"The Healthy Americans Act" Senator Ron Wyden D-Ore

[SHRED]

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Sounds kinda like the "Healthy Forests Act"...eh?

More mandatory public subsidization going to the very same corporations who brought us this health insurance mess in the first place.

Thanks Ron!
Thanks for fucking nothing!!

:grr:



"In addition to guaranteeing that every American can afford quality, private health insurance,..."

http://wyden.senate.gov/newsroom/record.cfm?id=307848&%22?

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[Vinca]

1. This guy is completely clueless about healthcare.

He views it as affordable insurance and nothing more. You wouldn't need a "Healthy Americans Act" if private insurance companies hadn't been cherry picking for profit since the 1960's. They shouldn't be rewarded.

[SammyWinstonJack]

2. Of course he's clueless. He's covered.

x(

[Laelth]

3. I don't need insurance. I need health care. n/t

:dem:

-Laelth

[Oregone]

5. Single payer insurance can ensure you get health care

[Laelth]

7. I don't care too much how it gets done.

But I don't need insurance. I will celebrate when our government guarantees health care to all citizens (and I mean all, no exceptions, no effort on the part of citizens required other than showing up at the doctor). If it takes "insurance" to do that ... well, it could probably be done cheaper another way, but whatever.

:dem:

-Laelth

[Oregone]

9. "it could probably be done cheaper another way, but whatever"

It really depends. Ok, here is the thing. Without insurance, the government would have to buy, purchase, regulate, and run every single health care facility in the nation (which would be a massive, insane investment and huge organization). And on top of that, the government would have to continue to pump the same amount of money into them to pay for the services.

With insurance, the government simply pays the facilities to do the work. They negotiate lower prices and set caps, as well as regulate. They cut down on the administrative paperwork. Yes, the facilities can be government run, and can be acquired/built as time goes by, but it requires a much smaller up front investment.

The first model is almost entirely unrealistic, to suggest absolute ownership and running of every facility (and ran at what efficiency?)? The second route just makes sure it gets paid for first off. With the amount of money it would take to own everything, that money may have a bigger social return elsewhere.

[Pastiche423]

12. Epic Fail

[Oregone]

13. Why?

[Pastiche423]

15. Your promotion of insurance

[Oregone]

16. So single-payer insurance is bad now? WTF?

You people want the world, but you don't want to understand a single thing about it (yet make a practical and logistical compromise).

You realize if the government didn't go with an insurance plan it would have to purchase every fucking medical facility in the country? Do you realize how many small practitioners a single town has (some to the point of over-saturation)? Some clinics are doctor owned...you are going to force doctors to sell their practices and work for the government? Why would the government want every damn office in town anyway? You know how much extra overhead that creates? I just don't see how that is a sensible approach at all. It would be a nightmare running 20 facilities all separately in a small town, all providing the same services. I say, let em remain private, but restrict what they can charge by law. If they succeed, its best for everyone. If they wither, fuck em. And as a tangent...think of the billions spent on the initial acquisition of the facilities. Couldn't that be better spent on early education & intervention, and poverty programs (in the end, you just may have less people needing doctors).

BTW, Im currently on a government "insurance" program and quite happy. There are public hospitals and there are private ones (a few). There are mostly private small clinics and specialists. My health insurance card is accepted everywhere, no questions asked, and no bill in the mail. No pre-conditions will ever keep me from coverage. If you cant afford the premiums, the government subsidizes them. What the hell is wrong with this? Isn't that one hell of a great starting point?

Taking profit out of insurance and putting it to work for the good of the people can dramatically help a society. Hm...I wonder if Unemployment Insurance is bad to you too.

[Pastiche423]

17. Once again...

EPIC FAIL!

[Name removed]

18. Deleted message

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[Name removed]

19. Deleted message

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[Name removed]

21. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Oregone]

22. Once again, why?

Im seriously trying to discuss why a socialized single-payer health insurance approach is not the proper direction. Im not sure what warranted posts to be deleted. What is a viable alternative? If you can point me to one, I could begin considering its merit. In the meantime, I can observe single-payer programs being incredibly effective in various countries.

I don't think "Epic Fail" is a good start to an honest argument.

[Oregone]

4. Strange. I thought Wyden was previously a single payer advocate

[stevedeshazer]

6. This is exactly what I'd feared. A half-assed compromise that screws working class people.

He's my Senator. Dammit.

[depakid]

8. Wyden has been in D.C. far too long

One should also remind themselves that Wyden coss over and voted with Republicans on the Medicare Part D scam.

[Pastiche423]

10. Damn right he did!

I was furious and let him know. Did I get a response from my state's only Dem senator at the time? Hell no!

He lost my vote forever w/his idiotic vote on November 24, 2003.

[Deja Q]

11. The guy sounds like a real Wydass.

:evilfrown:

[annabanana]

14. Yeah.. This is what he was pushing on The Ed Show this week...

And Ed didn't know enough about it to ask decent questions..

[alarimer]

20. How about a campaign to send all of these clowns a copy of Sicko?

From the President on down, they all need to see this.