Sexiness is for everyone..(wonderful German underwear ad)

[SoCalDem]

and says a lot about US advertising.. we would never dare to do one like it..

...................................................
Sexiness Is for Everyone
Click link within to see it..It's totally clean

* Posted by: Morgan Clendaniel
* on October 26, 2009 at 9:30 am

I don’t want to give away the twist to this ad, so all I’ll say is kudos to this boundary pushing German lingerie company. Apparently, European ad agencies are much more high-minded than us about their sexy undergarments; this is a long way from the Lingerie Bowl.

[SeattleGirl]

1. Damn, I can't watch it right now! I got an error message, saying to

try again later.

x(

[eleny]

8. Here ya go

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DM3R6_1Ayoo

[SeattleGirl]

41. Thanks! n/t

[Posteritatis]

148. Youtube took it down anyway. (nt)

[saltpoint]

2. Whoa. That's a smartly done ad.

Those darn Europeans, anyway!

Recommended with thanks.

[donco6]

3. Whoa! Pretty risky.

But it made me grin.

[tekisui]

4. Wow. Interesting. It threw me at the end.

I didn't see that coming.

[SoCalDem]

6. Yup..nothing at all like "our" sexy underwear ads

6 ft tall women with fake boobs parading around:rofl:

[rubberducky]

5. I totally burst out laughing at the end! Thanks for the smile.

[wickerwoman]

7. Blech... what's the point?

Sexiness is for everyone as long as you're borderline anorexic and spend tons of money on eyeliner, perfume and tiny, tiny knickers?

I was hoping this was going to be about plus sized models or other non-traditionally "sexy" folk... instead it's just a retread of old "Orientalism", the mystique of objectified women from the "East" used to sell fancy underwear.

[tekisui]

10. I am curious what the reaction

of those who were ostensibly predicted is.

I agree with you on the still overtly sexist nature of the ad.

[Skittles]

11. yup

sexiness means hookerish

[reggie the dog]

58. how did she look like a hooker?

Because she did her hair? Because she wore a bit of makeup? Because she wore sexy lingerie? Is it hooker like to try to look and feel sexy? The point of the ad was that the woman was sexy, a confident sexual being in a part of the world where women are not supposed to be sexy, enjoy feminity, or enjoy sex.

[SoCalDem]

12. whatever floats-yer-boat

advertising is rarely subtle..this one is :)

and the woman featured is not anorexic..she's very much like millions of young attractive women in their prime..without "DDD silicone boobs" :)

young women DO buy and apply makeup
and they DO buy "sexy" underwear

there are ads for "ordinary" women (like myself), but somehow those "garmma-undies, as comfy as they are, are not that attractive..especially after a few washings, when they all turn a lovely shade of gray :rofl:..but then no one's caring all that much these days, what I wear under my jeans :)

[wickerwoman]

15. Sorry, but all this reminds me of is a picture in Edward Said's "Orientalism"

of 19th century porn featuring a woman in a burqa exposing one of her breasts. It plays on men's harem fantasies and the "otherness" of the East.

This is clearly targeted at men (not women) since men buy most of the lingerie and what it suggests to me is striptease, not empowerment. She's sexy because she buys stuff, not because of who she is. And the man who puts her in the lingerie isn't a hell of a lot more evolved than the man that put her in the burqa.

I find the combination pretty nauseating.

But yeah, whatever floats your boat.

[SoCalDem]

16. I must have missed out on the 19th century porn

:rofl:

porn of any kind was never an interest of mine

we'll agree to disagree..

I still think it's a clever ad campaign

[imdjh]

25. Thank you Mary Whatshername.

[Tansy_Gold]

30. Excellent response. I too found the commercial disgusting

this is a woman who is sexy, but she is not sexy for herself. She is owned, and both her sexiness and her sexuality are owned, too.

Further, it turns all women who live under a burqa or chador into objects. They lose even more of their humanity because there is no longer JUST speculation about what lies under the veil but commerically inspired LUST for the imagined sexiness.

Blech.


Tansy Gold, who much prefers sarongs

[reggie the dog]

61. looking sexy by wearing clothes that cover part of you

does not mean that she is owned. What is the difference if I make love to my wife when she is naked or when she is wearing lingerie?

[reggie the dog]

60. buying lingerie for my wife is like putting her in a burqa????

so when my wife buys me a nice silk shirt and some nice trousers to wear for an at home dinner is she doing the same????

[wickerwoman]

106. Does she buy you a leather thong, nipple clamps and high heels

and expect you to wear them under a bedsheet all day at work so she (and only she) can fantasize about you naked underneath? Does she forbid you to be seen by anyone else under pain of beatings, being splashed with acid or death?

Are you constantly bombarded by images that say the *only* way you can be sexy is to subsist on lettuce and carrot sticks, stop aging at 19, not have any children and spend tens of thousands of dollars a year on hair products, make-up, uncomfortable clothes, waxing to make you look pre-pubescent, face lifts, boob jobs, etc.?

Yes, men are *slightly* more objectified now than they were thirty years ago but it's not even in the same league as what women go through.

My point is that taking a woman off a her pedestal and ripping off her burqa only to immediately put her in garter stockings, high heels mascara, etc. is at best a lateral move. There's nothing all that progressive about taking an objectified madonna and turning her into an objectified sexual plaything.

But it's "European" and has a good soundtrack so therefore it's arty and edgy right?

[reggie the dog]

133. Men are visually aroused

My wife wears lingerie to arouse me. I keep up my end and help her have orgasams when we make love. She eats normally, works out 2 nights a week and I constantly tell her that the ads she is bombarded with in relation to wrinkles on the face, grey hair etc. are just bullshit. I never ask her to shave or wax because I think women are supposed to have hair down there. I tell her she is hot without makeup on because she is. She is also hot with makeup on. Sometimes she even overdoes the makeup and wears latex dresses or skirts and teases me over dinner at home. It makes for a fun sex life. As for comfortable most of her shoes are flat and that is just fine. High heals do offer the possibility of different standing sexual positions so they do have their place in playing games with each other. Personally I would wear anything my wife asked. I already modeled one of her lamé dresses for her complete with make up because she wanted to see me in drag. It was different but fun too.

[reggie the dog]

134. I turn myself into an objectified sexual plaything for my wife

I work out 4 days a week to stay muscled, not have a gut, and look sexy for my wife in public and in private. I like it when she sees other women checking me out. She works out 2 days a week to stay in shape to that she looks sexy for me. It is a two way thing. I am opposed to fighting ageing and I think small breasts look as sexy as big ones so I will never pressure my wife to get a facelife or boob job. I also agree with her that women should have enough hair to not look like a ten year old. Bald shaved looks to childlike for my liking and is a turnoff. As far as uncomfortable clothing I agree to wear collard shirts and slacks when we go out in public and ask my wife to choose my clothing quite often when we go out or stay in. Sometimes I ask my wife to wear sexy but not slutty clothes when we go out. Sometimes I want her to dress up like a total slut in private. At the end of the day I ask but she decides what she wears (unless she tells me just to pick at my will which happens from time to time) I really do not see how this subjucated women at all.

[Withywindle]

155. MEN buy most of the lingerie?

Damn, I wish I'd known that sooner! I could have saved a lot of money instead of buying all mine for myself! :rofl:

[reggie the dog]

59. I would say that the woman is ordinary

She looks nice, no fake breasts, not too skinny, healthy looking. Much like my 32 year old wife except that my wife has blond hair.

[pipi_k]

84. hahahaha! Nobody much cares what I wear under my jeans either

I too buy the "grandma pants"...two sizes too large, because they shrink in the wash.

Then one day when I'm least expecting it, the underpants that had shrunk to one size too small (even though they started out two sizes too large) are now hanging down around my thighs because the elastic waistband has decided to give up and die.


I don't have much of a problem with them turning gray in the wash because I try to buy colors. Black is good. Easier to spot them in the laundry basket because they don't look so much like parachutes or schooner mainsails.

:7

[Chulanowa]

17. Borderline anorexic?

I can't fault the rest of what you've got there, but really, that woman isn't anorexic in any way.

Weird that a desire to see plus sized models represented as sexy, turns into claiming that anyone not plus-size must have a psychological eating disorder.

[wickerwoman]

26. My aplogies.

To me pronounced ribs, such as this woman's, means too thin. She is certainly not average weight. And knowing what I know about the advertising industry, I made an assumption which is probably unfair.

I don't think anyone not plus-sized must be anorexic but I do get sick of *only* skinny, skinny women being portrayed as sexy in our society. We have runway models that look like Holocaust victims and *way* too few people in the industry raise an eyebrow or would suggest that being hyper-thin isn't "sexy".

This thread was advertised as "wonderful" "high-minded" and "something we would never do in US" and frankly I don't see it. We wouldn't portray a skinny woman in underwear as "sexy"? That's why I was expecting someone not traditionally "sexy", i.e. someone plus-sized or over 30 or transsexual or something like that. Too me, that's what the tagline "sexiness is for everyone" means.

Honestly, I think Christina Aguilera's "Beautiful" video is a lot more "high-minded" than this ad.

[reggie the dog]

62. sorry but this is an ad for Europe where most people are not overweight

She is average weight for France, where the company is from. If you do not believe me come to Paris, walk around, and notice that the vast majority of men and women are in shape, not overly skinny, but not fat at all.

[RebelOne]

77. I can agree with you about the women in Paris.

I saw very few women there who were overweight. Most of them were slim and smartly dressed.

[DaveinJapan]

159. Don't count on that lasting very much longer.

I could've said the exact same thing about Japan just 5 years ago, now I see extremely overweight people all over the place.

[saltpoint]

22. I wouldn't consider the woman in the ad "anorexic" at all.

She suggests sound health.

She walks like a dancer, IMO.

[imdjh]

24. Did it occur to you that the burka might be a metaphor?

[wickerwoman]

28. Of course, we just obviously disagree about what it's a metaphor for.

Would you like to explain your reading of the ad, as I have had the courtesy to do?

[imdjh]

33. The burka could be all outer clothing which covers the sensual person.

It could be social expectation which oppresses.

She could be wearing the burka as part of her outfit, like a woman wearing a trench coat to her husband's office, and then flashing him.

[wickerwoman]

38. OK, and why does she feel the need to cover her sensual person,

having spent so much time and money constructing it?

It couldn't possibly be because she *has* to... because she lives torn between a culture that sees her natural shape as shameful and a culture that considers her a sexual plaything...

No, it's far more likely to be a Halloween costume that she can tear off at her husband's office for her own enjoyment and not at all the enjoyment of men who objectify her... because nothing says female empowerment like tearing off all your clothes in front of your husband and his coworkers to reveal the tiny, tiny underpants that have been riding up your ass all the way to the office.

[imdjh]

40. What city is she in?

[imdjh]

42. If the burka is a metaphor, she doesn't have to feel the need to cover. It's a metaphor.

It could be saying that women's clothing covers up the nicer clothing worn under. Like if I referred to a designer that I disliked as having dressed his model in a burka.

[Brickbat]

71. +1. Totally agree. I saw nothing new, revoluationary, amazing or otherwise ground-breaking.

Women are viewed as objects, whether they're naked or totally enrobed.

[Le Taz Hot]

74. Yeah, I kind of had the same reaction.

[CTyankee]

75. While I agree with some of what you say, consider that young European women tend

not to be plus sized like some of their American counterparts. So what is the norm to us may not be the norm to them. Of course, they are not all as beautiful as this woman is, but we'd be well to think a little harder about the lifestyle implication for what we consider is "normal."

[wickerwoman]

102. Sorry, but that's kind of irrelevant.

My point is that if you're going to us the tagline "Sexiness is for everyone" you might at least consider showing someone who isn't traditionally sexy. Is there a single person on the planet that would ever doubt that this woman was sexy even in jeans and a baggy sweatshirt?

I just don't see anything "ground-breaking" or "wonderful" about showing a thin woman in garter stockings and fuck me pumps as "sexy" as if 99.9% of ads with non-mom women in them don't show exactly the same thing.

It doesn't matter if it's European or American. The standard of beauty is equally unrealistic and uninclusive.

"Sexiness" is *not* for everyone according to this ad. It's still only for thin women who buy mascara and wear uncomfortable clothes that men get off on.

That's what I found disappointing.

[CTyankee]

107. But that is YOUR value judgment. I hate to think about what you would say about the way women look

in Rio de Janeiro! I was amazed when I went there; I had never in my life seen such beautiful women. It's interesting because recently while in Portugal I talked to some Portuguese women who said the Brazilian women were "overdone," meaning too overtly sexy.

As for my relevance, I am only pointing out that what we see around us here in the States is different from what I have seen in Portugal, Spain, Italy (esp. Tuscany and Northern Italy) and even Sicily. If you see people around you are thin, you tend to think that's the way it is. We in the States have quite a few larger sized women so we feel THAT is the norm.

And don't even get me started on the men! When I came back from Milan and Venice last year I thought all American men looked like slobs. I actually admit to staring at 3 men who were crossing the Rialto Bridge, they were so gorgeous...and I NEVER do that here!

Different strokes...

[redqueen]

109. Such nonsense.

There are people of different body types all over the world. Yes, even in Brazil, Spain and Portugal, there are endomorphs.

[CTyankee]

112. Well, I haven't seen many truly obese people there, if any at all.

Some are fleshier than others of course. But overall they arent that big.

Look, this is an ad. It is trying to "look beautiful." I'm not saying you can't be beautiful if you are not as slender as this woman, but this is advertisement, not a reality show...accept it for what it is and just that...

[redqueen]

113. The subject line "Sexiness is for everyone"... as someone else stated...

implies more than just another good-looking ectomorph.

And I didn't bring up obesity... just the fact that not everyone is built like an ectomorph.

[Gwendolyn]

117. To be fair, the ad campaign was specifically aimed at muslim women.

Or men who fantasize about muslim women. Just because Americans happen to be obsessed with weight at the moment, it really isn't such a big deal elsewhere. It's doubtful that this company would ever produce an ad depicting plus-size lingerie as I don't think they sell these products nor are the women who wear them, customers. Could be wrong, but I doubt it. The hoopla amounts to nothing more than reaction to some blog guy who needs to get out more spying this ad on the internet and basically peeing himself.

This is the full copy under the video on their website.

"Wir glauben an grenzenlose Weiblichkeit und Sinnlichkeit. Jede Frau kann sinnlich sein, egal was sie liebt, woran sie glaubt oder wo sie lebt." My rusty German translation: "We believe femaleness and sensuality knows no borders. Every woman can be sensuous, no matter what she loves, what she believes, or where she lives."

http://www.liaison-dangereuse.com/

[redqueen]

118. Again, I'm not talking about weight. I'm talking about body type and looks.

This woman isn't an 'everyone' type, she's a model.

[Gwendolyn]

123. Technically, she's a minor celebrity and daughter of a race car driver.

But that's incidental. She wasn't cast as the secretly sensuous woman to depict an inclusive "everyone" body type. She was meant to represent "everyone" in terms of culture and religion. There's a difference.

[redqueen]

125. Yes... "everyone," in this context, simply means "Muslims too!"

:rofl:

[Gwendolyn]

138. Yes, precisely.

The company just wanted to make some clever statement to acknowledge the sex lives of frummy muslim women, not reinvent cultural weight or body type preferences. And it's this subject matter that makes the ad obnoxious, not the weight thing.

[CTyankee]

142. Really, an ectomorph? I don't see her that way. I think she is a naturally slim woman

who is young. I know when I was a young woman (long time ago) I weighed 125 lbs. and was 5'6". I didn't consider myself an ectomorph...to me, that would be 105 lbs and 5'6". So our weight considerations have "slid" over the years as Americans have gotten fatter...

[Codeine]

157. We've become so accustomed to obesity

that we've forgotten what humans are supposed to be shaped like when they are not consuming 2500+ calories every day while sitting on their fleshy asses.

Endomorphs and thicker shapes are normal; obesity and rolls aren't.

[wickerwoman]

140. Bullpucky.

The point is that *everyone* men, fat women, sixty year old women, transsexuals, dwarves, seven foot tall Amazons, women with facial tattoos and scarring, people with birthmarks, harelips, etc. can be sexy. It's just a question of self-confidence.

And yes, Brazilian women are sexy too.

The difference is that skinny Brazilian women in bikinis are *always* portrayed as sexy, while members of the other groups rarely are.

So if you are going to create a "bold" "innovative" "ground-shattering" ad campaign called "Sexiness is for everyone" why would you choose such a cliched gender and body type?

It's not about "the norm" in Europe or anywhere else. It's about expecting to be congratulated for being inclusive and then only including the group that is always included... like expecting a diversity award for hiring a certain percentage of white people. It's a lost opportunity to do something *really* bold or innovative.

[Gwendolyn]

141. I posted this elsewhere, but the point was not to create a bold, new, breakthrough...

ad campaign. Those were the words of some random blogger dude that the OP picked up. On their website the company claims it wanted to create an ad that acknowledged devout muslim women. And perhaps frum women of other cultures or religions. But that appears to be about it. They don't appear to be making any big statements about weight or body image.

[CTyankee]

145. yadda, yadda at the end of the day it's a European ad, fer chrissake.

They have their own ideals, we have ours. So what?

This is their idea of "sexiness is for everyone"? OK, they're German, we're American. We're different. Get it?

[CTyankee]

147. Well, blame the European makers of the ad of being "eurocentric".

I think you'd be right.

Look, I'd like to see more inclusiveness, but I sure don't expect this from a high toned European advertiser, either...

[redqueen]

85. +1 - Very disappointing.

Just the same old shit, but under a burqa. Pathetic.

[REP]

9. Beautifully done yet very sad

All dressed up and not allowed out.

[SoCalDem]

13. She did go out.. she just has a big secret

:)

[Gwendolyn]

14. Yes, her face...which is the equivalent of a vagina it seems.

Hence it needs to be covered up. Nothing sexy about burqa slavewear, and nothing sexy about this ad.

[saltpoint]

18. Imagine the reaction around this joint if a male posted your subject line.

[inna]

27. face an equivalent of vagina? what are you babbling about?

:wtf:

[Gwendolyn]

31. What is the purpose of wearing a burqa?

It's meant to hide the face from men. Why? To avoid sexual contact of any kind between the woman and a strange man. To look at a woman's face is to evoke such uncontrollable urges in the male of our species it can't be seen in public. It's a sexual thing, a woman's face. The equivalent of a sexual organ.

[TankLV]

53. I've seen to many women's faces that have the effect of a thrill KILLER...

same for men - the "ugly" is necessary to appreciate the "beauty" - but the burka thing is funny and also strange...

so this commercial is funny and a great twist at the end...!!!

[reggie the dog]

64. which is why this ad is making fun of burqas

There is a big debate going on in Europe about whether or not we should be multi cultural and allow Muslim men to force the women in their families to dress like this in public in Europe or if we should take a stand for womens rights and perhaps even outlaw the covering of ones face in public to protect women.

[reggie the dog]

63. context people

many of us are fighting against seeing the bur qua everywhere in France as we think that it is regression in the rights of women. This FRENCH company's ad points out that
1. women are sexual beings and making them wear a burqa cannot take away their sexiness underneath
2. men subjugating women with the burqa are stifling womens sexiness,
3. no matter how much society tries to keep women down women will rebel in ways they can without getting stoned to death.

The ad is taking the piss out of fathers, and men who make women wear these burqas by saying that "no matter how hard you try to keep your daughter ect. from looking sexy she can still look sexy underneath the potato sack and eventually the vibrant sexy women will break out of the mold you are making them suffer under.

[Liberal_in_LA]

21. I found it to be sad also. **spoiler**

No sun on her body, dressed up like a mummy. ugh.

[saltpoint]

32. Why would she not be allowed out? Say for the sake of argument

that she is in Paris, or Prague, or New York. Could a woman of her cultural identity not wear exactly those articles of clothing and proceed onto the sidewalks of those world cities?

In Berlin?

Copenhagen?

[Gwendolyn]

35. Sure she could go out...

chances are though, if her husband or brother discovered she ventured into the streets with nothing under the slave sheath besides her pantaloons, she'd be beaten like a dog.

[saltpoint]

37. Well, Gwendolyn, you surely do paint a bleak goddam picture of this

woman's narrative.

I'm afraid we don't see the same levels of promise and poise in the woman in the ad.

I say she rocks.

[Gwendolyn]

44. Of course you do.

;-)

My back story is just a little more realistic.

[saltpoint]

47. Well, pat yourself on the back and have another piece of cobbler.

[Gwendolyn]

82. I don't eat foods laden with sugar, but thanks for the sweet thought. n/t

[saltpoint]

83. I say cobbler and ice cream for everybody. Will of course respect your

diet.

[reggie the dog]

66. you got it exactly

even worse the toughs in the neighborhood get involved and subjugate women who have cool dads and brothers.

[reggie the dog]

65. no, not without risking being beaten, raped or set on fire

there have been cases where young women have been beaten, raped, and lit on fire here in France because they wore knee lenght skirts when they went outside. There are neighborhoods in all countries in western Europe which are majority Muslim. The men there tend to be very anti womans liberation. Many force the girls to wear pants, or headscarfs out of threats of rape or violence. This is one reason we made headscarves illegal in public schools, to protect the vast majority of Muslim women who DID NOT want to be forced to wear these things. We are also considering making the burqa illegal to be worn outside, especially if it covers the face.

[saltpoint]

68. I do follow the controversy over the burqa in France and Sarkozy's

comments on same.

It is my impression nevertheless that in most world cities, including for example New York, Berlin, and many others, that no legal prohibition stands against religious garb.

[reggie the dog]

69. legal no, but women are treated as second class citizens by many in most

Muslim neighborhoods in France. Women are called whores in these neighborhoods just for wearing knee length skirts.

[saltpoint]

79. The ad, IMO, plainly is beyond that view and well into a more

confidant, engaged, focused, and self-directed person.

[cherokeeprogressive]

94. The AD might be; too bad the reality isn't. n/t

[saltpoint]

151. If you are trying to equate the aims of advertising with the conditions

of the real world, you are likely to live a very frustrated life.

[cherokeeprogressive]

152. LOL at 48, I've lived a fair part of it, and with VERY little frustration, but thanks for playing!

[saltpoint]

153. "Play" is a good choice of words for advertising, as they have the briefest

of moments (or space) to make a play to their target audience.

I'm delighted you are not frustrated but the point remains, does it not, that advertising is designed in part to generate need or want which are met by consumer action.

The Ford Motor Company is interested in people buying one of their automobiles. Their ads are designed toward that end. The cars appear new, shiney, sleek, dashing.

All State's pitch is that their good hands are the best in the business and that consumers' concerns would be best managed in such good hands, that it would be questionable not to trust a company so dedicated as All State.

This ad is trying to sell underwear. By the criteria understood within the industry for successful ads, this one appears to meet several criteria.

That is what the ad is for. That's the advertising firm's mission.

It looks to me like they got it done.

[Canuckistanian]

19. I'm guessing this ad won't be playing in Saudi Arabia

Call it a hunch.

[MellowDem]

20. I thinks it's worse than US advertising...

it's a rather obvious and shallow attempt to market to a large Muslim population in Germany and it does so by using all the same bullshit skinny models. "Just because your culture makes you cover up your body doesn't mean you can't make yourself extra sexy for your man, who is the only one that can see your face. Buy our product!"

[reggie the dog]

67. sorry but skinny is normal here in the E.U.

[MellowDem]

127. Just not skinny, the whole "model" aspect...

of what a beautiful woman "should" look like. And Germany isn't the EU. Germany is better off than a lot of the EU with obesity.

I lived in Luxembourg for a semester, and the vast majority of women looked nowhere near as good as the model in the ad, which is the point. It's a fantasy.

[reggie the dog]

129. sorry, I must be spoiled with my wife.

[MellowDem]

131. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder...

and I'm glad you find it in your wife, otherwise it could lead to some problems! But I fail to see how this ad doesn't push the same old steryotype of beauty. I don't think anyone has thought of Muslim women who wear burqas as "ugly", so I don't see the myth that is being popped here.

[reggie the dog]

135. no myth, it is making fun of the assholes who make women

wear burqas by saying that no matter how hard they try they will not stamp sexuality, sensuality, and feminity out of women. At least that is how I intepreted the ad.

[Gwendolyn]

139. I don't know that it's making fun of the assholes exactly...

since they're the ones paying upwards of 200,00€ for a simple panty/bra set. But I agree the intention was to promote the idea that sexuality and sensuality are always waiting to bust out, no matter how diligently they attempt to stifle women. Men apparently love it, but since the burqa has not very wonderful connotations to most women, it doesn't view the same at all.

[Codeine]

97. She's not "skinny."

That's what normal people look like when they don't overeat.

[redqueen]

99. "Normal" people? Really?

Please.

That's what ectomorphs look like. Not everyone is an ectomorph.

[MellowDem]

128. Yes, that's what normal people look like...

when their whole career revolves around being a model and watching their diet and excercising for money. :eyes:

[reggie the dog]

130. or when they eat properly

like most people do in France. This is an ad for a French company after all. There are a lot less overweight people here than in the USA. I know people have different body types and all and that some body types have broader hips or what not but this woman is just in shape. You can eat normally and workout 2 days a week and be thin if it is your bodytype. On the other end I could work out my skinny upperbody and never put on muscle as fast as someone with a naturally stockier body type.

[MellowDem]

132. You can eat properly...

workout like crazy, and the chances are you won't be a model. It goes beyond just being fit and healthy. Not to mention all the makeup, lighting, etc. that lends to the "fantasy". I still don't get the point of the commercial. Do people in France find Muslim women to be ugly if they wear a Burqa? Beauty is for everyone? With an ad like that, I was expecting something challenging concepts of "beauty", not an ad saying that even repressed women should fit the steryotype of what beauty is.

[reggie the dog]

136. not ugly at all, but subjugated by overdomineering males

most women in France who wear the burqa are pressured by the male members of their families. I read this ad as telling those males that they may try but they will never rid a woman of her desire to be a sexual, sensual, feminin being.

[MellowDem]

137. I didn't see it that way...

but that's an interesting take on it. It's still a very "commercial" idea of what a woman's sexuality or feminine being are though. I don't know how great it is to condemn one form of being feminine (wearing the burqa) while pushing another that seems just as fake. Who defined wearing lingerie or wearing makeup as "sexy"? These are cultural ideas of sexuality as well, though much less harmful I think than the whole burqa thing.

[imdjh]

23. Did you expect such a sour response from this bunch here? The ad is very well done and smart.

[saltpoint]

29. Agree. It has the insider culture thing going for it, for one thing.

It deliberately clashes cultures' sensibilities. The woman is poised and extremely dancer-like in her movements. This is a woman who feels the pull of gravity on the earth but who could climb a mountain with a backpack if she so chose.

The colors are strong and definite.

The cultural jolt at the end is stimulating not only because the woman is beautiful but also because we want her to be that confidant, that intelligent, that interactive across cultural boundaries.

It's a handsome, strong, ad. The people who put it together, IMO, are certainly earning their keep.

[SoCalDem]

34. Actually, no.

I saw it as "art"..a well-done ad..clever and with an unexpected twist at the end..

but then, I was not aiming to make a geo-political/misogeny/slavery/anti-makeup/anti-obese/anti<insert anything here> "statement"..

This is the new-DU, though.. any comment or post can be and will be pounced upon by people who, in another time, would have clicked, cluck-clucked, and moved on. These times have people in a confrontational state of mind, though, so I should know better..

If you post "I like milk", you'll be attacked for cow-imprisonment
If you post "I like peanut butter", you'll be assailed by some anonymous, never-ro-be-met person who will swear you are trying to poison her peanut allergic child through cyberspace

and so it goes :)

[boppers]

146. I will unrec you for having a thought that differs!

Yay for DU!

[grassfed]

36. who do you think supports French haute couture?

there is much more to Islamic women, a huge diverse global demographic, than the stereotypes mentioned in tis thread.

An Arab woman: http://www.youtube.com/user/queenrania?blend=3&ob=4#p/a

[Warpy]

39. It's not that far off the mark, actually

but there's a remarkably sexy evening gown over the bra and garter belt in real life.

Designer fashion sells well in Saudi, the sexier the better. Women wear it for themselves and occasionally each other at same sex parties.

Good twist on the ad, though, for people who have never known veiled ladies and where they're really at.

[msongs]

43. the vast majority of women who don't look like that are not well served by this company nt

[SoCalDem]

46. That's why this company is but one of many

I have never set foot inside a Victoria's Secret, but I have managed to find underwear for the 42 years I have been buying it myself.

It's an ad...just an ad.. a clever ad..

Motorcycles are advertised, but I'll never want one, have one

[TankLV]

55. I think some of my underwear IS 42 years old!!!

hey - it still has SOME cloth - so why throw it out?!!!

[TankLV]

54. welcome to the REAL world...so what else is new...

Neither me nor you will ever be in any such ads - but they sure are fun to watch!!!

[Vickers]

45. Very cool!

:thumbsup:

[Mrs. Overall]

48. I'm surprised by some of the responses in this thread. Some women actually have reclaimed the power

of the veil or the burka for themselves.

I have had several Saudi and Middle Eastern female friends who sometimes chose to be covered because they didn't want anyone (male or female) to know/comment on their breast size, tummy, butt, hair color, hair cut, make-up, etc... There's a certain freedom in anonymity. It's surprising how many women, themselves, oppose anti-burka laws.

I am an ex-nun so I have had interesting discussions with women of other cultures who were (or are) "veiled" like I was. I felt the same way--yes, there is an oppressive element, but there is a way to take that power for yourself and give one big "fuck you" to convention and societal expectations that are placed on women's looks.

I liked the ad--burkas and habits can hide some surprisingly sensual things.

[SoCalDem]

50. They may be the religious equivalent to the muu-muu

At home, I like to be comfy and there's nothing more comfy than a "lounging dress", "patio-party dress"..whatever you want to call it ..:rofl:

basically, if you are coerced into wearing something, or are beaten for NOT wearing it, that's one thing..but if you CHOOOSE to wear it..for whatever personal reason.. it;s none of my business..

[girl gone mad]

52. I think few would object to the idea of a burka if it were a woman's choice..

rather than a legal or social requirement.

[Gwendolyn]

73. Bwahaha...the burqa is empowering! Now I've heard everything.

Sounds like pathetic patriarchal spin straight out of the 1950s.

If my male co-worker had come in this morning swathed head to toe in a black sack because he was embarrassed at having put on a few pounds or the way his hair looked, he'd have lost all credibility. Rightfully so. And I can't even IMAGINE wanting to enshroud my SO to keep him "pure" for my sexual use.

[derby378]

81. I tend to agree - but consider Annie Lennox for a moment

In an old interview, Annie explained that she went for spiky red hair during her stint with David Stewart in Eurythmics because she didn't want people focusing on her breasts or butt, but instead on her voice and her face.

I think it's the same motivation behind a voluntary choice to wear a hijab, but done in a manner that is still more individualistic and liberating.

[Withywindle]

156. Voluntary choice is the key here.

If every woman were FORCED to wear short-cropped red hair and mannish suits, it would be oppressive, no matter how beautifully Annie Lennox rocked that look (and she certainly did, and a whole generation of girls emulated her - or Cyndi Lauper or Tina Turner or Pat Benatar or Madonna other female pop stars of the era who were beautiful in a creative, self-determined unconventional way. Note that none of those women have technically "flawless" looks except maybe...Annie Lennox).

There's also the right to NOT have to try to be beautiful, to wear what feels comfortable and safe instead. Nothing wrong with that. I have trouble imagining that anyone's idea of comfort and safety would involve a garment that covers the face - preventing recognition - and allows for no peripheral vision. But maybe some women do feel that way. OK. The problem is when women who disagree are beaten, stoned, raped, cast out, and killed for not wearing a particular garment.

Some people like to say the Western fashion for revealing clothes and makeup is "just as bad," but I've never heard of a woman being beaten to death over refusing to wear them.

[Mrs. Overall]

89. delete

[Gwendolyn]

93. You didn't have to delete your post, but think I get why.

I'll answer part of it anyway. Of course women would find a reason to embrace their prison garb and spin it into a positive. It makes life more palatable. Just like the 1950s housewife who had no financial autonomy, couldn't get a loan or a job worth having, but in her words "everyone knows women rule the world. I say what goes in my house." Nonsense. It's the delusions of the bird in the gilded cage pretending the prison is better than freedom.

That's exactly what this ad portrays, and it's clearly aimed toward a specific community. Wear our lingerie and look how sexy you'll feel, how you'll play the coquette and dance for your mirror, alone. No one but you will know how you feel inside because when you go out you'll disappear as an individual. I can understand why men, distracted by her lovely behind and legs would miss the obvious, but as a woman, I find the vignette incredibly sad.

Nothing breakthrough here. You could tell where it was going just by the music.

[wickerwoman]

105. Because nothing screams empowerment like wearing garters and fuck me pumps under your burqa

so you can do a little striptease for your husband when he gets home (or at his office!)... a striptease only he can enjoy... :drool:

And any woman who has a problem with it must just be a fat jealous Puritan troll. Real women *love* wearing a burqa because god forbid anyone realize that they aren't a supermodel underneath.

What's wrong with you Gwendolyn? Why must you spoil a harmless jerk-off fantasy with your bitter, repressed reality?

:sarcasm:

[Gwendolyn]

114. Lol, I certainly don't want to interfere with anyone's jerk-off fantasy!

BUT, for anyone who wants to know where the mysterious, raven-haired, sensuous beauty was headed when the commercial ended, it was to the studio, where she dumped the burqa and slipped into a comfy tee-shirt and slacks to get ready for her day job. :)

[saltpoint]

49. Bottom line for me is that the ad has snap and focus and will

likely be very successful.

I say congrats to the team of folks who put it together.

[lumberjack_jeff]

51. Meh. I was hoping she'd don a nun's habit. n/t

[juno jones]

56. What will they do next to fuel our fantasies?

Show what scotsmen wear...or don't wear...under those kilts? :evilgrin:

I wasn't too impressed with the ad in the end. The posters above are right, women in chadors and burquas don't own themselves or their sexuality. They are allowing themselves to be defined by men.

[reggie the dog]

57. seems that it is an ad for French lignerie

I really like the ad. It makes me think that women are suffering by hiding their sexuality under those garments which cover their hair and faces. That ad not only sells lingerie but it makes a push for womens rights in my opinion.

[sendero]

70. Wow...

... you could go to a puritan Christian board for your daily dose of anti-sexuality or frankly just plain jealousy or you could just visit this thread.

"Anorexic"? Really? Laughable. Not with an ass like that.

Is it yet another ad selling sex? Yes, in a way it certainly is. But compared to most similarly targeted ads it's a breath of fresh air.

Some folks don't know how to leave well enough alone.

[Brickbat]

72. I totally disagree. Women are viewed as objects, whether they're naked or totally enrobed. This ad

just reminds us of that -- as if we forget.

[redqueen]

87. Exactly. People seized on the word "anorexic" upthread, because dealing with objectification

is a quite bit less popular. Even here.

[Brickbat]

90. Yup.

And the "even here" is not surprising. Male privilege is the last one anyone wants to let go of, and pointing that out only gets you a long lecture about how you're taking things too far, I'm a nice guy, I'm a feminist guy, I would never, ever do something like drug and rape a woman, why do you have to take it so seriously all the time, how come you're such a bitch about this, a man likes to look at a beautiful woman and sometimes looking at a beautiful woman is no more than that, why do you have to wreck it?

Ahem.

[redqueen]

126. "And the "even here" is not surprising."

Yeah, good point.

[ecstatic]

76. Let's say that scenario is true...

What would happen to that woman if a man saw what she had on underneath? That nagging question is what throws the whole thing off for me.

[LeftHander]

78. 60 lashes for the actress and 1000 for the advertising exec!!

The actress for breaking sharia law and the Ad Exec gets 1000 lashes for being a ad exec.

KIDDING

I liked the ad. Though I don't condone the wearing of burgas. I do encourage the sportin' knickers.

[MerryBlooms]

86. Recent story regarding Sharia law and 'deceptive' bras

"Whipped for wearing a 'deceptive' bra: Hardline Islamists in Somalia publicly flog women in Sharia crackdown"

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/article-1220864/Whipped-wearing-deceptive-bra-Hardline-Islamists-Somalia-publicly-flog-women-sharia-crackdown.html

[grassfed]

92. Islamic world is over 1/4 of the globe with as much variation as "Christian" world

You just may be able to dig up examples of excessive Christianity as opposed to Unitarians etc.

Mormon Polygamist 'underage sex cult'
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-559808/Polygamist-underage-sex-cult-case-descends-farce-judge-struggles-control-lawyers-parents.html

[MerryBlooms]

96. I realize it's extreme

it was something I read recently and it was directly related to the post I responded to.

<You just may be able to dig up examples of excessive Christianity as opposed to Unitarians etc>

Yes, absolutely, as well as most others religions.

[derby378]

80. Achmed the Dead Terrorist wants to weigh in...

Okay. Now that I got Achmed out of the way, that's a very effective advertisement. Well done!

[lunatica]

88. Sorry, but this ad makes it OK to be under a burka somehow

Women being sexy in lingerie ads tends to also give beautiful women power so it's not always about being seen as an object. It would be nice if they made powerful ads about regular women, older women, large women since it would be nice to feel sexy at any age. But to make it seem that wearing a burka is even minimally OK as long as you're sexy underneath is just wrong.

[TwilightGardener]

91. Meh. I thought it would show a chubby or older lady--now THAT would be revolutionary.

Putting a lingerie model into a burqa doesn't say much.

[Regret My New Name]

95. Those come around every so often...

[NashVegas]

121. I Thought It Was Going to Be a Trannie

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

98. LMFAO At So Many In This Thread.

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[NashVegas]

100. I Don't Feel This Ad Does Anything to Re-Define Sexiness

Instead, it not only confirms the stereotypical reason why so many Muslim women are ordered to keep it covered, but re-inforces the idea that you've got to be wearing stiletto heels, seamed stockings and garter to be/feel sexy.

She may be wearing an abaya, but underneath she's dressed like a $2k a night hooker.

I don't think this ad is directed at women: I think it's directed at men (who buy lingerie for women).

[Grassy Knoll]

101. NyECE !.....n/t

[defendandprotect]

103. Burqua is no problem if you have sexy underwear on?

PLEASE . . . !!!

[debbierlus]

104. Disappointing....

I don't think this ad is 'high minded', I think it is pathetic. Same sexualization of women...

Just a new twist...and a new group...

Whatever. Not impressed.

[closeupready]

108. K&R for later.

n/t

[dysfunctional press]

110. "this video has been removed due to terms of use violation"

i don't get it...:shrug:

[kiva]

111. More support for the disappointed group here -

less of a twist than an affirmation that sex sells, and what's surprising about that? The person who posted this on YouTube has some odd ideas about 'high-minded' ad agencies.

[TeeYiYi]

115. Sometimes a lingerie ad is just a lingerie ad...

...and not all subjugated women view themselves as such.

Politics aside, I felt it was thought provoking and beautifully done. Thanks SoCalDem.

TYY

Link to more about the Hot Mormon Muffins calendar.--->> http://www.insideedition.com/storyprint.aspx?SpecialReportID=2441

[Warren DeMontague]

116. That's nothing. THIS underwear ad completely redefines the relevant patriarchal male gaze paradigm:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yu_moia-oVI

[immoderate]

119. AAAAAUUUUGGGGGGHHHHHHH!!!!

My eyes! My eyes!


--imm

[ismnotwasm]

120. Dammit

And here I was waiting for beefcake. I get burqa wear and yet another woman in horrid high heels. I was really hoping to see some man putting on his very sexy underwear as well as new and improved male lingerie accessories.


And then there was the ever so enlightening youtube porn on the side.

I guess it's not well known that lingerie sells big in the Middle East?

[Warren DeMontague]

122. "I was really hoping to see some man putting on his very sexy underwear"

[Liquorice]

124. LOL I thought it was going to be a man too. Too bad it was a woman in a burqa. Terrible! nt

[petronius]

144. My thought too - spent the whole ad trying to figure out how they'd reveal

it was a guy, and so the end fell a little flat...

[Liquorice]

143. I've wondered for some time why (some) progressive men seem to

simply love seeing a woman in a burqa or other head covering related to Islam. They become very defensive and righteously indignant when a progressive woman says she hates seeing women in these getups... They will loudly claim that the women in these getups chose this attire, when that is not so in most cases. Most Muslim women are put into those restrictive garments at the age of 12 or 13. But even in the cases where an adult woman does choose to dress this way, they are ultra-conservative women! Why would a progressive man admire that?

These same progressive men have nothing but disdain for an ultra-conservative Christian woman who has 18 kids and proclaims her husband to be the boss of her. They will ridicule the special underwear of the Mormoms... But show an ultra-conservative woman in a burqa, and they start salivating. And therein lies the disturbing answer. I believe the only rational answer to this strange behavior by so-called progressive men is that they're getting sexually aroused by these images. Gross. These women are ultra-conservative right-wing women who, if they do choose this way of life (and most are forced into it), are in direct opposition to progressive ideals.

[Warren DeMontague]

149. That's weird. On many levels.

For one, a Burqua is about the most un-sexy thing I can possibly picture a woman in.

[Codeine]

150. In all honesty

I see "progressive" women make those arguments far more than men.

[supernova]

154. Been thinking about this ad all day

And the thing I keep coming back to is it feels like a tweak of Islamic men in in the EU.

:D

By showing what's underneath the burqa or chador, or whatever you call it first, you bring out what is revealed in those societies. Kinda defeats the purpose of the chador in the first place.

About the only people I can see being consistently annoyed at this ad are Islamic men.

Good job.

[Book Lover]

158. So the point I get from this ad is

The problem with burkas is that they don't let men see sexy women. Hmm. Not exactly a feminist position...