Why Dean is kind of full of crap

[el_bryanto]

Basically he's conceding that choosing to build a community center on hallowed ground is an aggressive act. That lets him play the equivalency card. "You Muslims should give up what you want and then we have a dialog with the people who are attacking you and trying to get this center shut down."

That conversation, Mr. Dean, would go something like this. "Thanks for shutting down the Cordoba House, now there's a dozen or so other Mosques around the nation we'd like you to cease construction of." I mean once they lose a high profile case like this, what incentive is there for anti-Muslim bigots around the country to stop their campaign of harassment?

No incentive, and Dean should know this! The truth is building a community center or a Mosque on land that you own is not an aggressive act. The aggression is coming from those who are trying to shut it down, and they are the ones who need to compromise and change their course.

Bryant

[JerseygirlCT]

1. Dean is just flat-out wrong here

there's no excuse for it at all.

And as you say, it opens the door for further discrimination and hate. His words are the aggressive act, not the building of an Islamic community center.

[Hell Hath No Fury]

10. I am terribly disappointed in him on this issue.

He got it 100% wrong. :(

[dkf]

2. Building a community center on hallowed ground IS an act of aggression.

How is it not?

[el_bryanto]

3. I meant to put hallowed ground in quotations. Darn. (added additional words)

Edited to add; I didn't take this response seriously. I thought it was a dig on me for using the term Hallowed Ground without clarifying. The dangers of living in an Sarcasm Saturated society.

But, even if it is "hallowed ground" why don't AMERICAN Muslims have the right to commorate this AMERICAN tragedy by building a center that espouses opposite values from those al-Qaeda preaches.

Unless somehow American Muslims just don't count as Americans.

Bryant

[digitaln3rd]

4. Re: Building a community center on hallowed ground IS an act of aggression.

1) It's not on "hallowed ground"
2) "Hallowed Ground" is a scare tactic meme. Do we have to worship Ground Zero forever? 9/11 was tragic, sure, but at the end of the day all "Ground Zero" is is the site of the former World Trade Centre

[karynnj]

7. Not to mention - it is NOT ground zero

Right now ground zero is still a hole. Don't you think the country buying that sacred land from the developer and creating a peaceful park as a memorial in the middle of the most densely built up part of Manhattan would be something better to fight for.

Note that even though the RW "optics" can only be done by photoshop - replacing the hole with a park eliminates what really is a view AlQaeda likely loves - the scar on the face of Manhattan.

Then there would be no need to worry what happens 2 blocks away.

[karynnj]

5. A) it is not hallowed ground unless a huge portion of lower Manhattan is.

It is a former Burlington coat factory out and it is next door to what sounds like a pretty seedy bar and around the corner from a strip joint.

Would you allow a porn shop there? Another bar? Another strip joint? Is there a litmus test for any property within "n" blocks of ground zero when it is up for sale? Do you think a law to specify that would pass?

[dkf]

6. Oh I didn't realize a huge portion of buildings in lower manhattan were hit by a 9/11 plane and

Closed for business. Thanks for the clarification.

[RaleighNCDUer]

8. Yes, we cannot demean the memories of all those who died

in the Burlington Coat Factory.

[dkf]

13. How's about all the people who died on flight 175?

Funny how people forget them.

[RaleighNCDUer]

14. You mean the people who were killed when their plane hit the WTC?

Flight 175 did NOT hit the Burlington Coat Factory. By the time that piece of landing gear impacted on the the Burlington Coat Factory's roof every single one of those people were already dead. NOBODY died at the Burlington Coat Factory. It just caught some debris, nothing more. Just like dozens of other buildings in the area - including the Sacred Strip Joint and the Sacred Bar.

Maybe we should level every building in a ten block radius to honor the dead - but would that be enough? The plumes of ash went far beyond a ten block radius - how about demolishing every building that is not a Christian church in all of lower Manhattan? Would that satisfy you?

[karynnj]

9. There were several that were damaged.

Many companies vacated buildings in the area and took temporary space in Midtown and NJ - there was available space due to the collapse of the dot.com companies in 2000/2001. Many of those buildings were restored others were torn down. Some like the Deutsche Bank building that suffered enormous damage and became moldy were empty for several years while there was litigation with their insurance companies. Portions of the World Financial Center were severely damaged - and took years before they were back to normal.

Can you understand the enormity of two 100 plus story towers collapsing violently in a very densely built up area? Debris was everywhere - even months later. The air was filthy - all the way to midtown.

[pinboy3niner]

11. Now you're really being disingenuous

As you already know (because we've discussed it before), Ground Zero is the WTC site--not the surrounding blocks.

The proposal to register the Burlington Coat Factory building as a historic site was rejected. It is not sacred ground, it's private property.

[Renew Deal]

12. The Burlington Coat Factory is pretty great, but I wouldn't call it hallowed ground.

:shrug: