If you knew your neighbour is an undocumented immigrant

[UndertheOcean]

would you report him/her to ICE or the FBI.

Say you don't like him , or he scratched your car , or his dog went to the bathroom on your lawn , would that affect your decision.

just wondering.

[mucifer]

1. No and No.

BTW do you realize if they are Latino their ancestors have probably been on this land longer than yours.

[UndertheOcean]

3. Good !

[provis99]

26. but what if the illegal is a loud, redneck Canadian?

would you turn him in?

[mucifer]

27. Why would a Canadian like to live here?

:)

[sandnsea]

56. I have an illegal Canadian

down the street. He's living with someone here. I suspect there are other illegal residents in my neighborhood. I don't care. If I can keep the tweakers down to one or two a year, that's all I care.

[Ken Burch]

31. I'd damn sure turn in Stephen Harper's loud, redneck Canadian ass

Wouldn't turn in anybody else, but that guy would deserve to be shipped home and thrown to the harp seals!

[Name removed]

94. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Lost in CT]

47. Well actually if they are an undocumented worker there ancestors haven't

Latinos that lived in the United states in the 19th century became US citizens. Plus Reagan gave amnesty in I believe 1988.

[mucifer]

48. yeah but hundred of years ago people there weren't boarders and people

were migrating back and forth.

[Lost in CT]

49. Right but an undocumented worker pretty much by definition hasn't been

in the US more than 30 years (and that is stretching it)

[mucifer]

50. But there's a chance their ancestors were long before mine were.

[Lost in CT]

52. Not really... the "mexican" territories that America purchased were pretty sparsly populated

Most immigrants come from Southern Mexico and Central America....

[L. Coyote]

59. The War on Mexico is rarely perceived as a "purchase"

Did we also purchase the people we killed, or were they thrown in for free?

[Lost in CT]

61. Well most of them were outside Mexico City... so no. nt

[L. Coyote]

68. When Mexico City was under US siege, they even killed mlitary cadets

Los Niños Héroes
Mexico has known many heroes through her long and eventful history. Perhaps none have captured the imagination and stirred the hearts to the degree that Los Niños Héroes .....

The Mexican-American War was in its final chapters when the Battle of Chapultepec took place. The date was September 13, 1847 and American forces were quickly advancing on Chapultepec Castle. General Antonio Lopez de Santa Anna, who was in charge of forces in Mexico City, recognized the strategic advantage that Chapultepec Hill held. Geographically, its value was enormous as it position protected Mexico City on its west side from invaders.

Unfortunately, there were not enough resources available for its defense. Rising some 200 feet above the surrounding landscape, the site was naturally fortified. However, American forces greatly outnumbered their Mexican counterparts, both in manpower and gunpowder. Many prominent Americans, including Abraham Lincoln and John Quincy Adams considered the war unjust and questioned the rationale for the invasion.

In the years preceding the war, Chapultepec Castle had been utilized as Mexico’s military training academy. As a result, when the war broke out, there were dozens of teenage cadets in attendance. General Nicolás Bravo commanded the forces stationed at Chapultepec Hill and when it became apparent that the American forces were triumphing, he ordered his men, including the cadets, to retreat to safety.

Six young men, however, refused to relinquish their posts and bravely met the superior forces of the Americans. Their names were Juan de la Barrera, Juan Escutia, Francisco Márquez, Agustín Melgar, Fernando Montes de Oca and Vicente Suárez. They died that September day, defending their country. Their sacrifice has been forever etched into Mexico’s history. .....

[Lost in CT]

70. What is wrong with killing military cadets????

young men with guns wearing uniforms and shooting at you seem like a viable target.

And in honor of St patricks day don't forget the Irish heroes of Mexico.

[L. Coyote]

71. I oppose war crimes, just as did President Lincoln. But, this is the USA, and it seems we wage

war any which way we want, and kill who we want. We just kill people for defending their country from invasion, and justify it however we want. And we stole the lands we wanted.

"...refusing to accept a cessation of territory, would be to abandon all our just demands, and to wage the war, bearing all the expense, without a purpose or definite object."
President Polk.

"Any people anywhere, being inclined and having the power, have the right to rise up, and shake off the existing government, and form a new one that suits them better. This is a most valuable--a most sacred right--a right, which we hope and believe, is to liberate the world,"
Abraham Lincoln, speech in the U.S. House of Representatives, subject: The War on Mexico. Delivered January 12, 1848.

President Polk defended his ordering the Mexican invasion, but Lincoln had this to say about what provoked the hostility,

"The marching of an army into the midst of a peaceful Mexican settlement, frightening the inhabitants away, leaving their growing crops and their property to destruction, to you may appear a perfectly amiable, peaceful, unprovoking procedure; but it does not appear so to us. So to call such an act, to us appears no other than a naked, impudent absurdity...the war was unnecessarily and unconstitutionally commenced by the President."
A. Lincoln, July 27, 1848.

On Feb. 2, 1848, the Guadalupe Hidalgo Treaty was signed. Mexico conceded Texas, California, and the Territory of New Mexico for 15 million pesos.

[Lost in CT]

73. I agree but they were two countries very similar with a land dispute.

This isn't the ABC wars or the French invasion of Mexico,, This was a fair fight... one side had its shit together and the other did not... the side with its shit together won.

[L. Coyote]

76. Just like Iraq, make up a fucking excuse, and excuse US, but we are going to kill your asses!

like it or not, and steal your resources too, cuz we can!

And then we will write the history we want, and people will repeat it ad nauseum.

[Lost in CT]

77. This has nothing to do with Iraq.... what are you taking about.

Two recently independent European colonies in North America went to war over some sparsely populated land... We wanted to go west they wanted to go north...

It really is that simple.... The US isn't blameless here but neither was the Mexican government

[L. Coyote]

78. I'm talking about US military invasions of soveriegn nations. It's an old habit, you know!

Beginning before the genocidal extermination of the Native nations in Ohio!

Maybe you are ill-informed or something? The US invaded Mexico to steal the West, and President Polk as much as said so himself. President Lincoln opposed the illegal invasion. Read the history first, please, before making stuff up.

[Lost in CT]

80. The Spanish didn't show up in California till 1769

"When the Europeans came to the new world, Spain claimed the land we now call California. Not finding riches there, Spain did not consider California to be as important as other "richer" areas, such as Mexico. But in the 1700's Spain began to realize they needed to settle in California if they were going to keep the land. So in 1769, a Spanish missionary, Junipero Serra, arrived in Alto California and began a series of missions, which would stretch from San Diego to California. Native Americans living in these areas lost their lands, and were forced to work at the missions. Many died."

Hey the Spanish acted just like the Americans... wow...

So much for their moral authority.

I stand by my previous statement.

[L. Coyote]

83. Like I said, excuses for invasions. We are really good at that, even today for old invasions.

Not to mention, the Native People of California had rights too, which we trampled if we did not just shoot them dead.

But I guess that does not matter to you, since "Spanish" got there before the US, we can invade.

[EFerrari]

81. You realize that there are people alive in this country

that have no birth certificate because they weren't issued at the time of their birth, right?

The situation isn't nearly as neat as you seem to believe it is. And some Latino families have been here since much earlier than the 19th Century.

[Lost in CT]

93. That is a horse of a different color.... and has more to do with voting rights than immigration.

But lets stay reality based. Leaving aside Reagan's amnesty in 1988 the great majority of latinos who are legally eligible to live in the United States have paperwork that states so. The undocumented worker issue deals with mostly fairly recent immigrants of the last thirty years who entered this country illegally.

[EFerrari]

109. Well, no, it doesn't. It's just a continuation of the same impulse

that has been around since before California became a state.

[Thothmes]

90. You mean the land that they wrested from

the original inhabitants.

[moundsview]

2. Only if his dog pissed on my loan, I hate that!

n/t

[DBoon]

62. Because all dogs piss on your lawn

However, a dog that pisses on your loan deserves special treatment

[greenkal]

What do dogs have to do with loans?

What in the hell?

[greenkal]

64. What do dogs have to do with loans?

What in the hell?

[Siyahamba]

4. That would give me a good excuse not to pay that loan.

:D

[UndertheOcean]

7. spelling NAZI !!!

[spindrifter]

5. No way.

[Exilednight]

6. Did he vote for Bush? n/t

[UndertheOcean]

10. Say he voted for Nader !!!

:)

[Exilednight]

37. I'd flip a coin {snark} n/t

[BlooInBloo]

41. Ok... now you've made it tough on me!

:rofl:

[BlooInBloo]

42. self-delete - wrong branch.

[Deja Q]

8. Well, if I knew it I'd clap my hands...

I'd need proof.

Since I don't, I'll let store clerks and other people who ask for IDs do the work.

If I see anything suspicious, I'll call the authorities. And I don't care about what color their skin is.

[BlueJazz]

9. I tried to pay my loan but my neighbors dog pissed on it.

[skooooo]

11. How can you really know something like that?? nt

[UndertheOcean]

13. Will , he has shifty eyes , and clearly stealing yobs

[roody]

32. I am not qualified to prune grapes, so they are not stealing my job.

[donheld]

57. Maybe they told them.

I have a dear friend who told us he has no green card. I'm not about to tell.

[AlCzervik]

12. your loan is good for me to Poop on!

[mucifer]

14. I already know undocumented people. Most I like. Some I don't.

Never called no one about it. I never will.

[UndertheOcean]

16. cool !!!

High five !

[stray cat]

15. No way - only if he was violent and in that case you could call the police on anyone

[Jamastiene]

19. That sounds like my answer.

I just don't see the point in cutting anyone's chances out in life. Unless they are some kind of threat to me, I don't see the point in turning them in. :shrug:

[Warpy]

17. No, he'd have to be the kind of asshole who shot at me

on my way out to pick up the mail. Then I'd call the cops and let them make all the other appropriate calls.

I never sweat the small stuff.

[Abaddon865]

18. You still need proof

Look while I'm not a fan of ANYONE immigrating here illegally, it is not my job, duty, or obligation to report him or her.

[Brazenly Liberal]

20. Absolutely not.

I'm not buying the rightwing bullshit about undocumented immigrants. I find it offensive that these people are demonized so. If I didn't like him, so what? He might not like me, either.

[chollybocker]

21. Damn French.

Oh wait, this is a 'Damn Mexicans' thread. Or is it brown people in general? I can't keep up with this hate agenda.

[UndertheOcean]

22. Damn Dutch , i hate the Dutch !

[chollybocker]

Yes, especially the Dutch!

And don't get me started on the Welsh...
;)

[UndertheOcean]

36. Don't get me started on the Welsh ,i will need blood pressure meds. n/t

[BlooInBloo]

45. I hate them worse than dogs! They live in windmills, and mince around in clogs!

:rofl:

I heart this mp3: http://blogfiles.wfmu.org/KF/2006/05/dowie/John_Dowie_-_British_Tourist.mp3

[Sheepshank]

66. crazy Dutch bastards n/t

[NoPasaran]

102. Gouda breath bastards, scheming to saw our doors in half...

[Hell Hath No Fury]

104. Here in SF, that "undocumented worker"

is as likely to be Irish or Chinese as Latino! :D

The whole "illegal immigrant" is too, too often a cover for what is really just "no more brown people". :eyes:

[gratuitous]

23. Wait; how do I know my neighbor ISN'T an undocumented immigrant???

I'd better start calling the cops. Just in case. That's the Cheney One Percent Doctrine!

[Mind_your_head]

24. I might not *like* it, but I'm not a "snitch", so NO and NO eom

[roody]

25. My friends and neighbors are, and I would never report them.

[UndertheOcean]

28. Because you are a decent human being , something more people here should be .

[noamnety]

29. I'd most likely get along with him in the first place.

I tend to seek out immigrants in general.

[Veritas_et_Aequitas]

30. I mind my own business excepting for cases in which

life/limb could be harmed. If the neighbor's not causing harm, then I leave him alone.

[Elidor]

33. My neighbor was an illegal alien

Her children and grandchildren are citizens, however. She was caught and deported, and it took her three months to get back here to her babies. When I finally learned she was back, I was relieved for all of them. They were good neighbors and very hardworking people.

[UndertheOcean]

34. Its Good that ended will . We must stop tearing families apart like this

[treestar]

35. If there are 13 million, it might not make that much of a difference

They'd just go onto the end of a presumably long, long list.

We have a really bad immigration law, and apparently can't or don't choose to enforce it.

They really just should be legalized, so they can demand equal wages and working conditions required under the law.

[RB TexLa]

38. No

[Arkansas Granny]

39. No. The only reason I would report any of my neighbors is if they were

engaging in activities that directly threatened my safety or property, such as drug dealing, violent behavior, theft, etc.

[earcandle]

40. No. That would be like murdering someone.

[Dappleganger]

43. If he was a dick, yes.

I wish we could deport all dickheads.

Responsible people get a free pass, IMO. They're the kind who built this country.

[BlooInBloo]

44. If he/she was a threat to society in some fashion, I'd certainly call the police...

Probably the only way I'd directly call the INS would be if he/she was doing something directly related. Like, just to make up an example, if he/she was "importing" little mexican kids to be sold as houseservants or some shit like that.

[Sancho]

46. Down here, you'd have to turn in half the population...

maybe we need a logical way for people to become legal without fear of unreasonable jail or torture...even if you turn 'em in, the system is overwhelmed.

[nevergiveup]

51. I wouldn't report them

unless they had a deranged Pit Bull. Even then I would probably feel guilty.

[JI7]

53. NO, and the reasons you gave are not enough to turn them in either

[AndrewP]

54. No I would not.

[paulsby]

55. no. i am the police, and am under no obligation to do so

legally or by dept. code.

i am 100% against illegal immigration, but have nothing against illegal immigrants.

one of my best friends is a canadian, working here on a visa, and she busts her ass to meet all the requirements. she is NOT a big fan of illegal immigration.

my general philosophy is that i don't police my neighborhood, nor do i care what people do inside the privacy of their homes.

apart from like rape, and murder and stuff like that.

[Marie26]

58. That's a pretty shitty thing to do. nt

[Number23]

60. The world is full of so many assholes that eventually one of them would turn him in

So, no. I would not report him/her to anyone.

[DesertRat]

63. No

I know that some of my student's parents are undocumented. It's none of my business.

[L. Coyote]

65. If people did shit like that, they would not be here! In AZ, until recently at least,

the undocumented Americans lived out in the open, without fear of people knowing their status.
I have even done translations for people with the police, and the police did nothing when they found out.

[littlebit]

67. Hell yes I would report his ass.

I did report a whole house full a few years ago.

[EFerrari]

79. You'd have been further ahead learning to spell "Carolina".

[Raine]

87. LOL

:thumbsup:

[littlebit]

100. Is that really the best insult you could come up with?

Come on I'm sure you can do better than that. :rofl:

[csziggy]

69. I did not even report the guy who assaulted me to them

The wife he paid to marry him so he could stay in the country finally turned him in after he beat her once too many times.

Long story but he got sent back to Sweden just in time to be drafted to go to Iraq for the first Gulf War.

[jannyk]

72. Been there, done that, so no! I was an illegal for my first 3 years...

in the states, I have now been here for 28 years. There were thousands of us, English and Irish, all overstaying our visas, working and living in Houston in '78-81.

Used to work in places which would get regularly busted and we'd suddenly be missing the dishwasher, veg cook and busboy etc. Yet, as an English, white, 28yr old female - I was never even asked my legality. Oh, and nine times out of ten, the deported staff would be back within a week!

[shireen]

74. no no no no no no

whatever my feelings are about illegal immigration, i cannot ignore the human being who made the decision to leave his/her family behind to find work to support them. The problem needs to be solved at higher levels, specifically the Mexican government which has done very little for economic justice.

[cynatnite]

75. If he scratched my car, I can't very well collect on the damages if I turn him in...

I get my money and then turn him in. :sarcasm:

Seriously, no, I wouldn't do either at all. He's got as much right to this country as I do, as far as I'm concerned.

[ContinentalOp]

82. Definitely not.

Oh wait, do you mean I get a new neighbor who is an illegal immigrant? Or I discover that my current neighbor is here illegally? If it's the later, then absoultely yes! Anything to get them deported!

[BuyingThyme]

84. My bathroom is in my house.

And there are undocumented immigrants all over the fucking place and nobody cares.

[1]

85. i would blackmail him into doing my lawncare. if that failed...

ice, ice, baby...

:rofl:

[Hannah Bell]

86. no. unless he were tony blair or someone like that. in which case, with evil glee.

[Raine]

88. No, I'm not a squealer

that rats people out. I don't go running to the authorities over crap the way some do over every little thing. I would only turn someone in if they committed a violent crime like murder, rape, assault, spousal or child abuse etc.

[Recursion]

89. I despise snitches

The state can enforce it's own damn laws.

I wouldn't hire him, but I wouldn't inform.

[JNelson6563]

91. I wouldn't do anything

unless there was violence involved. Just being a mildly assholish neighbor wouldn't be enough for me to "report" them.

Julie

[Belial]

92. no and yes..

[Lucian]

95. No, and no.

[ejpoeta]

96. No, I don't think so.

I know I have family members who would, I am sure. you notice that the anti immigrant stuff seems to ramp up when the economy starts going bad?? No one seems to care when the jobs are plentiful. Hmm. I do not begrudge someone the desire to provide for their family. I think I know a few folks who would do the same if it meant the difference between feeding their kids and letting them starve. just sayin.

[Marrah_G]

97. Not unless the person was a danger to the community yet had not been caught

[Dorian Gray]

98. Nope

I wouldn't report him. How do you know this for sure? How can anybody know for sure unless the person told him?

[a la izquierda]

99. Not a chance

though in Oklahoma, I risk a felony charge by knowingly fraternizing with undocumented workers. Unless that stupid bill died (HB1804)-I'm not sure, and I don't care. I have a good friend whose parents were undocumented workers and who were deported when she was an infant (my friend was born here). She grew up in Mexico as a dual national, her mother is now a citizen and her dad has a green card.

I'm not the immigration police and honestly, when I've had documentation problems in Mexico (i.e. lost my visa card and only had a copy of my photo page in my passport on my person), the authorities there were helpful and didn't throw me in jail. They made me pay a fine, reissued my visa and that was the end of that.

[TexasObserver]

101. No, I would not.

A human being is a human being.

While they may be here illegally, there are many, many good people who are here under that status.

Even if they do things I do not care for, I think it would be bad karma to report them.

[Hell Hath No Fury]

103. I would have to "turn in"...

half the people I work with, play with, and see every day. They are all good people, who work hard and make great additions to our country.

I would never report an undocumented person for simply being undocumented, under any circumstances.

[Luna_C_06]

105. There is a new Latino family a few blocks down from us.

They moved into a house that was a known coke/crack/meth den and completely cleaned the place up. Even the needles, used condoms, and soiled underwear. They don't know a lot of English and work by picking crops and doing landscaping so they probably are here illegally, but they are very friendly plus they did clean up a part of the neighborhood that no one else was willing to touch.

So my answer would have to be HELL no! If I had the extra money I'd buy them a grill just to thank them!

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

106. We had a house full of "illegals" next door.

Nice guys. A bit rowdy at times. They, on their own, came over and repaired a fence that that my step-daughters horse had kicked down. I gave them $20 and a case of beer for their trouble.

Just working men trying to make a living.

Turn them in? No way. No how.

[Fleshdancer]

107. No to both questions. n/t

[WeDidIt]

108. If I knew for a fact with no doubt whatsoever...

Yes, I would.

I like my neighbors, too. To the best of my knowledge none of my neighbors are undocumented immigrants.