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Jack Rabbit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-09 06:15 PM
Original message
Response to Professor Yoo
Professor John Yoo, one of the architects of the Bush regime's policy toward detainees in the war on terror, wrote a piece in the Wall Street Journal today condemning President Obama's decision to close the detainee facility at Guantánamo Naval Base and to end the policy of torture, called "enhanced interrogation techniques" by Yoo and other members of the regime and by their cheerleaders in the right wing punditocracy.

Mr. Yoo argues:
  • The civilian law-enforcement system cannot prevent terrorist attacks;
  • The government will be unable to get more information from captured al Qaeda terrorists.
Mr. Yoo, who is himself a potential defendant in any future war crimes trials, lacks the credibility to make such assertions. Moreover, his case for keeping Guantánamo open is every bit as fact free as was the Bush regime's case to go to war against Iraq.

First of all, I don't view those lawyers, including Professor Yoo, who advised Mr. Bush on what is legal concerning detainees, so much as bona fide legal advisors as co-conspirators with Bush and Cheney to trash the Geneva Conventions and the Convention against Torture. Yoo, Alberto Gonzales, Jay Bybee and others should be prosecuted for war crimes along with Bush and Cheney. The legal reason is too spurious to take seriously. Their mission was to give the former regime legal cover by redefining torture in a way that waterboarding would not be torture, when no reasonable person would say otherwise.

Yoo's pleas that Guantánamo remain open that torture continue are based on the dubious propositions that civilian courts are insufficient to keep us safe from terrorism and that torture works. To the first proposition I offer the trial and conviction of José Padilla as a refutation. Try as they might, Bush and his legal henchmen could not keep American citizen Padilla from being tried in federal court for terrorist-related charges. Padilla had his day in court and was convicted. It would appear to me that an ordinary federal court was quite sufficient to keep the American public safe from Mr. Padilla. Mr. Yoo also compares the Guantánamo detainees to pirates, "illegal combatants who do not fight on behalf of a nation and refuse to obey the laws of war." However, this is a false analogy. A pirate, when captured on the high seas, is charged with a crime and brought to court to face trial. Here, he enjoys the rights of due process. On the other hand, Guantánamo detainees are denied due process, including the right to be charged with a crime. Most detainees were never charged with any crime. Indeed, the purpose of Guantánamo was to violate the human rights of the detainees to a fair trial and any protection against torture or other harsh or humiliating interrogation techniques.

As for torture itself, which Mr. Yoo defends along with such erudite spokesmen of the lunatic fringe as Sean Hannity, not only is it universally condemned as cruel, but it doesn't work. A subject being tortured will likely say anything to get his interrogators to stop. Consequently, nothing a torture victim says should be taken at face value. That includes Khalid Sheik Mohammad, who confessed to being the mastermind behind the September 11 attacks but to a number of other schemes, some never carried out. It also includes Ibn al Shaykh al Libbi, who under interrogation by waterbording in 2002 told investigators that the Iraqi government trained al Qaida members to use biochemical weapons. We know now that this is not true, yet by falling back on this kind of "information", the Bush regime cited as a fact the working relationship between Saddam's regime and Osama's terror network. The only thing torture worked for in this instance was telling neoconservatives what they wanted to hear, which were talking points and not necessarily facts. Bush and the neocons didn't care about the facts. They were lying and they knew they were lying when they told us they had reliable information about Saddam's weapons and his ties to al Qaida. Like the legal memoranda approving torture itself, the intelligence gained by torture was suspect at best and worthless at worst.

Speaking about sources we should not take at face value, we have only the word of former Bush regime spokesmen such as Professor Yoo and Mr. Cheney and sycophants like Sean Hannity that valuable information was gained by harsh interrogation techniques. Against this is an article by journalist David Rose that appeared in December's Vanity Fair that states counterterrorist officials on both sides of the Atlantic conclude unanomously that "coercive methods" failed to provide "significant levels of actionable intelligence." Moreover, in the specific case of Khalid Sheik Mohammad, Rose quotes a senior Pentagon analyst as saying, "K.S.M. produced no actionable intelligence. He was trying to tell us how stupid we were."

Mr. Yoo shouldn't tell the public the kind of nonsense that appears today under his by-line in The Wall Street Journal. He should save it for the judge.
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aquart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-09 06:18 PM
Response to Original message
1. Yes.
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Jack Rabbit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-09 07:24 PM
Response to Original message
2. For the Central Time Zone
(Now watching former Governor Blagojevich)
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Jack Rabbit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-09 08:24 PM
Response to Original message
3. And now for Mountain Time . . .
Hello, Denver . . .
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ColbertWatcher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-09 08:26 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. Hello from CA! n/t
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ColbertWatcher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-09 08:34 PM
Response to Original message
5. Yoo is a good boy, but ...
... he can't be held accountable for what comes out his mouth because it originates from his head and we all know he has no control over that.

One more thing: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=8143742&mesg_id=8143742

That link goes to a great essay I read years ago and was thinking about lately, which addresses Yoo's assertion that "civilian law-enforcement system cannot prevent terrorist attacks."

I'd like to know who's hiring all these GOPers? Melon Scaife? Reverend Moon? Murdoch?

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FSogol Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-09 08:58 PM
Response to Original message
6. K&R. n/t
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MadMaddie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-09 09:00 PM
Response to Original message
7. You can't find a bigger bunch of idiots....seriously
do they not think that everything they write and say, in papers and on the TV machine cannot be used as evidence?

I hope that the Hague is capturing everything....
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Hissyspit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-09 09:06 PM
Response to Original message
8. Larisa Alexandrovna's response to you, Yoo:
http://www.atlargely.com/2009/01/john-yoo-hoping-and-praying-not-to-go-to-jail.html

John Yoo: hoping and praying not to go to jail...
John "Loves Torture" Yoo is all upset - poor man - because he is not happy with President Obama. Penning a best-of-Bush-propaganda for the Wall Street Murdoch, Yoo writes the following (apparently his lawyer has not told him to shut up yet):

During his first week as commander in chief, President Barack Obama ordered the closure of Guantanamo Bay and terminated the CIA's special authority to interrogate terrorists. While these actions will certainly please his base -- gone are the cries of an "imperial presidency" -- they will also seriously handicap our intelligence agencies from preventing future terrorist attacks. In issuing these executive orders, Mr. Obama is returning America to the failed law enforcement approach to fighting terrorism that prevailed before Sept. 11, 2001.

Now boys and girls, how many lies can you spot in just the above paragraph alone?

Lie 1: Torture produces good intelligence. No, it does not. Ask any credible intelligence officer (and I have asked plenty) and they will tell you no it does not work and does not produce actionable results.

Lie 2: The CIA has special authority. No, it does not. The last time this argument was used was during the Church Investigations. It did not work then and it won't work now.

Lie 3: 9/11 Could have been stopped if the CIA was allowed to torture. No, the attack on this nation was not a failure of intelligence. The IC did its job - the 8/6/2001 PDB (among other, many warnings) is an example of this - it is the leadership who failed. Spin it any way you want - and it has been by the Bush administration - 9/11 was a failure of the President to take action, not a failure of intelligence.

Now, back to Yoo's additional distortions and fabrications:

What such a review would have made clear is that the civilian law-enforcement system cannot prevent terrorist attacks. What is needed are the tools to gain vital intelligence, which is why, under President George W. Bush, the CIA could hold and interrogate high-value al Qaeda leaders. On the advice of his intelligence advisers, the president could have authorized coercive interrogation methods like those used by Israel and Great Britain in their antiterrorism campaigns. (He could even authorize waterboarding, which he did three times in the years after 9/11.)

Really? Ask the UK.

The real reason John Yoo wrote this foolish, inaccurate piece is in the hopes of gathering around him some support for his illegal actions.

You may wish to read his latest epic verbiage festival, but I would urge you not to waste your time. The man is a liar, a coward, and now defends his illegal actions by using lies and discredited propaganda to justify the unjustifiable.
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rateyes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-09 09:48 PM
Response to Original message
9. Fuck Yoo....
Yes, Yoo, not you.
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BlooInBloo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-30-09 12:26 AM
Response to Reply #9
14. gawddammitalltohell! People are beating me to everything! hrmph.
:rofl:
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rateyes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-30-09 07:44 AM
Response to Reply #14
17. Sorry.
:evilgrin: :fistbump:
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Jack Rabbit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-09 10:47 PM
Response to Original message
10. And for my neighbors on the West Coast
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Jack Rabbit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-30-09 12:09 AM
Response to Original message
11. One more time around the block
Edited on Fri Jan-30-09 12:09 AM by Jack Rabbit
!!
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gratuitous Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-30-09 12:14 AM
Response to Original message
12. It's a poor criminal who won't defend his actions
I mean, there are guys apprehended with blood dripping off their hands and a body at their feet who protest their innocence. Why would anyone expect any less from Mr. Yoo? The major difference I see is that the Wall Street Journal doesn't usually give over column space to the first guy; not sure why they gave Yoo such a nice platform.
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Jack Rabbit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-30-09 12:25 AM
Response to Reply #12
13. Remember, the WSJ is a Murdoch publication now
Think FoxNews in print.
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csziggy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-30-09 12:32 AM
Response to Original message
15. The Bush System - Yoo has given the human rights abuses of the last eight years a name
Such a nice, innocuous sounding phrase that can be the shorthand for torture, rendition, illegal denial of rights and an entire spectrum of war crimes.
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Jack Rabbit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-30-09 01:16 AM
Response to Reply #15
16. KO thought so, too
Yoo was named Worst Person for this little dropping today.
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Jack Rabbit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-30-09 10:34 AM
Response to Original message
18. Good morning, America
Let's fight fascism today.
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