Obama needs a strong, not weak, response to the Somali pirates

[David Dunham]

A firm response by Obama on the Somali piracy issue will render ineffective Republican claims that he is Jimmy Carter revisted on foreign and military policy. The Somali pirates are clearly acting illegally, and in taking other ships, have already killed innocent people they took hostage. The US public will be very supportive if Obama takes firm action to prevent future pirate attacks.

Conversely, a weak and indecisive response by Obama could hurt him politically, especially with American working class voters who by and large do not like manifestations of US weakness in the face of hostage taking and illegal acts like piracy. We need to remember that American blue collar workers are not always Democratically-oriented. They voted solidly for Reagan over Carter and Nixon over McGovern.

[Uzybone]

1. thanks for your continued concern

I'm sure you really worry about pirates.

[Skittles]

2. Obama should do what he thinks is right

and not be influenced by how rightwing whackjob assholes will see him

[Oregone]

4. Agree!

[David Dunham]

7. The 58 percent of US voters who voted for Reagan were not all right-wing whack-jobs

The US public simply does not reelect wimpy presidents.

[Skittles]

31. they were ALL fucking idiots

[jpak]

39. Yup

n/t

[Oregone]

3. Jimmy Carter started the Afghan proxy war...

How can you claim he was "weak on defense"?

:)

[snowbear]

5. According to the US Navy, FBI, and political pundits on both sides-he's doing JUST what he should do

.
.

And I have faith in our president that he knows exactly what he's doing..

[rwheeler31]

6. You go bomb them who cares what the the world thinks.

[Name removed]

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[BlooInBloo]

8. What's with the warmongers today?

[Uzybone]

10. I know, the fact that he increased Afghan troops

and didn't immediately leave Iraq isn't enough for them. Those were wars started under Bush. Obama needs his own clusterfuck to prove that he is "tough".

[David Dunham]

12. No, but he should have the navy destroy the Somali pirates skiffs and "mother ships"

That will teach them a good lesson -- not to mess with us or else they get whacked.

[TorchTheWitch]

42. And what happens to the 50+ hostages currently held?

The pirates killed a French hostage just last Friday. The currently hold over 50 hostages on various vessels from several different countries. Clearly, if we blast these pirates holding the US captain all those other hostages will be in immediate danger of their own lives, and clearly the pirates have no problem with killing them. How will the countries of those other hostages going to feel if that happens?

[David Dunham]

9. Fortunately, Gen. Jones will urge Obama to kick some Somali pirate a-ss

[Arctic Dave]

11. Um, yeah. Didn't we already cover this. The only weakness I'm seeing is

the lack of creativity when posting the same stuff.

[The_Casual_Observer]

13. My guess is that the only thing that will stop this is a take no prisoners

policy where everybody dies, hostages & all. It only has to happen once or twice & that's the end of this shit.

[David Dunham]

14. US public opinion will turn on Obama if he is weak in dealing with these pirates

[tabatha]

17. You know what is so funny about this....

is that Reagan turned tail and removed troops from Lebanon.
Was that strong?

I remember in South Africa, the Apartheid regime was supported for exactly this same reason --- "kragdadigheid" (toughness, powerful) by the Afrikaners. Same right-wing mentality.

When all it took was negotiation, to avoid a bloodbath in South Africa.

[The_Casual_Observer]

22. The Navy sure seems COMPLETELY useless right now. What the

fuck is all that battleship shit for anyway??

[islandmkl]

15. remind us all what exactly that clusterfuck of a president [ ° ] did against these pirates...

for the past 8 years...oh, they didn't grab AN AMERICAN...they have 240 other hostages of assorted nationalities...and NOW they are getting away with TOO MUCH and SOMETHING DRASTIC MUST BE DONE!!

give me a fucking break...Obama is listening, apparently or OBVIOUSLY, to those who are advising "No need for the sledgehammer, yet..."

all you armchair "let's blow their ass up" commandos tune in to the Masters or baseball or something...

pretend you're in Augusta instead of acting like fucking Rambo-revisited wannabees....

[David Dunham]

16. The US public will want action and disfavor inaction by Obama against the pirates

If the US captain is killed by the pirates, they had better be quickly attacked and destroyed or Obama will be in disfavor with the public.

[tabatha]

21. You miss the point.

The FBI is trying to save the captain's life.

[islandmkl]

30. define 'inaction'...

are you the type that thinks the game is over in the 4th inning?...in the 2nd quarter?...

you seem to think this is a simple 'whole bunch of us versus a few of them' scenario...

reactionary decisions have gotten us where we are today...

and i would submit that most of us are looking for a wiser course of action...

if we wanted °'s style of 'diplomacy and action' we would have been for m.c.johnny...

the only people crying for action are those people who have a limited understanding of the full situation...the same people who will destroy their own security to 'get even' or 'make 'em pay...'

[Oldtimeralso]

18. Tell Me How Strong Was w's Response to the Chinese

when they took one of our reconnaissance planes?

I think he was busy getting fitted for his "Mission Accomplished" flight suit.

[David Dunham]

19. The Chinese have nukes; the pirates don't and should be destroyed if they persist.

[tkmorris]

20. You may well be right, however

This particular situation (Somalia) is a giant hairball. There are many pirates there, and we don't know where the vast majority of them are. This is essentially a policing problem, the waters off Somalia need a strong and permanent enforcement presence, and Somalia's government (insofar as one exists) lacks both the will and the ability to accomplish this. Our military is already stretched thin and needs down time, though admittedly not so much our Navy. Do you propose that the US take the lead in protecting international shipping in the area? That might be a tough sell, and itself opens the door for criticism of Obama.

As far as the current situation is concerned I think it is imperative that these 4 pirates not escape. How to accomplish that while ensuring the safety of the Captain is another matter, and frankly may not be possible IMHO. I suspect that may be the policy in play here, ie they will save the Captain if they can, but under no circumstances are the pirates to escape. If that means taking the lifeboat by force then I believe that is what they will do. The last I heard it had drifted to within 20 miles of the coast, and if it gets too close our hand will be forced in order to avoid the possibility of the hostage takers escaping. If the hostage dies in the takeover I expect the "official story" is likely to be that the pirates themselves acted first, forcing our response, whether that is actually what occurs or not.

I sincerely hope Captain Philips knows the score, and is prepared to act when the time comes. In the end he may be in the best position to save himself, or at least make a critical difference in whatever attempt is made on the boat.

[tabatha]

23. Yes, there is probably far more going on than we know about....

it is not a simple case of showing power.

[TorchTheWitch]

43. that's already been happening for a long time

Various countries have been patroling the waters trying to root out these pirates but so far it hasn't worked... the area is enormous and it would take far more ships than anyone has or can part with. The international community has already come to the realization that what they have been doing isn't working, the situation has gotten worse, and something else (like arming merchant vessels) is the better and cheaper option.

Captain Phillips has already tried to escape once in jumping overboard and trying to make a break for the Navy ship. Within seconds the pirates recaptured him. Because of that, the captain is now bound and the pirates have apparently dumped their communications overboard.

Just last Friday a French hostage was killed by pirates when the French Navy attempted a rescue opperation. The situation is getting more dire, and there are MANY hostages of several countries currently being held by these pirates some of them for months already. Over time the pirates have become more greedy, more bold and now violent.

[Bandit]

50. Three days ago they were three hundred miles off Somalia

Now you say they are twenty miles off....They must be drifting at over three knots an hour. That is pretty darn fast for just drifting...

[Warpy]

24. Thank you for your concern

I'm sure he appreciates your nostalgia for the days of the Cowboy in Chief going in with guns blazing. It certainly told the world what this country was all about, didn't it?

Of course, that was also his father's policy and that is one reason Somalia is still a mess.

I am happy that the whole thing is in the hands of negotiators who are dealing with it in such a way that the Captain has a chance of coming through alive and not held prisoner in Somalia.

I am utterly delighted that the sensible approach is at long last being used.

But thank you for your concern.

[David Dunham]

25. The negotiations ended. Pirates now must surrender or face the consequences if they kill captain.

[Name removed]

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[Name removed]

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[HughMoran]

26. How many of these posts are we going to see?

Holy shit, you'd think this was some sort of gigantic military operation based on the "concern" of some here. It's one civilian who we'll likely get back alive, then we'll fuck up some Somali ass. What's the fucking hurry?

[David Dunham]

27. The pirates took another US owned ship today and have 250 hostages already

A joint US-European naval response is needed to stop these pirates from doing more.

[HughMoran]

28. US Owned? I don't see any reports of more Americans being held hostage

I did see that the French got a hostage killed in a raid recently.

Why are you all wound up about this - it's been happening for years now. You just care about what Republicans think - huh? C'mon.

[TorchTheWitch]

45. Oh good crap!

Another one? So what's the grand total of international hostages have they stock piled now?

[HughMoran]

51. Well, ya gonna turn off the flaming siren now?

Fucking impatient person.

[TorchTheWitch]

44. the pirates have over 50 hostages right now

in various vessels of all sorts of nationalities and others being held in Somalia. Just last Friday they killed a French hostage when the French Navy tried a rescue opperation. You've apparently been pretty late to the party on what's going on with this issue.

[HughMoran]

48. No, this has been going on for 2 years and I've been intently following it

THAT is why I can't comprehend the sudden urge to "nuke" them. Let's get our people back safely, then make sure this doesn't happen to anybody else. Once again - what's the fucking sudden emergency? There have been hundreds held for a log ass time.

[CoffeeCat]

29. I think Obama should rig up the cast and crew...

...from the "Pirates of the Caribbean"--including the scary looking ships
and weapons--and scare the livin bejeezus out of them all!

If I saw Johnny Depp coming at me from a few yards away--I'd surrender!

[islandmkl]

32. fuck it...i say fly over the whole area and spray them ...

with what-the-fuck-ever Goldfinger was using at Fort Knox...knock EVERYBODY, EVERY FUCKING BODY goddam unconscious (US Naval personnel included) and then send in a special team of NITROMETHANE SEALS or DOUBLESECRETSPECIALFORCESYOUDON'TEVENKNOWABOUT and just pick up the hostage captain, pop a cap in the ass of the pirates (or whatever method such stealth squads use) and head back to ship...

a couple of hours later everyone wakes up...and the crisis is fucking over...some headaches, of course, but at least all CONCERNED AMERICANS can get some fucking sleep....

[jbnow]

33. Since when does a president direct a battle? Or do you want

war declared on Somali?

[islandmkl]

34. you're right...hell yeah...we're about due to declare a war that we can 'win'...

:evilgrin:

oh yeah...i guess that isn't exactly our modus operandi since about 1945...

don't you just love people that seem to think Barack is just 'not picking up the phone and telling the assorted military forces to proceed'...

these people haven't ventured past STRATEGO...let alone RISK....

where are we finding these hawks, dare i say CHICKENHAWKS??

[Two Americas]

35. sure

The more Democrats act like Republicans, the less the Republicans will criticize them.

[LostInAnomie]

40. Why the hell would he even get involved?

Hostage negotiation is not the territory of a President. He should leave it up to the professionals and let them resolve the situation. If he wants to form a policy for how we prevent piracy from now on, that's different. But, it would be ridiculous for him to try to involve himself in the current process.

[backscatter712]

41. Leave it to the professionals.

It's a rinky-dink lifeboat with one hostage and four thugs.

Either they'll come to a deal with the US Navy or they won't. There's a lot of armchair quarterbacking here which isn't particularly helpful.

That said, I don't think it would hurt for Obama to send a few more destroyers and frigates into the area, persuade other countries with decent navies to do the same, arrange to provide escorts for cargo vessels in the area, and hopefully make life a bit more difficult for the pirates.

[H2O Man]

49. One question:

You wrote that "There's a lot of armchair quarterbacking here which isn't particularly helpful." I agree: in fact, even if a DUer expressed the absolutely best possible means of dealing with the situation, it is in no sense helpful to resolving the actual crisis -- because it is merely an internet discussion forum. But, that being the case, do you think that people expressing their opinion, no matter if you agree with it or not, is in any way harmful? It has no impact on the actual situation, and it seems to me that discussing world events would be "particularly helpful" in helping people on an internet discussion forum processing events around them.

[backscatter712]

55. What can I do?

:shrug:

It's an Internet discussion forum - I doubt the President or the .mil off the Somalia cost is reading this. I'm guess I just wasn't particularly worked up over this crisis.

At any rate, I just got back from celebrating Easter with my family and saw the news - looks like it's a happy ending (except for the pirates...)

[Stinky The Clown]

46. There is NO good that would come out of Obama or any president getting directly involved in this

Look at Clinton with Waco.

The best thing Obama can do is leave it to professionals and no one any higher than undersecretary of state.

[opihimoimoi]

47. Firm....very firm.....nip it in the bud.....

[HughMoran]

52. heh

[Skittles]

53. still concerned, Mr. Dunham?

:rofl:

[tabatha]

56. This makes the point about Obama.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x8338790

[bemildred]

54. Did someone suggest a weak response?

I don't remember anything like that.