Who else believes that Bushco was wiretapping

[malaise]

all Members of Congress. Bushco was Nixon on steroids.
They must be punished.

Risen said they tried to wiretap a Member of Congress.
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/04/16/us/16nsa.html?_r=1&em
<snip>
The National Security Agency intercepted private e-mail messages and phone calls of Americans in recent months on a scale that went beyond the broad legal limits established by Congress last year, government officials said in recent interviews.

Several intelligence officials, as well as lawyers briefed about the matter, said the N.S.A. had been engaged in “overcollection” of domestic communications of Americans. They described the practice as significant and systemic, although one official said it was believed to have been unintentional.

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[JuniperLea]

1. Yep

That was the sole reason, no question. That's why so many have gone along with the bullshit, because BushCo has something on them.

[PDJane]

2. Of course they were.

And they were likely blackmailing members of congress. It's what they do.

The Bush family has used that tactic before, apparently....I believe it.

[spanone]

3. yep, including the current President.....especially the current President

[AzDar]

4. Kerry... Kucinich... Feingold... all good candidates for a tapping.

George W. Bush was an un-American, Constitution-hating, traitorous FUCK.

I hope someday we'll get the truth.

[Ilsa]

12. Don't forget Wellstone, early on, I bet. I don't believe they'd wait

for the paperwork if they really wanted to do it.

[Taverner]

5. I agree with you - but I don't think they'll be punished

[bdamomma]

8. sadly maybe they won't be but if we the people start questioning

these last horrible 8 years maybe something could be done, or am I being too hopeful?

[pacalo]

6. I believed that from the moment I learned about the wiretapping.

And the strong-arming & bribery that probably happened as a result of it would explain the Democrats' refusal to do anything about the Bush misadministration.

Only those senators who stood up had no skeletons in their closets, imo.

[bdamomma]

7. oh yes indeed, didn't Rockefeller say at one time he thought he

was being wiretapped also?

[malaise]

14. Yep

I remember that well

[bemildred]

9. I have always assumed I was being listened to, since the 1970s.

Assuming anyone cared enough to listen.

[Mind_your_head]

10. Of course they were......

why do you think it has stopped?

[malaise]

15. So was the reason blackmail

or something else?

[RandomThoughts]

11. actually I think the reason wire tapping

to control someone could work, is lack of knowledge or ability to have perspective by average voters in the population.

If one joke, or bad thing, can be used to smear people, it requires a group that will judge the person based on that alone. Sometimes you even see reports of comments from hearsay used to define people. The ability for people too believe it defines the whole character of a person, is one of the faults of society. In a healthy society, such things only work when it supports an already held belief, so only works if it was a small part of a larger evaluation of character. If it was a pattern of behavior and truly defining, then it has meaning.

However, the wiretapping alone is not the problem, it is that it can be used as a weapon, and who holds that weapon that is the problem. Quite simply the group that has control over that information could gain more power then deserved through intimidation. But the push back is to prosecute those that allowed it to happen, or for people, since many people have access to the system, to share its misuses to the population.

In theory if the information is meant to protect people from violence and corruption, then a use of such information for political gain, would be struck down by the vary people that have the information, for using such things for politics(like the J Edgar Hoover files were said to do) for using it for politics lowers the integrity of groups that defend for sake of justice. For example, J Edgar had some successes with his info, but lowered the respect of the organization by his tactics.

The reason wire tapping is wrong, without court order, is because of how easy it can be missued. But if it can not be removed, then the only solution would be to make information on everyone available to everyone. This removes secrecy. However it shifts the problem of information outside of perspective being gathered, to who has the megaphone to spread that information. Just making it a new problem of information flow and learning of the population.

Imagine if everything a person ever said could be mined for one sentence, then the entire person is defined by that sentence. (Rev Wright is a good example of this happening). But the knowledge that that is being done changes it to the smearer looking bad. As people realize what is being done.

The people that use gossip and smear for self gain, do something without integrity or honor, and in that, the gain of some believing it, is far less then the loss of even more that realize the wrong that was done, and in the end leads to the demise of those that used those tactics. Which is interesting also.

[Double T]

13. Here. There. Everywhere!

We've ALL got files :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi: :hi:

[HamdenRice]

16. It has already been confirmed that the NSA wiretapped Colin Powell

It's pretty obvious that Bush had the entire DC elite under surveillance. I've posted several times about the story, published in the Guardian, that Bolton got NSA wiretaps of Powell which he fed to Rumsfeld and Cheney in order to undercut Powell's efforts at diplomacy on Iran and North Korea.

The Wall St. Journal reported when Spitzer went down that Spitz was caught in a web of almost complete surveillance of elected local officials by the Bush DOJ.

It's an open secret.

[malaise]

17. And now Harmon

Ah well.

[riderinthestorm]

18. Yes. nt

[AzDar]

19. Blackmail would explain a lot...

:kick:

[truebrit71]

20. No doubt in my mind. Why wouldn't they? Who would stop them?

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