oh fuck. Black NYC off duty cop shot and killed by white cop

[cali]

Off-Duty NYPD Cop Fatally Shot By Fellow Officer
25-Year-Old Omar J. Edwards Died After Being Shot Within Blocks Of The Harlem Police Station
Fatality Marks Force's First In The Line Of Duty Since 2007NEW YORK (CBS) ―
Click to enlarge
Commissioner Raymond Kelly said 25-year-old off-duty police officer Omar J. Edwards died after being shot within blocks of the Harlem police station on Thursday night.
CBS

Friends Mourn Tragic Loss Of NYPD Officer (5/29/2009)
A plainclothes policeman who drew his gun while chasing someone he had found rummaging through his car late Thursday was shot and killed by a fellow officer who was driving by and saw the pursuit, the police commissioner said.

Commissioner Raymond Kelly said 25-year-old Omar J. Edwards died after being shot within blocks of the Harlem police station where he worked.

Edwards had just finished his shift around 10:30 p.m. when he headed to his car and saw that the driver's-side window had been smashed and a man was going through the vehicle, Kelly said.

Edwards struggled with the man, who got away from him by slipping out of his sweater, Kelly said. Edwards chased the man up two streets with his gun drawn, he said.

A sergeant and two plainclothes officers in an unmarked police car saw the pursuit and made a U-turn to follow the men, Kelly said. One of the officers jumped out of the car and fired six times, hitting Edwards twice -- once in the arm and once in the chest.

<snip>

http://wcbstv.com/local/nypd.officer.shot.2.1023188.html

[La Lioness Priyanka]

1. what does this have to do with the inflammatory title you gave it?

it doesnt seem at all to be about the race of respective officers.

[xultar]

3. If it was a white guy running with his gun drawn they wouldn't have shot first and asked later.

If you don't see the problem with this I don't know what to say.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

6. yes, you're right.

[cali]

21. if you agree with xultar

than obviously you no longer find my title inflammatory, right?

[La Lioness Priyanka]

24. no, i still think your title is inflammatory. i do see her point, that if this was a white cop

there is chance he may not have been shot. however, i do not think he was shot because he was black. he was running through harlem with a gun. having lived in harlem for a few years, i am more than certain, most peopel running through harlem with a gun would be shot.

edit: changed his to her

[cali]

28. her point.

I think you're being somewhat insensitive here.

[xultar]

53. It is an...'oh fuck' moment because NY is on the brink after all the white cop on black man kills.

[cali]

56. yes. and honestly I think if a white cop saw a white guy chasing

a black guy, he'd be more likely to assume that the white guy was a cop or in the right somehow. I don't see how people can argue that. And the last two cops killed by other cops in NY, were respectively, a black cop and a latino cop. Not sure about the race of the cops in the latter shooting, but Christopher Ridley was killed by white cops.

[BlooInBloo]

25. Clearly you're a member of the "black KKK" - hahahaha!

[cali]

8. yss, I think that's exactly the problem.

[HamdenRice]

You're exactly right. To some black cops I knew, white cops were their biggest worry

That is, undercover and plain clothes black cops and detectives.

This isn't the first time that a black cop has been shot by white cops who tend to shoot first and ask questions later.

[xultar]

54. DING DING DING. I can't believe we have to explain this shit on DU.

[cali]

58. pretty unbelievable the responses this thread has gotten.

it's frustrating.

[HamdenRice]

61. Yeah, some of the responses are strange, distessing and depressing nt

[redqueen]

66. I'm beyond being surprised by anything around here anymore.

[Fire1]

84. Oh, this party has MANY demons.

[Number23]

92. You can't???

I can't believe we have to explain this shit on DU.

Really?????...!

[malaise]

79. And they state that worry in the article I read

Very sad. Look at that poor dead cop's young family. :cry: :cry:

[madeline_con]

86. I have to agree. He saw a black man chasing someone, and

made an assumption based on racism.

[cali]

5. you don't think that a black police officer shot by a white police officer

isn't going to be a big deal in NYC? Think again. That's the gist of my title. And if you read the article, you'd see that the race of the officers is noted. you can pretend that race will have nothing to do with how this is perceived all you want, but that won't make it so.

[okieinpain]

9. I don't think it's inflammatory, I think it's just telling the truth.

black man with gun has to be a criminal, so shoot him.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

10. black man, without uniform, running through a very crowded area with gun drawn

i dont think an indian, hispanic or other person would have survived this either. maybe, a white guy would but that too maybe doubtful.

i just think cops tend to shoot in these situations.

[cali]

14. cops tend to shoot minorities in such a situation

far more regularly than white men, is what I believe. The slain officer hadn't fired his gun and the cop who killed him fired 6 shots. Did he yell to the officer who was slain to stop? We'll see.

[okieinpain]

22. I'd agree with you. n/t.

[JVS]

27. This is just a case of gun-happy cops all around getting themselves some friendly fire casualties.

The only reason the cops think it's tragic is because this time they're the victims instead of civilians.

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

82. The obligatory cop hater.

[LooseWilly]

88. I don't know...

maybe it was Detective Alonzo...

[Beacool]

63. Exactly!!

That's the main problem, cops shoot too often first and ask questions later. I don't think he got shot for being black. He got shot for chasing a guy with a drawn gun.

[roody]

90. Maybe the truth is inflammatory.

[BlooInBloo]

2. Brave man - to be black, not in uniform, and chasing somebody in America.

[newfie11]

4. The question is what color was the person that broke into his car.

If he was also black than how on earth can anyone make a discrimination charge. One man with a gun chasing another in Harlem! I don't think color come into this. They thought they were saving a life. Also I don't think the whole story is told in this little blip.

[cali]

7. I'm not making a discrimination charge

but the facts are that Officer Edwards didn't fire his gun and was shot and killed by a white officer. This is going to be an issue in NYC. Furthermore, I provided a link to the whole story- which was more than a blip.

[newfie11]

13. This is a newspaper report. The rest of the story needs to be heard.

Did the plainclothes officers yell for him to drop his gun??? No one knows. The way this is written "white cop kills black cop" does sound like race is something they are trying to make an issue of.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

15. that wasnt the way the original article was written. nt

[cali]

17. agreed. I pulled that information from the article

because that a white cop shot and killed a black cop in NYC is going to be a very big deal and raise racial tensions. Now you may not agree with that, but that doesn't make my post inflammatory.

[Raineyb]

59. Race is the issue here

To the police white guy in plainclothes with a gun = cop. Black guy in plainclothes with a gun = criminal. Hell black guy out at night = criminal but I digress.

This is not the first time this has happened either. Unfortunately, nothing will be done. As usual.

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

67. I live in NY and on the local news, they pointed out that the officer that was killed was black

and the one who killed him was white. Race will be the issue.

[Raineyb]

74. Of course they did. The NYPD has a nasty habit of shooting first

and asking questions never when it comes to black men. And there's been other incidents where black off duty police officers were shot by white cops. There's no way this wasn't going to be pointed out and the race differences certainly wasn't going to get by anyone.

It's on the front page of the Daily News. The question is will how far will they bury it when they exonerate the cops who shot at Officer Edwards.

[hedgehog]

11. Why did Officer Edwards have his weapon drawn? Would this be

standard procedure when chasing a suspect who has not displayed a weapon? (The article doesn't report whether or not the apparent thief was displaying a weapon. Since he was rummaging through an unattended car, I'm assuming his intent was smash and grab, so no weapon on display).

[cali]

12. yes, an officer can pull a gun on a suspect in the commission of a crime

even if that person has not displayed a weapon. it's not like he shot the perp. I don't know what the rules are re an off duty cop.

[JVS]

16. Plainclothed policemen have to watch out about that.

[cali]

18. Plainclothes black policemen have to watch out far more.

[JVS]

20. Do you seriously think that a planclothed white man chasing someone with a gun would be regarded...

as nothing to be concerned about? I highly doubt the cops would just sit back and let that go by.

[Seldona]

23. I agree.

But would their response be six shots?

[cali]

26. yes, history teaches us that black suspects are much more likely to

be shot than white suspects. And this happened in Harlem. My guess is that if the white officer had seen a white man chasing someone (particularly a black man), the officer would have been less likely to shoot.

[BlooInBloo]

29. Durr. Racism apologia takes its start from resolutely pretending the nonexistence of history.

[cali]

30. rather disturbing to see that.

and from posters I wouldn't expect to see it from. Interesting to be accused of "inflammatory posting" because I noted the race of the victim and shooter. People who are upset about Obama's remark about protesters are denying the likelihood of racism playing into this tragedy.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

31. yeah, yeah i get it, all gays are racists because they might think

having actually lived in harlem, that in these circumstances, almost anyone would get shot at by cops. cops both black and white, are hypervigilant in harlem.

[cali]

35. I said nothing of the sort. how sad that you think I did.

I do think that people tend to be more attuned to injustice that they identify more closely with. I certainly do not think nor was I suggesting in any way, shape or form that you or gays in general or racists. I'm sorry you took it that way. I do think you're being a bit insensitive to historical realities in this thread by pitching a fit about the title noting the race of those involved. Having lived in Harlem, you surely know that this will be a painful and contentious matter for many Harlem residents.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

40. ofcourse i do. hypervigilance by cops makes harlem residents in general feel

over policed and underprotected. however blaming the individual cop for what might not really be his fault, is what i am against.

[cali]

43. It's the history of black suspects being shot by cops more often than

white suspects that I think has to be considered. And the posters that I know are AA who are posting in this thread, are certainly finding this very disturbing- because of that history.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

44. any suspect with a gun running around crowded urban areas is a problem

if the guy didnt have a gun drawn, i would totally agree with you.

[cali]

47. the point is that the residents of Harlem- at least a substantial number of them-

are likely to be very upset about a black officer being shot and killed by a white officer. race is going to be a big issue in this case. And we don't really know whether the area was crowded when this happened. I'm also wondering why 6 shots were fired. And did the shooting officer identify himself as a cop before he shot. Did he order the off duty cop to stop? As I said, the history of the use of deadly force on black suspects is going to play into this. Now maybe, the white officer didn't have any subconscious bias that led him to shoot a black suspect when he wouldn't have shot a white one. Maybe we'll find out. But perception of the black community is not insignificant when it comes to cases like this.

[Occam Bandage]

49. The six shots aren't an offensive part of the story, I think.

People who use pistols are generally trained to fire three rounds at a time, and to fire until the target is down. If in the first three rounds he was not hit, or was only hit in the shoulder (or heck, even if both hits were in the first three bullets), he probably wouldn't be on the ground immediately, meaning the other cop would fire another three shots.

I agree that it's inarguable that there will be a backlash.

[cali]

51. some quickie research reveals that the last two cops killed by other cops

in NY, were both minorities, an AA cop was killed by white cops in Westchester County and a latino cop was killed by other cops (not clear on the race of the other cops) in NYC. I imagine that this information is not unknown.

[Occam Bandage]

65. And will undoubtedly reinforce the notion that the police are an unleashed tool of white power,

and that compliance with the police--hell, even joining the police--does not immunize anyone from their arbitrary violence. A very unfortunate story.

[BlooInBloo]

32. As always, race > ideology.

[Seldona]

19. I would like more information before passing judgment personally.

Though that matters zero. Public perception is what matter here. I hope this isn't blown up into something it might not be before all the facts are in. If it turns out they failed to identify themselves there is a problem right there I believe. Then there is the question of what would have been the response had this been an white off-duty officer?

Not that I am passing judgment on the actions here, but I would hope a police officer would respond if someone were chasing me down the street with a gun. They didn't know the person being chased just committed a crime, at least that I am aware of.

I look forward to reading on how this case progresses. Either way it is a sad situation.

[Occam Bandage]

33. I'm not certain a white cop wouldn't be at risk in a similar situation.

It may be that a white cop would not have been shot, and it may be that a black cop would be at greater risk, but I think you have to be pretty foolhardy to draw a gun and run down a street without a uniform on.

[cali]

38. black suspects are more likely to be shot than white suspects.

furthermore, there are quite a few plainclothes officers in every major American city, and it's likely they do, from time to time, chase suspects with their guns drawn.

[Occam Bandage]

I acknowledge that, and agree that there will likely be a justified backlash.

"If they'll even shoot one of their own for being a black man in a dubious situation, what chance do we have?" is a reasonable statement.

My statement was only that the victim was acting in what I would think is a high-risk manner; if he's not providing any signal that he is police while chasing, then any cops (or would-be "heroic citizens") see only a man with a gun running after an unarmed man. I'm not trying to defend the cops or defend racist police behavior by any means, so please don't think I am. It just seems to me that a plainclothes cop running down the street with a gun in his hand, with no ongoing visual or verbal indication that he is police (unless the story failed to mention that, which would be crucial) is an invitation for a shoot-first-ask-questions-later wannabe-Rambo to intervene fratricidally. But as you say, there are plainclothes cops all over America, and most of them avoid being shot.

I suppose I'd chalk that up to most cops not believing the appropriate response to a man running with a gun is to shoot without so much as a warning, while acknowledging that a black man with a gun is more likely to cause a Rambo-cop to fire than a white man with a gun.

[MineralMan]

34. I think all of this is based on the presumption that

a black man with a gun is perceived by cops as a criminal. That's where the racism lies in this story, and it's a very alarming thing.

The black officer had not, apparently fired his weapon. There's nothing in the story about him threatening the other officers.

I agree with cali that this will most certainly lead to some serious recriminations against the different perceptions.

[cali]

36. well said. yea, that's exactly what's disturbing about this.

[TCJ70]

37. Running around with a gun drawn while not...

...in uniform is a bad decision no matter who you are.

[cali]

39. so plainclothes officers on duty never chase suspects with their guns drawn?

[TCJ70]

42. I don't know, but that doesn't make it not a bad decision.

Other things we need to know from the case:
1. Did the shooting officer attempt to talk to the off-duty officer before shooting?
2. Did the off-duty officer identify himself? (if #1 happened)

There's a few more things that need to be revealed before I can make a sound opinion on this one.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

45. no to both. there are other articles about it that refer to the black cop

as a rookie who didnt id himself and from all references the white cop did not ask

[cali]

48. Officer Edwards had been on the force for two years

Officer Kelly had been on the force for four years. Don't know whether that makes Officer Edwards a rookie or not, but neither had served for a long period of time. btw, I just did a little research and the last two cops killed in NY by other cops - one in White Plains and one NYC- were both minorities. Their names were Christopher Ridley, AA and Eric Hernandez, latino. Officer Ridley was killed by white cops. Not sure about Officer Hernandez.

[HamdenRice]

71. Do you realize the irony of your post? The white cops were also running with a gun drawn while not

in uniform.

[cali]

41. If this thread at DU is so contentious, what the hell do you think

the reaction will be in Harlem? And that was the point of my noting the races of those involved- that and the history of black suspects being shot more often than white ones.

[Blue_Tires]

46. we had a similar case like that here a few years back...

undercover cop gets into it with a couple of thugs in bad neighborhood, it's dark and a lot of bystanders have gathered around...he calls backup and HE ends up being the one who got shot...

[Number23]

93. Yep. Happens so much it doesn't even make the damn news anymore.

I'm starting to think that there are few things in the world braver than a black police officer.

[Brewman_Jax]

50. Far from the only time this has happened

January, 2000 when Sgt. Cornel Young, Jr. was shot and killed in Providence, RI trying to break up a fight while off-duty.

May, 2006 when Officer Seneca Darden in Norfolk, VA was on a plainclothes assignment and killed by a white officer.

August, 1994 when NY transit officer Desmond Robinson being shot and wounded by a white NYC officer.

I could find no incident of a white plainclothes officer shot by a black uniformed officer.

[cali]

52. Christopher Ridley in Westchester NY- AA cop shot and killed by white cops

Eric Hernandez, latino cop killed in NYC. both within the last couple of years.

[Brewman_Jax]

60. My post was to show

that it has happened in various places, and still they try to explain it away. This is the 21st Century? :eyes:

[aikoaiko]

55. This is a tragedy, but culpability should rest on whether or not proper procedures were followed.

Mostly did the shooting and undercover cops properly indentify themselves.

[cali]

57. and history. again, the last two cops shot and killed by other cops in NY

were black and latino respectively. And no, from preliminary accounts, the cop who shot and killed the other cop did not identify himself.

[BlooInBloo]

62. :)

[aikoaiko]

64. Any preliminary reports on about the undercover cop having his badge exposed or other identifiers?

This is not to blame the killed officer, but if killed officer did identify himself the shooting officer is even more negligent.


edited to add: From the article:"It was unclear whether the officers identified themselves." I guess we'll have to wait for the investigation.

[RamboLiberal]

70. According to NY Daily News I just read his badge was in his pocket

and they didn't realize he was a cop till medics opened his shirt and found a police tshirt underneath.

[joshcryer]

80. Both cops were in "track down a criminal" mode, they were oblivious to reality.

The guy who was chasing down the real criminal who wound up dead, and the cop who shot him dead. No sense of rationality. I find it highly unlikely that he told them who he was.

But oh wait I forgot only white cops behave this way. Black and hispanic cops, never.

Oh wait, I've seen many episodes of COPS where black, hispanic, and asian cops freaking tackle completely defenseless and passive individuals because they "didn't follow commands properly." I've seen black cops beat guys down for "not heeding instructions," and in many cases the guys they were beating down were black.

Basically this has become a black and white issue (literally).

[Brooklyns_Finest]

68. Cop Board

I got this post from a cop on a cop board that I frequent.

Yes a true tragedy -- The race factor is an issue here, but not how the media is spinning it - Forget being PC, the reality is that a black guy with a gun on 124th st would be deamed a perp, more than a white guy with a gun on 124th st -- 124th st in that area is predominantely black and hispanic -- a white guy with a gun in hand in that area would garnish more of a second look than a black guy -- There are some what we call "pioneers" in that area (white and asian people slowly moving into the area), but they are by far the extreme minority --

I am lucky I survived my last shootout (off duty) not because the perps bullets missed me, but because another off duty cop approached me and had his gun to my head asking me who I was and to drop my gun - My response was "I'm on the job" as I paid him no attention and was focused on the perps at hand -- I could've met the same fate - I was a guy on the street, gun in hand and had just shot a couple of guys - The other cop did not have to wait to pop me and I would've never seem him coming - I thank my lucky stars to this day

Overall, off duty and in plainclothes we all have to be aware of other cops coming to the scene and our response to them -- God bless Officer Edwards and his family.

[HamdenRice]

69. Holy Crap! What a story.

But yeah, that's straight from a cop's perspective. He's lucky.

[Brooklyns_Finest]

75. Another post

From 911 Jobs Forum:

The fact that a cop shot another cop is tragic, what is disgusting is that there is an implied tone that officers of color live with this fear of being gunned down in the line because of their skin color.

Maybe the scribe who hacked out this “article” should visit the Officer Down Memorial Page to do some research on race as related to UC/off-duty cops being shot in this very same tragic occurrence.

Not sure about the rest of you but I remember being told time and time again in the academy that there is an inherent risk in being in plain-clothes and pointing a gun, the risk being that you spin around to say “Im the police” and the responding cops shoot; as is normally justified and a spit second decision. I did this once and despite having my very unusual description being provided to dispatch, I was still laid out and had my arm wrenched.

As I type this, CNN is detailing the story and not one word of race was mentioned; least CNN is not biased at this moment.

[Raineyb]

76. Mentioning race does not make coverage of the story biased.

This is the NYPD, they have a reputation of being trigger happy when it comes to black men in general and this isn't the first time that a black cop has been shot by a white cop. Not to mention race in context is not a sign of lack of bias it's a sign that CNN isn't interested in discussing the inevitable issues of racial profiling that would come up if they mentioned the context in which this shooting has occurred.

[tuckessee]

73. That cop quoted there is quite a gunslinger.

"I am lucky I survived my last shootout.....

Many cops do their whole careers w/o getting in a shootout and here this guy has obviously had many.

[Brooklyns_Finest]

77. NYC

I think the guy is an NYC police officer. I think the amount of time you shoot your weapon depends on your city and your unit.

On another note, I like getting perspective about these things from other sources.

[Uzybone]

72. Just another day for a black man who by default is "mistaken for a criminal"

How sad.

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

81. The cops shouldn't even investigate someone chasing someone else with a gun in hand.

[Raineyb]

85. I suppose it's merely coincidence that only black off duty cops get shot

by their white fellow officers in these situations?

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

95. How many instances of this have happened in the last 20 years?

[JTFrog]

78. The account I read on CNN said he was shot 3 times. One of them in the back.

How do you shoot someone who "turned toward Dunton with his gun in his hand" in the back?

http://www.cnn.com/2009/CRIME/05/29/ny.officer.killed/index.html

According to Kelly, the officers reported that, after the command was given, Edwards turned toward Dunton with his gun in his hand.

Dunton fired his Glock 9 mm six times, hitting Edwards three of those times -- once in the left arm, once in the left side and once in the back, according to police.

:shrug:

[cboy4]

83. I've never heard of a city with so many plain clothes cops

running around with guns.

I guess I don't have a problem with that per se, if the cops understand that if they see another person running around with a gun, it could be another cop.

But that's the catch.

Unless you have a uniform on, you really take your life in your own hands running around the streets chasing someone with a gun.

Not dismissing what happened. I just understand why it did.

[Truthiness Inspector]

87. "White cop"

Fucking disgraceful. Is this what it's come to, if a white person makes a mistake it's based on some bigoted thing, but everyone else gets a free pass to be human and make mistakes?

This is dangerous and sad territory, and nothing good will come of it. We are all people, and further divisions do NOT help.

[TCJ70]

89. Oh you're just a racist!

Didn't you know?

[cali]

94. yeah, because that's what the poster was called. or not.

making false accusations on DU, shocking, I tell you.

[cali]

91. yes. a black cop was shot and killed by a white cop

those are the facts. and this kind of mistake has happened way too frequently in NY over the past few years. No white off duty cops shot and killed, several black cops shot and killed by white cops. that's right, white cops have shot and killed black cops in NY several times over the past few years. Do I think they did it on purpose with malice? Do I think racist cultural assumptions play into this? Yes, even if they are mostly subconscious.