Conservatism is what it is and will be forever. It is not something you can bend and shape

[radfringe]

Limbaugh closed CPAC last evening by declaring that too many misconceptions exist about who conservatives really are, and he wants to change that. "When we (conservatives) look at a group of people, we see Americans — we don't see groups of people, we don't see victims, we see potentials." he said.

"Conservatism is what it is and will be forever. It is not something you can bend and shape," he said.

http://townhall.com/columnists/SalenaZito/2009/03/01/conservatives_energized_by_ideas?page=2

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there seems to be a conflict here. when talking about people being potentials it implies the possibility of something new emerging, a change, growth and movement in some direction.

However,Limbaugh follows it up by stating "Conservatism is what it is and will be forever. It is not something you can bend and shape"

This implies conservatism is locked, it will not change, it refuses to change. There will be no growth, no change, no movement, and nothing new. You can't even say conservatism is written in stone because even stone will change if given enough time.

While people may have potential, the conservatives just want more of the same - nothing more and certainly nothing new.

[Jamastiene]

1. Limbaugh contradicts himself with those two statements.

Too bad his followers won't wake up and see that.

[ThomWV]

2. I do not take that message lightly - and have been trying to find a way to say it myself

You should listen very closely to what that lard ass has to say - because that is the enemy and if you do not know him he will defeat you.

He is right. Conservatism is what it is and its not going away. When it returns it will be stronger than ever. He's wrong that it can't be bent and shaped. It has been; bent to a shape beyond recognition but it is not broken. CPAC showed it is alive and well. Now it will go through a transformation. Where its going is almost certain though and it won't be Rush that runs the show.

[radfringe]

5. by his saying it can't be bent or shaped

it implies more of the same - nothing different. When a group, government, movement or even a species fails to change in response to it's environment - it dies.

while I doubt the "conservative movement" in the broad sense won't die, limbaughs assertion of 'not gonna change' locks them into a frozen state of stagnation. CPAC may be alive, but it's far from well - the message coming out of CPAC is Democrats/liberals are bad, government is bad, taxcuts are good - nothing new there, the same tired mouth-foaming message.

[ThomWV]

7. Don't get me wrong, I think Rush will be on the wrong side when it happens

But I am certain that the Republican Party will return rapidly to its conservative roots. Two years from now the Republican Party will be shed of the likes of Rush and Palin and the whole dam party, at least the part you can see, will look more like Eishenower's party than Bush's.

[radfringe]

11. 2 years? I tend to doubt it

at least based on the blather coming from the NOPers - there is no inclination to change. They seem very reluctant to even admit there is a need to change.

I think 4-6 years is a more reasonable timeline - especially if the NOPers take another thumping in 2010.

[ThomWV]

15. You may very well be right but I'll tell you why I said such a short period

It isn't the mouthpieces on TV that will force the change, its the money in the background. I think the blowhards will disappear almost immediately when the tap from Corporate Boardrooms dries up and that the serious old entrenched money will demand the sort of conservative restraint with sensible investment (sometimes very large) similar to what they will see as the golden years - and I ain't talkin' about Reagan either. I think they will hie to the memory of Ike; after all Ronnie is finally being appropriate discredited. As goes the money so goes the party - hence the speed, that was my thinking.

[radfringe]

16. do you think think the corp boardroom tap will dry up that quickly?

Obama administration is or will be pushing for more regulation - this won't sit well with the looters of wall street (and elsewhere - they may be inclined to pump more money into the NOPers coffers for a message of regulation bad, deregulation good...}

I think you are giving the NOPers and their benefactors a bit more credit for being "sensible" than is warranted. The blowhards have the microphone and their blather is what is being heard - not the concern that may be expressed in boardrooms about the direction of the NOPer party.

[ThomWV]

18. Oh, they will be pumping money alright, but not to the blowhards

That is sort of my point. Smart people will not long support blowhards who are clearly out of power and favor, but still their interests will be represented. That's why I think Newt will be one of the last to die out - or maybe a better way to say it one of the last to survive. He holds a grain of rationality that the likes of Rush can never come up with. Then they have their past, Bush 43 can't be mentioned and for the sake of avoiding confusion neither can 41. Reagan is now being exposed for the fraud he was and I don't think the people will be fooled again with trickle down economics. That means they have to go back to Eisenhower for a model. Now that's not too bad a model and they can rebuild a base on it. That is exactly what I predict will happen - and I don't think it will take long. Very rich men have lost a lot and they won't suffer fools long.

[MadHound]

3. Limbaugh has no clue about history does he?

After all, it was just thirty years that the RW fundies became a driving force in the conservative movement. Before that, the Republican party was the party of big business, not big business and whacked fundie social conservatives.

There was another change in the conservative movement with Barry Goldwater in '64, when the racists of the South fled to the Republican party.

The party is now undergoing another change. Aghast at what they wrought, the traditional big business, moderate Republican class fled the Republican party for Obama last fall, and now they are in a battle with the social conservatives for the future of the party.

Limpballs is simply clueless, about history and so much else.

[baldguy]

4. Then the RW shit we've been dealing with the last 30 yrs isn't conservatism.

What Rush has been peddling is fascism.

[ixion]

6. a couple things...

1) I never try to apply rationality to ANY Republican premise, because they never use rational thought when creating it.

2) These people are not actually "conservative". They are, in essence, violent authoritarian extremists. There's a huge difference.

[radfringe]

17. you hit the nail on the head.....

unfortunately they are wearing a "conservative mask".

it also presents an opportunity to discuss, define and contrast what is a conservative vs VAEs (violent authoritarian extremists)

[ixion]

20. I would like to see such a discussion, escpecially in the MSM

where the topic is the 800 pound gorilla in the room that no one seems to want to discuss.

In theory, a 'conservative' supports minimal government, state's rights, individual liberties and fiscal responsibility.

The GOP claims 'ownership' of these concepts, but in action support none of them. Not one.

And yet no one bother's to call them on it when they bellow it out during an interview or a speech.

It's maddening, I tell you, and one of the core reasons why I stopped watching broadcast news.

I'm interested in the Truth, and nothing more. The Truth also seems to be a large mammal in the room no one wants to mention.

[mwb970]

8. Apparently the conservative movement refuses to evolve.

At least they're consistent. Of course, not evolving leads to extinction, but fortunately they don't believe in that!

[Orsino]

12. They didn't *have* to evolve

They know that our innate worship of money and testosterone guarantees them a nearly equal share of the vote. They've always been able to make up the difference by changing a few faces and appealing to fear.

I'm not convinced yet that they are in serious trouble, or if so, that they realize it.

[Waiting For Everyman]

9. It's a "one trick poney"... corporatism.

The "social values" are only to disguise that fact. Of, by, and for the rich is all it's about.

[Thor_MN]

10. The disarray they now face is due to them having control for 8 years

They wrecked the economy and reputation of the United States. They are now in denial trying to say that Bush did not represent them. Their mental disconnects in thinking that supply side, trickle down economics actually work are amplified by the fact that they see Bush when they look in a mirror.

[jimshoes]

13. Conservatism .... Cancer

same thing.

[dem629]

14. I agree with Rush.

(Wait. Hear me out!)

I agree that conservatism is what it is and will be forever b/c it is not something you can bend and shape.

We KNOW this is true because all of us know at least one conservative personally who will not change their view on something even with overwhelming facts right in their face.

We KNOW this is true because we just had a conservative president who "stood by principle" and would not "bend and shape" a new view to deal with new incontrovertible evidence that rendered his previous opinion wrong.

These people live by the philosophy "Don't bother me with the facts; I've already made up my mind."

[TahitiNut]

19. Inflexible? Yup. Chimeric and hypocritical? Absolutely.

:shrug:

[brazos121200]

21. If the republican party ended tomorrow, there would still be

conservatives. There will always be people that want the status quo, and people that are willing to sell their principles to whoever can afford to pay for them. There have always been conservatives and probably always will be, the best that can be hoped for is that they do not acquire political power and are kept in the minority. Someday, maybe reason will prevail and they will creep back into the hole they came out of.