When Adults Help Kids Flirt With Death

[LostinVA]

I just read this in Editorials and thought it was an excellent read:




When Adults Help Kids Flirt With Death

Posted on Jul 18, 2010
By T.L. Caswell


Thousands around the world were relieved to learn late last month that Abby Sunderland, 16, is safely back in the bosom of her family in Southern California. If you weren’t one of those, at this moment you’re probably asking, “Who?” Abby Sunderland, the international hero and role model to admirers near and far, that’s who. The girl whose name fetches almost 7 million hits on Google, that’s who.

The teenager—called an adventurer by some and a daredevil by others—returned to her home in Thousand Oaks, Calif., on June 28 after being plucked out of the Indian Ocean following an accident that terminated a colossal solo voyage. She and her 40-foot sailboat had ended up in quite a pickle when a heavy sea snapped off the racing vessel’s 60-foot mast, leaving, as she later told a throng of reporters in California, a 1-inch stub.

The mast broke when the sloop Wild Eyes encountered a 30-foot wave during a squall and turned upside-down, briefly knocking the young sailor unconscious. Largely because of the emergency radio beacons onboard, she was rescued two days later. But during the long hours when there was no way for her to tell anyone she had survived, anxiety over her fate ran high. (A few pessimists declared she probably was dead.)


http://www.truthdig.com/report/item/when_adults_help_kids_flirt_with_death_20100718

[Uben]

1. Hero?

So now all you have to do to be a hero is fail at what you do? Explains George Bush pretty good, doesn't it? Sorry, but even if she had achieved her goal, she would be no hero, just a very fortunate young lady. I see heroes as people who save lives or enhances them greatly from a bad situation. She did neither.

[LostinVA]

3. I think you completely missed the point of the editorial

The author didn't say that at all, they said the opposite, really.

[Better Today]

2. I get that it seems this was a trek too dangerous, but the only "kids" I knew who

died young were from car accidents and one who broke his neck landing on his head at gymnastics. Since auto accidents are the most dangerous and life threatening activities kids partake in, it seems foolish to pick on this girl or her parents.

[Dogtown]

4. Millions of 16 YOs drive cars,

few attempt solo circumnavigation.

Statistics is a seriously misunderstood discipline.


This trek was a grandstand play by the parents, munchausening-by-proxy.

[LostinVA]

9. "munchausening-by-proxy"

Terrific way to put it!

Or, "famewhoring by proxy"!

[Dogtown]

24. :ROFL:

:applause:

[TexasObserver]

36. "munchausening-by-proxy" is right!

And not just the parents, but all her "team" of adult enablers.

We don't let 16 year olds camp out in national parks unsupervised. We don't let them rent cars. We don't let them sign contracts. This child had no business on the high seas alone. When she's 18, she can see if she can get the glory her parents obviously need.

[Heidi]

6. I would bet that if more kids have 40-foot sailboats, the number of teen sailboating deaths

would be much higher.

[Gormy Cuss]

29. The editorial writer put it best...

Contrary to some arguments, the risks in Sunderland’s venture can in no way be equated with the real but lesser dangers that most teenagers routinely face. Whatever the chances of dying on a movie date or a trip to school (in any part of any city), they are microscopic in comparison with the chances of dying on a solo voyage around the world. If you don’t believe that, ask Lloyd’s of London to quote you insurance policy prices for each.

(second page of the OP link)

[Better Today]

40. Driving for teens is not a "lesser danger," it is the most dangerous tool we offer our kids.

More dangerous than guns, which by the way 16 yos are allowed access to for hunting, and sportsmanship, and get access to for other reasons, legal or not. There are so many ways kids can be damaged or killed with other sports as well, like football and head injuries and heat stroke, and motocross, and as I mentioned even gymnastics can be deadly.

The only thing I think I would do differently if I was her parents, I would have had a monitoring craft following her around, not interfering with her progress, but monitoring it. If I couldn't have afforded that, I wouldn't have let her go, but that's just me and I don't think I should force that perspective on others.

[Dogtown]

51. You're missing the point.

Perhaps you're trying too hard.

If they'd sent a "tender" along, then she wouldn't have been solo, and the parents couldn't bask in the glory of her "rugged individualism".

Face it, these people are very little better nurturers than the Ramseys. They set this girl up and anyway it plays, they win. If she makes it, "Yay, Look at our seed! She's a winner, like US" If she's rescued, "I prayed to Jesus, and it was good enough; he saved her for ME."

If she died... Face it, you're defending ghouls. They would have fed on their mourning for years to come.

If, as a rite of passage, all 16 year old girls had to make a solo trek circumnavigating the globe, I promise you the fatalities would outweigh vehicular deaths. Quit comparing the two activities, they are not equivalents.

It's the OCEAN, it's *really* big and there are all sorts of shit that can kill you.
Not to mention she was alone. For a very long time. That isn't healthy for teen-agers. They need to socialize, lest they end up self-absorbed and cold-hearted, like this girl's parents.



Do you have kids?

[stray cat]

5. Its almost like giving a highschool student a driver's license

which increases their chance of getting killed in a car accident

[Edweird]

7. Everyone dies.

Some people want to live as much as possible before then. She is old enough to understand the risks involved. She's lucky to have such supportive parents (as long as this was her idea and not her parents attempting to live vicariously through her).

[TwilightGardener]

18. I always felt lucky to have parents whose number one mission was to

keep us alive and intact until we reached adulthood. In the animal kingdom, that is also the goal. But some parents have no problem risking the sacrifice of their children for ego or fame. I give no more credit to these idiots than I do to any negligent parent. Being wealthy upper-class doesn't mean they aren't tremendously stupid.

[pipi_k]

22. My parents were perhaps a little too protective, but I agree with your point...

which is that parents' jobs involve keeping their kids alive long enough to see adulthood.

Some of them are so wrapped up in their own little "I want my kids to live life to the fullest no matter how short a time they have to do it" that they don't even see where their stupid decision could end up hurting someone else.

Even if they don't give a shit what happens to their own kid, they can certainly give a thought to bystanders who might be injured or killed or mentally scarred for life because those parents are so clueless.

Like that poor little 8 year old boy near me who ended up killing himself with a semiautomatic weapon at a sportsmens club a couple of years ago. What if he had accidentally killed someone else's kid? And then there were the people who will no doubt suffer nightmares the rest of their lives because of what they saw. I know I would.

I try to work up sympathy for them for their loss, but geez...their stupidity affected a whole lot more people than themselves. I honestly don't understand the thought process that goes on when parents allow their kids to do clearly dangerous things...

[TwilightGardener]

23. Was that the little boy at the gun show? If so, I remember that.

Terrible--and where is the value to a child having the experience of firing a gun like that, anyway--in the event that he HADN'T shot himself? There is no gain, except dad being able to brag to his buddies at work that his kid fired an AK 47 or whatever it was. What gain is there to letting a 16 year old out to navigate a vast ocean by herself, and endangering other people who have to rescue her? Of course, she can sail for the rest of her ADULT life in two or three more years to her heart's content, but then nobody would pay attention, would they? Not breaking any records, no fame, no sponsorship.

[pipi_k]

34. It was....and here's some more idiocy from the parents...

They're suing a 15 year old kid for "not providing proper guidance".


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/11/10/christopher-biziljs-famil_n_351732.html


Complete and total idiots.

[Better Today]

41. If believe that about the animal kingdom, you need a better education.

Even chimpanzees have been documented as sitting by idly as baby chimps are ripped limb from limb by male aggressors, as is also the case in lion prides, when a male has been ousted the lionesses set idly by while the new male(s) kill any young offspring from the previous male. Many in the animal kingdom lay eggs never to return at all. You have a romanticized image of the animal kingdom.

[Edweird]

48. Live your life in fear - die anyway.

Do everything 'right', make all the 'safe' choices, never take any risks and still die. You only go 'round once, so wring every last drop of endorphin filled adrenaline out of it if that is your wish.

[TwilightGardener]

49. Once you're an adult, I'm all for doing whatever you want, and taking responsibility for it

(in other words, not requiring dangerous rescues by other people).

[Edweird]

50. Hehe, people that perform 'dangerous rescues' are in it

because they want to perform dangerous rescues. For example, the rescue divers for the Coast Guard are well trained volunteers - not 'Bob from the warehouse'.

Live your life as you see fit and others will do the same.

[pipi_k]

19. Lots of people die doing stupid shit...

but if it's their choice and nobody else is involved, then whatever.


What burns me up is when people do stupid shit and other people die trying to rescue these idiots from the consequences of their own stupid acts.

Or maybe it's not even someone trying to rescue them. Maybe it's just an innocent bystander.


Stupid shouldn't affect other people.

[SB37]

38. Completely agree....

If she decided that she wanted to do it and the parents were OK with it, I've got no problem with it. I like the fact that people are free to choose their own paths.

This is not a decision I would make with my own kids; but, if that was right for them - more power to 'em....

[here_is_to_hope]

8. It's funny that if you fail, as Abby did, you make the news...

But if you are successful, as Jessica Watson was, you don't.
Not much mention of her anywhere though she completed her voyage a week or so before Abby was befouled.

[notesdev]

10. Watson made the news

I remember it clearly.

What I don't remember is the legions of people who are suddenly concerned about Sutherland speaking up at that time.

The choice that both of them made is one that should be well within the rights of a free person. For most of human history a 16-year-old was considered to be a full adult; note that traditional rite-of-passage-to-adulthood rituals occur at the age of 13 or earlier.

[LostinVA]

12. Except, as minors, they aren't "free persons"

I wasn't posting on here when all of this was going on, but I don't think minors should engage in something like this, or the 13-year-old short-roped up Everest.

[Morning Dew]

14. here's a kid who went to war at age 11

ANDREW J. BOTTS.

Andrew J. Botts was born March 30, 1853, in Jefferson county, Iowa.
His father was John Botts, a native of Adair county, Kentucky, born in
1820 and died in 1870 in Macon City, Missouri. His mother's maiden
name was Susan Craig, she also, was born in Adair county, Kentucky,
and died in Macon City, Missouri, in 1864. When the subject of this
sketch was about four years old, his parents moved with him to Macon
county, Missouri. In July, 1864, he went into the union army as drum-
mer in company B, 42d Missouri volunteers. He remained with the army
until the close of the war — doing garrison duty in Tennessee, and par-
ticipating in various skirmishes. After the war, he returned home and
entered into the tinning business, and in 1867 went to Chillicothe, Missouri,
to learn the trade of tinner.

http://www.ebooksread.com/authors-eng/missouri-historical-company/history-of-ray-county-mo-ssi/page-66-history-of-ray-county-mo-ssi.shtml

[LostinVA]

11. I also think she and her family were much more low-keyed about it

And, she had more experience, the proper equipment, etc. I still doubt the wisdom of her doing it, but I think that may have been part of what you stated. Also, Abby's father seemed to like being in the news.

[Mariana]

25. Watson made the news big time in her country. nt.

[Morning Dew]

13. Didn't Marco Polo go exploring at 17?

[LostinVA]

16. What year was that?

[Morning Dew]

39. Well, it was a while ago.

More recently, my grandmother was married with a baby on the way at 16. But that was 1930.

[Starry Messenger]

15. I see some crazy shit as a high school teacher.

Don't even get me started. There seems to be a trend to turn teens into mini-adults.

[SunnySong]

42. Actually the trend has been tthe oppisite for quite a long time...

In my grandparents time you were a spinster if you were 18 and still living at home.

[Starry Messenger]

43. I have no idea what that means, but ok.

Are you talking about the turn of the century? I'm talking about the last 10 years.

[SunnySong]

45. Well not quite that long ago... even when I was growing up it was common for kids to be

relatively independent by 16. But of course that was last century...

[Starry Messenger]

46. When I was a teen in the '80s my mother wouldn't even let me go to the mall by myself.

Nowadays I'm living in the same area and there are parents who rent hotel rooms for their kids on the weekends, stock them up with booze and let them party all weekend. That's the kind of thing I was thinking of. It's totally unsupervised but it's all done with the parents helping. The kids stumble in hung over on Monday and full of stories. It makes it hard to teach. I think that kind of scene is more appropriate for college (in moderation and not during finals, etc.)

[TwilightGardener]

17. Dumb. And the real hero is the French fishing-boat captain who almost

drowned rescuing her.

[The2ndWheel]

20. It's her life. I tip my hat to her

I'm sure everyone knew the risks.

[kiva]

21. I think that the headline says it all.

This isn't about the nineteenth century kid who left home to fight in the Civil War. It's not about my 15 year old great-great-uncle who lied about his age to enlist during WWI. It's about parents and a corporation enabling and encourage a 16 year old to undertake a tremendous risk, one that almost ended someone else's life:

Ironically, Sunderland’s attempt to set a record ended up almost killing someone who never will bask in the light of intercontinental celebrity or contemplate being the star of a reality show. The captain of the French fishing boat that rescued the girl fell into the ocean during the transfer and was saved only with considerable difficulty.

If Abby Sunderland just wanted to sail around the world, she could have done so in a couple years, when she is 18. Of course, no company would have likely sponsored her, and her parent wouldn't have the 'honor' or having two record-breaking kids.

[LostinVA]

32. Well said!

[DirkGently]

26. Agreed. This is vicarious gloryhounding by narcissistic

parents. Who maybe have passed it on to their kids. Her brother tried it, and got lots of attention. Her website is a Facebook-y merchandising bonanza. At least one sailing expert I saw who commented noted that she was trying to cross a notoriously dangerous piece of water at one of the most dangerous times of year to do so.

Everybody doesn't need to be famous. Everyone doesn't need a world record. And I think it's reckless to send a kid, no matter how accomplished, off on an endeavor with an extremely high level of mortal danger, for no other reason than to gain attention and to claim a world record.

And there's something about the level of privilege required to even attempt this nonsense that irks me too. One reason this kid could even try this is that she has her own *racing yacht.* So she's in a pretty small class of "adventurers" to begin with. Puts me in mind of "Sir" Richard Branson and his many boats / balloons /aquacars alternately needing rescue and setting "records" for the rich guy with the fastest custom hardware.

So. What. Meanwhile, after some brave soul rescues her from this self-generated emergency, she'll get a shiny new yacht and try again.

I'd hate to see her or any similar young member of the landed gentry get hurt pulling one of these self-aggrandizing stunts, but it's going to happen, and then what are we supposed to think, other than, "What a stupid waste?" It's not heroism or exploration at this point -- it's a media stunt. Is that (and Internet glory) a reason for a teenager to be risking their life?

[TexasObserver]

37. "vicarious gloryhounding by narcissistic parents" is right.

You're right. She was traversing the Southern Ocean on a path almost certain to take her into stormy seas, as happened. It was the wrong time of the year, but they were late getting her boat ready. She sailed a boat she wasn't really big enough to handle, and they put her on it because they wanted her to make better time than was possible with another boat.

This was a glory grab, and it was all about her getting the record, which she didn't, of course.

[DirkGently]

27. Her family is devoutly Christian and her father has stated that,

"We are born-again Christians, and we don't make any decision just based on feeling or even on sound knowledge."

Uh huh. No offense, but some of that "sound knowledge" might have been helpful here.

[WinkyDink]

28. Defenses from the 1800's? Yeah, we had child coal-miners, too.

[LostinVA]

33. And chimney sweeps

I mean, five-year-olds just lay around half the day anyway, right?

[AnArmyVeteran]

30. 'King' Tut was only 9 when he began his reign.

Of course he worked hard for decades to prepare himself for his job as king.

[bvar22]

31. Rich White Girl in expensie ocean going sailboat = adventurer.

Poor Haitian Family crossing the Gulf on home made boat = ?

[Brewman_Jax]

35. Let them become adults

As stated above, the parents' first duty is to get them to adulthood so they can take care of themselves. Once they're fully-grown and responsible adults, they can finance and undertake their own adventures.

[MadHound]

44. Kids flirt with death all the time, every single day, enabled by their parents

Parents hand their kids the key to a car. Hands their kids the key to an ATV, better yet, sans helmet. Parents cheer as their sons and daughters engage in violent, dangerous sports. Parents buy their children guns to play with. Or fireworks. Or have them out on the farm, running dangerous implements, or handling large livestock, even cheering it on at the rodeo. Kids are on skis and surfboards, jet skis or boats, planes and motorcycles, diving to the depths or gliding through the heavens. All this and more kids are doing every single minute of every single day in this country, yet there is no uproar, no outrage.

I think that the difference here is simply one of money and fame. Abby Sutherland is a child of privilege, something that is never looked upon fondly here. She also had her fifteen minutes of fame, something that is also not looked upon fondly here.

But while people fret and fuss about this one girl, who wasn't injured, who didn't die, some other kid is being injured, or dying, all due to the fact that they risked their life, doing something that their parents approved of. Why is there no outrage over that.

The fact is, kids take risks, it is part of being a kid. Sometimes they die taking these risks, that is part of life. Unless you want to wrap each and every single kid in bubble wrap, never let them out of the house, the fact of the matter is kids will continue to take risks, and suffer the consequences. The only question remains is how they take these risks, be it with a car, a bike, a boat.

Oh, and one other thing to note. More kids died from bike accidents, car accidents, gun accidents, skiing accidents, and many other things than boating accidents.

So don't you think all this outrage over one girl, in one boat, is a bit overblown? It is part of being a kid, a part of growing up. And yes, the vast majority of kids do survive these risks and grow up. Amazing, eh?

[NashVegas]

47. Risk Nothing, Gain Nothing

Thanks to the support she gets from her family, this little girl is probably going to achieve a great deal in the future.

You can't have it both ways.

You can't yell for Americans to wake up, politically, on one hand, and pacify & infantilize them in every other respect, and think it's going to work.

There MUST be room for risk and for failure, even colossal failure.