our industrial base overseas.

And now they have the absolute gall to be upset that we're not buying their shit?

[SoCalDem]

11. And by creating something NEW..and useful

Having 14 different brands of the same washing machine/car/tv/shoe/etc. is creating a "thing", but it;s also diluting the value of it because there are only so many people wanting to BUY that stuff, and the more of it made, only dilutes the value and quality as each manuffacturer seeks to make it cheaper and cheaper..

[Turbineguy]

12. Absolutely

Repubs think of infrastructure in terms of cost, where it is in actuality an asset.

[hfojvt]

14. it's also possible for the whole pie to get bigger

and for the working class to get shrinking slices of this growing pie. It could happen I mean. Not, of course, in the greatest and the richest country in the world :patriot:

[ColbertWatcher]

6. Yes! Excellent post! Proud to kick and rec! n/t

[Warpy]

8. We've been trying to get this concept through to cement skulled

media addicted fools in this country for thirty years.

Finally, things are so bad that people out there are starting to realize the one thing a business needs to succeed is a customer base.

Without customers, no business can stay open.

People who are working a patchwork of low paid, dead end jobs with no benefits are not going to be customers for anything but subsistence items.

That might be starting to dawn on even the flinty hearted and hidebound auto executives.

[SoCalDem]

10. we might start to see a "back to the land" movement if things don't change

That's the one benefit that farming has.. If you can grow food, at least you will eat..and if you can build a rudimentary shelter, you can stay dry..

welcome to the Third World..

[bvar22]

16. There is already a movement.

It is small, but growing every day.

We started making plans after Campaign/Election 2004. We sold everything, cashed in most of 401K, and bought land in a very rural and unspoiled part of the South....surrounded by National Forest, long growing season, protected on property clean water source, very low property taxes.
We moved to our New Home from the Big City (Minneapolis) in 2006.
Since arriving here, we have met a surprising amount of others up in these hills who moved here for the same reasons....unpolluted, sustainable, independent, healthy, organic, living.

We will no longer pay for the obscenity this country has become.
We have reduced our taxable income to near poverty levels.
We no longer use "credit", don't have a mortgage, build everything ourselves, buy "used, 2nd hand, or salvage" directly from previous owners, and Barter, Trade, or pay CASH to avoid all taxes whenever possible.
As much as possible, we have stopped consuming in the Corporate America sense of the word.

We have planted a large vegetable, herb, and fruit garden, have two healthy HoneyBee colonies (expand to 4 colonies next Spring), and keep a dozen chickens. More fruit trees and a large BlueBerry Patch are being added this year. We are freezing and canning this year for consumption over the Winter. Next year we will be solar drying food & herbs for storage and marketing.

After 2 years, we are still on the Corporate hook for electricity, Sat TV, some gasoline, and about 1/2 of our food, but have plans to eliminate or minimize those. Internet access is by cheap Dial Up.

We realize we are very fortunate to be in a situation to do this. We have no dependent children, and are in good health. We miss the luxury of Urban Consumption, but have little desire to return.
We pray that an Obama administration and a Democratic Congress can turn things around for America, but see no signs that this will happen. Our focus has become local Humanitarian/Community Issues, and methods of denying support for Corporate America.

[hfojvt]

13. interesting way of looking at it

but what about another side? What happens if the two people in RTW state do not get those $12 an hour jobs? Many people in this country are working odd jobs or whatever they can get which is sometimes nothing. I used to find it strange in my first factory job. So many people would just up and quit. Tuesday they worked and Wednesday they did not come in. I wondered where they went and what they did. Did they quickly find other jobs? Did they have somebody supporting them? Did they get government assistance?

Before I got that job, and at other times in my life, I have lived off of savings, sometimes pretty low to the ground.

From the perspective of the job-seeker, MORE jobs, even if they pay a little less is better than fewer really good-paying jobs.