What do you tell a 13-year-old about marijuana?

[BurtWorm]

I am opening the floor for discussion. I'm just curious what DUers will say about it.

[Zywiec]

1. The Pot Paradox

An empty bowl needs to be filled, a full bowl needs to be emptied!

:hi:

[SammyWinstonJack]

3. .

:spray:

[NJmaverick]

2. Tell him it's a mood altering drug

like drinking or smoking. It's illegal and there are health issues involved with its use. Tell them it's best to wait until they are an adult, before taking the risk of breaking the law.

[Arkansas Granny]

29. Good answer.

[ProdigalJunkMail]

38. just about the perfect answer... n/t

[Ohio Joe]

61. Well said - nt

[KittyWampus]

71. Good job. I'd add that for most people it tends to take away ones motivation to excel.

Phelps is an anomaly. Although I wonder how much pot he really does smoke.

[Terry in Austin]

79. Bzzt! Reefer Madness alert

> take away ones motivation to excel

What's wrong with this picture?

[KittyWampus]

87. Nothing. I smoked pot for years and know how it causes most people to be satisfied

to get stoned, space out and/or think whatever they're doing is way more "deep" than it actually is.

But if you're still depending on the crutch that pot is, I can see why the truth would be most likely dismissed as a caricature.

[ContinentalOp]

92. That depends on what you smoke.

Some people get a lot done after they smoke.

[Terry in Austin]

96. Think I'll smoke gospel instead

It's so truthy, and it'll get ya through the day!

:evilgrin:

[KittyWampus]

201. okay wiseguy! Actually, as I posted just below you, I am not religious. Don't belong to a religion

or go to a church.

But in the end, it's up to everyone to figure out what will get them through the day.

[Terry in Austin]

208. Amen

> up to everyone to figure out what will get them through the day.

:toast:

[notadmblnd]

138. It's no bigger crutch than religion

let the self righteous, sanctimonious, morally superior crap rest and stick to the facts, please.

[KittyWampus]

200. I'm not the least bit religious. LOL!

[notadmblnd]

254. I didn't imply you were.

[Ghost in the Machine]

301. Yet you quote scripture in your sig line....

:shrug:

[DireStrike]

157. So can alcohol, video games, church

and a host of other things.

[Zhade]

218. I'm a patient. My doctors found it improved my eyes and keep me from getting glaucoma.

You're wrong. The only crutch here is your clinging to debunked propaganda.

[Webster Green]

267. LOL!

What a load of crap!

Do you work for the DEA or the fucking Partnership for a drug free America?

Fail!! :rofl:

[Webster Green]

275. What's wrong with this picture is that it's complete bullshit.

This one has to be a fucking DEA agent or some other kind of fucking narc. :puke:

[Jackpine Radical]

123. Carl Sagan was a pothead. It obviously wrecked his career.

[Beam Me Up]

141. Another bullshit meme that keeps getting spread.

Look, I started smoking pot recreationally when I was 19 years old. I'm 62 years old now and I've done quite well for myself, thank you very much.

The problem isn't the drug, the problem is the psychological and social motivating factors of the user. Nothing is more innervating than poverty, lack of education or an absence of social support for actualizing one's best.

People who don't want to take responsibility for their own actions can always point to their drug use (regardless of what drug they use) as an excuse for their irresponsibility. "The drugs mad me do (or not do) it." That is bull shit. Whether it is pot or alcohol or oxycontin or what ever, YOU are responsible for your behavior. If you are using a drug as a means to escape your responsibilities to yourself, your family, society, then you need counseling and support -- certainly not incarceration.

Please stop spreading this ridiculous meme.

[Scout]

203. exactly

people who have screwed up lives that smoke pot would probably have screwed up lives without the pot.

[grannie4peace]

289. bravo! on the money!!!!!

[Zhade]

217. FALSE. Only heavy indica users who are already amotivational.

Epic fail.

[misanthrope]

268. That's horseshit! I know plenty of smokers of all types...

...from wake-and-bake stoners who get nothing done to motivated and active people who only use it to unwind.

Lazy people are lazy, active people are active. Stop blaming a drug for someone's decisions and tendencies. It's like saying all drinkers are alcoholics.

[Webster Green]

272. That is total fucking bullshit!

Plenty of star athletes and others who do excel love their marijuana.

You've been brainwashed. I feel sorry for you. :silly:

[eridani]

284. Wrong, He's the norm

I know plenty of high-achieving tokers.

[CrownPrinceBandar]

293. Totally wrong............

back up your assertions please.

[Threedifferentones]

91. If only that were how our legal system dealt with the issue

Unfortunately, from a legal standpoint, it is much safer to indulge in drugs as a kid, when such offenses often go only on to your "juvenile" record.

Of course for alcohol and tobacco, the situation is practically reversed. There are still modest legal risks for indulging as a kid, while as an adult they are perfectly legal.

[Fireweed247]

122. the health issues are that they could be using it for depression, asthma and other serious problems

but the government/pharmas made it illegal because they want to sell you their drugs which do not work nearly as well.

[Cetacea]

134. Comparing it to alchohol might not be a good idea.

He might think it's ok then since everyone drinks. And it might make him more curious to try it. I'd stick to the legal side of it. "I can't think of a good reason why it's illegal but it is and if you ever get busted I am not baling you out." Or something to that affect.

You could also tell him that since it is not legal or controlled there are different strengths out there and it is my understanding that some pot is so strong that smoking it is akin to taking LSD which puts it into the not-so-benign league. (And there's another good reason to legalize it.)

[NJmaverick]

151. I cosnider the lack of control, part of the health risks

As for the alchohol comparison, you may be right. My thinking was, if you make it out to be this special substance, you increase the curiosity factor.

[Zhade]

219. HAHAHAHAHAHA! BULLSHIT. There is NO weed as strong as LSD. NONE.

That is a total myth.

And I *would* bail my kid out, because no one should be in jail for pot. Depending on the situation (like his age at the time), I'd either give him a stern lecture or smoke with him.

[notadmblnd]

137. could you elaborate on the negative effects on health?

Keep in mind there are ways of partaking other than smoking.

[NJmaverick]

147. Well you can start with the fact that you are using a product

that has not been inspected or produced under any sort of regulation. So you don't know what is in the stuff you purchase.

Then if you do smoke it, there are health issues are par with tobacco smoking.

Finally there are unknowns as to what long term health affects may exist. After all there have been little to know studies performed, to measure the health affects.

[notadmblnd]

166. Not exactly facts

if you grow your own, you do know what you are using. I also realize you used the word "IF" you smoke. Many people these days use alternate methods such as cooking or vaporizing. Could you expound on those associated health risks? I am aware of people that have used the substance for over 30 years via various alternate methods. How long would you suggest one would have to use to determine the long term health risks associated with the substance? I've never known anyone to overdose, die or kill anyone else while under the influence. I've never even read an article in relation to the above mentioned. Could you cite the research or lead me in the general direction of some of these studies?

[NJmaverick]

167. If you want to believe that marijuana is some sort of miracle drug

that lacks any dangerous side affects (unlike pretty much every other drug in existence), I am not going to rain on your parade.

[notadmblnd]

181. I never claimed to believe it was a miracle drug or anythig else

I made an earnest effort to obtain information. I asked for facts, opinions and a direction to go in for the research data. Thanks for the info.

[Scout]

198. you won't get any facts backing up that posters' claims....

because there are none.

[notadmblnd]

253. I know

it was a test, he/she failed.

[Zhade]

221. There is zero evidence that it is dangerous. You certainly have offered none.

NT!

[Webster Green]

265. It is exactly that..

A miracle plant all the way around. There are no dangerous side effects at all. :wtf:

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

269. I know a guy that got convicted of vehicular homicide. He ran over someone while high.

[notadmblnd]

277. okay, Now I've heard of one. And he did this while hign on pot only

and not another substance or combination of substances such as pot and alcohol?

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

291. Just smoking pot, that's the only thing he tested positive for.

[CrownPrinceBandar]

295. That's no proof.............

THC can stay stored in the body for up to 30 days. The dude could have smoked 2-3 weeks before the accident and he would have still tested positive. Smoke doesn't always mean fire.

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

302. That's proof that he hadn't taken anything else.

He admitted to being high when he pled guilty.

David

[eridani]

285. Going 5 mph will kill someone?

Must have been a really unfortunate impact angle. If pot were legal, your average traffic ticket would be for doing 40 mph in the left lane of the freeway.

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

292. Running someone over with a 3,000 lbs vehicle at any speed will likely hurt or kill them.

[eridani]

299. It the driver keeps going

Most MJ users, when driving, are quite a bit slower and more paranoid than in an unstoned condition.

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

303. I don't understand your point.

[eridani]

309. That it is really, really rare for MJ users to kill anyone while driving

That's because they drive really, really slow compared to their usual driving speeds.

[Jeep789]

288. Any proof that it was actually because he was high?

I doubt it. Was the guy crossing the street in a legal intersection? Was the driver visually impaired by the sun or headlights? Is it possible this accident was just that, an accident waiting to happen that had nothing to do with any impairment? Seems today one really is guilty unless he can prove himself innocent, especially where a death is involved.

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

294. The same could be said of every drunk driving case.

Of course it's possible. Maybe a OJ's law team could have gotten him off by raising those issues. As it is he pled guilty.

David

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

312. News link? -nt

[Zhade]

220. Those aren't facts. Those are assertions that MAY be true. Sometimes.

And NO, there are NOT health issues on par with tobacco. Jesus, did you even TRY to educate yourself? Start with this FACT: Pot smoke is a bronchial dilator. Tobacco smoke is a bronchial constrictor. And studies HAVE been done. Overseas. Where scientists are actually allowed to do long-term experiments, the likes of which have proven IT SHRINKS TUMORS.

Ignorance like yours is why we're stuck in this perpetual cycle of lies about this plant.

[Webster Green]

266. Oh bullshit!

Total fucking bullshit! :crazy:

[Seldona]

180. Exactly what I told my kids.

Great answer imo.

[Zhade]

216. There are no health issues -- except that it improves health.

I agree on the adult thing, though.

[Stargazer09]

257. That's exactly what I told my sons!

I also told them that I don't want it in my house or anywhere around me. I'm military and paranoid about failing a drug test. And obviously, my younger children obviously don't need to be exposed to it.

[The Hope Mobile]

276. That's what we've told our kids. nt

[YOY]

4. Generally non-addictive but people start habits with it out of convinience.

Like anything good some folks inevitably overuse it.

Generally safer than alchohol and far safer than other "illegal" drugs.

Just some thoughts.

[Rosa Luxemburg]

5. that smoking can kill

any smoking is not good for you. Maybe they shouldn't eat it either?

[elleng]

27. But those BROWNIES are SO GOOD, Gertrude!

.

[eagertolearn]

139. That brings up a funny memory. In the 70's even my parents were trying

pot and let my sister grow a 6 foot bush in our yard. My sister made some brownies and my mom had them in the back of her freezer where my grandmother found them the week she was baby sitting us. She was dizzy for a few days an no one knew why until my parents got home!

[elleng]

144. I LOVE IT!!!!

What did your parents say/do when they got home? (They may be around my age.)

[eagertolearn]

279. I just remember that they never told my grandparents and let them

believe that grandma was sick. I think we all got a laugh out of that. My mom is 70 and is very conservative. Every once in a while i have to remind her of the 70's when she gets off on how terrible liberals are!

[elleng]

282. I wish I'd tried it on my Mother. (She passed on in September.)

She was very literary and open minded, and I suspect that if she DIDN'T know the story, she would have enjoyed it!

[Fireweed247]

116. Smoking mary jane helps people with lung problems

http://www.salem-news.com/articles/august302007/med_pot_83007.php

With my experience with more than 4,000 patients including many who have asthma, I was surprised when patients with asthma came in requesting marijuana permits.

This required considerable thought and consideration because I had heard for years that marijuana caused irritation of lung passages and coughing. It was time for some education for me by my patients.

Cannibinoids, the medicine in marijuana, cause smooth muscle relaxation and smooth muscles are the inside lining of the airways; therefore, marijuana should help asthma patients by enlarging the bore. It does.

The answer is simple. Old marijuana pre- about 1980 was usually 5 percent or less medicine and burning it as in smoking caused the irritants and bronchitis. We call that “Ditch Weed”.

I have seen the hemp plantations in New Zealand. That’s “Ditch Weed” and no self-respecting pothead would smoke it. This is obviously what these New Zealand guinea pigs were smoking.

For heavens sake, give them some good grass containing 15 percent THC.

I presume somebody down under is trying to frighten people from smoking marijuana. It won’t work.

[Zhade]

222. Untrue. POT DOES NOT CAUSE LUNG CANCER. It SHRINKS tumors.

This is documented medical fact.

[eridani]

286. OR they should use a vaporizer n/t

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

6. This might be the hardest discussion of the day! I didn't when my sons were 13 and

allowed the DARE program give them the basics. Having smoked pot when I was 16 and although not smoking it for many years, I have no problem with it at all. I don't like to lie to my kids and when they were a few years older, I then opened an honest dialogue.

[BurtWorm]

25. I feel very similarly about it.

I don't necessarily want to encourage her to use it at this age. But I don't want to lie about it.

[Zhade]

223. You didn't lie to them, but DARE sure did.

NT!

[JerseygirlCT]

244. I'm not keen on that whole program

for that reason: it's not honest. It lumps all drugs into one category, and attempts to scare kids away, instead of treating them with some level of respect and honesty.

[we can do it]

7. Only Buy from a Friend?

:sarcasm:

[NJmaverick]

10. That raises the point, that there is no control or regulation

you don't know what you are buying and the people you are buying from are not the trust worthy type.

[Scout]

199. there's some more bullshit

"the people you are buying from are not the trust worthy type"


you know so little, why don't you stop making a fool of yourself?

[LanternWaste]

212. You're certainly skewering some sacred cows...

You're certainly skewering some sacred cows... and judging by the righteous rage of the responders, it would seem pot is a bigger sacred cow than religion to a lot of people. :P

[Zhade]

224. Well, pot exists. Gods don't. Pot heals people. There's no evidence religion does.

Religion isn't wrongfully illegal. Pot is.

[LanternWaste]

290. Methinks you missed the point

Methinks you missed my point-- that point being about 'sacred cows' and all; not what is or is not legal or illegal.

[dendrobium]

246. Some people really LOVE their ganja!

You are fighting an uphill battle here NJmaverick. People are actually saying ganja has no possible ill effects and that it is basically harmless. I say that people should have more respect for ganja than that. It is very potent and of course it has medicinal value. But there can be ill effects. Here in Jamaica some people do become very dependent on it and basically their whole life revolves around smoking. Particularly in the young (especially young teenage boys) it does seem to de motivate them. I advise my children not to mess with mind altering substances because the effects can be unpredictable.

And it is a fact that here in Jamaica sometimes crack cocaine is added to the spliff - this is called a "seasoned spliff" and users are sometimes unaware of this additive.

But before anybody gets too angry, I am in favour of complete decriminalisation - the drug war is a waste of resources. The law should only restrict the public use of ganja.

[lunatica]

8. Tell the truth

And add that it makes you stupid but only for a little while.

[grannie4peace]

not always-

there are many great artists that use it as a muse

[lunatica]

17. I was being fatecious. OP should tell 13 year old about medicinal maryjane too

[Deep13]

9. Well, it's illegal in most states...

...and an adult conviction really does go on ones "permanent record." Selling it is usually a felony offense.

Apart from that, it makes a person temporarily lazy and stupid. Heavy, long term use can cause psychosis. As with any mood-altering drug, one can develop a psychological dependence on it, though as far as I know it is not actually addictive.

[BurtWorm]

21. People always stress the risks and dangers of drugs when talking to kids about them.

In fact, I don't know of anyone who became psychotic from smoking pot. I don't think it always makes people lazy and stupid. In fact, when I was using it regularly, I often became overstimulated at worst--my mind was moving too fast for comfort.

The thing is, I don't want to pretend that there's no reason to try marijuana. I actually think she should try it sometime. It's one of life's pleasures. But I don't know if it's a good idea to say this. I think she should make up her own mind about whether or not she wants to use it. But I don't want her to have an irrational fear of it.

Of course I don't want her to risk being arrested for using it either. That's the rub.

[Webster Green]

43. Yep!

Indeedy! :P

[Deep13]

49. I don't think any responsible parent can advise a kid...

...to do something unlawful. It may be a stupid law, but that will not help the teenager if she is caught.

[BurtWorm]

52. Of course.

[wovenpaint]

57. You answered your question

IMHO, that's a very good-and honest-conversation to have with your child-and, the conversation may bring up the use of alcohol as well.
Also, maybe include the point that others have made about the lack of regulation and the risk of OTHER things being laced into it...that's a big concern.

(on second thought, you might not want to verbalize the "trying it" part)

[BurtWorm]

63. I wouldn't. I leave that entirely up to her.

[KittyWampus]

73. you may have been "over-stimulated" but most often the thoughts you were having were

ultimately not the genius it felt like when you were stoned.

IMO, people need to learn (young or old) to reach the level of stimulation without drugs. It's possible. Too bad so many falsely believe they need a drug to access that part of their own consciousness.

[LanternWaste]

213. We used to tape record our Indian circles in high school...

We used to tape record our Indian circles in high school when we'd smoke in my parent's basement (I think my parents had the only basement ever made in TX) thinking that we would solve the world's problems after a few joint, or come up with The Best Movie Script Ever.

But to be perfectly honest, we'd feel a bit sheepish the next day when we listened to the tapes, as the conversations were usually centered around someone bogarting, the cool riff in a Moody Blues tune that was playing, or how far one of would get with our girlfriends on the next date.

Genius we were not. Clowns? Probably. Stoners? Absolutely. Paranoid? Only when my dad was in town. But genius...? Hardly. :P

[Zhade]

227. Uh, you have no idea what he was thinking. Carl Sagan had some genius thoughts while smoking.

Wanting to enjoy a medically-proven beneficial plant is hardly the same thing as being unable to use their own mind without it.

[Withywindle]

306. Well, what that comes down to is...

A genius who smokes pot is still a genius.

A doofus who smokes pot is still a doofus. (But maybe a happier one.)

[Webster Green]

271. Lame!

People that think like you ruin everything.

People like you need to mind their own fucking business. :thumbsdown:

[notadmblnd]

148. kids are going to do what they want to do depsite what we tell them

The harm in marijuana, in my opinion comes from the fact that it is illegal. I've told him that when he is old enough, I don't have a problem with him trying it. However, he is never to buy at school, or use outside of the house. Do not transport anything (not even a roach, papers or pipe) in the car and never tell people that you use it. I've been open and honest with him about my views and I'm confident that if he decides to try it, he will come to me first.

[notadmblnd]

150. here's what I've told my 16 yr old

The harm in marijuana, in my opinion comes from the fact that it is illegal. I've told him that when he is old enough, I don't have a problem with him trying it. However, he is never to buy at school, or use outside of the house. Do not transport anything (not even a roach, papers or pipe) in the car and never tell people that you use it. I've been open and honest with him about my views and I'm confident that if he decides to try it, he will come to me first.

[JerseygirlCT]

247. Well, perhaps your hesitation comes from her age.

Deciding for herself might be better left to when she's old enough to really understand the implications. At 13, I'd say I don't think that's something you should do now. When you're older, you'll make an adult decision.

And I do know that at least a couple of the kids my son knew in HS did start that way. For them, it was the beginning of some very serious addiction problems. He watched that first hand, and that was became part of his education on it, too. I think that's also likely due to the young age of these kids. Judgment just isn't all there yet, you know?

[Webster Green]

36. Maybe it makes some people lazy and stupid..

Never did that to me. There's nothing I can't do stoned that I can do when I'm straight, and I smoke like a Rasta and work my ass off. Your broad brush is just foolish!

You better provide some links on the psychosis theory, and links to the fucking DEA don't count. I'm calling Bullshit! on that as well. :smoke:

[Deep13]

48. Links are not evidence.

I'm relying on expert testimony I read in a trial transcript where a forensic psychiatrist testified that nearly constant marijuana use over three months by the defendant had created a psychotic episode.

I have not looked at the DEA website, assuming there is one. If they have evidence on the subject, then they are as reliable of a source as anyone.

[Starbucks Anarchist]

69. Yes, in that particular defendant.

[uncle ray]

77. i'm reminded of a story posted a day or two ago

that said that when people hear testimony from an "expert witness" they switch off their critical thinking skills.

oh, and a post saying that you read it somewhere is not evidence either. when you make wild claims about the dangers of marijuana, one should be careful to not make themselves look more ignorant than the pot smokers they are trying to demonize.

[Deep13]

89. An expert still needs a foundation for his testimony.

There were three experts. Two for the defense and one for the state. The expert for the state was thorough, explained his reasons, explained by the defense argument was illogical and gave specific examples. He concluded that constant smoking for several months produced a psychotic episode. The defense experts came to the same conclusion. The difference was that the state witness said that the psychosis 1. did not prevent the defendant from knowing that shooting a police officer was wrong and that 2. the law excludes voluntary intoxication as a basis for an insanity defense.

I'm not making wild claims. I'm taking about extreme cases. In those cases it can cause psychosis until the intoxication wears off.

And I don't expect you to take my word for it. I answered the OP and was then challenged to produce evidence. I'm satisfied with the basis of my conclusion. If you want more, do your own research. I know there is a strong feeling on this board to decriminalize marijuana. While I basically agree, we cannot allow that to make us ignore reality.

[snort]

160. when is my psychotic episode due?

i feel so left out. been smoking steady for better than 30 years and have yet to have my very own psychotic break. i'm so jealous!

[Deep13]

164. This guy did it every waking minute for three months. nt

[Starbucks Anarchist]

168. He was already nuts.

The pot had nothing to do with it.

[Deep13]

174. I guess I should believe you...

...and disregard the testimony of one of this state pre-eminent psychiatic experts. And before you say this is an argument from authority, the basis for his claimed expertise was also illustrated on the court record.

[Starbucks Anarchist]

177. Or you can try to find reports of numerous psychotic potheads running around.

Given the large number of potheads, we should've heard of their never-ending mayhem by now.

In fact, have you ever seen Tommy Chong or Willie Nelson go crazy? They're never sober.

[Deep13]

178. How do you know they are never sober?

And I didn't say anything about violence. And how do you know pot heads never become psychotic? Anyway, as I have said, the psychosis wears off when the person becomes sober. Maybe there just aren't as many of you as you assume. I said near constant use for months on end can cause psychosis. Psychosis does not necessarily lead to violence. This particular defendant wanted to prove he was psychotic and that the psychosis caused him to shoot at police officers (and severely injure one). He proved the first part, but not that the psychosis made him do it. The expert said that if he had been sufficiently psychotic to be legally insane then he would have been so debilitated he would not have been able to get out of bed.

Anyway, why is it so damn important to you to try to prove me wrong on this?

[Starbucks Anarchist]

184. How do you know that they DO become psychotic?

You brought it up in the first place and used only one isolated case to "prove" psychosis appears in all heavy pot users.

I said near constant use for months on end can cause psychosis.

Precisely my point. Tommy Chong and Willie Nelson have been smoking for DECADES on a regular basis, yet I have never heard of any psychotic episodes from them. In fact, they've been quite productive.

Anyway, why is it so damn important to you to try to prove me wrong on this?

It's a discussion board, and you are claiming an isolated case applies across the board, which is patently false.

[Deep13]

189. I am not relying on the case.

I'm relying on the testimony of three pschological or psychiatric experts who testified in the case based on their experience and study. All three agreed that this kind of use can cause psychosis. Two of those three made the further leap that this meant the defendant was insane. The state's expert was called in to rebut that.

Regular use is not constant use. Once a week is regular. This guy smoked one and lit another as soon as it was done for months. THC is a known hallucinagen and at some point enough of it has got to be toxic.

I never said it applies "across the board." I only said it can happen in extreme cases.

[Starbucks Anarchist]

191. "Heavy, long term use can cause psychosis."

You posted that upthread. Sounds like an across-the-board statement to me.

And once a week is not "regular." "Regular" would happen at much shorter intervals. And if this guy was smoking joints one after the other, you know what would have happened? He would have fallen asleep.

[Deep13]

192. He slept. I'm not suggesting he was awake for three months.

And whatever you say here, a forensic psychiatrist and two other mental health doctors who actually have a legal obligation to know what the fuck they are talking about disagree with you.

"Heavy, long term use CAN...."

So you are wrong in your reading.

[Starbucks Anarchist]

193. I didn't say you suggested that.

I'm saying if he smoked constantly (one joint after another), he would be fast asleep EACH DAY before he'd have the chance to break out in a psychotic episode.

And trying to weasel out of your statement with "Can" is hilarious. It's the equivalent of "Some people say...," a way of heavily implying something without any proof.

And whatever you say here, a forensic psychiatrist and two other mental health doctors who actually have a legal obligation to know what the fuck they are talking about disagree with you.

Three people out of how many? Have you seen any respectable peer-reviewed scientific articles stating the same? I can find one of the few scientists who don't believe in global warming, but it doesn't make them right.

[Deep13]

195. I'm done battling wits with an unarmed man.

Good night.

[Starbucks Anarchist]

206. I'm done arguing with an ignoramus who can't back up his BS.

So keep on wading in your kiddie pool of ignorance and continue to trust the DEA (as you did upthread) along with random court cases to prove a point that collapses under the slightest scrutiny.

[Webster Green]

207. Project much?

If anyone in this discussion is unarmed, it is you. You are living in 1937 or something. Pot is so fucking nice and mild-mannered, yet some uninformed folks have so bought into the lies and hysteria that any discussion is futile.

Give it up, man. You are completely out to lunch on this particular subject. Trust me, I'm an expert on marijuana. I've been a cannabis legalization activist since 1966. B-)

[Zhade]

229. You just lost the argument -- which is fitting, because you never proved your allegation.

You relied on bald assertion from alleged experts arguing that correlation is causation, and when your argument was destroyed, you resorted to name-calling.

Epic fail.

[Zhade]

228. Because it's a LIE.

Correlation IS NOT CAUSATION.

[snort]

169. I've done that easy.

And having spent most of my time hanging with fellow pot smokers, as you may imagine, no crazy time yet, for me or for them. I'm fifty, not old but sure as shit not young, and in all that time and everywhere I have been I have as yet to encounter even a tale of such. Me thinks that this is bullshit. Who could possibly want to spread these falsities? Perhaps those making money through law enforcement, prison system, 'addiction clinics'? Ever hear someone argue themselves out of a job? Damn few widget makers are going to tell us that we just don't need widgets anymore, some will be proactive and create a scenario warning us about a significant need for widgets.

[Deep13]

176. And you base these suppositions on what?

The guy is not a "therapist" at an addiction clinic. He's an expert in forensic psychiatry. He does not work for the police. He works at a hospital. You don't even know who he is. You will say anything to avoid the conclusion that smoking your own weight in grass might sometimes be bad for you.

By the way, his testimony that there was a psychotic episode was harmful to the state's case. In trying to prove insanity, proving a mental disease would be step #1.

[Webster Green]

104. The DEA is not a reliable source for anything! They are lying thugs!

On the interweb tubes, we link to stuff that might help back up our statements. Mmkay?

You are dead fucking wrong about pot, though you are certainly not alone. We have been lied to for many years.

One psychotic episode in one individual isn't enough to declare that pot leads to psychosis. Did the defendant ever drink milk? Perhaps we should blame the fucking milk. :wtf:

[Deep13]

109. You're misrepresenting what I wrote. nt

[Webster Green]

121. You wrote that the DEA "are as reliable of a source as anyone."

Not true! They are sadistic, lying thugs.

I didn't misrepresent anything. That's what you wrote.

[Starbucks Anarchist]

126. With a vested interest in anti-pot propaganda.

[Deep13]

145. It causes paranoia too...

...or so I've heard.

[Webster Green]

209. You know that it ain't paranoia if they really are out to get you, right?

They really are out to get us, and they really are scumbags! :think:

[Webster Green]

107. Of course links can be evidence..

They can even be proof, if the link is to a genuine scientific study. Unfortunately, not much research into pot has been allowed over the years, and the research that has been allowed reached their conclusions before the study, because the only people allowed to do the research have been lying drones who would perpetuate the government's lies.

Got it? :eyes:

[Deep13]

110. Links lead to more websites with more claims...

...that depend solely on the credibility of whoever is writing them.

[Webster Green]

119. Bingo!

But links are still all the rage on the Internets, though naturally you have to make use of the bullshit filter.

Have you downloaded a reliable bullshit filter yet? :shrug:

[Deep13]

143. The thing about a bullshit filter...

...is that it works on all claims from all sources, if you catch my drift.

[Webster Green]

196. Actually, I don't catch your drift at all..

Nothing you have said here makes any fucking sense. Sorry! :hippie:

[Zhade]

230. Clearly, the download is stuck.

NT!

[Ghost in the Machine]

173. Cannabinoids promote embryonic and adult hippocampus neurogenesis and produce anxiolytic- and

Cannabinoids promote embryonic and adult hippocampus neurogenesis and produce anxiolytic- and antidepressant-like effects.

Neuropsychiatry Research Unit, Department of Psychiatry, University of Saskatchewan, Saskatoon, Saskatchewan, Canada.

The hippocampal dentate gyrus in the adult mammalian brain contains neural stem/progenitor cells (NS/PCs) capable of generating new neurons, i.e., neurogenesis. Most drugs of abuse examined to date decrease adult hippocampal neurogenesis, but the effects of cannabis (marijuana or cannabinoids) on hippocampal neurogenesis remain unknown. This study aimed at investigating the potential regulatory capacity of the potent synthetic cannabinoid HU210 on hippocampal neurogenesis and its possible correlation with behavioral change. We show that both embryonic and adult rat hippocampal NS/PCs are immunoreactive for CB1 cannabinoid receptors, indicating that cannabinoids could act on CB1 receptors to regulate neurogenesis. This hypothesis is supported by further findings that HU210 promotes proliferation, but not differentiation, of cultured embryonic hippocampal NS/PCs likely via a sequential activation of CB1 receptors, G(i/o) proteins, and ERK signaling. Chronic, but not acute, HU210 treatment promoted neurogenesis in the hippocampal dentate gyrus of adult rats and exerted anxiolytic- and antidepressant-like effects. X-irradiation of the hippocampus blocked both the neurogenic and behavioral effects of chronic HU210 treatment, suggesting that chronic HU210 treatment produces anxiolytic- and antidepressant-like effects likely via promotion of hippocampal neurogenesis.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16224541?ordinalpos=2&itool=EntrezSystem2.PEntrez.Pubmed.Pubmed_ResultsPanel.Pubmed_RVDocSum

Here's another good site with lots of research: http://www.scientificfactsofpot.com/studies.htm


Peace,

Ghost

[BurtWorm]

190. Put that in your bong and smoke it, Partnership for a Drug Free America

:smoke:

[Zhade]

231. Oh, you and your DOCUMENTED FACTS!

NT!

[NoSheep]

187. People who are lazy and stupid are going to be that way anyway, I think.

[ima_sinnic]

67. 40-year heavy pot smoker here and I have not gotten "psychotic"

--nor has it made me "temporarily lazy and stupid." In fact, after I've smoked a doob, I become like the White Tornado around my house and start puttering, sorting, and organizing like crazy. lol--perhaps that's a bit "psychotic."

[Deep13]

90. See my other responses. nt

[Zhade]

233. You mean your other bullshit responses wherein you make unsupported assertions...

...not backed up by evidence? Why would any intelligent person waste their time that way?

[Echo In Light]

95. Funny how that "Reefer Madness" bullshit still holds sway for many

[shanti]

130. exactly

NOTHING will change the mind of my 77 year old mother on mj, even medically (and she's a RN). her mind is made up, and she's not stupid by any means, with an IQ of 130. it's very frustrating.

[Echo In Light]

161. That example nails it tho! Indoctrination/brainwashing isn't contingent upon intelligence

[Zhade]

226. Where do I start when debunking the bullshit? NO IT DOES NOT.

There is ZERO evidence it causes psychosis. NONE. Correlation is not causation.

Sativa does NOT make you stupid or lazy.

And it's habituation, not dependence.

[tridim]

11. I don't have kids, but if I did I would say something like..

"I know kids take drugs, but please if you're going to take drugs please don't take anything harder than marijuana. Don't believe the hype, Marijuana is not the same as alcohol, cocaine, heroin and meth."

[H2O Man]

12. It depends.

To begin with, parents should discuss things like tobacco, alcohol, pot, and other substances with their children long before they are 13. Start early.

At 13, most kids will have questions about different substances, including pot, and the key is to try to answer their specific questions, rather than to begin "drug education." But, even if a parent hasn't spoken about drugs with their child(ren) at an earlier age, there are still good options. There are a number of good resources available.

Kids should know that there are a number of issues involved. For example, if there is a history of addictions in the family system (including grandparents, aunts, uncles, etc), then those who are in the family have a greater risk of abuse/addiction-related problems.

Also, there are adults who may have a drink or some pot socially, but who do not have abuse/addiction issues.

In any case, there is a time and place for everything. And 13 isn't a good time to even experiement with tobacco, alcohol, pot, etc.

[Donnachaidh]

23. family addiction history is something kids NEED to know about

We told my son about his grandfather's drug and alcohol addiction. He has an uncle that was an alcohol and drug addict, but has been clean and sober for decades - and is now a drug addiction therapist. Earlier generations had alcohol problems as well.

He knows their is a strong history of problems, and he can use this in his decisions about potentially trying any of the drugs his peers are now trying. It's helped him say NO to all of it.

[H2O Man]

30. Also any history

of mental illness. Although I think that pot should be legal for adults, much in the manner that alcohol is, there is a very real relationship between several types of mental illness and substance abuse. I'm saying this, partly in response to a post above here that states that a person never knew anyone who became psychotic from smoking pot. Having worked in a mental health clinic with a population referred to as "MICAs" (mentally ill, chemical abuser), I can say that people who have a history of illnesses including psychotic or depressive disorders are at risk from the use of substances such as alcohol and/or pot.

[Zhade]

234. They are risk of using them. Pot does not cause the psychosis, however.

At least, there's no credible evidence anywhere that it does, and correlation is not causation.

[H2O Man]

256. I've been reading

the sub-thread above, and have avoided commenting on it, because most of the contributions are incorrect to some degree or another. But you are a friend, and someone who I respect, so I'll go into some more detail. I'm not including "links," though, because I think you know me well enough to know that I'm not bullshitting or bluffing. And I really don't care what other people think.

In the legal case discussed, the testimony of the expert witnesses was not that a perfectly normal (whatever that is) person smoked the demon weed, and broke out in psychosis, then committed a crime. In that sense, pot's relationship with the defendant's psychosis was not one of causation.

However, in the cases of people with a major mental illness -- and this can include young people who have not previously been identified as having experienced the symptoms of an illness (such as psychosis) -- smoking pot can indeed be closely associated with the emergence of their experiencing symptoms of their illness. Including psychosis. Thus, it is not a mere correlation. It's a trigger.

One of the growing fields in community health services is the treatment of people known as MICAs. They are mentally ill, chemical abusers. This population has led to the much closer coordination of the previously separate mental health and substance abuse services, for not surprisingly, many people under the age 55 with mental illnesses also have (or have had) issues involving substance abuse.

Pot is one of the substances, some legal, some illegal, that can have a negative effect on a segment of the population. To be fair, other substances (including some found in over-the-counter medications) can and do have a risk for some people with mental illnesses. That has not, will not, and should not make cold and allergy medications illegal. Nor should it be used as a reason to keep pot illegal.

Tobacco is known to impact the brain chemistry in a way that is beneficial for some types of psychotic disorders. A cigarette, for example, may provide relef for perhaps 5 to 10 minutes to a segment of the population. This does not mean that everyone should smoke, of course.

I also worked with one gentleman who was highly intelligent, but who had a severe and persistent mental illness. He took medication, and combined it with "self-medication" in the form of numerous large joints of leafy pot, that he bought cheaply from a local grower. He was symptom-free when he had his supply of pot. However, the few times that he ran out, he would begin to suffer from the illness. He became psychotic. His treatment team, including me, recognized that he was different from most of the people his age we worked with. Our job wasn't to be judgemental -- it's of no significance if pot is legal or not. But we worked with a population that included a number of people who were best off when they avoided pot. I remember one saying, "Life isn't fair." He was correct. Life is just what it is.

[JerseygirlCT]

250. Agreed here as well. nt

[JerseygirlCT]

249. Very good answer

I think a family history of alcoholism is part of why my older son has no interest in drinking. That might change, but I cannot argue with his reasoning.

[H2O Man]

262. Family history

is an important part in assessing one's risk factors. As parents, we should be honest about such things. And we should try to influence our children's understanding of those risks, and certainly discourage anyone as young as 13 from experimenting with pot. To do otherwise is neglectful.

When they get older, they will make choices for themselves. Sometimes, that includes poor choices. Other kids make better choices. My sons are in their early 20s now, and I know that even when they were in their teens, they did some partying. I said that they should be honest with themselves, and evaluate if it was having a negative impact on their lives. By the time they are that age, it's about the only thing a parent can do. If I saw it getting in their way of doing well in life, I'd have approached it differently.

[JerseygirlCT]

263. Yes. Those/these years are definitely hard ones in that way

Tough to negotiate those waters gracefully - they're still young enough that you know things you want to tell them, and old enough to start making mistakes. Which hurts. But which is the way we learn, all too often.

When we can find a sort of middle ground on that, it's a good thing, I think. As I said, for my son, part of that education was watching friends get caught. (Not necessarily in a legal way - I'm talking about the grasp that addiction has). Several friends died while he was in HS. One on his birthday, and so I'll still often find him sad on that day. It was a pretty rude awakening, I think. But I also think that because we were so honest with him, he felt comfortable discussing any and everything with us, and that helped him think things through in a safe environment.

[Donnachaidh]

13. Already had this conversation

I admitted to my son I had tried it. I was never a fan of pot, but it HAD given his grandmother some real relief when she was going through chemotherapy. And even though we have friends who still smoke regularly, we (personally) didn't think it was a good thing for him to do.

However, we did say that if he wants to try it, we'd rather he did it at home, rather than out with some of his friends. Not saying that his friends are that irresponsible - but at least he wouldn't get hassled by cops if anyone did something stupid.

The choice will be his in the long run, but we try to be as upfront and honest about drugs with him.

[BurtWorm]

28. Excellent post.

Thank you. Very well put.

[NOW tense]

14. Pot is illegal. With all illegal things

there are consequences. I can not stop you from doing things, but know that the stigma of illegal drugs can ruin ones reputation. This applies to both kids and adults.

[eagertolearn]

146. This is what I have focused on with my teens and with addictions

in the family. They are involved with the "Teen Court" system and see other kids getting into trouble and the consequences. But alcohol and pot is all around them in high school. All you can do is supply them with the information and hope they make the right choices and learn from their bad choices. Keep the communication going. I see too many parents who want to be their kids "best friends" so they won't even bring these topics up. If if's not talked about it's not happening right? Keep the "real" conversation going with your kids!

[surrealAmerican]

15. Tell them that it could get them arrested, and ruin their future.

Also, answer any questions they ask as honestly as you can.

[Starbucks Anarchist]

16. It's safer than cigarettes and alcohol.

[leftyclimber]

18. We pretty much used NJMaverick's argument upthread when we had this talk.

It's a mood-altering drug, just like alcohol, but it is also against the law to use or possess it, unlike alcohol. Before you're 18 we can be held liable for your actions, just like we can if you are caught drinking underage or otherwise breaking the law. What you do when you're 18 and a legal adult is your decision, but there can be pretty serious consequences if you're caught by the police.

My SO's son is in eighth grade, as I'm assuming this 13yo is, and he was already on to the ridiculousness of the Reefer Madness stuff they were selling him at school. We tried to be honest and neutral and focused mainly on what pot does and what the legal consequences can be for using/possessing it both as a minor and as an adult.

[MissMillie]

19. that it's an artificial high

and that there are lots and lots of other ways to feel good (exercise, hard work, good grades, being with friends and family)

[elleng]

32. thats not likely to be duplicated in any non-artificial way.

.

[TheCoxwain]

113. I will contest that ..

What you say is generally true...


But I have tried meditation...... couple times I ve slipped into really deep consciousness - I became unaware of my body or limbs ....the Euphoria was better that any pot trip I ve had ...


You can call me loony .... But I know it is true.

[elleng]

127. I'll call you fortunate!

TM, or other meditation?

[TheCoxwain]

152. I dont know what kind of meditation it was ..

I used to just close my eyes and become try to become aware of my awareness ( in an effort to get a positive feedback loop going ) with immense amounts of concentration ...

most times I either fell asleep or couldnt keep my eyes closed long enough or became distracted...



but 2 or 3 times ... I think it came to a point when all that existed was an extremely powerful consciousness .. I couldnt even feel the ground I was sitting on ..


I ve tried many times to replicate it .. no luck thus far .. But I firmly believe that it is repeatable -- just need the right state of mind..

[lurky]

20. Don't exaggerate how bad it is.

That will destroy your credibility. Nobody ever died from pot, and there isn't really any evidence to support the whole "gateway drug" story.

However, let them know that it could have serious long-term health effects, especially in a teenager. It can also lead to depression and panic attacks, and if someone has any predisposition to other mental illnesses like schizophrenia, it can cause psychosis. The biggest problem is that it can make you dumb and lazy, which might be fun on a Friday night, but makes for a pretty sad life.

Finally, getting arrested for pot can destroy your life, especially if you are a teenager. The drug laws are stupid and unfair, but they are still a reality, and the consequences can be pretty steep.

[Zhade]

235. Once again, no, it does not cause psychosis. Correlation is not causation.

NT!

[GoesTo11]

22. Careful: This could happen

http://www.flicklife.com/c9d479eb5ec0b99d887f/Greg_Brady_stoned_on_the_set.html

[droidamus2]

24. Another point

Though I am not a parent I would expect you may get the 'adults do it so it can't be that bad' argument. I would point out that as far as hormones and a growing body kids and adolescents aren't exactly the same as adults and therefore the effects (not the getting high part but the effect on the body) could be different. Other than that just be honest kids aren't as stupid as we sometimes think they are and if they catch you lying or misleading them on something like smoking pot you are setting yourself up for them not trusting you on even more important questions.

[Echo In Light]

26. Depends on the individuals involved, context, maturity, etc

I've smoked most of my life, so I'll definitely cross this bridge w/our daughter down the road...and when that time comes I'll be forthright in explaining my views and experiences. But no, as I don't perceive anything wrong with it (it isn't a drug that damages one's spirit) I'm not gonna be a hypocrite about it.

[dkofos]

31. Don't tell him/her anything. Make it a knowlege project.

Sit them down at the computer and let them learn on their own.

Maybe you can sit with them and learn something yourself.

[Zhade]

236. With all due respect, that's an awful suggestion. It may lead to the kind of "reefer madness"...

...bullshit propagated by some very misinformed posters in this thread.

[Alcibiades]

33. You don't have to tell a 13 year old anything

They already know where to get the best pot.

[kentuck]

34. No kind of smoke is good for your lungs.

If you care about your health and body, you will not do any type of drugs. However, our experience shows that marijuana is probably the least harmful of all the popular drugs. Today's marijuana can be mind-altering, especially some of the stuff grown in California and Kentucky. It is probably a gamble not worth taking, since it is still illegal and could affect your future negatively. But, if you are going to smoke, don't pollute your lungs with ditch weed. Find some good one-toke reefer and smoke it for spiritual reasons, not for fun. :-)

[Fireweed247]

108. Smoking is good for some people's lungs...

check out this story I found
http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20061025201839AAsuN48


My son was born with severe asthma, and has almost died numerous times in his life, from it. He's 24 years old now, but still suffers from the severe asthma.

About the time he got his driver's license at 16 his asthma mysteriously got better..... My wife and I assumed that he was finally growing out if it. Unbeknownst to us, he was smoking marijuana.

2 years ago he got busted with a joint. He was put on probation with random urine tests, and was unable to smoke any pot for a long time. His asthma came back just as severe as it was before he started smoking pot.
I'm convinced that pot helps asthmatics. My son is living proof.

[Fireweed247]

112. another story

I discovered that marijuana relieves (and even prevents) asthma quite by accident. For years, I thought my reaction was idiosyncratic. Then I read that some doctors were interested in performing clinical trials using marijuana to treat asthma, and I realized that other people must have experienced similar relief.

I find that smoked marijuana provides better relief of asthma than prescription drugs for four reasons.

(1) Marijuana seems to produce faster symptomatic relief than Proventil , and speed is important when you’re having trouble breathing.

(2) Marijuana seems to increase lung capacity and produce deeper breathing than Proventil. (In fact, marijuana seems to enable me to take deeper breaths than I can take even when I’m not having an asthma attack.) There are a number of objective tests of lung capacity that could be used to test this hypothesis.

(3) Since it take more "puffs" of marijuana to get relief than "puffs" of Proventil, it is easier to titrate the dosage of marijuana. I find this to be true even though the strength of marijuana (and therefore the necessary dose) varies widely due to genetic and environmental variation.

(4) Even when I smoke more marijuana than I need to for asthma relief, it does not make my heart race, give me headaches, or produce excessive bronchial dilation. It does tend to make me sleepy, which actually makes it perfect for right before I go to bed, when I consistently need to use Proventil to prevent the asthma attack that inevitably starts as soon as I lie down.

I use marijuana for my asthma only rarely, since I do not have a reliable source of supply.

http://www.rxmarijuana.com/lisa.htm

[dendrobium]

264. Doctors in Jamaica have done research on this.

It has been known for generations here that ganja can be used to treat asthma. As an asthmatic "smoke" is not normally a good thing so the ganja leaves are used to make a tea.

Researchers at the University of the West Indies isolated the compound which helps asthma. I believe they called the drug they patented "Canasol".

[kentuck]

125. I have severe asthma...

And sometimes a little pot helps better than any inhaler or prescription that I take. It does help asthma in some cases, I can vouch for that.

[Sebastian Doyle]

158. I don't doubt the medicinal properties of the marijuana itself

But I have to admit I'm surprised that smoking anything would be good for asthma. I would think any sort of lung irritant would only make it worse. But then, isn't that what an inhaler does?

[Zhade]

237. Again, false. Pot smoke is a bronchial dilator, the opposite of tobacco smoke.

It shrinks tumors, instead of causing them.

[davsand]

35. Material Girl is 11 and I started out with the statement it is illegal.

Period. It is illegal and, as such, it is a bad idea to mess with it.

I also went on to say that I think it is probably less harmful to health than booze is, but that booze has been determined to be legal for people over 21, and that maybe by the time she is 21 she will be free to make the choice between two legal drugs. Until that time, just stay away from any of it it--booze or pot.

We also talked about Med use, and I told her that I fully support legalizing it for med use especially because it has helped so many people even IF it is illegal. She has a Grandma who has been in chemo for the last couple years and is in radiation right now--she fully understands the issue in a way that maybe some of the other kids her age don't.


Laura

[TransitJohn]

37. Stay outta my stash!

In all seriousness, say you prefer they don't smoke while living at home at all...when they're 18 and on their own, it's outta your hands.

[Wickerman]

39. It can screw up your student aid should you want help to go to college

"A student who has been convicted of any offense under any Federal or State law involving the possession or sale of a controlled substance shall not be eligible to receive any grant, loan, or work assistance."

http://norml.org/index.cfm?Group_ID=3903

I've told my kids that and you kind of hope they fully understand that they can get busted and an overzealous prosecutor can fuck up their lives just because they can. Of course, when you are young you are invincible and nothing bad will ever happen to you.

In addition to the other stuff already in this thread...


Great discussion.

[Donnachaidh]

46. wow -- this is something I *didn't* know!

This is definitely something that should be stressed to the kids. Many of my son's friends are going to be trying for financial aid. Getting busted would kill THAT dream.

Thanks for posting this!

[eagertolearn]

307. Thanks! I printed that out and it is going on the counter.Sometimes it's better to

start with them finding an article (I put it right where they sit to eat) than me lecturing them about one more thing.

[walkaway]

40. I was a very stressed out kid until I smoked my first joint.

After that I had a happy, social and relaxed time in High School and College. My brother (who smoked all through his preteen years) is a PhD with a great family and two incredible daughters who are 12 and 13. I wonder what he will tell them

We both benefited from and enjoyed pot all through our youth. It's too bad so many lies have been old about it. The issue is so cloudy because of the politics. I wish I could advise anyone going through a stressful adolescence to light up. I guess I can't because I am now a grown up but if I was 13 I would have to say "relax and enjoy".

[eagertolearn]

308. I have been truthful with my teens but I also tell them that the times

were different then (in the 70's). Back then we never got caught and the one time a police man found us sitting at a lookout drinking a beer he just made us dump it out (along with the case of beer that we didn't realize was in the trunk that my friends dad had just bought that day at the store). Now it goes on your record and we're just more aware of the dangers of driving under the influence. I think you have to be honest.

[seabeyond]

41. we have been talking about it a couple years, means my 11 yr old is ahead of 13 yr old in ways

cause he listens. we have had dare in school and they have been talking about it. the main emphasis we put on in this house is truth.... not the get behavior thru fear (lies)... but truth. so when they bring me conversation about any drugs, alcolhol, sex... i go straight to the honesty of it and ...

i am mama, i rule and you are punished if i catch you AND since i have done, i will see.... all

we have alcoholics in family so a perfect example of danger, real danger of booze. i have never felt as harsh with pot as booze. we talk honestly about perception of pot, what they say is the harm of it, .... lack of production, idleness, gateway. and then i talk about a high percentage use are productive, not addictive, not violent... and if you use, i will see and you will be punished. until 18 and out of house baby

and how i can handle pot over booze (violence, alcoholism in family, destructive, death)

also seperate out pot from other drugs

i am just straight talk with my boys on all the subjects

but then my boys and i have been having social issue discussions forever so we have touched on this so often, and many more of the subjects. i cannot believe you are just getting to this conversation with a 13 yr old

[bobbert]

42. There's a time and place for everything, and that's called college

lol, a south park quote, but I feel it's so true. Once you get to college it's expected that you'll experiment, but don't fuck up your chances of getting into one.

[krabigirl]

45. eh, I'd be happy if my kids waited until senior year to try it. That's when I did..not at 13 though.

[krabigirl]

44. Not sure. Since it's legal for medical use in my state, I will mention that, but only for adults.

Also, will mention that it's not good for developing brains, and is illegal to use (other than medically with dr's note) in CA, so don't do it or else you will get into trouble with the law. I will not, however, be all draconian about it. I know it's not as harmful as we are brainwashed to believe. My issue is more about the illegality of it, and that young brains need to develop before introducing mood-altering drugs.

[guitar man]

47. "Don't Bogart that Joint"

and, "a friend with weed is a friend indeed!"

:D

[seemslikeadream]

53. (*_*)

[seemslikeadream]

50. The truth

[tuckessee]

51. I would tell them the truth.

That it is an absolutely harmless and beneficial herb that is suppressed violently by the vicious, arbitrary Police State acting as cronies for Big Business.

I would warn them that the gov't would utterly ruin their lives if they are caught with it and advise them to wait until they are at least 18 before trying it.

I would also ask them to study up on the subject by reading a variety of opinions on the subject.

[Dreamer Tatum]

55. If it's "absolutely" harmless, then why are other opinions necessary?

Taking smoke from a burning weed into your lungs is NOT GOOD.

[tuckessee]

72. Aren't there other ways to consume it rather than "smoking"?

Some people reduce it to an oil or butter which can be consumed in food or beverage.

I've also heard of "vaporizing" the herb, which apparently heats it just enough to release the THC and not burn the rest of the plant/flower.

In addition, there are legitimate studies that show smoking cannabis not only DOES NOT cause lung cancer but in fact reduces tumourous growth in the lungs.

I must confess to not having a lot of experience with the herb myself. That is one reason why I would encourage thorough independent study of the issue by any interested parties.

[Zhade]

238. And yet again, another myth about pot. You are wrong.

Pot smoke is a bronchial dilator that SHRINKS tumors instead of causing them.

[Dreamer Tatum]

273. Horseshit

Taking smoke into your lungs is UNHEALTHY.

Sorry to impugn your favorite kind of smoke, but it's a fact.

D'ya happen to know, from archaeological studies, what the leading cause of death was among people who lived before the Indistrial Revolution?

Smoke inhalation. Campfires, cooking fires, fire in general.

Smoke in lungs bad.

[Echo In Light]

56. Indeed. One needs to be wary of some of those varying opinions, especially the ones....

...espoused by those who've swallowed the police $tate propaganda hook, line and sinker. It's important to understand how and why some adopt the authoritarian view on such matters.

[Soylent Brice]

54. tough call. i smoked for the first time when i was 12.

i have 3 kids now, and i quit smoking when my wife told me she was pregnant with our first. i don't see anything negative, at least no more than any other substance. it's about moderation, if you ask me.

kids are going to drink and smoke, and in a lot of cases try drugs. it's how you talk to them about it that counts. i honestly don't know what i will say to my kids. i certainly won't encourage, but i'm not about the boogeyman approach either.

[LynneSin]

58. The worst thing to say is nothing. It opens the child up to a bigger and worse world that pot

I had a friend who said nothing to her daughter when she found out and now the daughter is into much worse than pot.

I'd like to think that kids would wait until they are 18 before they make these decisions but letting the child know that you are there to listen is the smarting thing you can say. Oh and that they need to not let other kids dictate how you (the 13 year old in question) should be in life.

[AngryAmish]

59. It's for losers but mostly harmless

[Echo In Light]

62. Wow, guess I must know a lot of "losers."

[tuckessee]

74. Losers like Carl Sagan.

Hell, Sagan is a DEAD loser. That ought to be proof enough.

[Starbucks Anarchist]

76. Winners drink!

[seabeyond]

80. see, i dont teach my children with anything to qualify all of a person as loser

by a simple action.

this to me is more harm in teaching our children than the issue of pot.

it really isnt about defining a person

but that is just my view

it also sets the children up as using it as a rebellion type thing adn also a bit of none truth which i refuse to give children. tehn they prove ya wrong and dont really trust on some important issue

[iamthebandfanman]

88. ill be sure to tell

my friends with college degrees and respectable jobs that they are losers.

[Echo In Light]

98. That, however, is somewhat aligned w/that posters snide perception of "losers"

[Webster Green]

128. It's for losers?

Jeezus, get a fucking grip!

That is the lamest post in this thread (perhaps).

Remember the Olympics gold medal winner who got caught taking a hit on a bong?

Reefer Madness lives on! :eyes:

[Forkboy]

132. Ok, Rush.

[Zhade]

240. Fuck you. I'm quite successful, with many friends.

Ignorant asshole should be your new name.

[benld74]

60. Well I did in the past, BUT,,,

nothing really happened in a bad way. I know individuals who still use. It is illegal of course, and studies have shown in the countries where it is legal, that the lungs of users are actually worse than those of cigarette smokers. I know its hard to believe, but I have seen the studies.

[Echo In Light]

64. Could you please source that? Just curious

[tuckessee]

78. You'll need to back up that statement with links.

My cursory search showed exactly the opposite of what you claim.

Here is one of scores & scores of articles about the subject. This particlular one is from Scientific American

http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?id=large-study-finds-no-link

[Echo In Light]

102. Exactly my point n/t

[Fireweed247]

118. that is bullshit propaganda

another story
http://www.nutritionalsupplements.com/prescription/marijuanaR8.html

I'm a diagnosed asthmatic with severe asthma. I was diagnosed at age 2 months. From this age to age 15, I endured several surgeries, hundreds of medications, tests and treatments to find a combination of treatment/drugs to allow me an active lifestyle. In addition to several other genetic respiratory disorders, I also deal with frequent migraine headaches.

I started smoking marijuana for recreational use at age 15. By age 16, I no longer used any medications for asthma, chest pain, coughing, or headaches unless suffering from a flu, or the common cold in addition to my normal health afflictions. Marijuana has allowed me to breathe freely and live without pain and coughing for the past 5 years, and I will continue until I find a better solution.

Marijuana is a known "relaxant" and works in the same manner on my inflamed bronchi. I believe that it relieves stress/tension and migraine headaches in the same manner, by allowing additional blood flow to restricted arteries in the brain
. I have been working with my current pulmonary specialist for 3 years now, who supports and encourages my use of marijuana.

[Webster Green]

129. Really now?

Here's another study: "Marijuana May Fight Lung Tumors"

Here is an actual internet link: http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2007/04/17/health/webmd/main2696726.shtml

[Zhade]

241. Fucking BULLSHIT. There are no such studies. Stop lying.

NT!

[Cetacea]

65. The one that doesn't kill is illegal?

I really wouldn't know what to say.

[Echo In Light]

70. It's the perfect allegory for how America is centered around mass delusion/adherence to illusion

[ogneopasno]

66. I talk about how it's illegal, and that there are decisions and things that people can do and

decide about better when they are grown up -- like drive a car, live by themselves, drink beer, fall in love, and so on -- and that people can make smarter and better decisions about things if they wait on it. Regarding pot specifically, I say that it changes the way your brain works in a way you can't always control.

FTR, I have never smoked pot, and this is an answer I give to kids younger than 13, but I will probably keep on this line as they get older.

[LeftHander]

68. Tell her/him it is against the law....

And if you break the law for drugs underage you will end up with it following you.

Scholarships, Athletics, Student Loans are all put in jeopardy.

Occasional pot is mostly harmless physically but legally it is another matter.


"In this family....we obey the law."

[KittyWampus]

75. Smoking pot is an albatross. It can open doors in our conscious mind but those same doors

can be opened more safely and effectively without drugs.

Once you get into the habit, it drags most people down and dampens motivation to excel.

[Terry in Austin]

82. The albatross

is assuming that everybody defines "motivation" and "excellence" the same way, wouldn't you say?

[KittyWampus]

83. it doesn't matter how an individual defines excellence. Pot has one chasing butterflies

while thinking you're accomplishing something.

[Echo In Light]

93. Me, I enjoy "chasing butterflies" while I'm simultaneously "accomplishing something."

I can walk and chew gum at the same time

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

103. Each person's experience with pot is different. I've known people

who have verged on being OCD while on pot and with that focus accomplished things.

[Starbucks Anarchist]

117. Do you listen to music?

Lots of them smoked/smoke pot and put out some brilliant work.

[Zhade]

245. Man, that Carl Sagan never accomplished a thing!

Oh, wait - I meant to say "you're completely full of shit on this subject".

[Cal Carpenter]

297. I guess my clean house, successful vegetable garden

and 5-times-weekly aerobic exercise must be a figment of my imagination. Pot makes all of those things more enjoyable (or just barely tolerable in the case of the cleaning, heh)

You need to 'get over yourself' as they say...

[Echo In Light]

84. For some 'outside the box' simply does not exist - or worse, shouldn't exist

[scarletwoman]

225. That's just plain silly. I'll be 60 in November, I started smoking pot 43 years ago.

I still smoke it. I've lived a wonderful life, travelled all over, raised two wonderful intelligent children, and am living a darn good life in a house that's completely paid for, and working in a job I love.

I love pot. It opens my mind to different perspectives and perceptions, and generally makes me feel happy and creative. My definition of "success" is living a life that allows me to make full use of my creativity and intelligence.

I "excel" at being my own free-thinking, free-spirited self. And I thank pot for assisting me in that endeavor.

sw

[Zhade]

251. Hear hear, SW. It's certainly helping my writing career!

Not to mention my eyes - doctors found it improved them.

[scarletwoman]

258. Wow. Ya know -- it's like the battle between the "straights" and the "freaks" is still raging.

:rofl:

:smoke: :hippie:

sw

[Zhade]

260. And like always, we have the facts and they have the fear.

NT!

[Zhade]

243. More ignorant bullshit. I doubt you ever really smoked.

NT!

[clu]

81. if they really want to party

cuz it *is* fun, and safer than alcohol.... is to finish the important developmental and scholastic tasks in high school and college, and then to cut loose when they have a good job and real free time.

[freedom_to_think]

85. When you are smoking a joint in front of them

[iamthebandfanman]

86. what would you tell them about cigarettes and alcohol? n.t

[Zhade]

252. That unlike pot, those DO kill people.

NT!

[ejpoeta]

94. well, i know what my husband would say.....

he'd probably tell my daughter (who is 10) all about his childhood with his parents who did drugs. he would tell her about the huge electric bill from the marijuana they were drying out or whatever they do with that. he wrote a paper in high school about his experiences. i hope that would help her to stay the hell away from drugs.

[MilesColtrane]

97. It's too bad that most parents don't teach their kids how to moderately partake of intoxicants.

The blueprint seems to be either, it's illegal, don't ever do it, or wait until your eighteen, then you can do whatever.

At least in Europe most parents introduce their kids to moderate alcohol consumption at an early age.
Hopefully by the time a teen decides to experiment with pot, it's on the basis of a special occasion...maybe on a weekend with friends listening to music.

The problem comes when a kid is getting baked everyday and going to school, or lighting up just because he's bored. (legal issues aside)

[Echo In Light]

99. So, the real "problem" then is that perhaps not everyone is geared to $ucceed in corporate culture?

...or, is the crux of the problem a perceived sense of exalting imposed uniformity where everyone should inherently want to "succeed" per corporate culture's ideal?

[MilesColtrane]

105. If I had a kid I'd want him to "succeed" at least enough so that...

...he'd have some kind of economic security at some point in his life.

Not flunking high school, or not getting fired for being high on the job is a small step in that direction.

[Echo In Light]

115. What I'm getting at is that there are many varied approaches to living, and what defines "success."

I also understand what you mean, but wish to stress that tailoring one's life to be a more valuable cog in the corporate machinery doesn't necessarily equate to or reflect upon the intrinsic worth of human life.

[MilesColtrane]

135. "tailoring one's life to be a more valuable cog in the corporate machinery...

...doesn't necessarily equate to or reflect upon the intrinsic worth of human life."

We agree on that.

Unfortunately Capitalism doesn't.

I would like to think that my hypothetical child could see the results of not playing certain aspects of the game by looking at my choices and the resulting socio-economic status I enjoy now, but I'd try to make that lesson explicit instead of relying on his powers of observation.

[Echo In Light]

159. I quit high school and have never once regretted it, so chances are that if my daughter ....

Comes to a similar conclusion I'll not try to scare or shame her into a different perspective.

In my estimation (I'll turn forty this summer) the only appreciable existential difference in working a dead end McJob, and pursuing a career is that the latter involves a greater assimilation of self into the inducements and illusions put forth by the predominant interests of the society ...which don't necessarily have anything to do with speaking to the actual wants, needs, dreams and desires of individuals, but of organizations/corporations instead.

[MilesColtrane]

170. Did you smoke when you were still in school, and if so, did getting high...

...influence your decision to drop out?

[Echo In Light]

171. I began smoking weed before age 10, but it was my interest in music and existential philosophy...

That largely contributed to my not finding any real meaning or satisfaction with school. I'm aware, however, that one never gets something from a book that they didn't somehow already know :)

I'm a musician, so I worked odd jobs and played in bar/club heavy metal bands. Schools are there to teach passivity, uniformity and obedience, so it was pretty easy for me to split.

[MilesColtrane]

175. A couple more questions. (Thanks for replying.)

When you made the choice to leave school, how did you see your life unfolding from that point on?

And, Did things go according to your expectations for the most part?

[azmouse]

100. I'd tell them it's not necessary for a happy life.

I've never smoked it, I've never been even faintly interested in smoking it, and I've had a great life.
Leave pot alone. You don't need it.

[Neoma]

101. Show him the movie Reefer Madness.

[Romulox]

106. That the gov't, your teachers, and the TV are LYING to you about it.

Unfortunately, lying about pot makes it hard to explain to the child that they are NOT lying about heroin or meth...

[NashVegas]

111. You Tell Them You Love Them

And you tell them that if they have problems with something bothering them, you are here to listen - and you'd better goddamn well listen. You tell them drugs can be a great way to forget about their problems, but in the long run, those problems are always going to be there if you don't deal with them head on.

Other than that, you tell them drugs can be a lot of fun but they come with penalties if you get caught with them, so they'd best not do them with people who are stupid enough to get caught.

Also, you tell them experienced dope dealers are weasels who would sell them out in a heartbeat.

[WI_DEM]

114. tell them it can alter mood and to be careful not to be caught smoking it because

you could have more trouble than if you're caught drinking alcohol.

[killbotfactory]

120. Just show him this clip:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=57DdviStOFo

It will scare them away from the evil stuff forever.

The real danger of pot is being caught with the stuff or failing a drug test, because the state and it's institutions will try to ruin your life over it.

[Echo In Light]

124. And since the state realizes the want will never be quelled, it would seem the motive is....

Sadism, making $ on inhumane laws, and ultimately creating an entire range of people who will perceive their system of governance as the enemy.

And these fascists think the pot smokers have something wrong with them?!

[trudyco]

131. Good Question - I need help in this department..

My experience was very limited due to the fact that smoking makes me sick (later I found out I was allergic to tobacco but didn't know that during the teenage years).

I'd point out that people enjoy it because it lessens pain and alters your mood, makes you mellow and often happy, but at the same time your judgment can get altered. You can spend hours fascinated over anything, even the most boring, dumb things. Some people love this and some people think it's a waste of time. Afterwards you can get very hungry and that can lead to weight problems. In some states it is legal for medicinal purposes because of the mood altering, lessening of pain, and the ability to get people to gain weight. It can be smoked, which is never a great idea in my opinion, or it can be baked in things like brownies. It is not a good idea to get High and drive. One study claimed that it could effect male hormones in teens, not sure about female. This may have been refuted. Some people who are OK with alcohol just think Pot is terrible. For years it was presented to the public as some terrible drug.

Unfortunately it is still illegal and the laws are fierce. It isn't like getting caught smoking cigarettes underage. It's stupid but that's the way it is. If you do try it, be careful. And don't let it lead you to trying other drugs because they can be dangerous and the laws against them are tough, too.

How's that? Does it cover everything without being alarmist yet not condoning illegal activity too?

[rucky]

133. Know your source, and avoid the stuff that may have been sprayed w/ paraquat

[ecstatic]

136. I would ask him if he has high expectations for his future

That would be a starting ground. To discuss what he wants out of life and mention how getting caught up with mind altering substances can stop one's dreams. Many people EXPERIMENT with drugs and go on to do great things, but it's impossible to use it regularly and still excel in life. That's just my opinion based on the people I know who do it, of course.

[Zhade]

255. Yeah, be sure to tell the kid what failures Carl Sagan and George Washington were.

Fucking ridiculous. You don't EVEN know how many successful people smoke daily.

One of them is replying to you right now.

[Butch350]

140. Don't hog the joint?

[TexasObserver]

142. The first thing you must tell them is ...

"Stay out of my stash, you little bastard!"

I keed!

I keed!

When my now grown kids were young teens or so, I told them that I didn't care for the whole drug war, and didn't think marijuana was as harmful as alcohol or many prescription drugs, but that it is illegal, so you have to know that it is illegal. I asked them to wait until they were 18 and then they would be adults, and as an adult could decide how they felt about, but between now and then, be aware that getting arrested for possession would hurt them in life.

I told them if they decided to use, not to do it driving, or outside, or in a car, but in someone's house, where there is a reasonable expectation of privacy. I told them to avoid having it on their person, too.

Basically, I said don't use, wait until you're an adult, make your mind up then, but if you use now, be aware that you could be arrested or expelled, so be cautious. I explained to them how things were different in the 1970s, when there was a widespread sense that pot usage wasn't that bad a thing, and law generally didn't freak over it. Now, the laws against its usage are mainly a way to collar ordinary citizens for a "crime" of negligible value, except to feed the private prison system.

[timtom]

149. How about...

Don't ever let me catch you smoking pot, ya little weasel!

[L. Coyote]

153. To talk to their parents, not me!

[bamacrat]

154. Tell them ...

that it is not a harmful substance, but a natural one that has been used by humans for thousands of years. It is completely natural and is non lethal, our brains have receptors especially for THC, nothing for other drugs. But to be careful with it and to wait until ones maturity level has reached a point where they can stay productive while enjoying this natural treat.

[roughsatori]

155. Tell them it is a GATEWAY DRUG!!!

:sarcasm:

[DireStrike]

156. "It's about the same as alcohol, yet it's illegal."

You'll probably try it some time. Be careful though - there are ridiculously stiff penalties. Definitely never buy more than a tiny amount and NEVER sell any.

[Donald Ian Rankin]

I think the important thing is to make clear that it's illegal

Make it clear to them that in itself it's not all that dangerous (it's not totally safe, but most evidence suggests it's less dangerous than smoking cigarettes), but that if you're *caught* using it you risk getting into serious trouble, so if you are going to use it then be discrete, and don't be the one supplying it to your friends.

[Donald Ian Rankin]

162. I think the important thing is to make clear that it's illegal

Make it clear to them that in itself it's not all that dangerous (it's not totally safe, but most evidence suggests it's less dangerous than smoking cigarettes), but that if you're *caught* using it you risk getting into serious trouble, so if you are going to use it then be discrete, and don't be the one supplying it to your friends.

[Hepburn]

163. Back in the 1980s, I told my then 13 year old son the following:

If you wanna smoke, including grass, you can do it at home. If you wanna drink, you can do it at home. If you have a sex partner, let me know and I will make sure you have condoms.

I would rather have my child at trying out all these new "adult" things like sex, smoking and drinking than making an unwanted child and/or driving under the influence and coming back to me in a wooden box.

Because these were the rules at our house ~~ my son showed little or not interest in booze, MJ or drugs. However, as to sex....ummmm...that was a totally different matter!

:hi:

[snort]

165. I'm so glad my kids are in college

'cause the old pot train just keeps on rolling in to the station. Seriously though for all of my smoking they never showed much of an interest. an odd flip of circumstances from my parents generation to me and then the kiddies.

[Dr Fate]

172. Same thing you tell them about whiskey, vodka, and grain alcohol.

None of it is good for you, none of it is for kids, you shouldn't drive when you use any of them- all of it is fine in moderation and all of it is a part of life.

[Zhade]

259. Except that medical science shows pot IS good for you.

Heck, so is alcohol -- when it sterilizes the surgical instruments.

[Dr Fate]

296. I meant smoking it. n/t

n/t

[Dukkha]

179. that drugs are bad. m'kay?

you shouldn't smoke marajuana, m'kay?

[moriah]

211. "There's a time and a place for everything, and it's called college."

I liked Chef's answer better.

[Tommy_Carcetti]

182. Don't do it. It's illegal.

I don't care if the dangers are hyped up and it should be legalized/decriminalized. As long as something is against the law, I'm not going tell my kid as long as they are under my control to do something in violation of the law. It's common sense parenting.

[cherokeeprogressive]

183. Tell him it makes video games seem like you're actually IN them. n/t

[NoSheep]

185. There's a time and place for everything...Don't get caught with it. Buy only locally grown from

a trusted source or grow your own tiny amount. best to never keep more than a few grams at one time.

I'd also tell real stories about people I know who smoke it or have stopped and why.

If you are immature and lazy and irresponsible you shouldn't smoke it for the same reason you shouldn't do other things until you get your life together, like get married, buy a car, have a child, drink alcohol. Because it can take up time and energy you should use to study, work and improve yourself.

If you don't like the effects, don't smoke it.

It really doesn't do anything negative as far as I can see to those who are productive and enjoy the effects. I can't smoke it because it makes me afraid I'll just go around telling everyone what I think and it might get ugly. I have a hard time holding my tongue. My back gets tense. I did smoke it when I was younger and it was completely harmless.
The only thing bad is that it isn't legal. I'd use that to discuss hypocrisy.

Show him that movie Woody Harrelson did....about the misinformation and demonization. It's called Grass, I think.
Finally...I'd act like it isn't that big of a deal...then maybe the curiosity won't be so strong. After all, it is illegal for some insane reason.

[Zhade]

261. Grass was fantastic! Great recommendation!

NT!

[rcrush]

186. What do you tell him about alchohol or cigarettes?

I think it would be the same thing and tell them the truth about it and then let him make his own decision when he turns 18?

[Taverner]

188. Wait until you're older, kid

Like beer, coffee and cigars

Best not to play with while your brain is still developing

[ieoeja]

194. "How can a weed be illegal?" asked my ten year old

... when I told him why I was destroying the pot plants I found growing in my backyard.

"If you smoke it, it makes you feel and act a lot like I do when I'm drunk. So it makes no sense that marijuana is illegal while drinking is not. But because it is illegal, getting arrested for using it can ruin the rest of your life. So I will stick to drinking."


Yeah, yeah, I know. Drinking can cause negative violent outbreaks, while pot never does so. But it is still smarter sticking to that which is legal for the reason stated above.

I don't find this a conundrum at all.

[cliffordu]

197. Give that here!

[plum eggplant]

202. I would tell any tween or teen that pot, like all intoxicants, is something

that s/he will encounter as s/he gets older. I would say that I feel that in some ways it is not as dangerous as alcohol,cocaine, or prescription drugs, but that it doesn't mean that pot cannot be abused or be very detrimental to one's life. I would also say that no one knows if they have won the addiction gene lottery, so while one person may be able to handle smoking pot once in a while, there are others who will use it every day and it will really mess up their lives and that s/he doesn't need it to be happy in life.

[Jersey Devil]

204. Tell him too much pot can make him blind

Oh wait

[The Straight Story]

205. Tell them to use flavored blunts

:)

[BalancedGoat]

210. This letter is a great example in my opinion.

A Frank Mother-Son Conversation on Drugs

One mother shares the advice she offered her son on drugs before he entered high school. Eight years later, as a college graduate, he tells how successful the advice was.

[freedom_to_think]

214. Tell them the truth

Tell them it isn't nearly as dangerous as half the crap on the market that doctors and pharmacists shove down peoples throats.

Tell them it is a natural growing plant that doesn't have the harsh side effects and pose the dangerous health issues that alcohol and tobacco pose.

Tell them that it is much more eco-friendly to use as a paper product and could conserve hundreds of thousands of acres of trees should the paper industry move to hemp paper (which by the way, the Declaration of Independence is written on)

Tell them that you can also make clothing and rope from the plant which is another eco-friendly property.

And it is illegal because.....?

[Zhade]

215. The truth -- that it's a medically-proven beneficial herb.

NT!

[Thickasabrick]

232. Tell them how you feel about pot. Your children will get many

opinions - the one that comes from you is the most important - if you go with saying something that will hopefully discourage it or scare them, they will look back later and think - wow, they totally lied about that (if you do).

[scarletwoman]

239. First, I always told my kids that while their brains were still developing, it wasn't a good idea

to use mind-altering substances -- including alcohol.

Second, I always emphasized that marijuana is an HERB, not a "drug". I'm an herbalist, and my kids were brought up with me giving them natural remedies for illnesses, and eating organic vegetarian food prepared from scratch -- much of it from the garden.

I smoked pot openly in front of my kids while they were growing up, just like I drank the occasinal beer or glass of wine in front of them. Adults get to do stuff that kids can't do, because adults are adults -- kids instinctively get this distinction, it's not that big a deal.

Obviously, there's the extra fillip that pot is illegal, but it's not all that complicated to communicate that extra care must be taken due to the ridiculous "drug" laws. When you're a regular pot smoker, the precautions you take are passed on by example. As a dedicated counter-culturalist I also brought my children up to question mainstream authority.

Anyway, my boys turned out fine. I asked them to please not use pot or alcohol until they got through high school, and I had always promised them that when they turned 18 I would get stoned with them. And we did.

sw

Edited to add: I think it made it easier that smoking pot was simply part of normal life while my kids were growing up. Questions were answered over the course of years, at age appropriate levels, rather than coming up suddenly at a certain age. I was able to model careful use in front of them, including the extra caution required due its illegality.

[JerseygirlCT]

242. We were always pretty upfront - though that's fairly easy

because we weren't exactly big users in the day.

But I also told mine that pot was a whole lot stronger now than it was back in parents' college days.

He actually took it from there, and has decided not to drink or do any other drugs. For now, of course, but as he's in college now and is comfortable with it, that's fine by us. He's old enough to make educated decisions now, and so I'm glad that the honest route worked well.

[adamuu]

248. One thing to add -- tell him his brain is still developing, physically, until about age 20

do you really want to interfere with that?

[deaniac21]

270. Tell him it's a crutch for the weak.

[Echo In Light]

300. Like shopping, or "careerism," or "working out" is

[varelse]

274. I'd be the one asking questions

the average 13 year old is likely to know more about marijuana than I do.

[Trajan]

278. As father of 3 teens ...

I said I supported the right to engage in use by adults, but I STRESSED that people should make choices wisely, and that using pot is NOT a wise choice for teens, just as drinking and smoking cigarettes is not a wise choice, and that many adults should reject usage because of the negative impacts it might cause them ....

Freedom is a wonderful thing, but when a person is free, they need to use wisdom in how they exercise that freedom .... There will be consequences in making such choices ....

[orleans]

283. and one of those negative impacts could be the inability to get

college grant money

(what a fucked up thing)

[omega minimo]

280. "That Seventies Show"

:yourock:

[MrSlayer]

281. That they can't have any until they are 18.

That's what I told mine anyway. I told them the truth. The government propaganda against pot is absolute bullshit.

[fujiyama]

287. Just be honest and use common sense

It really depends on how mature the kid is.

First off, they should know the legal ramifications - you could lose out on college grant money if you're caught with it and nowadays you are drug tested at many work places (even shitty part time jobs at many places). The consequences of getting caught selling or even possessing it, is pretty high especially when young.

Technically it has a lower toxicity than alcohol and is less addictive than cigarettes. The kid should be aware of the difference between marijuana and say ecstasy.

I personally have coughed quite a bit when smoking it and have some asthma but the effects were temporary - and it may have just been my own hit (maybe too much at once). I am a little irritated by some dismissing all honest criticism and discussion of it as a drug - some hail it as though it's a harmless miracle herb of some sort.

Now, I can understand why many are very defensive considering the nonsensical propaganda we are fed from many channels, but some forms can be quite potent. I don't think driving or operating any machinery after smoking or consuming marijuana is a wise idea. I've met some real idiot pot-heads, but some intelligent ones as well. For many it does tend to stun motivation. The fact is that smoking anything (including marijuana smoke) can be an irritant for many with breathing problems, though as has been noted its effects are different on everyone. Another person noted correctly, that since it isn't regulated, it's important to use it from trusted sources. Ultimately, it comes down to it being a relatively mild hallucinogen and depending on any history of mental illness in the family, it's wise to exercise caution.

I personally haven't smoked in some time, though I'll admit I do miss it a bit. I've never really become addicted to anything though including cigarettes. Ultimately, a person can be successful while still using weed. It certainly has well documented benefits but like anything, the use shouldn't interfere with other activities in life.

[aikoaiko]

298. Vermont has the largest "ounces" ever.

[lonestarnot]

304. That it could cut down on opthamologist's bills.

:shrug:

[marano35]

305. When you get 18.....

Smoooooke it.

[datasuspect]

310. puff, puff, pass

[JFKfanforever]

311. You tell him/her, "Just say 'Wait!' "