RAH RAH USA. . .and to the MALCONTENTS: TOUGH SHIT

[wndycty]

Today's rescue of Richard Phillips is a thing of beauty. I know this is the Democratic Underground and some of us don't like the RAH RAH sentiments expressed but TOUGH SHIT.

We vote, we are engaged, we are activists BECAUSE WE LOVE THIS COUNTRY. We have no problems calling out the shit done by this country, but the we also reserve the right to shout RAH RAH when something goes right.

The Maersk Alabama was delivering RELIEF SUPPLIES TO AFRICA! They got hijacked by pirates, our Navy moved in and rescued the captain and killed 3 of the 4 pirates.

Our President was being criticized by the right for not doing enough and not moving fast enough, yet our Navy successfully rescued the captain. . .so excuse the FUCK OUT OF ME FOR SAYING

RAH RAH USA

:patriot: :patriot: :patriot: :patriot: :patriot: :patriot: :patriot: :patriot: :patriot: :patriot: :patriot: :patriot: :patriot: :patriot: :patriot: :patriot: :patriot:

[Uzybone]

1. Why do you love America?

:sarcasm:

[MADem]

191. That was the PERFECT first post!!!!

PERFECT!!!

[Adelante]

2. RAH RAH USA

Me, too.

[drm604]

3. K&R

:patriot:

[stillcool]

4. For me..it's not about this story..

this ship..and I have to wonder why the media chooses to highlight this incident. There is always more to the story. And with Somalia there is a lot more.
http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/North_Africa/North_Africa_page.html

[cali]

8. if you don't grasp why this is such a big story- and not just here-

I can't be bothered to explain it to you. And yes, there's a lot more about Somalia, and gasp, some of it is the responsibility of the Somalians.

[Name removed]

24. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Cynical Guy]

49. Ooh! Shiny!

Don't look at what I'm doing here, or what's going on at the same time as this event, look over here!

(You're right about the strange and inconsistent focus that the media places on certain stories)

[Fire1]

74. stillcool, will you kindly stick with the superficial bullshit and

leave 'reality' out of it???? Too Deep!

[TBF]

81. Best response on the thread. n/t

[RetroLounge]

105. and it was deleted...

So I guess it wasn't all that great.

RL

[Fire1]

111. Maybe not but it's burned into my memory! lol!

[inna]

139. why was it deleted? nt

[TBF]

156. Well I didn't say it was the nicest response on the thread, but it

definitely was the best from my view, and certainly deserved.

[Reterr]

76. Oh get over yourself

:eyes:
You really are almost Limbaughesque in how much you think of yourself and every little opinion you hold. It is so annoying the way you go around authoritatively telling people this and that because apparently everyone should just accept that you are the ultimate authority on all things reasonable here or something. Why? Because you have the highest obscenity/condescension/rudeness to content ratio in your posts?

Btw this isn't about the captain. I am glad the captain was rescued. But regardless, your tone is annoying as all hell as always....

[Skittles]

79. HEY RETERR

you want I should teach you how to use IGNORE on pompous idiots? I'd do that for you my sweet! :D

[Arctic Dave]

40. Your not the only one who thinks this is way overhyped.

I am happy the crew is safe but I am amazed at the veracity of the way some people are lapping up this story.

[pnorman]

145. "way overhyped"? Consider this:

Had it NOT worked worked out so flawlessly--- ie: had captain Phillips been killed (a very DISTINCT possibility under the circumstances), the anti-Obama machine would have gone into FRENZIED overdrive! It would have been the centerpiece of the "Teabag Tantrums", scheduled in a few days, and it would have been non-stop ankle-biting for the next few years! That could have been BAD -- bad for Obama, and bad for this country!

Personal note: I've been going to sea for over a half century. Retired for the past 9 years, I still maintain a strong interest in my Union, and manage two listserves concerning it. It represents the engineers on that ship, and there are a few on those lists who know captain Phillips personally. Needless to say, there is MUCH joy on those lists. AND a formerly RABID anti-Obama guy there, has done a complete 180 degree on "my Commander in Chief". You'd have to know the situation, to realize what a MIRACLE that was!

pnorman

[Orsino]

167. Yeah, overhyped.

Without taking anything away from the professionalism of the rescuers, we can still acknowledge that this story gets extra rah-rah attention because guns were involved. This is red meat to American military fetishists--though, some of these, as you point out, will choose the rescue as a reason to become Obama fans.

There's good reason for those involved to feel pride, and to be honored by the rest of us--even those of us saddened by the loss of life.

[Arctic Dave]

171. I am not saying what happened wasn't a good outcome, I think it was justifiable,

I am referring to the MSM's latest obsession. I am glad your friend is safe. Maybe now the world can start a proactive response to stopping these type of crimes, instead of a reactive one.

[certainot]

187. this was overhyped, pushed by the GOP propaganda machine

in the hope that they could push the kind of action that was taken, with the hope it would fail, and they could use it against obama.

that's the way the GOP will run it's media operation as long as obama is in, that's the way it has worked the last 20 years because the talk radio monopoly with its coordinated uncontested repetition from 1000 stations it can turn molehills into mountains any time they want. and that's the way it's going to continue to work until the radio monopoly is broken up.

the biggest national sunday news programs led with the piracy story while on another there was some small mention about legalizing pot, a much more worthy topic.

there is value in not taking shit when a citizen is threatened like that and send a message that might discourage it again. but there are plenty of other opportunities for justice that are ignored- this became high profile. it is great that he was rescued but there was a real possibility he could have been killed in the attempt - couldn't the shipping co pay the 2 MIL to ensure his release and then all relevant countries do something more general to reduce the piracy, and illegal dumping? the piracy issue will probably be addressed anyway, why not after the ransom was paid? in this case though, payment of the ransom would have been sold by the GOP media machine as obama being chickenshit. if the captain had been killed it would have been the other way around. as it is, limbaugh is mocking the press for suggesting this was brilliant white house work- taking the credit from the seals- when it is unlikely there will be any of that.

[ieoeja]

198. If you think we should have paid the ransom, you should have voted for McCain.

Carter refused to pay ransom to Iran. While Reagan's very first action as president was to pay the demanded ransom. The result was twelve years of Islamic terrorists taking Americans hostage and more ransom payments.

That Blackhawk pilot was the first American held for ransom under Clinton. Instead of money, he sent the US Marines back towards Somalia. The pilot was released immediately. And Islamic terrorists did not take another American hostage again throughout Clinton's entire 8 year administration.

Over the past few years some Somalis have turned to piracy. I am not aware of any gov'ts paying ransom, but I do know the companies have been paying. And BushII did nothing so far as we know. Now that Obama has finally done something, we will have to see what happens. But I suspect most Somalis involved in this practice to date will turn to something easier.

So if you are a fan of paying ransom, then you should consider voting Republican next time. It makes sense when you consider the makeup of the two parties. The GOP is full of people who think everything should run like a business. The Democratic Party is full of liberal do-gooders. Which of those two groups is more likely to put a monetary value on a human life? And which is more likely to refuse on a matter of principal?

[certainot]

203. you're nuts to compare this to the iranian hostage situation and terrorists

for one thing reagan's people (bush) paid for the hostages to be kept in iran so carter couldn't get them out and would lose the election. there is speculation that the carter effort to rescue them was sabotaged by reagan people (bush). see the original OCTOBER SURPRISE and the whole iran contra aftermath.

the reason anyone would compare it to that and even bring in islamic terrorists is precisely the point in my original comment. you've been at the shit end of a limbaugh/hannity/fox feeding frenzy and i was suggesting the company pay for his life the same way it had been done by others so far without loss of life. it ended up costing much more than that in life and dollars and could have gone much worse. the whole idea of sending out that prison ship recently and showing off how the future pirate prisoners would be chained to the floor i'm sure gave some people erections but it was absurd and little more than more media hype.

the somalis originally were doing it to stop illegal dumping and fishing off their coast and it has turned to something else. but i doubt this will deter them much except to maybe leave american ships alone, which it seems they had been doing anyway. in the long run there still has to be an international overall effort.

[ieoeja]

207. Never listen to Rush. FNC is blocked.

I don't watch CNN or MSNBC because they're fucking stupid. I have no idea what prison ship you are talking about. If not for DU I would have thought this was a back page story. I have seen ZERO of the media hype.

So don't blame my facts on the stupid shit you choose to watch.

Fact: Islamic terrorists took American hostages repeatedly after Reagan paid off Iran.
Fact: Clinton stopped paying ransom, and Islamic terrorists stopped taking hostages.

You want to talk about a whole lot of other stuff. Fine. Enjoy yourself. But don't tell me the above facts are some made up bullshit by the Rightists. Why would they make up facts that point out how completely hopeless Republicans are at protecting Americans?

[MADem]

192. You are right.

There was dancing and singing at Mass Maritime as well, as you can imagine.

[George II]

219. Personally, I think every rightwing moron should be teabagged!!

[BlancheSplanchnik]

161. better choice of words..

veracity..
I think the word you wanted was "gullibility of some people.." or "credulousness of some people.."
"naive" or "unquestioning" would work too...

(hope this isn't too irritating of me, jumping in tangentially and all. I'm a word connoisseuse, but it's impossible to know who appreciates a better choice of words and who doesn't :shrug: )

anyway, good point. I'm torn between admiration for the Navy effort and tired of the continued media tripe. If the media didn't have a truly inspiring and easily digestible sensational story here, they'd substitute the latest celebrity eye-brow-raiser. *spew*

[Arctic Dave]

170. You are right. You reminds of an article by David Foster Wallace.

It was about word usage.

[BlancheSplanchnik]

181. I LOVE David Foster Wallace

RIP :cry:

I think it was reading his work and noticing how turned on I was by his vocabulary and writing style that caused me to realize what a freakin' word nut I am. God, I just wanted to throw myself on him... :7

[Arctic Dave]

183. I see you have a little enthusiasm for his work. LOL

I was really sad when he died. I have read a lot of his books.

[BlancheSplanchnik]

221. mee too...

was so sad to find out.

I would love to get ahold of his Harper's essays and other work. All I have are "A Supposedly Fun Thing" and "Brief Interviews".

[George II]

64. Well, to the rest of America it IS "about this story"....as for your next post below??

Just what makes you think the media "spoon fed" us this story? I suspect you're one of the "malcontents" the OPer was talking about and talking to.

[stillcool]

96. Of course for the rest of America..

it IS this story. What else have you been watching on tv? And really, how much do you know or care about Somalia, and the history of the United States intervening in that country? As far as 'malcontent'...well I'm very content that I am not led around by the nose by what runs across the tv screen.

[George II]

101. Blather, but I see you were either unwilling or incapable of answering my question about "spoon fed"

[stillcool]

104. what do you think the tv is?

[George II]

106. Yawn....let's try this one more time (third!)

Just what makes you think the media "spoon fed" us this story?

[stillcool]

112. I can't believe this..

After all the lies the media has told have been exposed, I would think people would question why you are being fed, what you are being fed. I'm really quite flabbergasted that anyone would swallow whole what the media tells you, and not question in the least if it's the whole story, or if it's accurate at all.

[Name removed]

115. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[stillcool]

116. What question am I ducking?

as far as troll...Thank you for that..."I know you are but what am I" I thought I was in the playground but I wasn't sure.

[George II]

129. You have not answered the repeated question.....

WHAT MAKES YOU THINK THE MEDIA "SPOON FED" US THIS STORY?"

Can you answer that question? You made the claim, surely you can tell us?

[stillcool]

131. There is a reason this is the only story..

they've been covering, no? Don't you wonder why this was made such a big deal out of, to the exclusion of all else? Being spoon-fed is what the media does best. Managing perception, making big stories out of nothing, and making nothing out of big stories. Maybe I am missing what it is that makes this story so significant?

[George II]

133. OK, you are not willing to answer the question...thanks.

All you do is parrot the same ambiguous, vague line. You have an agenda, one I don't plan on participating in.

Thank you for wasting my time.

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

158. The piracy has been going on for 20 years, more intensely for the last 5.

How often has it been spotlighted like this?

Ergo, spoonfed.

[Raineyb]

188. It's a pity that you had to spoon feed such an obvious answer. n/t

[George II]

206. See my post below yours...

[George II]

205. This was the FIRST pirate attack on an American ship in more than 200 years....

THAT is why it has been spotlighted like this! You're whining about the American press and their reporting without even spending a few seconds verifying the logic behind your ridiculous accusations..:wtf:

Totally ludicrous.

PS - and you STILL haven't answered the question, just posed another one in response.

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

211. Spoonfed.

[George II]

212. Spoonfed? Bull....it was the first act of piracy on Americans in 200 years. Check this article:

THEN tell me this particular act of piracy has been "spoonfed" by the American press!

http://features.csmonitor.com/globalnews/2009/04/09/somali-piracy-back-in-spotlight-with-us-hostage/

Somali piracy back in spotlight with US hostage
The FBI has joined the effort to try to secure Capt. Richard Phillips's release.

By Jonathan Adams | Correspondent 04.09.09

The first pirate attack on a US ship in some 200 years has put Somali pirates back on the front page.

World attention began focusing on the pirates last year after a sharp spike in attacks. Speedboat-borne bandits from the failed northeastern African state had become increasingly emboldened, and a kidnap-for-ransom trade thrived off the Somali coast.

The problem faded from the headlines earlier this year, after a US-led naval force stepped up antipiracy patrols in the Gulf of Aden, and countries such as China joined the fight.

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

213. *

[George II]

214. Meaning?

or, more bluntly........:wtf: ???

[Horse with no Name]

144. YOU just got called a troll???

:rofl:
Oh my, now THAT is funny.
You and I don't always agree on the smaller issues, but generally on the bigger issues we are always neck and neck.:thumbsup:

[inna]

140. thanks a lot for the link, nt

[The Straight Story]

5. You are not allowed to say nice things about America, only other countries

Cause we have done bad things - even with Obama in office USA is all evil, all the time. Wavering from that means your progressive card will be taken away.

Remember, and repeat after me, America sucks, it is and always will be evil, and Iran is a far better place and you would be happier living there or cuba than here.

:)

[paulsby]

57. i agree totally. america - fuck yea (i say with no irony)

seriously.

i cannot recall how many threads i read where when the US is compared to any european country (a recent thread on france comes to mind), the foreign country is ALWAYS better. they are more (fill in the blanks).... XXXXX with "XXXX" as anything good.

when was the last time you read a thread where somebody compared the US FAVORABLY vs. another european country. that's considered the ultimate sign of "nationalism" or whatever.

however, the opposite is always ok.

i can praise, for example, canada - by saying their health care system is superior. but also say there restrictions on speech rights is terrible, and america is better in that respect.

or that france's criminal justice system is inferior to ours (ours is adversarial. their system is wack)
but few others will ever give america any favorable comparison.

this hostage rescue is a proud day. we killed (3 ) of the bad guys and got the hostage out alive.

and as somebody who has spent a lot of time in a lot of foreign countries, i can't think of ANY country i would rather live.

[hisownpetard]

117. in.

[MADem]

195. Mind if I sit by you?

I've spent almost half my life outside the continental USA. I appreciate the good stuff, too. I was getting a little worried these past eight years, but that worry is easing with every passing day.

No nation is perfect, but there's a lot to like about the USA--its diversity is not the least of its strengths; after all, we're a country where ANYONE, from anywhere, can be a citizen.

[Bluebear]

124. Surely you don't think that Democrats feel that way? Do you?

[DevonRex]

6. And they prevented it from escalating. They intercepted other pirate ships

who were trying to get there to help the ones in the life boat. They turned them back. Obama didn't order the Navy to fire on any Somali ports that the pirates frequent. This could have turned into a huge thing.

Instead, it was handled quietly and correctly. So Rah Rah USA!!!

[Warpy]

12. Yes, it was handled the best it could have been

given the desperate circumstances.

Just think about the fake cowboy in chief and think about what he would have done.

We'd have at least one more war we had no hope of winning.

[DevonRex]

15. LOL, we're both replying to each other. OMG, when I think of what Dubya

would have done it's downright frightening.

[Downtown Hound]

31. Dubya would have wet his pants and used this as an excuse to attack somebody else

Just like he did after 9-11.

[blondeatlast]

54. Or think about how President McCain would have handled it.

On second thought, don't. I want you to sleep well tonight.

[Wednesdays]

93. President McCain would have been killed by stress by now

Instead, this would have been handled by President...

Oh. My. God.


:scared:

[blondeatlast]

121. President Oh. My. God.

That would be how I'd refer to her, I think.

Yikes!

[Smith_3]

7. I don't know. As a rule of thumb, when the US "get it their way" usually there is some caveat.

I don't know alot about the situation in Somalia, but from general experience, chances are the activities down there by the United States are not noble, despite what some news sources or bloggers might say. So pardon me if I refrain from the rah rah.

[Warpy]

9. I'm never delighted with anything that kills people

but I am delighted that the captain was freed, unhurt.

The international community needs to come together to patrol those waters and make sure that piracy is too dangerous and expensive to pursue as a major source of income.

[DevonRex]

13. Just realize that many more would have been killed if hte Navy had

handled this poorly. Other pirate ships attempted to go to the scene but were turned back with nobody killed.

[Warpy]

14. Oh, I do

I'm a bleeding heart but I'm not stupid.

That the deaths were limited to three is pretty amazing, given the situation.

[DevonRex]

17. Heh, you sound like me. A bleeding heart but not stupid.

:hug:

[Abq_Sarah]

42. The downside of that

Is the pirates on the boat that was turned back are free to attack more ships. We aren't going to keep our fleet off the coast of Somalia and when our ships move on, the pirates will be back to business. We (meaning all countries that use that shipping route) need to make it clear that piracy comes with a very stiff price. If you hijack a ship, kidnap the crew and try to extort money from any country, you will not walk away....... period.

[a la izquierda]

165. Nicely put...I think you've pretty much summed up

how a lot of people feel.

[Political Tiger]

10. It's good to feel pride in our country again!

After 8 horrible years of Herr Bush, we deserve it!

[Oregone]

11. But just a question...

Why rah, rah death? People were killed, although they are bad to you. But it seems strange to applaud human death.

Maybe its unrealistic to think a ransom could be paid, and they could of apprehended them as criminals (retrieving the money) after Phillips was safe. But on the other hand, blatantly cheering death seems a tad morbid. Although, I guess it is Easter.

[Political Tiger]

18. I'm not sure if anybody is happy anybody died

and if they are they should be ashamed, but at the same time I can't feel sorry for these pirates.

[Oregone]

22. BTW, someone said elsewhere Phillips jump overboard first...

Which kind of would explain a bit why it was handled the way it was (instead of the way I suggested)

But there is defiantly a good number of pro "pirate death" people here. Almost more than pro "banker death" people. Gotta wonder whats behind that all. I think people think it is great these "bad" people are dead. Correct me if I am wrong.

Yeah, I'm glad the Captain is as safe as anyone else. Thats good news.

[MadMaddie]

27. The 3 that died they chose this path of Piracy and criminality

they chose to attempt to hijack the ship and they chose to kidnap the captain.

When it is all said and done each man can choose the path that he desires. If he chooses the path with a gun and crime then if he ends up dead because of that choice that is of his own making. It still comes down to individual responsibility to do right or wrong.

[Oregone]

37. I disagree

Fundamentally. I also disagree death is an acceptable consequence for criminality, even if I accepted the premise of "choice", as you put it forth.

Further, death is anything but an event to applaud and cheer, despite the circumstances

[MadMaddie]

44. So what is your solution? Allow the Pirates to continue

hijacking ships until they murder innocents?

Now we can go back to the root cause of the Somalian Piracy and fix that problem. Illegal dumping of Toxic wastes and the overfishing of their coastal waters by other countries. But it still does not excuse criminal actions such as piracy.

And yes it is a choice, because not all Somalie's are committing piracy. So those that are participating in these activities are actively choosing to committ these crimes.

I am not cheering their deaths but they had a choice (to lay down their weapons and let the captain go) they chose not too.

Every man and woman has a choice and a responsibility to do the right thing.

[Oregone]

46. Lets not construct straw man arguments...

And applauding death is the problem I have here, as I originally stated. I'm not sure why criticizing that amounts to much more than criticizing the celebration of death.

"And yes it is a choice, because not all Somalie's are committing piracy."

Well, first you have to convince me humans are capable of making choices. If a given situation is repeated to a static individual (which there are none), is such an individual capable of producing but a single choice? Would there ever be more than one possible outcome, to the exact same situation, to the exact same individual, with the exact same environmental variables? Is there a "choice", or simply an inevitable outcome? Are human brains much more than complex Turing machines, or rather, multiplexors depending upon current structure and environmental/temporary inputs? Is the human brain more than a dynamic, infinite state autonoma that produces but a single outcome based upon 1) the current environmental input and 2) the current brain circuitry (which is dynamically built from genetics and past experiences, all, in this model, beyond the original sentient control of the machine/brain itself). In other words, are we all merely what are genetic goo has created, molded by the environment, which is reciprocally molded by our genetic goo and dynamically forming brain structure? Do we ever have a free individual choice, or are individuals molded from the time of birth by external and internally uncontrollable forces, that change what control the individual may exert on the environment in the first place?

Do we maybe, by examining what an individual is, and how they are formed (scientifically speaking), need a little more compassion from the start when examining why and how people end up in situations like this in the first place? I think so.

Saying they made a "choice" (for which the acceptable consequence is death) is a bit black and white. Pregnant teens make choices to have sex. Fuck em. Take em off welfare. Let them starve. They chose 'wrong', not my problem. Maybe our focus should be on trying to mold an environment that molds individuals whose life outcome isn't likely to be a pirate. Just saying, you know....but, thats all besides the point.

Maybe in the meantime, my actual point, let us just not cheer death, unless its Jesus' and it'll get us closer to heaven. In that case, bring on the bull whip.

[MedleyMisty]

173. Thank you for this post

I had been bullied and insulted for thinking that humans have a choice - for me, though, it was thinking that they had a choice to not celebrate death, to not punish people for bad "choices", to feel empathy and compassion. I guess it was sort of reverse classism, in that I thought people who grew up in privileged environments could choose empathy for those who grew up deprived and desperate. I can see how growing up in bad circumstances limits your choices and your ability to make them, but I never could understand how growing up safe and secure with lots of money limited your choices and your ability to make them.

If it had been presented this way, rather than "You are an evil capitalist tool for thinking that people have the choice to not be evil capitalist tools!", I would have been more open to the idea.

[tomp]

152. "Every man and woman has a choice and a responsibility to do the right thing".

...unless they are in the u.s. military. then, we "support the troops".

[MadMaddie]

217. Not all soldiars and not all cops are bad or evil.

These soldiars did their jobs.

[Schema Thing]

16. Why do you hate George Carlin?

[sufrommich]

19. Great post and I agree! nt

[Turbineguy]

20. It was the best of outcomes

for this incident.

And hopefully it will mark a turning point for the larger problems.

[arcadian]

21. Today we are all Freepers.

Thing of beauty. :cry: :patriot:

[leftstreet]

26. ouch

:thumbsup:

:cry:

[remedy1]

28. Oh, Bullshit....

The navy did good, and three criminals are dead.

Good job, Navy SEALS!!!

[leftstreet]

Fuckin A! On to Afghanistan!!!!11111!!!!!

We're #1 man!

[Bicoastal]

35. Hey, I think I head my name mentioned!

[jpak]

30. Fuck that and speak for yourself

n/t

[Kajsa]

61. +1.

n/t

[Raineyb]

189. Re #21

Exhibit A

[Dappleganger]

208. Give this one a drink! nt

nt

[Bicoastal]

34. Freepers do not have a monopoly on being proud of their military when it does what it's supposed to.

And the ultimate goal of the military is to protect its citizens from harm at all costs.

We didn't bomb Somalia, we didn't air raid the villages of the pirates' families; we killed three armed men who shot at their hostage when he tried to escape and were quite prepared to do so upon his second try. The kidnappers even fired upon a US Navy rescue ship during the deliberations.

Despite all of your self-righteous foofaraw, you have yet to explain why the Pirates didn't deserve their fate.

[paulsby]

59. i have a friend who is a navy seal commander

simply put, he's a bad ass. exceptionally soft spoken, and he doesn't walk around strutting or flexing his muscles (imaginary lat spread syndrome is how we refer to that at the gym).

i've done defensive tactics training with him, though, and firearms practice, and the guy is simply a fine tuned killing machine.

as he should be.

the navy seals kick ass, and we should be proud.

[irislake]

84. Go ahead

be proud. Three dead and those Seals "kick ass".

Lovely!

[GinaMaria]

118. Seals are well trained assassins

They are used like surgical instruments to precisely slice out a problem. The reality is we live in a world that requires these skills. I am not proud to live in a world where we need assassins. Your description of Seals is very similar to the description I've heard from a former boss who was a navy navigator. They are killing machines, understated (no steroid induced strutting), keep a low profile, don't call attention to themselves, say very little and they are trained assassins.

[MADem]

196. That's rather a blunt assessment of their skillset.

They have the ability to do that, but that's a rather unfair and limited characterization. "Assassin" doesn't describe what they were doing vis a vis Captain Phillips. They wouldn't have killed anyone had those pirates given up their captive. The CO of the Bainbridge made the call that they were ready to pull the trigger on their hostage, and that's why they used ultimate force to separate the hostage from his captors.

They can do many other things as well. They plant explosives, monitoring devices, conduct surveillance, reconnaissance--basically, if you want someone to go in and out of a location with no muss nor fuss, they're your asset. The SEALS do their best work when no one ever even knows they've been there--and we, often as not, don't even hear about it.

[driver8]

168. I've met a couple of SEALs -- they were pretty low key.

I guess when you are that bad ass, you don't need to prove yourself to anyone.

[BlancheSplanchnik]

182. my hunny was Marines Recon...

same kind of understated toughness. He doesn't have to strut his stuff.

[bridgit]

85. Pft, no, freepers aren't smart enough to have pulled off such a thing

:kick:

[SemperEadem]

92. speak for yourself

I will never be a freeper.

[Name removed]

107. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[tekisui]

23. Proud day.

The first US hostages taken by pirates in 200 years, all are back safely, 3 pirates dead, one arrested.

[Arctic Dave]

43. Many Amereicans have been killed by "pirates" in the last 200

years. "Pirates" in the he Gulf of Mexico have been doing it for years. Other then we call them criminals. I guess calling them pirates makes for better news ratings.

[tekisui]

45. I need to better educate myself on that.

I will look into murders in the Gulf in the recent past.

[liberalmuse]

25. This was a small test, but an important one, and President Obama's Navy passed.

It also didn't hurt that Captain Phillips helped by attempting to escape whenever he saw the chance. I love people like this. President Obama didn't overreact and blow the shit out of everything, which could have likely resulted in more loss of life than there was. I think this is a good metaphor. Preparedness, patience and a willingness to step out, take a risk and help oneself when the opportunity arises are very good things. The SEALS were ready when the good Captain jumped overboard the second time, and were well-trained enough that they succeeded.

[Thothmes]

215. It is the United Stated Navy

It has been that for over 200 years. President Obama is its C-in-C for 4 or possibly 8 years. Then he will be gone and it will still be the United States Navy.

[remedy1]

29. Right on!

Our SEALS are the best!

Great job. Well done.

[slay]

32. Um - I can understand the celebration but putting TOUGH SHIT in there makes you

look like an arrogant american ass. evidently you've made it clear you don't care so whatever. i will NOT recommend this thread and hyper-patriotism is just so... *yawn*

[arcadian]

33. +1

:applause:

[CitizenPatriot]

53. just had to say that your sig line pics

ROCK!!!!

[Malikshah]

67. So very true-- creating the strawman and then pumping testosterone-- actually

comes across as d-baggery rather than sincere in one's support of getting the captain free.

[Lisa0825]

36. I am happy about the rescue, but it doesn't address the root problems.

I hope that now that an American ship was the target, more focus will be placed on the issues the led up to it so we can prevent future kidnappings.

Welcome home, Captain!!! :woohoo:

[paulsby]

60. fuck that

somalia is a seriously fucked up country, and we are not going to solve their problems. that's going to be up to them.

read blackhawk down for an intro to one thoroughly munged country.

it's not our job to focus on their issues.

but when they attack american interests we need to let the pirates know we will capture/kill them and that's that.

which is what we did.

[Lisa0825]

68. Oh for fuck's sake.....

can't you understand that if the problems are not addressed, more pirates will just keep kidnapping and collecting ransoms? We can't just round them up in a corral and blow them up. The problems need to be addressed to benefit the rest of the world.

:banghead:

moran

[paulsby]

73. oh for fucks' sake

we are not the world's police, and it is neither our job, nor is it likely we will succeed in solving somalia's problems FOR THEM.

again, if you understand their massive fuckeduppedness, you might grok that.

regardless, if we blow their fucking pirates out of the water repeatedly, they WILL get the message. they are engaging in piracy because it's lucrative. when it ceases BEING lucrative, they will cease doing it.

[Name removed]

102. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[paulsby]

103. another cogent reply

from you. about what i could expect.

[ShareTheWoods]

113. The root problem for the pirates is greed, laziness and stupidity

They are extorting millions and endangering innocents. Their death appears to be the only way to stop them. Those
that choose to live by threatening others will be killed if necessary to save the lives of innocents.

[Hanse]

38. I think the other person's point...

was that most people, present company included, don't really give a shit about relief to africa, or the hostage, but that pirates were killed. Like some dumb action movie.

I think he's got a point. The whole thing is a tabloid media non-issue.

[Wednesdays]

39. There's nothing wrong with cheering for America

It's when we do it while plugging people full of bullets, or when we repress people, that it becomes a problem.

[doctor jazz]

41. Recommend and

:kick:
:-)

[Warren Stupidity]

47. IM GONNA PUT A HUGH FLAG ON MA TRUCK SERIES!

AND CHANT USA USA USA LIKE A MINDLESS MORAN

I'm happy that the captain was rescued. Your post is obnoxious.

[marmar]

50. Agreed...... Be happy the captain was rescued and be done with it.......

..... instead a strident "Kiss My Flag" post. Good f**king grief.

[Bluebear]

125. my god...

...we tend to see things in almost exactlt the same way, don't we?

[marmar]

126. Great minds and all, Bluebear.....

:grouphug:

[Raineyb]

190. Well said.

I couldn't agree more.

:thumbsup:

Regards

[Mass]

204. Well said.\nt

[readmoreoften]

48. If the US Navy can't rescue a dude from ragtag pirates then it would be a pretty

pathetic waste of taxpayer money. Most other Western democracies give free health care and college to their populations instead of a bad-ass military. And I bet their militaries would've managed to beat out a rag-tag group of pirates as well.

Goes to show that idiot "jingos" will latch onto any old bullshit for a reason to stick that big green foam #1 on their hand.

[rpannier]

87. At about the same time the French engaged a group of pirates that had taken French nationals hostage

At least one French national was killed by the 'rag-tag' pirates

[MADem]

197. In front of his very young son, and wife, too. That had to be stressful.

And memorable...and not in a good way, either.

[DS1]

51. I wish I could push their noses in that shit, honestly

[smiley_glad_hands]

52. I'm a liberal but not a pacifist. Pacifism is for the naive. Rah Rah USA. eom

[VermeerLives]

55. Agree

Pacifism isn't an effective strategy for survival.

[jmondine]

150. Gandhi wasn't a pacifist either

He was an activist and provocateur.
Not trying to relate it to this event in any way, really. Just sayin'.

[ChimpersMcSmirkers]

56. .

:patriot:

[Odin2005]

58. The heads of the Naive Pacifist fools are about to explode.

Sorry guys, turns out you can't chit-chat your way out of all problems.

[Garbo 2004]

77. And yet they were negotiating ("chit, chat") for days. When hostage in imminent danger

according to reports, and there was an opportunity, Navy executed Plan B. (Plan A to negotiate their surrender if possible, which was the hostage takers' only viable option for survival in the circumstances.)

Not unlike a police action when hostages are taken. Not a matter of pacifism or militarism IMO.

[90-percent]

62. GWB?

He would have nuked Greenland.

And push the big red button live on Fox News.

-90% jimmy

[George II]

63. Yes, the right criticized Obama for what he did(n't) do, but...........

just how many pirates were captured by the bush administration?
just how many pirates were killed by the bush administration?
just how many pirates' hostages were rescued by the bush administration?

This has been going on for years, and the rescue today, to my knowledge, is the FIRST ever by US forces.

Great job Navy. Great job Obama.

Rightwingers? GO FUCK YOURSELVES!! Do something FOR this country, not just TO this country!

[Thothmes]

216. How many American flagged ships

were attacked during the bush administration and their crews captured?

[Politicub]

65. It was handled extremely well

Three cheers!!

And, RAH RAH RAH right back atcha. :)


:patriot:

[lostnotforgotten]

66. You Appear to Be Manifesting Behaviors Similar To Those Of The Right

America, love it or leave it - and all of that foolishness.

[jmowreader]

69. You know what GWB's first response to the pirate incident would have been...

"Do they have Bibles? We need to get them Bibles."

(Which, of course, was Shrub's first thought after he presided over the worst dissemination of intelligence sources and methods in the history of the Republic--the Chinese capture of the Navy surveillance aircraft in the first weeks of Bush's maladministration.)

[Maru Kitteh]

70. K & R Baby!

Excellent post!

[madrchsod]

71. u s navy seals rule....

[eleny]

72. K&R from me, too

Bravery, skill and patience resulted in the rescue bringing him out alive.

[veganlush]

75. now the thing that needs to be done, that we on the left are bad at...

..is to call out all the right-wing whacks that were criticizing their Commander-In-Chief, with troops in harms way, over this whole pirate thing. We should be breaking out the videos, transcripts, etc,..showing these assholes for what they are. But will we...? Also there's more to this story, as evidenced on other posts here, showing that maybe some multi-national corporations were operating as 'pirates' there before all this...


edited to put an 's' on the end of 'asshole'

[BobTheSubgenius]

128. Couldn't agree more.

An acquaintance of mine linked me to an article on a whacksite (in both senses of the word, if you ask me) called "Timebomb" or some such foolishness, about this story, and the thread was appalling. These people HATE Obama, liberals, progressives, Democrats.....well, you get the idea. Anyone to the left of John Birch. (One of the posts actually said that, for all that people around the world hated *, everyone knew where he stood, and that's what led to all the peace and stability the world enjoyed during his administration. I kid you not.)

My prediction....the "inactivity", "cowardice" and all the other nonsensical terms were DEFINITELY laid at the feet of Obama, and now that it's worked out, it could have either been done better, or the credit goes elsewhere entirely. BO either had nothing to do with it, was lucky, or should have done something else, and sooner.

I actually hate these people.

And, I think that "asshole(s)" can't contain too many esses. Please...add more, if you see the need, or even just feel like it. :D

[HughMoran]

78. Hey RWers - we win

[tooeyeten]

80. Amen

"Our President was being criticized by the right for not doing enough and not moving fast enough, yet our Navy successfully rescued the captain. . .so excuse the FUCK OUT OF ME FOR SAYING "

Amen!

The right is nothing but a bunch of WHINERS.

:kick:

[Zhade]

82. You know... this WON'T make your dick any bigger.

NT!

[Mass]

83. The largest Navy in the world has defeated a pirate boat.

I am really happy for the captain and his family and have no particular sympathy for the pirates. Not sure how this qualifies as a great victory? The only thing here is that the pirates were stupid to attack an American boat rather than a Liberian boat with a third world crew, because nobody in the world would have cared about that.

[Joey Liberal]

90. The Army isn't used on the ocean

That area of water is massive. There aren't enough ships in the Navy to cover every inch of water. It was a great day for our Navy, in particular our Navy SEALS. It ended well, and yet you have an attitude. Get your tea bags ready.

[Mass]

91. Gosh. Have I landed on free republic by error? I am happy for the captain, as I said.

Obama did his job well, and we can be happy about that. I am not just sure it is worth this level of enthusiasm. Sorry. I reserve my enthusiasm for this country doing good things in the world, like proposing to get rid of nuclear weapons, not for the Navy doing its job.

[Joey Liberal]

186. Enjoy the Tea Party.......... nt

[Joey Liberal]

86. And it happened on Obama's watch

We should be celebrating, not bitching.

[bridgit]

88. Agreed...^rec ~

:kick:

[Iggo]

89. Fuck you, too!

:hi:

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

94. A Monumental Victory!! Tyson KO's Pee-Wee Herman!! God is on our Side!!

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

97. Bingo!

[bridgit]

98. Imo more like handing random, death defying acts of chaos a vote of little if *no* confidence

[EFerrari]

100. LOL.

[dflprincess]

114. Truly, the battle of Midway pales in comparison to this glorious victory!

:banghead:

[AlbertCat]

120. Apunto! I mean, I'm glad things worked out and all...

... but, it's all gaga only because the Right Wing predicted failure. The heroes in this drama are indeed heroes, and cool adult action prevailed rather than the Conservo-macho rushing in with guns blazing and dicks hard. But y'know....duh!

It's been so long since adults were in charge, it's a miracle when something works.

It's like that woman from the Washington Post on a Round Table clip on here somewhere exclaiming about Iowa's supreme court upholding the state's constitution "It's AMAZING! Absolutely AMAZING!"

It is???? Oh damn.... it IS.

[Freddie Stubbs]

202. Rescuing the Captain SAFELY was a victory

Anyone could have gone in the guns a blazing and killing the pirates. But our Navy SEALs managed to pull this off without hurting the hostage.

[Life Long Dem]

95. Another words, rah rah to MSM and big business

I excuse the FUCK OUT OF YOU for saying rah rah.

[EFerrari]

99. Wow. You completely missed arcadian's point. That's hilarious -- and with flags, too!.

lol

[BlooInBloo]

108. Holy crap.

[opihimoimoi]

109. The President gave the approval...the rest is the Navy and the Opportunity taken

Good Sniping, good plannig, good timing.....good communications during the time frame prior to the shooting...those boys should also go to the White House for medals along with the others.....

RAH RAH RAH GO USA

[Political Heretic]

110. There's a right way, and then there's an arrogant freeper-like way to be proud

You've chosen the latter. Good job.

[Bluebear]

123. Quelle surprise. nt

[wndycty]

127. And at least 55 DUers agree with me

:kick:

[Orwellian_Ghost]

119. What Is Patriotism?

What Is Patriotism?
by Emma Goldman
1908
San Francisco, California

Men and Women:

What is patriotism? Is it love of one's birthplace, the place of childhood's recollections and hopes, dreams and aspirations? Is it the place where, in childlike naivete, we would watch the passing clouds, and wonder why we, too, could not float so swiftly? The place where we would count the milliard glittering stars, terror-stricken lest each one "an eye should be," piercing the very depths of our little souls? Is it the place where we would listen to the music of the birds and long to have wings to fly, even as they, to distant lands? Or is it the place where we would sit on Mother's knee, enraptured by tales of great deeds and conquests? In short, is it love for the spot, every inch representing dear and precious recollections of a happy, joyous and playful childhood?

If that were patriotism, few American men of today would be called upon to be patriotic, since the place of play has been turned into factory, mill, and mine, while deepening sounds of machinery have replaced the music of the birds. No longer can we hear the tales of great deeds, for the stories our mothers tell today are but those of sorrow, tears and grief.

What, then, is patriotism? "Patriotism, sir, is the last resort of scoundrels," said Dr. Johnson. Leo Tolstoy, the greatest anti-patriot of our time, defines patriotism as the principle that will justify the training of wholesale murderers; a trade that requires better equipment in the exercise of man-killing than the making of such necessities as shoes, clothing, and houses; a trade that guarantees better returns and greater glory than that of the honest workingman...

Indeed, conceit, arrogance and egotism are the essentials of patriotism. Let me illustrate. Patriotism assumes that our globe is divided into little spots, each one surrounded by an iron gate. Those who have had the fortune of being born on some particular spot consider themselves nobler, better, grander, more intelligent than those living beings inhabiting any other spot. It is, therefore, the duty of everyone living on that chosen spot to fight, kill and die in the attempt to impose his superiority upon all the others. The inhabitants of the other spots reason in like manner, of course, with the result that from early infancy the mind of the child is provided with blood-curdling stories about the Germans, the French, the Italians, Russians, etc. When the child has reached manhood he is thoroughly saturated with the belief that he is chosen by the Lord himself to defend his country against the attack or invasion of any foreigner. It is for that purpose that we are clamoring for a greater army and navy, more battleships and ammunition...

<snip>

http://edchange.org/multicultural/speeches/emma_goldman_patriotism.html



During the late nineteenth and early twentieth centuries, the United States pursued an aggressive policy of expansionism, extending its political and economic influence around the globe. That pivotal era in the history of our nation is the subject of this on-line history.



Contents
Expansion in the Pacific:

A Letter to an Emperor
Footholds in the Pacific

The Spanish-American War:

Remember the Maine
A Splendid Little War
A Gift from the Gods

The Boxer Rebellion
The Panama Canal
U.S. Intervention in Latin America

http://www.smplanet.com/imperialism/toc.html

[Bluebear]

122. As usual, unnecessarily framed as flamebait. You forgot to use "poutrage".

[conturnedpro09]

130. K&R! Go NAVY! Go OBAMA! Go AMERICA!

On this Easter, my family and I are feeling so happy for the Captain and his loved ones. We're all beaming with plenty of good old American pride-- without apology!

:patriot:

[Canuckistanian]

132. I hate the word "malcontent"

Along with another word, "troublemaker".

Both terms are used far too often by people who are desperately trying to marginalize the real concerns of others.

Carry on with your celebration.

[mia]

134. Say it again: "RAH RAH USA. . .and to the MALCONTENTS:"

... get real!

Richard Phillips is safe and all of us should be able to rest more easily because of it.

[rug]

135. Worrying about pirates was keeping me up for nights on end.

Thank God for the seals.

[mia]

137. Thank God that the Commander in Chief authorized the SEALS

to do their jobs. The pirates gave up their rights when the threw the first grappling hook.

Bravos all around.

[WheelWalker]

136. Competency has its own, unique appeal, has it not?

[inna]

138. weak

[mia]

142. Have you tried vitamins?

[inna]

141. dude, it's just completely reactionary; i'm aghast that this lame thread got so many recs. nt

[mia]

143. Who's reactionary? You're "aghast" that we love our country. n/t

[Bluebear]

146. Yeah, everyone not in a cheering lather with four letter words "hates their country"

[LynnTheDem]

147. George W. Bush, mocking & jeering a woman murderer sentenced to death.

As reminded by Walldude;
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=5444501&mesg_id=5444807

[slay]

148. Same here - this thread seems more appropriate to freerepublic.. should i wrap myself in a flag

before i go to bed tonight? sigh.. :shrug:

[TheWatcher]

149. Jingoism: Not Just For Republicans Anymore!

:eyes:

[McCamy Taylor]

151. WTF? We are killing women and children in the Congo for diamonds and other minerals.

Our government is the one arming the murderers--and rapists and folks who force children to become soldiers. You think I am going to get rah rah because we rescued an American captain? The U.S. is a big fat colonial tyrant that brings nothing but death to the third world.

[cali]

155. love the george bush mindset you possess. it's so...

nostalgic. And you forgot all your usual numerous and often misleading links. The U.S., dearie, is not the sole source of evil in the world. And no, the U.S. doesn't only bring death to the third world. Your hate is no different from freeper hate. It's rabid and sick.

[slay]

178. WTF are you talking about - McCamy Taylor was talking FACTS while you talk blind

patriotism. YOU are the one being bush-like if anyone but whatever - i'm done with this LAME thread.. pfft

[Bluebear]

222. that it is

[SlingBlade]

153. Great Post K&R

:toast: :patriot:



:kick:

[depakid]

154. "some of us don't like the RAH RAH sentiments"

Some of us just think that it's pathetic....

[endarkenment]

157. The fact that this got so many recs is just sad.

I think many of us have learned NOTHING over the last eight years. Or is that 80 years?

[Deep13]

159. Enlighten us.

:shrug:

[Renew Deal]

175. I think it's because many people here are disgusted with many other people here.

Namely the america haters (sadly there are a few), the unreasonable, and the defenders of criminality.

[Raineyb]

193. You sound as idiotic as Bush when you say shit like that.

No one is saying they hate the country (Although I can see why people from other countries would hate many of our citizens considering the disgusting behavior displayed by those who think death is something to fucking cheer about like it's a goddamned football game or something.) Some people find the mindless cheerleading without any bloody thought as to how we got here and why all of a sudden this particular story of piracy an issue on the TV when it's been going on for years without a peep from the MSM. The same MSM I might add that had skewed their "news" stories leading the populace to an illegal and costly war in Iraq.

So excuse the fuck out of me if I find the same skewing of a story in order to get the patriotic fervor flowing in this piracy story equally suspect. If I wanted mindless cheerleading with no goddamned critical thinking I'd become a fucking freeper.

It really shouldn't be too much to ask on a discussion board. Although by the numerous of less than thoughtful responses to a mere inquiry about perhaps rethinking the sagacity of cheering death one could easily be forgiven for thinking otherwise.

[Deep13]

160. Someone I know said a few days ago that Obama was saying anything about this.

Obviously, he was annoyed by that fact.

I responded with, "Saying is irrelevant. Doing is what matters."

[JPZenger]

162. The French and Russians Acted Faster and Killed Hostages

When the Russians and French were each faced with pirates taking over one of their vessels, they used force more quickly. In both cases, hostages were killed.

By the way, the USS Bainbridge was named after a hero of the US Navy who, among other achievements, fought against the Barbary pirates in 1804. Every other country was paying tribute/ransoms. President Jefferson sent the US Navy and Marine Corps. That was the source of "from the shores of Tripoli."

[jonnyblitz]

163. this thread needs some Toby Keith!!!1

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cSWuA-RttGU

[slay]

180. ROFL!

gonna try and build a ladder to sanity? good luck in this thread.. :P

[Bluebear]

220. Hell yeah!

:crazy:

[JDPriestly]

164. Agreed. This rescue was on the one hand fair and humanitarian

and on the other a healthy use of military force. The Somalis may have legitimate beefs and fears, but the pirates' methods for changing things are wrong.

[Uzybone]

166. Thank goodness there is at least one thread on Greatest page

that isn't defending pirates, slamming Obama or saying the left and the right are more or less the same. This site is headed down the shithole fast.

[nichomachus]

169. Yeah for us -- let's blow up more shit -- we're Americans dammit -- we blow stuff up

[iandhr]

172. Rah Rah USA

You're God Damn right. Don't fuck with the US NAVY

[No More Bushbots]

174. How Many Innocents Were Killed?

0
Congratulations Navy on a job well done.

By the end of the day, the Reich Wing will be complaining that the Obama Administration acted unilaterally and put the Captain's life at risk.
Remember, you read it here first.

[iandhr]

179. 0 Thats right. 0.

Thank you for your post When foreign hostels hold one of our citizens hostage we have every right to respond with force.

[greguganus]

176. K&R. n/t

[Democrats_win]

177. There's much to be happy about; so, be happy. Don't act like the Republicans.

They spent the entire GWB presidency unhappy even though everything was going their way. We know that the traitor Repubs will bring America down again so enjoy the good while it lasts.

[OneBlueSky]

184. no flag waving here . . . nationalism and its little brother, patriotism, . . .

are right up there with religion when it comes to "things that cause wars" and "stupid differences between groups of humans" . . . and I really hate that this country's first inclination when it comes to solving difficult problems is "let's kill someone -- or something" . . . however . . .

the pirates were given every opportunity to end the stand-off peacefully, and they declined . . . they had a gun at the captain's back, and I have no doubt they would have used it . . . so, much as I regret the necessity to end this violently, I do understand it and support the decision of President Obama and the skipper of the Bainbridge to act . . . and I'm glad that Capt. Phillips is safe and that no U.S. personnel were killed or injured . . .

but . . . I'm not waving any flags and shouting "U.S.A.! U.S.A.!" like this was the hockey team beating the Russians or something . . . this was a bad situation that, unfortunately, had to be ended violently, not proof that the U.S. is some kind of superstar in a great morality play . . . I think the past eight years have proven otherwise . . .

[LynnTheDem]

194. Perfectly said.

Thank you.

[walldude]

209. Thanks... not enough of this around here...

I'm getting tired of being berated for not acting like a fucking freeper about this..

[EFerrari]

210. Thanks, OneBlueSky. n/t

[Bluebear]

218. +1

[tuckessee]

185. I guess you needed a confidence boost.

The only military victories since WW2 have been against mighty Grenada & Panama. Charlie kicked your ass. The rinky dink Iraqis & Afghanis are whipping your ass.

At least now you've found something to make you feel good for awhile.

It'll be interesting to see if you can deal with the rest of pirates without going apeshit with your Shock & Awe and killing thousands of innocents.

[BlueJazz]

199. wndycty..Sounds good to me!

[NancyG]

200. Obama can do both-rescue the captain AND work on the underlying problem

of radioactive waste and overfishing the ocean around Somalia.

I don't see the Prez as doing an either/or. He'll do both. Handled this immediate situation and will be working to fix the why of it.

I believe in his head and heart.

[Autonomy]

201. This is what the military is for

saving people from criminals. A great job by the US military, and gratz to President Obama.