Four million cats and dogs euthanzied by shelters each year

[Karmadillo]

While the media serves its appointed role of distracting us by giving us endless updates on the First Dog, it's worth taking a moment to remember four million cats and dogs are euthanized by shelters in this country each year. I realize it's essential we spend our money to bailout banks and fund wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, but I wonder what a few billion dollars would do to significantly reduce that number.

http://www.hsus.org/pets/issues_affecting_our_pets/pet_overpopulation_and_ownership_statistics/hsus_pet_overpopulation_estimates.html

<edit>

Number of cats and dogs euthanized by shelters each year:
3-4 million (HSUS estimate)

<edit>

[Runcible Spoon]

1. Thank you for this.

Both Biden and Obama squandered a pretty great opportunity to set an example. Here's to hoping unwanted animals get a little help somewhere along the way...

[MADem]

7. What nonsense. His kid has allergies.

He wanted a midsized dog. That limited his options. This dog is on his second home, he has just gotten a new name (from Charlie to Bo), he was a poor fit with his first family. He would have gone to "rescue" http://www.pwdca.org/breed/rescue/ and been reassigned, or simply resold, had not the Obamas taken him.

You want the kid to have a headful of snot to "make a point?"

I don't know how many times the Obamas talked about the importance of pet adoption during this dog search process.

They don't have to live every aspect of their lives to please others. Especially when it comes to their little kids, who weren't even on the ballot, as I recall.

[Karmadillo]

11. Not nonsense. Shelters have plenty of hypoallergenic dogs for those seeking to adopt.

Schnauzers, poodles, and various terriers come to mind. No need for a headful of snot to make a point.

[MADem]

18. Yes it is. None of those are midsized dogs, save the standard poodle--which is an ugly ass dog.

And a standard poodle in a shelter probably needs prozac, is poorly socialized, is old and unwell, or has "issues." Otherwise, he'd go to Poodle Rescue. http://www.poodlerescuene.org/ As would a schnauzer, http://www.schnauzerrescue.com/ or a terrier (of any specific variety).

http://www.westierescue.com/
http://www.foxterrierrescue.net/
http://www.yorkierescue.com/
http://www.aire-rescue.com/
http://www.wtcares.org/


I know, I have a purebred rescue terrier. Great dog. Not my first one, either--but not a midsized dog, not by any stretch. They're "under one arm" dogs that can be easily picked up by anyone who doesn't have a bad back.

The Obamas had specific requirements that they wanted fulfilled for their pet. It's not their "job" to suborn their wishes for an appropriate companion for their children to make others happy or "set a good example." I know both the President and his wife have talked about pet adoption on a number of media availabilities and interviews--they've done their bit.

We know where they got the PWD bug--from Ted Kennedy. He's got a couple of 'em. They likely found lots to like about his, and that was that.

[Runcible Spoon]

24. Way to hijack the point of the OP.

We wanted to have a moment for the needless deaths of millions of animals. I think it's a shame Obama doesn't give more visibility to this cause.

You want to make it about his entitlement to the "perfect" dog. He "wanted" a midsize dog. Honestly, he's the President, there is no fucking reason it NEEDS to be a midsize dog. He will have enough resources to comfortably have any size dog for the rest of his life. Just stupid "preference". And that preference means that an unwanted dog somewhere is denied a home.

But once again, it's never about the ISSUES. It's ALL ABOUT OBAMA, his feelings, his wishes. I'm sick of it.

[MADem]

28. The point was to carp about the Obamas--it's made clearly at the end of the post.

And who the hell are YOU to tell the President what kind of dog he can have? What kind of dog he'll have to buy the dog food for, what kind of dog will be a member of HIS--not YOUR--family?

What nerve you have.

Get over yourself--you're coming off rather poorly, but that is your way, apparently. I have to say, I'm rather sick of you. If you hate the guy so much, there are other places where you can go and find people who are Just Like You.

[Tarheel_Dem]

32. A-M-E-N! I wish I could recommend your post. (nt)

:thumbsup:

[Name removed]

35. Deleted sub-thread

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[Name removed]

38. Deleted sub-thread

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[firedupdem]

39. Amen! Leave those people alone about the damn dog! The dog

has a home!

[Runcible Spoon]

43. Unlike the millions of others who aren't so fortunate in their friends or pedigrees.

[firedupdem]

45. And he can't save the world. It's a dog. The dog has a home.

Move on to the next topic of outrage. You are always ticked about something.

[Runcible Spoon]

61. Let's list the things I'm "ticked" about:

The denial of FULL CIVIL RIGHTS to all Americans
The neoliberal pillage of our economy
More senseless expenditure to enrich the military industrial capital
Turning our educational system into a corporate machine

And yes, today I got pissed because Obama squandered an opportunity to send a powerful message about unwanted animals. In a country of plenty, it's obvious that the most vulnerable still suffer.

Yes, I'm such a MONSTER for caring about these things and my anger is very much unjustified. Hey! There's an egg roll after all, I should just look at the pretty pictures and it will be allll better.

[Name removed]

57. Deleted sub-thread

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[cherish44]

52. The OP is a veiled snipe

Doesn't take a rocket scientist to see that.

[Hansel]

72. Having worked at an animal shelter and seen this tragedy firsthand

I doubt that the purpose of this post was a veiled snipe. It is a horrible experience to watch highly adoptable loving dogs and cats receive a death sentence just because they sneeze. Some have taken their last breath in my arms looking up at me with trust in their eyes and as if wondering when our next play time will be. It is a painful experience and it never ever gets easier. It is even more painful for the person doing the injection.

I think it would have been a good example for the Obamas to have chosen a shelter dog, however, I think that President Obama can also make this experience valuable in other ways. In fact, he already has in one very important way. The Obamas took their time and got the perfect dog for their family. Therefore, it is unlikely to end up at a shelter.

I don't think the OP was meaning to snipe at the President. I'm sure it is more about the great missed opportunity to educate the public on the mindlessness of buying dogs from a breeder while millions of animals are needlessly put to death at shelters every year. It would be great, though, if the Obama's emphasized that this dog will be neutered.

[AndrewP]

77. Agreed.

[tblue37]

71. Adopting a pet is a lifelong commitment--for the life of the pet.

It is important to select the type of pet that suits the family's needs--and preferences.

[Hekate]

111. Kee-rist. He's the President of the US, not the president of PETA. Get over it. He's entitled to...

... a family life of his own. He owes none of us any details of same. If his daughter has pet allergies she either has asthma or is at risk of asthma, which is a serious and incurable illness. His choice of a pet is NONE of our business.

How many rescue animals do you own? No, don't answer that. I don't give a damn.

Hekate

[CatsDogsBabies]

126. The dog is for the kids

for goodness sake, let them have their dog. We have 15 (the equivalent of at least one 20 hour a week job) rescus animals, both cats and dogs. People need to spay and neuter their animals in order to control the number of unwanted pets.

[northernlights]

55. bullshit -- there are plenty of labradoodle and goldendoodle

puppies languishing in shelters and desperate for homes.

They absolutely could have met their needs with a shelter puppy. The just put friendship with Ted Kennedy first.

[fortyfeetunder]

87. I second your post.

I thought Malia had asthma, and that was an overriding factor when choosing a dog.

I only hope the PWD is going to be a good fit with Malia. I would hate to see this go wrong for this family.

I can understand and respect the Obama family decision.

[glinda]

59. I have ten rescues that were facing euthanization. How many do you have?

[AndrewP]

79. Exactly. And every day I see them killed for lack of a home.

Oppps. Sorry. Didn't want to make anyone have bad feelings. Please.....resume posting on the Michelle Obama fashion threads.

[Critters2]

102. Portuguese Water Dogs available thru Petfinder.com:

http://www.petfinder.com/search/search.cgi?pet.Animal=Dog&pet.Breed=Portuguese+Water+Dog&pet.Age=&pet.Size=&pet.Sex=&location=Washington%2C+DC

[northernlights]

54. there are 10 hypoallergenic midsized puppies available

from shelters right now -- all of them labradoodles and goldendoodles, which were their original top prospects. And that's *just* from PA to points north and east. And *just* today. There also were some other poodle crosses with poodle hypoallergenic coats and lethal cuteness (especially a border collie/standard poodle cross that I wanted to run and adopt right now).

They had *plenty* of shelter pup options to meet all their needs. But Ted Kennedy wanted to give them Bo, so they gave up their principles.

That's politics. That's Washington.

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

86. Exactly, principles be damned if politics are involved.

[OwnedByFerrets]

89. There are HUNDREDS of Bichons who need saving every day.

http://www.smallpawsrescue.org/

But no, we couldnt save one of these babies.

[MADem]

108. They wanted a medium sized dog. A bichon is not medium sized.

He doesn't have a "Honey I Blew Up The Dog" machine.

[ecstatic]

13. Can't figure out which of today's poutrages is more ridiculous:

The "oh noez we killed a pirate" outrage or the "oh noez the Obamas don't have a shelter dog" outrage. :crazy:

[Karmadillo]

16. Concern over four million euthanized cats and dogs is ridiculous?

nt

[MADem]

20. No, concern over picking apart why the Obamas decided to get the dog they wanted is ridiculous. NT

[ecstatic]

31. Nice...

Rovian twist of my words. :eyes:

[Tx4obama]

63. yes...

it is ridiculous when people link that to the Obama girls decision of what dog they want.
They are little girls and have a right to have whatever dog they want to have.
Blame the people that didn't fix their pets or that have abandoned them - it is not the problem of Malia and Sasha.

[Runcible Spoon]

25. Why don't you take a trip down to your local shelter and tell the unwanted animals about "poutrage"

Your flippant disregard makes me sick.

[MADem]

29. Why don't you run down there and adopt a dog to take up the slack?

Or don't you pass the screening?

[Runcible Spoon]

34. ...

Meet Leeloo, adopted from the Atlanta Humane Society about 4 months ago:


Sorry, don't have room for a dog at the moment. Should I expect an apology from you or should I just be realistic and assume you will find some justification in your assholery?

[MADem]

44. Go on, go get another cat, then--make up the difference.

Every dog I've ever owned (and we're in double digits) was either a shelter, rescue, or "street" dog (street dogs from several countries around the globe, too). Every cat, save one quasi-rescue purebred, was a street kitten or a leftover from some "accidental litter"--and those are in the double digits, too. I've never abandoned an animal, if I take one on, I keep 'em until they grow old and die at home amongst their family. I've paid tens of thousands of dollars in air shipment and kennel fees over the years to take my animals with me when I've moved around the globe. I've paid obscene quarantine fees in Hawaii and the UK.

I certainly won't be lectured by you about my "unwanted animals" bona fides, or swayed by a picture of a single cat. Go get that cat a buddy--make up for Obama's Great (in your opinion) Sin, why don't ya? Be part of that CHANGE we can BELIEVE in. DO your part!!! Make the SACRIFICE. That cat you have doesn't count--you WANTED that cat and got that cat before Obama decided on the unsatisfactory (to you) rescue/relocated water dog. Now, you need to take it one step further--go on. Get another cat. Just Do It.

As for "assholery"--you might want to check yourself. That's your modus operandi when it comes to any and all things, Great or Small, Obama. You're not even subtle about it anymore.

[Runcible Spoon]

58. You have a perception problem.

If you cared 1/100th as much about real issues as you do about defending Obama's allegedly fragile feelings on an internet board, your life might have an impact. How sad.

I don't "like" or "dislike" Obama. I challenge you to find any of my posts one way or the other. I don't know him. He's a personality created and maintained by media manufacture and careful message control.

All I give a fuck about are his actions (or inactions) on issues.

I'm sure I've garnered quite an audience in issues like gay marriage. However, I find it outrageous and unacceptable that I have to come to DU, a supposedly liberal board, and fight with people about supporting civil rights. I've fucking had it with people who try to spin the administration's tepid attitude towards the issue. If you want to know where my negativity comes from, it's from that. And the wholesale giveaway to the banks.

And every once in a while, something like Dog-gate comes up. I didn't make a big deal of it in my opening comment, but if you want to blow up my comments and start a flamewar about it, I don't care.

You wouldn't believe the number of people who don't even post on DU because they are sick of being attacked by people who care more about maintaining message control for Obama than they do about doing the RIGHT THING.

[Tarheel_Dem]

62. God I wish you would join them.

"You wouldn't believe the number of people who don't even post on DU because they are sick of being attacked by people who care more about maintaining message control for Obama than they do about doing the RIGHT THING."

And who the hell put you in charge of what the "RIGHT THING" is? Was there a special election you didn't tell us about?

[Runcible Spoon]

64. The RIGHT THING is sometimes clear.

Civil rights for all is the RIGHT THING.

Of course, we all know where YOU stand on that.

[MADem]

69. No, I don't have a perception problem. You do. You seem to think that Barack Obama

was elected President of PETA and the SPCA.

He wasn't. He was elected President of these United States.

You go out of your way to find fault with Obama. It's noticeable. It's more than noticeable, it's obvious, to the point where it appears to be a mission with you.

Check your attitude before you hit the post button.

And FWIW, Obama was not my preferred candidate. I couldn't even bring myself to work for his campaign after the nom, because I didn't feel like expending the effort and I was entirely unmotivated. I voted RELUCTANTLY for the first time in decades. And I could give a shit about "message control."

However, he's in the job, he won decisively, and I, unlike perpetual whiners and carpers, know that he's a damn sight better than the alternative, and he deserves a chance without being carped at by cringing whiners who nitpick about bullshit--just like you are doing...DOG GATE? Please. Give me a fucking break. That's pathetic.

I've got your number--you transmit it with every single post you make.

[Hekate]

112. DOG-GATE?! DOG-GATE!? Christ on a Trailer Hitch, were you even born when Watergate happened?

Good God almighty.

Hekate

[Hansel]

76. So ignore it . n/t

[Name removed]

17. Deleted sub-thread

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[SidDithers]

2. Not all of those are unwanted animals...

we had our cat put down last weekend. She was 16 and very sick.

Sid

[astonamous]

3. Hopefully not in a shelter... :-(

[SidDithers]

4. Ahh, you're right...

I jumped in too quickly, didn't read the OP properly.

No, our kitty was euthanized at the vet.

Sid

[tosh]

6. I am sorry for your loss.

[MADem]

12. In some rural locations, the only nearby place to get that sort of thing done is

at the shelter. If the choice is drive five or ten miles to the shelter with a dying animal in discomfort, or thirty or fifty to the vet, there ya go. You make your donation and the shelter helps you out.

And in other cases, the shelters contract with a vet's office to do the deed.

[MADem]

9. One of my dogs is seventeen and near the end.

Lame, arthritic, blind, occasionally incontinent, sketchy about the eating. Needs carrying on some days, can manage on others.

Most days are tolerable, he waxes and wanes, but if he gets to the point where he can't do for himself anymore at all, his pain cannot be managed, and his quality of life completely sucks, it's needle time.

So he'd be part of "the stats" as well.

I'm hoping he obliges me and slips off on his own. I really don't want to do it.

[Ocracoker16]

10. the statistic doesn't include older pets that are sick and put down to ease their pain

These are shelter animals. They are unwanted animals. While some do get adopted, many more get euthanized after a certain time period at the shelter. These are the animals that the statistic applies to. Shelters are so overpopulated that they have to put down animals in order to have space for incoming animals.

That is why I support the no kill shelters where animals remain until adoption no matter how long that takes. I have 2 cats which I got from a shelter. I love them very much. I encourage people to adopt from shelters rather than buying them from breeders. With this many healthy dogs and cats being euthanized, I think that it is pretty clear that when you buy an animal from a breeder you are indirectly contributing to having another animal just as wonderful put down.

[MADem]

5. It's fewer than in decades past. And the WH dog focuses the effort on pet adoption.

I mean, really, what the hell more do you want? I don't know how many times the Obamas have talked about pet adoption, and shelters, etc., every time the dog issue has come up. They said they wanted a shelter dog, or a "rescue" dog. This dog was "second-hand"--not quite a rescue, a shift due to a poor fit... but a dog that is on his second family, and his second family is the First Family.

Frankly, we've got other priorities right now. If it comes down to funding "no kill shelters" and extending unemployment benefits for my friends, neighbors and family, I go with the people.

However, maybe Obama's dog will encourage those who can afford it, in these tough times, to ADOPT a pet. That is what they're going for, after all.

So, in defense of the "evil" media, they aren't DISTRACTING, they're FOCUSING the attention of the public on the topic of pet adoption...and the Obamas helped them do it.

[Karmadillo]

8. What the hell more do I want?

Well, that would be a fairly long list and I'm guessing you're really not as interested as you pretend to be. I was posting the numbers because I thought it would be helpful for people to know how many animals are euthanized at shelters. I'm sorry you were offended. I confess I haven't heard any media reports on the First Dog address the number of euthanized shelter dogs and cats, but if you have, I defer to your no doubt reliable reporting.

I do think, despite your implication otherwise, it's possible to use bailout/war funds to provide unemployment benefits for your friends, neighbors and family (and other people, too!) AND to provide funds for spay and neuter programs to reduce the number of euthanized cats and dogs. Might upset shareholders and warmongers, but that would seem a small price to pay.

[MADem]

27. You were posting the numbers to squawk about why the Obamas didn't adopt a shelter dog.

Your comments about them make that entirely clear. The figures were just a means to an end--and if that's not the case, it sure as hell read that way. You might want to proofread, if that wasn't your intent, when you talk about what they haven't done to suit you.

Never mind that they've touted adoption during the whole "search for a dog" process, not once, but DOZENS of times, on every frigging show from Ellen to news interviews.

A lot of those animals in your list are euthanized at PETA shelters. Why? Because they're vicious pitbulls, unsocialized violent mutts, abused, fucked up, psychotic and un-integratable animals, and old, crippled or otherwise mutilated animals that can't be saved. Warning--graphic images at link. http://blog.peta.org/archives/2009/03/why_we_euthaniz.php

How do I know this? I read about it here.

Don't ask the Obamas to "be all" for everyone -- it's asinine, and it's especially asinine when it comes to their KIDS. I'm sure they thought this through--they've only been talking about it since, what...the nomination???

To suggest they haven't done anything to tout shelter adoption is simply false. They've mentioned it at every possible opportunity.

[Karmadillo]

36. The internet certainly is quite the forum for rude people, isn't it?

Not to deny you can read my mind, but I posted the numbers because I find it disgraceful that this country allows such a large number of dogs and cats to be put to death when there are easily implemented alternatives. As you keep saying over and over again, the Obamas have talked and talked about shelter adoption, even though when it came to act, they did something else. It's their choice, but you should understand, to the degree your perpetual anger and rudeness allow, there are people who would like the President to set an example in this area. Seems like it's reasonable for them to express that opinion on an internet discussion board. I, on the other hand, did not post these numbers because of what the Obama's did or didn't do. I thought the First Dog mania made it an opportune time to make sure people knew just how many dogs and cats we allow to die needlessly. If the Obamas had adopted a shelter animal, I still would have posted the numbers because they concern me.

And, just for accuracy, while PETA does euthanize animals when there is no other choice, the number is minuscule compared to the number of healthy animals killed by shelters (and, while focusing on PETA, it's worth noting how hard they push spaying and neutering and legislation to address the problem).

http://blog.peta.org/archives/2009/03/why_we_euthaniz.php

Why We Euthanize

In my first year working at a grossly substandard animal shelter in Maryland, I forced myself to go in early to euthanize dogs by holding them in my arms and gently helping them escape an uncaring world without trauma or pain and to spare them from being stabbed haphazardly—while they were fully conscious, terrified and aware—in the general vicinity of their hearts with needles blunt from reuse and left to thrash on the floor until they finally died by the callous people who would arrive later to do the job.

I always wonder how anyone cannot recognize that there is a world of difference between painlessly euthanizing animals out of compassion—aged, injured, sick, and dying animals whose guardians can't afford euthanasia, for instance—as PETA does, and causing them to suffer terror, pain, and a prolonged death while struggling to survive on the streets, at the hands of untrained and uncaring "technicians," or animal abusers.

It's easy to point the finger at those who are forced to do the "dirty work" caused by a throwaway society's casual acquisition and breeding of dogs and cats who end up homeless and unwanted, but at PETA, we will never turn our backs on neglected, unloved, and homeless animals—even if the best we can offer them is a painless release from a world that doesn't have enough heart or homes with room for them. It makes it easy for people to throw stones at us, but we are against all needless killing: for hamburgers, fur collars, dissection, sport hunting―the works. PETA handled far more animals than 2,124 in 2008. In fact, we took in more than 10,000 dogs and cats and work very hard to persuade people to spay and neuter their animals and to commit to a lifetime of care and respect for them. We go so far as to transport animals to and from our spay/neuter clinics, where they are spayed or neutered and given vet care, often for free! Since 2001, PETA's low- to no-cost spay-and-neuter mobile clinics, SNIP and ABC, have sterilized more than 50,000 animals, preventing hundreds of thousands of animals from being born, neglected, abandoned, abused, or euthanized when no one wanted them. And on a national level, PETA is focusing on the root of the problem through our Animal Birth Control (ABC) campaign.

If anyone has a good home, love, and respect to offer, we beg them: Go to a shelter and take one or two animals home. The problem is that few people do that, choosing instead to go to a breeder or a pet shop and not "fixing" their dogs and cats, which contributes to the high euthanasia rate that animal shelters face. Most of the animals we took in and euthanized could hardly be called "pets," as they had spent their lives chained up in the back yard, for instance. They were unsocialized, never having been inside a building of any kind or known a pat on the head. Others were indeed someone's, but they were aged, sick, injured, dying, too aggressive to place, and the like, and PETA offered them a painless release from suffering, with no charge to their owners or custodians.

more...

[MADem]

51. Would you really like to see animals mistreated?

Take a trip to Iran. Or Iraq. Or Afghanistan. Or Pakistan. Or Tunesia. Morrocco. Ethiopia. Or even civilized Italy.

Here in the USA, animals are treated better than a lot of PEOPLE in those countries. I won't even describe some of the dispicable shit I've seen happen to dogs, especially, in the developing world. And let us not even discuss the food markets of China and Korea.

We are not a perfect nation, but we do more for animals than most nations do. We have animal control officers. Things called "no kill shelters" do exist in some communities.

Your glass is half empty and you knock it over at every turn. The swipe at the Obamas at the end of your post was plainly gratuitous. They get no credit for even bringing up the shelter issue and keeping it in the news for many months from the nay-sayers, they're simply criticized because they put their fucking KID in front of "symbolism."

How DARE they?

I'm not really sure why you're cutting and pasting from the link I provided. I don't argue with PETA's reasoning. I simply pointed out that THEY too euthanize. Sometimes there's no other way. I don't blame other shelters for doing it if they can't afford to keep the animals alive, either due to room, staffing, funding, what-have-you. What, you want them to give every animal a teaspoon of food, so that they all can hang on by a thread? Should they maintain the fifteen year old lame animals, at the expense of the health of the puppies and kittens, when they've got a limited budget?

Sometimes you have to make tough choices. You cull out the older, the lamer, the abused, bruised and broken.

The Obamas made a choice too--they picked a dog that probably would have gone to PWD rescue, and chose their allergic kid first.

[Karmadillo]

56. The mistreatment of animals elsewhere hardly justifies the mistreatment of animals here.

Given the redirection of some of the money the Obama administration is taking from taxpayers to bailout the wealthy and conduct multiple wars, we could significantly reduce the number of dogs and cats euthanized (and do lots of other things to make a better country).

Regarding your defense of the Obamas' decision, they could have adopted a shelter dog and still addressed the allergy issue. They chose not to. Their choice, but again, I think it's reasonable to criticize them for it given the scope of the problem of unwanted dogs and cats and given the very visible place the Obamas occupy in the American hierarchy. You emphasize they are worthy of praise for talking about shelter adoption, but to me, this is one of those issues that requires more than talk.

[MADem]

68. Your glass is forever half empty. There are priorities, pressing ones, ahead of

taking care of all the kitties. So long as there is a single homeless person or someone shitting bricks because their unemployment is running out, the animals have to wait.

Regarding the Obamas--it is NOT up to YOU. Or anyone else on this thread. I responded to the allergy issue and the breed issue upthread. I donate money at two shelters in two separate states, I also swing by with food and toys and leashes every few months. I've NEVER seen a "posh" dog at either shelter--EVER--they all go to the rescue organizations, which are no kill. And this PWD probably would have ended up at rescue, if he wasn't returned to the breeder for resale, had not the Obamas taken him.

But, whatever. You're determined to see the worst in everything this poor First Family does. You'll spend another miserable eight years, I suppose.

[Karmadillo]

82. It appears post #66 anticipated your response, but

I would just note one can take a few billion dollars from the bailout for the rich and the multiple wars and use that for an awesome spaying/neutering program and one can also take billions more for the homeless and unemployed. And we can build schools and new transportation infrastructure and green energy grids and all sorts of stuff. So, it's not animal suffering OR human suffering. An enlightened citizenry can address both.

And I have noted it's the Obamas' choice to do what they do, but when you're the President and when you're pushing the First Dog story in the media, it seems the right of a citizen to comment on that choice.

And, also, as I noted earlier, the issue on this thread is the 4 million euthanized dogs and cats. Just as Obama was "outraged" over the killing of seals in Canada, I hope he will be outraged by the unnecessary deaths of millions of animals and lead the nation in doing something about it. And, again, before you object, he can also lead us in doing something about the homeless and the unemployed. It may mean he won't be able to help the rich in the generous manner to which they have recently become accustomed, and he may have to wind down one or two of the wars, but he can lead on those issues if he wants to. As you have noted, it's his choice.

[MADem]

92. You can comment all you'd like.

And others can comment on your comments. That's how it works.

[LisaL]

84. This dog was never going to end up in a rescue.

The breeder has a contract by which the owners have to return the dog to the breeder if they can't take care of dog. Saying the dog would have ended up in a shelter or on the street if not for Obama is ridiculous.

[MADem]

91. Friends with the breeder are you?

:eyes:

[LisaL]

93. No, but I've read an interview the breeder gave, where the

breeder said that the owners would have to return the dog back if they can't keep it. Happy now?

[MADem]

94. Gee, I'd love to read that. Got a link? nt

[LisaL]

95. Why yes I do.

"Stern respects the desire to give a shelter or rescue dog a home, but feels the Obamas also have the right to get the dog they want for their family. She said it would have been difficult for them to get a PWD from a rescue or shelter because the national breed club takes a very strong stand on breeder responsibility.

“We don’t want any of our dogs to end up homeless. And the Portuguese Water Dog Club of America, that we belong to, requires that their breeders take back their dogs if for any reason, any reason at all, the people can’t care for the dog. That’s what responsible breeders do, always."




http://www.petconnection.com/blog/2009/04/12/the-obama-puppy-the-breeder-tells-the-tale/

[MADem]

96. Gee, did you know that the Portuguese Water Dog Club of America

runs their own "rescue" and "relocation" program? While part of their organization bylaws is that breeders "step up," they provide support if the breeder cannot or will not.

A rose, by any other name, would apparently smell as sweet. I provided this link before, but I'll do it again:

http://www.pwdca.org/breed/rescue/

According to this site, what the organization expects of the breeders is that they perform the same "rescue" and "relocation" role that the organization would provide if the breeder was unknown.

This dog WAS a "relocation" and would have been a "rescue" had not the organization had this specific requirement. Had the breeder been unable to deal with this dog, the breeder would have funded the rescue organization managing an adoption.

Would it make you happier if little Bo went and spent two nights at the shelter? This is a dog that didn't work out and was too rambunctious for the family he was placed with. He's a second-hand dog, getting a second chance with the First Family.

[LisaL]

97. Hah?

The link you provided has to do with finding the breeder, which has absolutely nothing to do with this case. The breeder of this dog was always known. The owner returned the dog to the original breeder. "Little Bo" therefore was never in danger of ending up in the rescue, shelter, or on the street.

[MADem]

100. Read again, slowly.

The BREEDER did the job the RESCUE outfit would have done, because that is a requirement of the organization.

Had the breeder been unable to perform this function, the rescue and relocation arm of the organization would have done what the breeder did--retrieve and relocate the dog.

This is a second-hand dog. He's been living with another family, called Charlie, and he hasn't worked out. He can't be too well loved, otherwise he wouldn't BE a second-hand dog.

You're pissed because the dog didn't go to the "rescue" department, but instead, the BREEDER performed the rescue/relocation. Would you be mollified if Bo went and spent two nights in a shelter, is my question? Would that make him more "genuine?"

:eyes:

[LisaL]

101. The dog is a young purebred puppy, whose breeder was

perfectly willing and able to take him back, after he didn't work out with whoever adopted him. Which doesn't make him a "rescued dog," no matter how you try to twist it. It's a common thing for responsible breeders to take a dog or a cat back if the owners can't take care of the pet.

[MADem]

105. The dog was a six month old troublesome and rambunctious barker,

who was "too much" for the family and the dog they already had--he was a "poor fit." He has spent some time with a trainer who has worked on the little shit's "behavior" issues.

He's SECOND HAND. And that's a fact, no matter how much YOU twist it.

[LisaL]

106. Jeez. The dog sounds like a completely normal healthy puppy.

A rambunctious puppy? Who would have thought?

[MADem]

107. I agree. But the first owners didn't like a rambunctious puppy.

I think they wanted a younger version of their old dog with a similar activity level.

[JeanGrey]

118. LOL!

Although I do wonder if this is the right pick for the Obama's. These dogs like water and are happiest around it. They require a LOT of attention and become troublesome if they don't get it. So I hope they understand what is required to own this breed of dog.

[JeanGrey]

119. Wow - "little shit"?

I thought you were concerned about the dog? Why the name calling?

[Hekate]

124. I thought it was pretty apt. "Uncle Ted's" personal trainer has apparently taken it in hand now...

Ask yourself why the pup's first owners gave it back -- apparently they couldn't make it behave even though they'd had dogs before. "Little shit" is *exactly* what my husband would call it :eyes:

Bo looks adorable, but he has to learn to be a good boy to live in a place with a continual stream of visitors and a family who hasn't raised a puppy before. Good thing Uncle Ted has already raised this breed and owns three of them now; he'll be of some help.

Hekate

[JeanGrey]

127. Because possibly the dog was in the wrong environment?

People get dogs because they are "cute". Many times they do NOT consider their genetics, what they were bred for and the poor dogs end up in situations were they are miserable. That does not make them "shits".

[JeanGrey]

117. Yes you are correct. I was a persian breeder for 15 years,

showed almost every other weekend for years. I always took back my kittens/cats if there was ANY problem and either kept or rehomed them.

[Hekate]

113. Karma, I have to ask. Do you have a human child of your own? Does that child have asthma?

[Critters2]

98. How does this focus attention on pet adoption?

This pet wasn't adopted. It was purchased. It just encourages people to buy purebreds.

[MADem]

116. It is a second-hand dog.

It was a "poor fit" for its first family. It didn't get along with the other dog and was barking and rambunctious.

It was "relocated" by the breeder. It had to spend time with a trainer to learn how to behave.

Had the breeder not done this, or been unable to do it, the PWD association would have done it. The fact remains, the dog is not a dog straight from a breeder. It's a dog that went to a family, didn't work out, and was reassigned.

It didn't have to spend any time in a shelter or a rescue kennel (because that breeding association has rules for membership that include taking back dogs that people don't want, and finding them new homes), but it's still a dog that was named Charlie and living in one place one day with one set of people and a particular life, and the day after tomorrow will be living in the White House with two little kids and be called "Bo."

The dog, if he could speak, would probably call that an "adoption."

If you haven't heard Obama talking up shelter adoption, and the reason they have to be careful because of their kid's asthma, over the last eight months every time the "dog" thing came up, I can't help you tune in.

[JeanGrey]

120. As far as I know it was "rehomed" that is usually done

without funds. If you have read differently do you have a link?

[Critters2]

104. How would purchasing a purebred bring any focus to shelter pets?

Logically, it would have just the opposite effect. I'll bet lots of dog breeders are very happy tonight.

[MADem]

109. Have you been listening to him speak about this over the last eight plus months?

At EVERY turn, he has said they needed a hypoallergenic dog. He said they wanted a MEDIUM sized dog. He ruled out frou-frou dogs. He didn't want any little yappy dog. He said it over and over again.

He said, too, over and over and over again, that they would TRY but it would be HARD to find a dog in a shelter, because the two breeds they were considering (PWD and one other) get snatched up quickly and don't stay long in shelters. He also said if he couldn't go shelter, he'd go rescue. And then he said, again and again, that it is a great thing to adopt an animal from a shelter.

The dog he got was a second hand dog. Not formally a rescue, but a rescue in essence because the dog wasn't suited to the family that had it. It lived with its first family for six months, and that didn't work out. It used to be called Charlie, now it is called BO.

[bluestateguy]

14. Your point is duly noted

Thank you.

Ahem:

Now back to the First Dog Bo.

[stillcool]

15. we do have programs in my state..

to help people who are having trouble financially, take care of their pets. We also take lots and lots of abandoned animals from other states, and our shelters so far are well funded. I do not understand why so much depends on the federal government. What happened to the state government? Are state officials not accountable for anything?

[Tarheel_Dem]

19. Even so, it would still somehow be Obama's fault. Don't you get it?

[stillcool]

22. I do...I do..

I don't know what I was thinking. I'm always falling out of line.

[Tarheel_Dem]

26. LMAO. I have to admit, sometimes they're a barrel of laughs, on a slow afternoon. (nt)

[Karmadillo]

23. They're already slashing programs for the vulnerable at the state level.

I was simply thinking that if the feds have the money to transfer huge amounts of wealth to the rich and engage in multiple wars, there might be a few billion for spay and neuter programs to reduce the number of euthanized dogs and cats.

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/04/12/us/12deficit.html?hp

PHOENIX — Battered by the recession and the deepest and most widespread budget deficits in several decades, a large majority of states are slicing into their social safety nets — often crippling preventive efforts that officials say would save money over time.

President Obama’s $787 billion stimulus package is helping to alleviate some of the pain, providing large amounts of money to pay for education and unemployment insurance, bolster food stamp programs and expand tax credits for low earners. But the money will offset only 40 percent of the losses in state revenues, and programs for vulnerable groups have been cut in at least 34 states, according to the Center for Budget and Policy Priorities, a private research group in Washington.

Perhaps nowhere have the cuts been more disruptive than in Arizona, where more than 1,000 frail elderly people are struggling without home-care aides to help with bathing, housekeeping and trips to the doctor. Officials acknowledge that some are apt to become sicker or fall, ending up in nursing homes at a far higher cost.

Ohio and other states face large cutbacks in child welfare investigations, which may mean more injured children and more taken into foster care. Despite tax increases, California has ended dental coverage for adults on Medicaid, all but guaranteeing future medical problems.

more...

[stillcool]

30. to be honest, it's not an issue..

I'm passionate about. Maybe you should bring up the issue with you Senator or Congressperson?

[Karmadillo]

41. I'm not sure why the slashing of programs for the vulnerable isn't an issue you're passionate about,

but thanks for letting us know.

[stillcool]

70. Oh you mistake what I said...

people are my passion. I feel for you in your plight to bring attention to the fate of unwanted animals, but...alas...I know nothing of your issue. What I am deeply concerned with... my issues are foster care, child abuse, incarceration, military families, and mental health, and how government policies contribute to the cause and effect of some of the worst behaviors in our society.

[AndrewP]

78. to be honest, then why bother posting in this thread?

[stillcool]

81. Because I don't see the correlation...

between war, global financial institutions, and unwanted pets? Am I not allowed to post in a thread where I disagree with the OP's sense of priorities?

[flvegan]

21. Don't breed or buy while homeless animals die.

K&R!

[BlooInBloo]

33. This is why the Obama administration has completely betrayed the American Pet.

[firedupdem]

42. You get me everytime! n/t

[BlooInBloo]

46. Er... you really should be able to see these coming by now, dontchathink?

:P

[firedupdem]

47. I never do! I'm always just reading along and suddenly I'm

hysterical...I look at the name....and it's you! I need to look at names prior to reading the comments! :)

[BlooInBloo]

48. hahaha! Awesome!

:rofl:

[JeanGrey]

121. I've seen some perfectly valid criticism of Obama but

this "doggate" stuff is ridiculous.

[moez]

37. With the millions starving people in the world....

those euthanized dogs and cats could be put to a MUCH better use! What a complete friggin' waste of useful food.

[Hekate]

115. A modest proposal, indeed. nt

[moez]

125. Except without my tongue in my cheek...

[thelordofhell]

40. And 3-4 million more will be euthanized next year

See what happens if you don't spay/neuter your "pets" that you let wander free outside without any tags or identification. Be a responsible pet owner and the number will go down.

[doctor jazz]

49. We (as in the USA) could SAVE enormous amounts simply by providing free spay/neuter services.

The money we spend on maintaining animal "shelters" (more accurately killing sheds) is far more than what it would cost to simply reduce the population of unwanted animals. Vets charge $85 to spay and neuter dogs...and we have gladly paid that several times the last decade for our adopted furries...but there are many people who just can't afford it. Our neighbor now has eleven dogs which aren't even well cared for because he won't get his dogs fixed and can barely feed all the offspring.
I'm not sure how to fix that...shoot the extra dogs...or just shoot him?
:grr:

[stuntcat]

53. FOR REAL

It's totally against reason for the operation to cost so much when so many young animals are being put down every day.

I trapped a couple of small feral cats and turned them over to the pound to be put to sleep. But then last month I caught two more, the 1st cats' sisters I think, and got them neutered. It cost me over $100 but at least I don't feel like I just had them KILLED, the way I did their littermates. Now I'm feeding the ferals a little and they're starting to watch me and look me in the eye and follow me around when I'm gardening! I'm pretty sure someday they'll be calm enough for me to bring in and take better care of. Whatever happens, I'm gonna make sure they have good lives.

These cats shouldn't even exist though, someone just should have FIXED their mother. Knowing my neighborhood, someone just couldn't pay for the surgery in the beginning.. if the surgery was free these cats wouldn't be out there giving me the guilt and worry x(

[northernlights]

60. at my local shelter, they neuter and vax the feral cats

and give them a chance inside the shelter. Some of them become very tame and end up as somebody's lap cat. Other's remain skittish and become barn cats. Many get adopted as barn cats, but just want their freedom and split. II had 2 of the latter -- I spot one of them a couple times/year).

The ones that don't get adopted out and are miserable in the shelter, are let loose in the 6 acres behind the shelter. They have a feeding station set up for them and simply maintain the colony.

[stuntcat]

67. oh that sounds great!

I'd like to imagine the boy/girl I took in got that much care. I know it isn't what happened though.

I have to remind myself- no one else in my neighborhood was about to do ANYTHING with them. And anyway I'm through getting innocent little animals killed :(

[roody]

88. That's very cool. Our county shelter spays ferals for free.

Then they get released. A non-profit helps with payment.

[havocmom]

50. And a tiny group with political axe to grind whines that Castro kills US Diplomat's pets

:banghead:

[Tx4obama]

65. When ALL Americans

start caring about all of the homeless adults and children here in America as much (or more) as homeless dogs and cats then America will start to become a more decent nation.

[Runcible Spoon]

66. Some of us can multi-task, thanks.

But thanks for trotting out the #1 most predictable canard that pops up on threads like this.

[Mike 03]

73. Yeah, but it amazes me when people express surprise about these figures.

How can this surprise anyone?

[Mike 03]

74. Is this a shock? Should the Obamas adopt all of the unwanted pets in the world? NT

[Critters2]

99. I would've liked them to adopt one. That doesn't seem too much.

Oh, right. I guess it is.

[Mike 03]

75. Kick and Rec, so we can throw more blame on Obama for not adopting all the fucking

dogs and cats in need of homes.

[LisaL]

85. I really object to you characterizing dog and cats that way.

:mad:

[Diamonique]

80. Damn! Sometime DUers can come up with the stupidest shit to be pissed at Obama about. n/t

[Individualist]

83. Thanks for pointing this out

I adopted two 9 month old cats (siblings) from an animal rescue organization last week. They're such sweeties!

[Michigan-Arizona]

90. Tucson, Arizona (Pima County)

If you live in one of 14 cities you can get your pet's spayed & neutered for FREE, most of these are area's where people can less afford to pay for it. I meant to included the fact that they seem to offer it for free about every 3 or 4 month's. I have 2 female's that I was able to get spayed for free under this offer. I printed up the information & had hubby take it to work for others to hopefully take advantage of. I've seen where they have done this in Phoenix as well. Where I had first found out about this free spay program was someone had posted it on the Arizona Craigslist Free section. Don't know if they do this in other state's but it may pay to check your state & county section on Craigslist. One last thing, it didn't matter how many pet's I had either as I could have had them all done.

[EmilyAnne]

103. In the Obamas' situation, temperament is a very important factor in choosing a dog. To be around

children and a constant stream of visitors, some of them children, requires a dog that is predisposed to healthy social behavior.

Many pure breed shelter dogs are without homes because they were bred irresponsibly and bad behavior traits were not controlled. They wind up dumped on a shelter because they are too challenging for an average family.

I have one of these little guys. I've talked about her on DU before, but she was rescued from a puppy mill that was shut down. She was horribly bred, but according to AKC, she's got a pure bloodline.
Never mind that despite all the puppy kindergarten, socialization, daily play time with other dogs and constant exposure to new people and places, she is still a nervous, whimpering mess after three years.

I CAN NOT trust her around children because I am afraid she will snap when cornered or approached too quickly.
She is on Prozac. And Pepcid to control the constant vomiting that stems from stress-related acid production.

We don't have children and we don't host dignitaries from around the world.
She is also not representative of most rescue dogs.
She is a good example of a lot of pure breed rescue dogs, in my experience with the people who run the puppy mill and backyard breeder rescue efforts.

Because they had needs regarding the girls' allergies, they needed to look for particular breeds.
Rescued pure breeds can be very challenging and could be a terrible fit for a family with children and a busy social schedule.
Just my opinion, of course.

[Hekate]

123. Common sense strikes again. We too had a rescue pup that could not be trusted with visitors...

We got Zima for our son when he was 15 y.o. and she was about 10 weeks old. The shelter said she was a Lab-mix, but whatever she was she had a screw loose and was aggressive. We all loved her and she loved us, but I watched her like a hawk and did not let her mingle with visitors, especially children and the elderly. She grew to be 80 pounds, so this was no light task. When our son left home he couldn't always take her, so she would return to us for long periods of time. She lived her last years with our son, though. When we had her put to sleep last year she was 15 years old and had as good a life as possible.

I would never, ever, knowingly take on a dog with an aggressive temperament.

My first husband foisted a schnauzer puppy off on me and it was a miserable experience. It was a complete personality mismatch, and I ended up giving her to my sister. I couldn't give Zima away because she was our son's dog at a vulnerable age for him, and because I truly believed no one would want a dog with her defects and so she would be put down. She really loved me, too...

On the whole I'm good with dogs and cats, and because of the kids coming and going during their late teens and early 20s we've sometimes had a lot at once. At one point there were 4 dogs, including crazy Zima -- but the others were tiny. The cat just died last month at 19 y.o., so he lived through all of this too. He was another from a shelter, as are the 2 kittens we adopted this month.

I make no apologies whatsoever for the Sheltie we bought from friends who bred his mother (the Sheltie is dead these many years), nor for the now 14-y.o. cockapoo that was given to me as a birthday gift by my mother in law, who bought it from a friend of hers. Money changed hands, gasp horrors, and out of the deal I got mild-mannered companions suited to my own way of life. When I get another puppy I may buy a small "breed" from someone I know or I may visit the animal shelter, but either way I feel no need to apologize for my decision.

You are absolutely right that the Obamas need a dog that not only fits into their family, but will not try to gnaw the legs of visiting dignitaries. The emotion certain people have invested in this subject is unbelievable.

Thanks for injecting some common sense into this thread.

Hekate

[and-justice-for-all]

110. Either adopt a shelter dog or pull them right off the street...

which is what we have done with all of our cats, all 5 of our cats came in right off the street. With our tom Piggy, we first took him to the vet and had him neutered, but we left him outside for over a year before bringing him in; so our motto is "stay around our house to long and your going to get a snippin'" Either way your saving their life/lives.

If you tell the Vet that the Cat is a stray, you most likely will get a discount on the snipping. SPAY AND NEUTER SPAY AND NEUTER.

[Skittles]

114. I took my kitty Riff Raff to the vet in a feral trap

straight from streets to vet for snipping and shots and into my home - we had a very rocky start the first year but he's settled in nicely as a, well, half-pet half feral kitty :D

[and-justice-for-all]

122. Our feral, Piggy, knew us before we brought him in..

and he knew the girls were inside because they would interact with each other through the screen door on the porch. It was a little rocky for a short time, but they came around.